Author Topic: Replacing the Republican Party  (Read 34909 times)

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Offline INVAR

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #475 on: August 24, 2017, 12:19:38 am »
I'll say one last thing. Now that Donald Trump is head of the Republican Party there's a lot of talk about replacing the Republican Party. Coincidence?  NeverTrump agitprop? Solar eclipse? You decide.

Oh give it a rest!  Trump is just the last straw for a lot of people.  Many of us saw what the Republicans did over the last 7 years and recognized they were part and parcel in party with Obama's agenda, helping hand him what he wanted on a silver platter with little opposition.

The Liberal Democrats have taken over the Republican Party and told Conservatives to shut up and get out.  They changed the rules so the grassroots could never challenge their leadership.  It then decided to make ObamaCare's path to Single Payer stamped GOP APPROVED with a few tweaks to lessen the pain it caused - and outrightly refused to do what they campaigned on ding for 7 years "Root and Branch".

That a lifelong NY Liberal Democrat was made president and declared a Conservative as head of the GOP simply illustrates the fact Conservatism within the GOP is dead and gone and it is time to get out and do something else, somewhere else.
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Online Bigun

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #476 on: August 24, 2017, 12:19:48 am »
   I knew they screwed the pooch and were capable of anything when they tried to pass Romney off as a Conservative, that was my red line.

I'm slow!  I didn't see it clearly until they pulled what they did at the convention last year.  That was a defining moment for me.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline TomSea

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #477 on: August 24, 2017, 12:23:41 am »
Don't forget we still have Obamacare and I have seen nary a tax cut.

If one reads the original article, the author, CoDevilla puts that blame at the feet of the Senate.

Not the house and the president wasn't even mentioned.

I think we are suppose to discuss the article posted.

Offline TomSea

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #478 on: August 24, 2017, 12:25:25 am »
   I knew they screwed the pooch and were capable of anything when they tried to pass Romney off as a Conservative, that was my red line.

Romney's accomplished one heckuva a lot more than Cruz, the Ted Cruz, Glen Beck smear machine may be well greased so they should expect it back.

At least, they are capable of anything, Graham, Cruz, seem capable of nothing.

Online libertybele

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #479 on: August 24, 2017, 12:28:13 am »
The Whig Party:

Whig Party, in U.S. history, major political party active in the period 1834–54 that espoused a program of national development but foundered on the rising tide of sectional antagonism. The Whig Party was formally organized in 1834, bringing together a loose coalition of groups united in their opposition to what party members viewed as the executive tyranny of “King Andrew” Jackson. They borrowed the name Whig from the British party opposed to royal prerogatives.

Jackson had shattered the National Republican Party with his victories in 1828 and 1832. His war against the Second Bank of the United States and his opposition to nullification in South Carolina, however, allowed Henry Clay to bring fiscal conservatives and southern states’ rights proponents together in a coalition with those who still believed in the National Republican program of a protective tariff and federally financed internal improvements. Members of the Anti-Masonic Movement merged with the Whigs after the demise of the Anti-Masonic Party in the mid-1830s.

Allied almost exclusively by their common dislike of Jackson and his policies—and later by their hunger for office—the Whigs never developed a definitive party program. In 1836 they ran three presidential candidates (Daniel Webster, Hugh L. White, and William Henry Harrison) to appeal to the East, South, and West, respectively, attempting to throw the election into the House of Representatives. In 1840 they abandoned the sectional approach to nominate the military hero William Henry Harrison. The subsequent contest was devoid of issues, Harrison winning on the basis of incessant electioneering by his supporters in the “log cabin” campaign.

After capturing both the White House and Congress in 1840, the Whigs were poised to become the nation’s dominant party and to enact Henry Clay’s nationalistic program. Harrison died within a month of his inauguration, however, and his successor, John Tyler, proceeded to veto major Whig legislation—including re-creation of the Bank of the United States.

Clay, the nominee in 1844, lost the election when he misgauged the popularity of expansionism and opposed the annexation of Texas. By the late 1840s the Whig coalition was beginning to unravel as factions of “Conscience” (antislavery) Whigs and “Cotton” (proslavery) Whigs emerged. In 1848 the party returned to its winning formula by running a military hero—this time Zachary Taylor—for president. But the Compromise of 1850, fashioned by Henry Clay and signed into law by Millard Fillmore (who succeeded to the presidency on Taylor’s death in 1850), fatally estranged the Conscience Whigs from their party.

