Roy Moore refuses to concede, says Alabama Senate race ‘not over’

[DiogenesLamp]

In case you missed it, more than a few people have come to different conclusions about the same issues as you - hence the length of this thread.

I didn't say you had a monopoly on foolish thinking,  i'm just pointing out that you are doing it regarding this particular point.   

Uh, it's only the AL voters that matter in this case.  They had exposure to a bigger media blitz against Trump, which included sexual impropriety, but they turned out for him in overwhelming numbers.  We've already been over that.

More than Alabama is manipulated.   You can focus on the specific case of Alabama,   but I have been trying to make the point since I got here that media manipulation  is tampering with elections all across America.    So far as Trump is concerned,   they accused him of being a boor,  not a child molester or rapist.   Had they accused him of either one of those,   he likely would have lost the election.   More especially if his own party started behaving as if the accusations were true. 


Why do you keep throwing out this completely invalid analogy?   "Child Molestation" and "RAPE"  are different animals to "fondling"  and "groping." 

No, it's just true.  The fact there are still defenders thinking his refusal to concede is preventing the seating of Jones proves it.  The vote certification and upcoming recess is holding that up.  That process timeframe was decided prior to the election.  Yet, the delusion remains with some that Roy is fighting the good fight and thwarting the dastardly plans of McConnell.

I'm all in favor of Moore putting up as much fight as is possible,   but I have made no statements about the time line.    If others have done so,  I have not noticed it.   

[edpc]

So far as Trump is concerned,   they accused him of being a boor,  not a child molester or rapist.   Had they accused him of either one of those,   he likely would have lost the election.   More especially if his own party started behaving as if the accusations were true. 

Why do you keep throwing out this completely invalid analogy?   "Child Molestation" and "RAPE"  are different animals to "fondling"  and "groping."

Because it's not invalid.  Your ignorance of it is the problem.  The issue was raised by the infamous Lisa Bloom and reported in various outlets.  Try your favorite search engine.

http://people.com/politics/donald-trump-rape-lawsuit-accuser-raped-13/

I'm all in favor of Moore putting up as much fight as is possible,   but I have made no statements about the time line.    If others have done so,  I have not noticed it.

I never said you did.  You're on enough Moore threads to find what I'm referring to if you care to.

[Bigun]

The North invaded to protect the financial interests of the New York area power brokers.   The South was about to seriously disrupt their monopoly on European trade,  and undercut their pricing in supplying goods to the greater Midwest.   

Leaving the South alone would have collapsed the economy in New York.

@DiogenesLamp

Trying to teach actual history to people who have bought in to the BS narative is a waste of time!

[DiogenesLamp]

Because it's not invalid.  Your ignorance of it is the problem.  The issue was raised by the infamous Lisa Bloom and reported in various outlets.  Try your favorite search engine.

http://people.com/politics/donald-trump-rape-lawsuit-accuser-raped-13/

I'm aware of this,  and I don't see any connection to what I am saying. 


"Child Molestation and "Rape"  are a quantum leap difference from fondling and groping in terms of weaponized accusations.    The only thing worse would be perhaps murder. 


Your "they did it to Trump too!"   argument is fallacious,   because they made no accusations on the same level of seriousness,  nor did party officials attempt to urge people to stay home or vote for someone else. 

[DiogenesLamp]

@DiogenesLamp

Trying to teach actual history to people who have bought in to the BS narative is a waste of time!

A lot of people want to believe that what they were taught is accurate,  and that their ancestors (or people associated with their states)  were "the good guys."   


Nobody wants to believe they benefited from some great evil,  or that they or their ancestors perpetrated such an evil.   Most have an emotional stake in believing what they wish,  and so are therefore immune to information that does not fit their world view. 

I used to believe as do most people,   and it was a decade long process by which I realized that what I had been taught was not accurate. 

[edpc]

I'm aware of this,  and I don't see any connection to what I am saying. 


"Child Molestation and "Rape"  are a quantum leap difference from fondling and groping in terms of weaponized accusations.    The only thing worse would be perhaps murder. 


Your "they did it to Trump too!"   argument is fallacious,   because they made no accusations on the same level of seriousness,  nor did party officials attempt to urge people to stay home or vote for someone else.

Fallacious?

A federal lawsuit filed vs media accusations.  That's a completely different level of seriousness, even if the suit is baseless and laughed out of court.

As far as party support goes, he had little to none until securing the nomination.  After that, it was mostly tepid, at best.  The GOP Chairman and Spokesman ended up part of his admin and were actively undermining him with their leaks and conduct in their short time there.  Shows how much they really wanted him.  They also weren't particularly fond of him in the primary.

http://www.businessinsider.com/reince-priebus-donald-trump-colorado-delegates-2016-4

Even 1 month from the election, prominent elected members still opposed him.  Others distanced themselves without condemnation.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/08/politics/donald-trump-video-women-remarks-republicans/index.html

It's impossible to take you seriously about this anymore when your counterpoints are so ludicrous and easily proven to be.  Your muleheaded obtuseness is wearing thin and giving me a headache. 

See you on another thread.

[DiogenesLamp]

Fallacious?

A federal lawsuit filed vs media accusations.  That's a completely different level of seriousness, even if the suit is baseless and laughed out of court.

You are right.  It is a completely different level of seriousness.  Nobody gives a crap about it,  so it isn't serious at all. 

As far as party support goes, he had little to none until securing the nomination.  After that, it was mostly tepid, at best.

Nonexistent support would have been a dramatic improvement over what they actually gave Roy Moore.   They  did the opposite of ignore him,   they deliberately drew negative attention to him,  and they deliberately hurt him with the full intent to hurt him.   

Even 1 month from the election, prominent elected members still opposed him.  Others distanced themselves without condemnation.

Like I said,  very different from what they did to Moore.   The went out of their way to condemn him.   They did everything of which they could think to actively help him lose.   

It's impossible to take you seriously about this anymore when your counterpoints are so ludicrous and easily proven to be. 

Well I might agree with you if you would ever get to the "proving"  part,   but you keep offering information that doesn't prove your claim.    It must appear so from your perspective,   but out here in the land of objectivity,   it doesn't even start climbing the foothills of proof. 


But on the bright side,  (at least from my perspective)  You are helping me prove one of my commonly used adages. 


"People want to believe what they want to believe."   

Your muleheaded obtuseness is wearing thin and giving me a headache. 

I won't be swayed by flattery. 

[Smokin Joe]

Seriously?   How do you read the same information and come to such very different conclusions from myself?   


They did it because they couldn't stand Roy Moore.   They didn't want someone rocking the boat,  they wanted someone who was "normal"  and who wouldn't stir up embarrassing sh*t.   




Uh,  it isn't just the people from Alabama.   Probably 20% of the vote nation wide is manipulated by the media.   





Here's where you try to ad hominem your way out of the argument.   

I can do that too.   Some of Moore's  attackers should win the title of "lyingest".   Either that or "stupidest."     


They've learned nothing.

Just because he didn't win the election doesn't mean he was guilty of anything. Considering those who stepped forth to contest the claims of his detractors really got almost no media coverage, I'd say the voters who decided not to get up and go vote for Moore were acting (or not acting) on the basis of deeply flawed and biased information. It is really difficult to make good decisions without good information.
None of that makes Moore undefensible.
Not unless we have replaced jurisprudence with media bias, mob rule, and guilt by acclamation.

Or should we brush up on our skills with cutlery and get in better shape in anticipation of the return of trial by combat or trial by ordeal?