Author Topic: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs  (Read 2048 times)

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Online Timber Rattler

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Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« on: April 04, 2025, 08:54:18 am »
https://www.nationalreview.com/2025/04/americans-will-pay-the-price-for-reckless-tariffs/

Quote
Believing that a country is in bad shape if it imports more goods than it exports — i.e., if it has a trade deficit — is, in most cases, a harmless error in reasoning. It’s the sort of thing that seems to make sense at first glance, but any halfway decent economics professor can train it out of students in one or two lectures.

That error in reasoning becomes harmful when the person who believes it is the president of the United States, and he is willing to claim emergency powers to act on it unilaterally. That’s what Donald Trump has done with his executive order to raise tariffs on virtually every country on earth.

As a share of the economy, the executive order is likely the largest peacetime tax increase in U.S. history. In nominal terms, it’s the largest tax increase, period. And it comes without any input from Congress. In fact, it effectively overturns USMCA, CAFTA-DR, and the twelve bilateral free trade agreements that Congress has approved. On Tuesday morning, the Dow Jones Industrial Average opened down over 1,100 points, or about 2.6 percent, in reaction to the news, while the tech-heavy Nasdaq collapsed around 800 points, or 4.6 percent.

Trump claims extraordinary powers to impose these tariffs on the basis that the trade deficit is a national emergency. He claims to be helping U.S. manufacturing firms, but groups such as the National Association of Manufacturers oppose the tariffs, probably because about half of U.S. imports are inputs for domestic production.

(snip)

The last thing that worked to substantially reduce the U.S. trade deficit was the Great Recession, because a bunch of people lost their jobs and couldn’t afford to buy as much stuff as normal. You probably remember that as a bad time, but if trade deficits are truly national-emergency-level terrible, then the 2009 reduction in the trade deficit should have been great news.

Trump likes to frame his trade policy as “commonsense.” To treat allies worse than enemies and raise taxes on consumers and businesses at a time when the cost of living is a major concern is anything but commonsense. Trump’s mistaken beliefs about trade have been a constant since the 1980s, but now they have been combined with an enormous grant of power, and Americans will pay the price.

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Online catfish1957

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2025, 09:06:22 am »
The NR used to be a decent source of conservative punditry.

Now it mostly trumpets the NWO Bushy/Cheney remnant POV.   Again, just  like the MSM, no where in that article does the NR mention or highlight that every one of those tariffs is at or below what the corresponding nation charges us.  If the NR wants to be that morally corrupt, let them join the ash heaps of CNN, MSNBC, WaPo, etc.
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Offline Free Vulcan

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2025, 09:18:05 am »
We've already paid a steep price for other nation's tariffs on us.
The Republic is lost.

Offline Fishrrman

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2025, 05:58:58 pm »
Catfish reminds us with:
"Now it mostly trumpets the NWO Bushy/Cheney remnant POV.   Again, just  like the MSM, no where in that article does the NR mention or highlight that every one of those tariffs is at or below what the corresponding nation charges us..."

Once again, for your perusal:
(it can enlarged if you wish by opening in a new window)

Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2025, 06:38:51 am »
Catfish reminds us with:
"Now it mostly trumpets the NWO Bushy/Cheney remnant POV.   Again, just  like the MSM, no where in that article does the NR mention or highlight that every one of those tariffs is at or below what the corresponding nation charges us..."

Once again, for your perusal:
(it can enlarged if you wish by opening in a new window)



This list is long been debunked. And not just by “NWO Globalists” but even by people like Ben Shapiro

This is a reflection of a bigger problem in today’s society. People will post things that are provably false and misleading without checking its veracity but it spreads quickly and becomes the “truth”

Goebbels would’ve loved to have the internet in his time

https://www.tiktok.com/@mostviralclipzz/video/7489317162113518894



The very same people who claimed to be skeptical of any stats coming from government just a few short years ago are suddenly embracing every claim made by Donald Trump as gospel. Good for Mr. Shapiro for exercising a bit of a skepticism of government claims, even if it comes from his own team.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2025, 06:47:39 am by LMAO »
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2025, 07:16:26 am »
Goebbels would’ve loved to have the internet in his time

As his devoted student, you would know ....