Again turning to a former general, the Whigs in 1852 nominated Gen. Winfield Scott. The North and South had become so polarized over the slavery issue that the Whigs were no longer able to make a broad national appeal on the basis of “unalterable attachment to the Constitution and the Union.” Scott collected just 42 electoral votes as many southern Whigs flocked to the banner of the states’ rights oriented Democratic Party.

By 1854 most northern Whigs had joined the newly formed Republican Party. To the extent that the party continued to exist, it commanded support only in the border states and from conservatives who refused to take sides in the sectional conflict. Many of the last remaining Whigs found a niche in the Know-Nothing Party during the second half of the 1850s and then backed the Constitutional Union Party as the country split apart in 1860.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Whig-Party
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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #480 on: August 24, 2017, 12:29:30 am »
Romney's accomplished one heckuva a lot more than Cruz, the Ted Cruz, Glen Beck smear machine may be well greased so they should expect it back.

At least, they are capable of anything, Graham, Cruz, seem capable of nothing.

You're still smarting from that "Vote you conscience" thing, aren't you?
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Offline Mom MD

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #481 on: August 24, 2017, 12:39:18 am »
If one reads the original article, the author, CoDevilla puts that blame at the feet of the Senate.

Not the house and the president wasn't even mentioned.

I think we are suppose to discuss the article posted.

The author may put the blame at the feet of the senate.  He would be mostly wrong.  The problem goes much deeper than that.  Otherwise the topic is replacing the Republican Party and I have endwavored to stick to the topic.  Not sure why you are calling me out on that one
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #482 on: August 24, 2017, 12:44:53 am »
You're still smarting from that "Vote you conscience" thing, aren't you?

Well, when I consciously remember the quote, I know I am.  Under the guise of "conscience" Cruz was saying "I don't support Donald Trump for President".  Scratch the surface of this statement a little deeper, and he was saying:  "I can live with Hillary Clinton as POTUS".

Like it or not, Cruz was and will remain frozen in that moment in time a small-minded, whining, self-serving politician prepared to sell out this nation for four years because his feelings were hurt.   Insult to this self-inflicted injury:  This was his choice.    :shrug:

The only way Cruz will be on solid national footing again is if people stop pulling off the scab and let this heal. 








« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 12:48:02 am by Right_in_Virginia »

Offline Mom MD

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #483 on: August 24, 2017, 12:46:37 am »
@Mom MD

In my opinion it will take the rest of this countries existence to create a new party powerful enough to take the white house and Congress.

Far easier to pass term limits and repeal the 17th amendment.

If you mean your tag line then I think both of us understand the world is too far down the path to destruction for any man made system to pull us back.   Politics never was the answer anyway.   As a conservative and a Christian my job is to stand firmly on truth.  When the political party I used to identify with has moved so far down the road that I can no longer stand with it it is time to dissociate from wrong not choose what is less wrong.  It is my job to stand for what is right no matter how dark things get not compromise with the dark because we might go over the cliff at a slower pace.  Ultimately we answer to a higher master and it is our job to stand firm not to try to win.  Winning is in His hands not mine.  I hope that makes sense

@driftdiver
« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 12:49:25 am by Mom MD »
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Online Bigun

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #484 on: August 24, 2017, 12:47:01 am »
Well, when I consciously remember the quote, I know I am.  Under the guise of "conscience" Cruz was saying "I don't support Donald Trump for President".  Scratch the surface of this statement a little deeper, and he was saying:  "I can live with Hillary Clinton as POTUS".

Like it or not, Cruz was and will remain frozen in that moment in time a small-minded, whining, self-serving politician prepared to sell out this nation for four years because his feelings were hurt.   Insult to this self-inflicted injury:  This was his choice.    :shrug:

THAT is the biggest departure from reason I  have ever witnessed on this forum by a WIDE margin!
« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 12:48:40 am by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #485 on: August 24, 2017, 12:50:20 am »
THAT is the biggest departure from logic I  have ever witnessed on this forum by a WIDE margin!

@Bigun, I love ya.  And I don't agree.  I stand by my post and my request that the wound from Cruz's decision be allowed to heal ... and it won't if the scab keeps being pulled off by people who cannot accept the reality that was in front of them that night in August.

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #486 on: August 24, 2017, 12:51:43 am »
@Bigun, I love ya.  And I don't agree.  I stand by my post and my request that the wound from Cruz's decision be allowed to heal ... and it won't if the scab keeps being pulled off by people who cannot accept the reality that was in front of them that night in August.

And i stand by mine!

I suggest that it is you who keeps insisting on pulling it off dear!
« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 12:52:37 am by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #487 on: August 24, 2017, 12:55:07 am »
I suggest that it is you who keeps insisting on pulling it off dear!

No, @Bigun   I'm begging you to let go of the Trump v Cruz  :bs:  It's over.  Let it go.

Keep bringing up the primary and dissing Trump because he won and Cruz lost, just keeps the wound open and Cruz will be the loser for it.

Your choice.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #488 on: August 24, 2017, 12:58:01 am »
If one reads the original article, the author, CoDevilla puts that blame at the feet of the Senate.

Not the house and the president wasn't even mentioned.

I think we are suppose to discuss the article posted.

LOL, Tom, you're about 20 pages late!

Online libertybele

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #489 on: August 24, 2017, 12:58:04 am »
Well, when I consciously remember the quote, I know I am.  Under the guise of "conscience" Cruz was saying "I don't support Donald Trump for President".  Scratch the surface of this statement a little deeper, and he was saying:  "I can live with Hillary Clinton as POTUS".

Like it or not, Cruz was and will remain frozen in that moment in time a small-minded, whining, self-serving politician prepared to sell out this nation for four years because his feelings were hurt.   Insult to this self-inflicted injury:  This was his choice.    :shrug:

The only way Cruz will be on solid national footing again is if people stop pulling off the scab and let this heal.

??? You certainly have a different perspective on things than I.  Cruz is on more solid footing now then before the election. Like it or not many conservatives didn't want DJT for President and if it weren't for Cruz later stating that he was going to vote for him to stop Hillary and was promised that Trump would nominate a conservative SCOTUS; Trump would have lost. Many conservatives were and some still are upset with Cruz for publicly announcing he was voting for Trump; not the fact that he said to vote one's conscious.  We should all vote our conscious for heaven's sake; to do otherwise is a wasted vote!  To tell someone not to vote their conscious is absolutely absurd.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 12:59:43 am by libertybele »
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #490 on: August 24, 2017, 01:01:32 am »
??? You certainly have a different perspective on things than I.  Cruz is on more solid footing now then before the election. Like it or not many conservatives didn't want DJT for President and if it weren't for Cruz later stating that he was going to vote for him to stop Hillary and was promised that Trump would nominate a conservative SCOTUS; Trump would have lost. Many conservatives were and some still are upset with Cruz for publicly announcing he was voting for Trump; not the fact that he said to vote one's conscious.  We should all vote our conscious for heaven's sake; to do otherwise is a wasted vote!  To tell someone not to vote their conscious is absolutely absurd.

Cruz is an excellent Senator and we are lucky to have him.

If some want to keep pitting Cruz against Trump by replaying the primaries .... it will circle back and hurt Cruz on the national stage.

I'm simply suggesting the primaries are over and it's time to let the old battle go.   :shrug:

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #491 on: August 24, 2017, 01:02:43 am »
As the Mod noted earlier in the thread - this is what the Trump Faithful/Trump Militant/Trump Supporters/AlwaysTrump/GOP Party Hacks/Establishment Bootlickers ALWAYS, ALWAYS do to threads that hit too close to home with the truth, which is to say it is the same exact tactic the Communist Left does to anyone noting the truth within their spheres of influence...

... they turn the thread into an insult brawl to get the topic shut down.

Which if they succeed in doing, I will merely repost the OP, again and again.

Because the topic of discussion is the absolute necessity of replacing the Republican Party as your party if you are a Conservative, because it needs to go the way of the Whigs.
I didn't leave the GOP, it left me. I still believe in the same principles I did back when. However, when I walked into the district Caucus and was informed (sans vote) that "W" is going to be our candidate--no idscussion, no vote, not even a shouting match, my attitude went right down the crapper. Well, If you don't want my input, what am I doing here? and I left. I never went back. It took a few years, but I noticed the same attitude on a certain website, and I voted with my little electronic feet on that issue, too.
I am a Conservative, and the Party which comes closest in platform to what I believe at this point is the Constitution Party. If we just used the Constitution without trying so desperately to get around it or stretch it to fit some other harebrained and unconstitutional scheme, the country would be in much better shape, more secure, and have far fewer problems. While prosperity is never guaranteed, chances are very good that we'd be far better off, across the board.
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Online Bigun

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #492 on: August 24, 2017, 01:06:28 am »
No, @Bigun   I'm begging you to let go of the Trump v Cruz  :bs:  It's over.  Let it go.