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2025, 09:29:47 am »
We've already paid a steep price for other nation's tariffs on us.
Amen.
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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2025, 09:36:38 am »

This list is long been debunked. And not just by “NWO Globalists” but even by people like Ben Shapiro




Drama queen.  It has been well noted that the accuracy of this chart contained some extrapolations, because preparing a finite to the dollar lisiting per every and all 100 countires in a  detailed chart would be an exercise that would take a year.  I think, well hope you understand the seriousness of adjusting trade parameters.

But your wholehearted endorsement of us getting screwed in international trade partners has been duly noted.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2025, 09:54:42 am by catfish1957 »
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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2025, 09:53:20 am »
Amen.

In business and industry in project management, the 90% rule is applied to cost and budget expense and capital projects.  Reason being, if you get pencil d--k's and Controller and Accounting bureaucrats putting the pencil to it down to the penny......   Ypu'd never start or complete a project.

And Ben Shapiro?  I thought he was smarter than that.
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2025, 10:17:42 am »
Drama queen.  It has been well noted that the accuracy of this chart contained some extrapolations, because preparing a finite to the dollar lisiting per every and all 100 countires in a  detailed chart would be an exercise that would take a year.  I think, well hope you understand the seriousness of adjusting trade parameters.

But your wholehearted endorsement of us getting screwed in international trade partners has been duly noted.

Sorry, it’s been debunked. Whether you choose to accept it or not as your business.
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2025, 10:32:01 am »
Sorry, it’s been debunked. Whether you choose to accept it or not as your business.

LMAO @LMAO

If you are that naive to expect the chart to be correct to the penny....    then it is debunked.  But so then is every OMB projection, and congressional budgetary number.    I hope you are more understanding of finance than that.

You choose not to understand concepts of time constraints, extrapolation, negotiation, and approximation.  Well that's your business too.
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline Bigun

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2025, 10:36:09 am »
Sorry, it’s been debunked. Whether you choose to accept it or not as your business.

Debunked by who? The same people who tell us that our children need 200+ inoculations before they turn two?
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2025, 10:37:59 am »
LMAO @LMAO

If you are that naive to expect the chart to be correct to the penny....    then it is debunked.  But so then is every OMB projection, and congressional budgetary number.    I hope you are more understanding of finance than that.

You choose not to understand concepts of time constraints, extrapolation, negotiation, and approximation.  Well that's your business too.


Third time, that chart has been debunked. Just like Donald Trump’s Canadian tariffs and dairy product claim.


Not everything that goes against your narrative is the result of “New World order globalists to git you”

Donald Trump put out that chart and said this was the tariffs other countries were charging us. You’re trying to come up with a twisted formula in order to make his lies  more truthful to you and palatable


It’s become an eye-opening experience to watch the same people who questioned everything that normally comes out of government are now fully embracing everything Donald Trump is claiming without question

Political tribalism or cultish devotion? Could be both.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2025, 10:42:11 am by LMAO »
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2025, 10:45:00 am »
Debunked by who? The same people who tell us that our children need 200+ inoculations before they turn two?

Funny, he cites only one valid conservative, and thinks it is debunked. And Shapiro?  As strong he is, is often a guy who can't see the forest from the trees, and gets bogged down in minutia.  He's the kind of guy who will argue that you didn't pay $100 because it was $99.97.

I gave him ample reason to understand the chart, but some are hopeless I guess.
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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #14 on: April 05, 2025, 10:49:45 am »

Third time, that chart has been debunked. Just like Donald Trump’s Canadian tariffs and dairy product claim.


Not everything that goes against your narrative is the result of “New World order globalists to git you”

Donald Trump put out that chart and said this was the tariffs other countries were charging us. You’re trying to come up with a twisted formula in order to make his lies  more truthful to you and palatable


It’s become an eye-opening experience to watch the same people who questioned everything that normally comes out of government are now fully embracing everything Donald Trump is claiming without question

Political tribalism or cultish devotion? Could be both.


@Right_in_Virginia
@DCPatriot

OMG....you are calling me MAGA?   I pinged a couple of regulars, maybe they'll give me street cred now.   :silly:

I give up, the fact, you can't understand approximation, and extrapolation?  I think we just part company, because you just don't get it or understand it.  I pride myself on being versed on economic matters, and have done well in that area.   But WTF do I know huh? 
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #15 on: April 05, 2025, 10:52:33 am »
Funny, he cites only one valid conservative, and thinks it is debunked. And Shapiro?  As strong he is, is often a guy who can't see the forest from the trees, and gets bogged down in minutia.  He's the kind of guy who will argue that you didn't pay $100 because it was $99.97.

I gave him ample reason to understand the chart, but some are hopeless I guess.

He's only 58, lives in Wisconsin, and likely just voted to put a Commie on the Supreme court there.  22222frying pan
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #16 on: April 05, 2025, 10:55:12 am »
The NR used to be a decent source of conservative punditry.

Now it mostly trumpets the NWO Bushy/Cheney remnant POV.   Again, just  like the MSM, no where in that article does the NR mention or highlight that every one of those tariffs is at or below what the corresponding nation charges us.  If the NR wants to be that morally corrupt, let them join the ash heaps of CNN, MSNBC, WaPo, etc.

Trump's chart wasn't exactly on the level with us either though was it? They used some sort of formula that included currency manipulation and also just import/export deficits as proof of a tariff... he also used VAT which is basically like a sales tax.

Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #17 on: April 05, 2025, 10:55:28 am »
He's only 58, lives in Wisconsin, and likely just voted to put a Commie on the Supreme court there.  22222frying pan

Nope

But the MAGA  movement did help put that woman on the Supreme Court. Ten counties that went for Donald Trump voted for a far left progressive like Susan Crawford.

And when Congress shifts next year or worse, we end up with a very far left progressive as president in 2028, I’m  holding MAGA accountable
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

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My Avatar is my adult autistic son Tommy

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2025, 10:56:34 am »
He's only 58, lives in Wisconsin, and likely just voted to put a Commie on the Supreme court there.  22222frying pan

That is bleep libelous, slanderous shit. Total trash post. I want to nuke it.

Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2025, 10:56:42 am »
Trump's chart wasn't exactly on the level with us either though was it? They used some sort of formula that included currency manipulation and also just import/export deficits as proof of a tariff... he also used VAT which is basically like a sales tax.


And Donald Trump went out there and told people these were the tariffs that countries were charging us, including islands  that are uninhabited


Yet, despite how much his supporters want to use twisted formulas to bail him out, that’s not selling
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

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My Avatar is my adult autistic son Tommy

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2025, 10:58:58 am »

@Right_in_Virginia
@DCPatriot

OMG....you are calling me MAGA?   I pinged a couple of regulars, maybe they'll give me street cred now.   :silly:

I give up, the fact, you can't understand approximation, and extrapolation?  I think we just part company, because you just don't get it or understand it.  I pride myself on being versed on economic matters, and have done well in that area.   But WTF do I know huh?

@catfish1957

Have watched the bandwagon thread closely and frankly awed at your knowledge and perception on the topic of tariffs, etc..  It is certainly your 'Wheelhouse'.

Baseball and now economics??  Why, I'd even had let my daughter date you!!
   :laugh:
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #21 on: April 05, 2025, 10:59:58 am »
In business and industry in project management, the 90% rule is applied to cost and budget expense and capital projects.  Reason being, if you get pencil d--k's and Controller and Accounting bureaucrats putting the pencil to it down to the penny......   Ypu'd never start or complete a project.

And Ben Shapiro?  I thought he was smarter than that.
I agree with what you said, so am trying to figure out whether you think I do not.
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Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #22 on: April 05, 2025, 11:02:48 am »
Ben Shapiro went out and did what everybody should do and that is when Donald Trump says these are the tariffs that countries are charging us, he went out and he investigated it and found it to be mythical.

Now he’s being attacked for doing what naturally anybody should do when it comes to the government stats and claims

Wouldn’t surprise me at all if he’s getting threats from that segment
« Last Edit: April 05, 2025, 11:03:56 am by LMAO »
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

Barry Goldwater

http://www.usdebtclock.org

My Avatar is my adult autistic son Tommy

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #23 on: April 05, 2025, 11:03:47 am »
Trump's chart wasn't exactly on the level with us either though was it? They used some sort of formula that included currency manipulation and also just import/export deficits as proof of a tariff... he also used VAT which is basically like a sales tax.

Hate sounding like a broken record, but you do realize that if a comprehensive chart was made country by country and product by product, would have taken at least a year.  We need to grant Trump some latitude for extrapolation, and use of the 90% rule.  And currency manipulation?  That sleazy tactic is real,  has been perfected by the Chicoms, and does need to be included on a formulaic basis. 

And most important of all......   This was an opening salvo.  This was the high price point in negotiations .  You ask for the moon, and then work down from there. 
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #24 on: April 05, 2025, 11:06:25 am »
Hate sounding like a broken record, but you do realize that if a comprehensive chart was made country by country and product by product, would have taken at least a year.  We need to grant Trump some latitude for extrapolation, and use of the 90% rule.  And currency manipulation?  That sleazy tactic is real,  has been perfected by the Chicoms, and does need to be included on a formulaic basis. 

And most important of all......   This was an opening salvo.  This was the high price point in negotiations .  You ask for the moon, and then work down from there.

You think we haven't done currency manipulation since the Nixon shock?

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #25 on: April 05, 2025, 11:07:53 am »
Ben Shapiro went out and did what everybody should do and that is when Donald Trump says these are the tariffs that countries are charging us, he went out and he investigated it and found it to be mythical.

Now he’s being attacked for doing what naturally anybody should do when it comes to the government stats and claims

Wouldn’t surprise me at all if he’s getting threats from that segment

Over react much?  I complimented Shaprio, and think he is one of the best young conservative minds in this country right now.  But is he 100.00% correct?  Nope.
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #26 on: April 05, 2025, 11:09:18 am »
You think we haven't done currency manipulation since the Nixon shock?

Big difference in short term spot uses and perpetual practice.  I think you are sharp enough to understand that.
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline Bigun

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #28 on: April 05, 2025, 11:23:28 am »
@catfish1957

Have watched the bandwagon thread closely and frankly awed at your knowledge and perception on the topic of tariffs, etc..  It is certainly your 'Wheelhouse'.



Thanks...  that's quite a compliment coming from you.  Here is another one I posted yesterday, that the naysayers won't respond to.....
What was cited by one Briefer was RWR's comments around free trade.  Which might have been proper and timely at that time in an era of equitable trading.   The problem is, that the world of trade in 1982, looks nothing like today.

Here is the quote:

"This philosophy also consisted of a commitment to sound money as exemplified by the gold standard, low levels of taxation and regulation, balanced budgets, and a commitment to property rights and economic liberty. These principles along with the protective tariff defined the political economy of the Republican Party. The doctrine of protectionism was not just putting “America first,” but also protecting the entire economy and labor by preserving manufacturing and solid wages for workers"


Was that a Donald Trump quote?  It sure sounds like one.   Nope....  it was made by the greatest American president in history around fiscal matters in 1925.....   Calvin Coolidge   Silent Cal, actually at one point had our government operating at a surplus. So do I support tariffs as a perpetual means of sovereign fiscal policy?  Of course not.  But some level of equity and fairness needs to be invoked into the process, or our demise will be accelerated.

https://coolidgefoundation.org/blog/grand-old-protectionists-calvin-coolidge-and-the-full-dinner-pail/
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #29 on: April 05, 2025, 11:26:03 am »
Over react much?  I complimented Shaprio, and think he is one of the best young conservative minds in this country right now.  But is he 100.00% correct?  Nope.

Actually, I’m quite enjoying this. It’s further evidence to me of how tribal politics have become.

It’s another issue of where,  if this was Joe Biden, you and others here would not be defending him. You wouldn’t come up with twisted formulas to explain where Joe Biden is actually right.

What do you think the reaction on this site, for example, would be if Joe Biden, while the market is crashing  and people are watching their 401(k)s decline, was selling gold citizenship cards and then took off golfing?
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

Barry Goldwater

http://www.usdebtclock.org

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Online Hoodat

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #30 on: April 05, 2025, 11:38:13 am »
Actually, I’m quite enjoying this. It’s further evidence to me of how tribal politics have become.

It’s another issue of where,  if this was Joe Biden, you and others here would not be defending him. You wouldn’t come up with twisted formulas to explain where Joe Biden is actually right.

B-I-N-G-O !!!

Which is why I keep asking the question, "What is it you people want to achieve?".  And the great mystery question, "What is it that Trump is trying to achieve?"  Because if you can't answer either of those questions, then you fall into the tribal politics category above.
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Online catfish1957

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #31 on: April 05, 2025, 11:39:36 am »
B-I-N-G-O !!!

Which is why I keep asking the question, "What is it you people want to achieve?".  And the great mystery question, "What is it that Trump is trying to achieve?"  Because if you can't answer either of those questions, then you fall into the tribal politics category above.

I answered.  What is your counter?
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Online Hoodat

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #32 on: April 05, 2025, 11:43:43 am »
I haven't followed the intricacies of these tariffs, mainly because I have adopted a wait-and-see approach.  I learned through the last Trump term that he loves stirring the pot but is quick to check while keeping his hand hidden.  But there have been a few actions that I trouble me.  Correct me on this if I got this wrong, but was some tariff rate formula implemented that punishes other countries for running trade surpluses with the US?  If this is the case, then that policy will not work.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #33 on: April 05, 2025, 11:48:48 am »
I answered.  What is your counter?

Sorry, I missed it.  Can you tell me where I can find it?  I had originally posted the question here, but there was no response from you on that thread.

I really am interested in hearing what matters to other people.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #34 on: April 05, 2025, 12:00:00 pm »
I actually like and respect catfish and I think he’s a smart guy. I’ll take my jabs  at him and he’ll take his jabs at me and at the end of the day we’ll find more common ground than opposition.

But there’s been a lot of of defending Donald Trump over things that no democrat would ever be defended over

What would the reaction be amongst Trump supporters if after Biden  passed the  inflation reduction act, we found out he warned companies about raising prices as a result


They’ve been all over the map on these. We’re being by the blonde young PS that there wouldn’t be any pain

https://www.yahoo.com/news/leavitt-trump-tariffs-won-t-231202743.html


But now we’re told we have to suffer

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/04/us/politics/trump-tariffs-us-economy-prices.html


Then there is the claim that this is actually a tax cut for the American people which nobody is buying

This is looking very similar to the ObamaCare or the so called summer of recovery arguments in 2009 that got so bad that Democrats wouldn’t even show up to town halls and some  were even suggesting postponing the 2010 elections.

I was banging my head on the walls at that time with liberals who told me I was wrong, and all of this will just be wonderful and cited examples of how businesses were hiring because of the recovery act pass by Obama and how Americans will save money on their health insurance while still being able to keep it

None turned out to be true.

So now he’s claiming the weak  will fail over these tariffs. Which tells me that he’s sensing this isn’t going as planned so he’s setting up small businesses to take the blame




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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #35 on: April 05, 2025, 12:13:48 pm »
Actually, I’m quite enjoying this. It’s further evidence to me of how tribal politics have become.

It’s another issue of where,  if this was Joe Biden, you and others here would not be defending him. You wouldn’t come up with twisted formulas to explain where Joe Biden is actually right.

What do you think the reaction on this site, for example, would be if Joe Biden, while the market is crashing  and people are watching their 401(k)s decline, was selling gold citizenship cards and then took off golfing?

You have said multiple times on this thread it has been "debunked," but I must have missed the link you posted to back that up.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #36 on: April 05, 2025, 12:18:19 pm »
You have said multiple times on this thread it has been "debunked," but I must have missed the link you posted to back that up.

I apologize.  You’re right

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/04/us/politics/trump-tariffs-us-economy-prices.html

https://www.dw.com/en/fact-check-trumps-false-claims-about-tariffs/a-72137021

https://taxfoundation.org/blog/trump-reciprocal-tariffs-calculations/



Those  are a few, and there are a lot more.


I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

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Offline Cyber Liberty

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« Last Edit: April 05, 2025, 12:33:54 pm by Cyber Liberty »
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Online catfish1957

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #38 on: April 05, 2025, 12:31:55 pm »
Actually, I’m quite enjoying this. It’s further evidence to me of how tribal politics have become.

It’s another issue of where,  if this was Joe Biden, you and others here would not be defending him. You wouldn’t come up with twisted formulas to explain where Joe Biden is actually right.

What do you think the reaction on this site, for example, would be if Joe Biden, while the market is crashing  and people are watching their 401(k)s decline, was selling gold citizenship cards and then took off golfing?

You steered your silly naysayer car into the ditch by invoking Pedo Joe.   I wouldn't trust him with a lemonaide stand.

Try for a better analogy than that.
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Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #39 on: April 05, 2025, 12:42:27 pm »
You steered your silly naysayer car into the ditch by invoking Pedo Joe.   I wouldn't trust him with a lemonaide stand.

Try for a better analogy than that.

It doesn’t have to be Biden. It could be any democrat.

Let’s go the 2024 campaign. When Harris  threatened to go after businesses and renters who raise prices under the guise of  “price gouging” there was page after page here of people pointing out the folly  of that idea and they were right. Some even called her a communist.

That’s called price controls and we know the history and results of price controls


Yet there is a thread on Trump warning car manufacturers against raising prices due to his tariffs, and it barely got two pages. In fact, if I recall, there was one or two that actually supported it.

Which to me doesn’t make sense. We’re told that tariffs won’t raise prices, but yet the president had to warn an industry not to raise prices as a result of tariffs?



To me, it’s in your face hypocrisy. A bad idea is a bad idea, regardless of what party it comes from.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2025, 01:22:07 pm by LMAO »
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Online catfish1957

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #40 on: April 05, 2025, 02:57:42 pm »
It doesn’t have to be Biden. It could be any democrat.

Let’s go the 2024 campaign. When Harris  threatened to go after businesses and renters who raise prices under the guise of  “price gouging” there was page after page here of people pointing out the folly  of that idea and they were right. Some even called her a communist.

That’s called price controls and we know the history and results of price controls


Yet there is a thread on Trump warning car manufacturers against raising prices due to his tariffs, and it barely got two pages. In fact, if I recall, there was one or two that actually supported it.

Which to me doesn’t make sense. We’re told that tariffs won’t raise prices, but yet the president had to warn an industry not to raise prices as a result of tariffs?



To me, it’s in your face hypocrisy. A bad idea is a bad idea, regardless of what party it comes from.
You are equating raising tariffs, which still happen to be still lower or at  the corresponding member nation level.   To price gouging?

Do you understand what you just said? 

No one said tariffs wouldn't result in higher prices, at least short term.  But, when member nations negotiate, this will level off.  Or in even more concrete terms and more important, some short term pain, might be worth the long term, when it comes to preserving our national wealth base for our descendant.    I'll make those sacrifices....  will you?
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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #41 on: April 05, 2025, 03:06:50 pm »
Trump Assures Pain From Tariffs Should Settle Down By His Third Term

https://babylonbee.com/news/trump-assures-pain-from-tariffs-should-settle-down-by-his-third-term

Quote
WASHINGTON, D.C. — With the nation anxious about the ramifications of widespread tariffs, President Trump assured Americans that everything would be settled down by the time his third term started.

Though admitting that tariffs may cause temporary market chaos and inflation, Trump remained confident that the short-term pain would lead to an economic boom in his next term.

"By the time I'm sworn in on January 20, 2029, all these worries will be in the past," said Trump. "It will be the new golden age of America. People will ask if you remember the market crashing in 2025, and you'll say no, because you'll be too busy counting all your money. We're going to be so rich, and so much stronger when I start my third term, it's going to all be worth it, believe me."

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Offline roamer_1

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #42 on: April 05, 2025, 03:14:28 pm »
Sorry, it’s been debunked. Whether you choose to accept it or not as your business.

Whether it's true or not is immaterial.
It doesn't matter.
It's the wrong focus.

The knee-jerk thing it presents is that it's not fair.
And it's not fair. It never will be fair.
Your Mammas should have showed you that a long time ago.

The way you bring business back is not by making it harder.
You make it BETTER here for business. You take the weight OFF. you make it conducive toward profit. You give them cheap labor and easy access to raw materials.

That is what will bring em back.
That is not what you're doing.
Because your big government is in your own way.

Offline LMAO

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #43 on: April 05, 2025, 03:14:42 pm »
You are equating raising tariffs, which still happen to be still lower or at  the corresponding member nation level.   To price gouging?

Do you understand what you just said? 

No one said tariffs wouldn't result in higher prices, at least short term.  But, when member nations negotiate, this will level off.  Or in even more concrete terms and more important, some short term pain, might be worth the long term, when it comes to preserving our national wealth base for our descendant.    I'll make those sacrifices....  will you?


Do you realize that every response you make to my point proves my point even further :cool:
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

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Offline bigheadfred

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #44 on: April 05, 2025, 03:52:51 pm »
Whether it's true or not is immaterial.
It doesn't matter.
It's the wrong focus.

The knee-jerk thing it presents is that it's not fair.
And it's not fair. It never will be fair.
Your Mammas should have showed you that a long time ago.

The way you bring business back is not by making it harder.
You make it BETTER here for business. You take the weight OFF. you make it conducive toward profit. You give them cheap labor and easy access to raw materials.

That is what will bring em back.
That is not what you're doing.
Because your big government is in your own way.

Lots of moving parts out there. Makes it hard to see the big picture.

https://www.federalregister.gov/executive-order/14192
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Online Hoodat

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #45 on: April 05, 2025, 04:05:18 pm »
Do you realize that every response you make to my point proves my point even further :cool:

Never thought I would see people championing higher taxes on this forum, @LMAO .
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #46 on: April 05, 2025, 04:11:53 pm »
Never thought I would see people championing higher taxes on this forum, @LMAO .
Ever hear of a mole?
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Offline roamer_1

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #47 on: April 05, 2025, 04:12:36 pm »
Lots of moving parts out there. Makes it hard to see the big picture.


That's why we lean so hard on principle.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Americans Will Pay the Price for Reckless Tariffs
« Reply #48 on: April 05, 2025, 05:56:18 pm »
Quote
Exclusive — Sen. David McCormick: Tariffs ‘Just One Chapter of the Book of the Trump Economic Agenda’
Breitbart,  Apr 5, 2025

Tariffs are just “one chapter of the book of the Trump economic agenda,” Sen. David McCormick (R-PA) said during an appearance on Breitbart News Saturday, discussing tariffs and the latest jobs numbers.

The latest jobs numbers, he began, are a “reflection of a number of companies already starting to invest in jobs in the United States,” or “an early response to the Trump economic agenda.”

"And listen, you know, the last month has been tariffs, tariffs, tariffs… And I will talk about that in a minute. But the tariffs are just one chapter of the book of the Trump economic agenda, and there’s some uncertainty around them, but there’s so much certainty around a number of other things,” he explained.

"There’s certainly around huge deregulation that is well underway, around energy dominance, which is going to lower energy prices and make it very attractive for companies to do business in the United States. There’s the extension, and I think the permanence of the 2017 tax cuts, which I do believe will happen. There’s trillions of dollars of foreign direct investment that’s already being committed since President Trump came into office,” he said, describing those things as all “good stuff that’s going to help the American people create jobs.”

As for the tariffs, he said, those are designed to solve a “particular problem, and it’s a big problem, which is the global trading system has not been fair to the United States, and it’s been increasingly unfair.”

“So, you know, to help the world come back from World War II, we gave very favorable terms to the world, and those terms have largely stuck. It hasn’t gotten better. China and many other companies’ countries have taken advantage,” he said, explaining that the tariffs are designed to bring “fairness” back for the American worker.


More w/audio: https://www.breitbart.com/radio/2025/04/05/exclusive-sen-david-mccormick-tariffs-just-one-chapter-of-the-book-of-the-trump-economic-agenda/

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