Keep bringing up the primary and dissing Trump because he won and Cruz lost, just keeps the wound open and Cruz will be the loser for it.

Your choice.

I have let it go and done everything possible to be fair to Trump.  YOU and a few others here go into convulsions at the meer mention of  the name Cruz!  I submit that it is you and your friends who have psychological problems!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #493 on: August 24, 2017, 01:08:35 am »
To tell someone not to vote their conscious is absolutely absurd.

When was the last time you heard someone say "vote your conscience" at a national convention?  The answer is: "never".

Cruz wasn't talking about "conscience", he was talking about revenge, settling a score with the party's nominee.

Don't confuse the two.  It was a monumental mistake ... which is why Cruz's donors were slamming doors in his face after he pulled this crap.  His donors knew he was saying:  "Don't vote for Trump".  His donors knew he was saying:  "I'll run again after four years of Hillary".

Again, my advice as someone who appreciates what Cruz brings to the Republican Caucus, please stop debating this.  There are far  too many voters, registered Republican voters, who understand what happened on that stage during the convention. Stop reminding them.

In the name God ... move on.

Offline RoosGirl

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #494 on: August 24, 2017, 01:09:37 am »
No, @Bigun   I'm begging you to let go of the Trump v Cruz  :bs:  It's over.  Let it go.

Keep bringing up the primary and dissing Trump because he won and Cruz lost, just keeps the wound open and Cruz will be the loser for it.

Your choice.

But most importantly stop dissing Trump, cause it just makes them so angry they have to rip off that Cruz scab.

Online Bigun

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #495 on: August 24, 2017, 01:10:32 am »
When was the last time you heard someone say "vote your conscience" at a national convention?  The answer is: "never".

Cruz wasn't talking about "conscience", he was talking about revenge, settling a score with the party's nominee.

Don't confuse the two.  It was a monumental mistake ... which is why Cruz's donors were slamming doors in his face after he pulled this crap.  His donors knew he was saying:  "Don't vote for Trump".  His donors knew he was saying:  "I'll run again after four years of Hillary".

Again, my advice as someone who appreciates what Cruz brings to the Republican Caucus, please stop debating this.  There are far  too many voters, registered Republican voters, who understand what happened on that stage during the convention. Stop reminding them.

In the name God ... move on.

YOU are insane!  Follow your own advice!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline driftdiver

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #496 on: August 24, 2017, 01:10:48 am »
Yes, and it's those same whiners, over and over again.

@libertybele

That I can fix for you.  All you crybabies want is an echo chamber.  Have at it.  Bye
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #497 on: August 24, 2017, 01:11:44 am »
I have let it go and done everything possible to be fair to Trump.  YOU and a few others here go into convulsions at the meer mention of  the name Cruz!  I submit that it is you and your friends who have psychological problems!

I submit you are wrong, yet again.

I value the contributions of Senator Cruz and am asking you to let this go for his good ... not your and not mine ... his.

And at this point, my friend, I don't give a rat's arse if you believe me.  Just don't goad the Republican electorate any further with this BS.

@Bigun

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #498 on: August 24, 2017, 01:13:09 am »
YOU are insane!  Follow your own advice!

I'll stop debating this when you do.  STOP!  Just STOP!  The primaries are over.

Oh, and as to the "insane" comment @Bigun ... I tried to be civil, now you can bite me.



« Last Edit: August 24, 2017, 01:14:32 am by Right_in_Virginia »

Online Bigun

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Re: Replacing the Republican Party
« Reply #499 on: August 24, 2017, 01:15:38 am »
I submit you are wrong, yet again.

I value the contributions of Senator Cruz and am asking you to let this go for his good ... not your and not mine ... his.

And at this point, my friend, I don't give a rat's arse if you believe me.  Just don't goad the Republican electorate any further with this BS.

@Bigun

YOU are still barking up the wrong tree @Right_in_Virginia!  I invite you to find a single post of mine that brings up Senator Cruz  on this forum in months prior to this conversation.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien