Ukraine 4

[catfish1957]

When it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, and ....

Too bad you can't photobomb this one, because if you want to use that silly duck analogy, you could quack along with your buddies here...

[PeteS in CA]

The war started in 2014 long before Zelensky even thought of running for office.

Also before Ukraine requested NATO membership.

[PeteS in CA]

Ukraine Strikes Moscow Oil Refinery in Massive Drone Barrage

Wall Street Journal by Matthew Luxmoore 9/1/2024

Russia’s Defense Ministry said more than 150 drones were fired against targets across the country on Sunday

Ukraine struck a major oil refinery in Moscow and other targets across Russia in one of its largest aerial barrages since the start of Russia’s invasion, expanding a campaign of drone attacks on energy facilities and further highlighting the vulnerability of strategic infrastructure deep inside Russia.

Russia’s defense ministry said on Sunday that its air defenses had intercepted or shot down more than 150 drones in 15 regions. At least one of them detonated over a major refinery in Moscow that is owned by state energy giant Gazprom, officials said, while another hit a power station in the neighboring Tver region.
...

Russian Narrative: Ukraine has equipped its drones with precision-guided debris that hits the intended target when the drone is destroyed.

Ukraine: Oops! You missed again ... and again ... and again ... and again ... and again ... and again ...

[Hoodat]

Also before Ukraine requested NATO membership.

But after 1 trillion cubic meters of gas reserves were discovered in Donbas and 4 trillion in Crimea.



The energy dimensions of Russia’s annexation of Crimea

Dr. Frank Umbach  |  27 May 2014

Ukraine’s energy independence and gas diversification strategy of last August to reduce its gas dependence on Russia came unstuck following Russia’s annexation of the Crimean peninsula. Prior to this, the Yanukovych government had managed to decrease Ukraine’s gas imports from Russia from 45 bcm in 2011 to just 28 bcm in 2013. The original plan was to end any Russian gas imports by 2020. This was a stepping stone on the way to becoming self-sufficient by 2035 by boosting domestic conventional and unconventional gas extraction.

Putin’s annexation of Crimea was very much driven by undermining Ukraine’s energy and gas diversification strategy. For the strategy to work, the Crimean peninsula was of strategic importance. It has vast offshore oil and gas resources in the Black Sea, estimated between 4-13 trillion cm of natural gas.

The new illegal Crimean government has entrusted Gazprom to manage the peninsula’s energy resources. The Crimean branch of Naftohaz Ukrainy, Chornomor Naftohaz, has already been “nationalised” by Gazprom. It is also expected that Russia will claim large parts not just of Crimea’s, but also of Ukraine’s continental shelf and Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ), which may seriously complicate the division of the Black Sea continental shelf and EEZs with Romania and Turkey.

Ukraine is now concerned about losing one of the two largest shale gas fields (“Yuzivska field”) in the Donetsk and Kharkiv ‘oblasts’ or regions. Ukraine holds Europe’s third largest shale gas reserves. The new regional separatism of its eastern regions also undermines Kiev’s plan to switch from gas to coal, due to its losing 45.6 percent of its national coal reserves.  .  .  .

https://www.nato.int/docu/review/articles/2014/05/27/the-energy-dimensions-of-russias-annexation-of-crimea/index.html


This war was launched over greed.  Putin's oligarch buddies wanted that gas and oil.  And Putin obliged.  And now tens of thousands are being massacred because of it.  These Russians want nothing better than to clear the land of people and cities and take the gas and oil.

[Smokin Joe]

Too bad you can't photobomb this one, because if you want to use that silly duck analogy, you could quack along with your buddies here...

I don't know any of those people. Seriously. I can't claim one as a "buddy" and would not claim the others because we have nothing in common.
 
Russia invaded Ukraine (again). Ukraine is fighting back.

I support  that, as much as I am for the Confederates kicking the Yankees out of Manassas (twice). We helped kick the Germans out of most of Europe (twice). At least this time our direct military involvement is very limited, and we aren't claiming the Soviets are our friends.

It isn't an either/or proposition.

We can spend money we don't have on both securing our border and helping Ukraine, but the will is not present in this administration to secure our border. Instead this administration has spent billions bringing in illegals and at least two of the people in that picture support that emphasis and a host of other policies I do not.

Zeleneskey is doing what any politician would do to try to save his country from being overrun. He's gone to the most capable people (US DoD and the rest of NATO) who might be opposed to Ukraine being overrun, and brought in the NATO countries, too. If that means making some concessions in stated policy to get the help to face an existential threat, so be it. What you practice doesn't have to flange up with the words, if it keeps your country from being overrun. As for corruption, there will be some, somewhere, sure. But this is the guy who defeated the previous corrupt regime there, and I'm willing to give him some benefit of the doubt.  He was already rich when he was elected, being an entertainer and the Ukrainian equivalent of media mogul. It's the underlings who will be more tempted to steal funds, most of which I doubt ever make it to Ukraine, just as some of the ordnance has not.

[Smokin Joe]

But after 1 trillion cubic meters of gas reserves were discovered in Donbas and 4 trillion in Crimea.



The energy dimensions of Russia’s annexation of Crimea

Dr. Frank Umbach  |  27 May 2014

Ukraine’s energy independence and gas diversification strategy of last August to reduce its gas dependence on Russia came unstuck following Russia’s annexation of the Crimean peninsula. Prior to this, the Yanukovych government had managed to decrease Ukraine’s gas imports from Russia from 45 bcm in 2011 to just 28 bcm in 2013. The original plan was to end any Russian gas imports by 2020. This was a stepping stone on the way to becoming self-sufficient by 2035 by boosting domestic conventional and unconventional gas extraction.

Putin’s annexation of Crimea was very much driven by undermining Ukraine’s energy and gas diversification strategy. For the strategy to work, the Crimean peninsula was of strategic importance. It has vast offshore oil and gas resources in the Black Sea, estimated between 4-13 trillion cm of natural gas.

The new illegal Crimean government has entrusted Gazprom to manage the peninsula’s energy resources. The Crimean branch of Naftohaz Ukrainy, Chornomor Naftohaz, has already been “nationalised” by Gazprom. It is also expected that Russia will claim large parts not just of Crimea’s, but also of Ukraine’s continental shelf and Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ), which may seriously complicate the division of the Black Sea continental shelf and EEZs with Romania and Turkey.

Ukraine is now concerned about losing one of the two largest shale gas fields (“Yuzivska field”) in the Donetsk and Kharkiv ‘oblasts’ or regions. Ukraine holds Europe’s third largest shale gas reserves. The new regional separatism of its eastern regions also undermines Kiev’s plan to switch from gas to coal, due to its losing 45.6 percent of its national coal reserves.  .  .  .

https://www.nato.int/docu/review/articles/2014/05/27/the-energy-dimensions-of-russias-annexation-of-crimea/index.html


This war was launched over greed.  Putin's oligarch buddies wanted that gas and oil.  And Putin obliged.  And now tens of thousands are being massacred because of it.  These Russians want nothing better than to clear the land of people and cities and take the gas and oil.

Putin's push to land lock Ukraine by seizing the coast has the added dimension of getting offshore drilling rights along with that coastline, something just beginning to be explored in the Black Sea. It isn't just about controlling access to deep water ports for the shipment of grain.

[Kamaji]

Too bad you can't photobomb this one, because if you want to use that silly duck analogy, you could quack along with your buddies here...

Hmm, the president of a country facing an existential crisis is asking the supreme legislature of the United States for help.  Really suspicious.  Yeah.  That's ToS quality thinking there, ducky.

[catfish1957]

Hmm, the president of a country facing an existential crisis is asking the supreme legislature of the United States for help.  Really suspicious.  Yeah.  That's ToS quality thinking there, ducky.

ToS???  show me some proof. 

That place is not conservative.  And for the upteenth time...   We are $35T in debt.  15M have poured across  the boarder, the past few years,  and this is seen as the existential threat?

Me?  I am of the camp that a picture can speak a 1000 words.  And in this case....   maybe 10,000.  And there is absolutely no earthly reason that I will agree with those two.....   EVER!!!!

[Kamaji]

ToS???  show me some proof. 

That place is not conservative.  And for the upteenth time...   We are $35T in debt.  15M have poured across  the boarder, the past few years,  and this is seen as the existential threat?

Me?  I am of the camp that a picture can speak a 1000 words.  And in this case....   maybe 10,000.  And there is absolutely no earthly reason that I will agree with those two.....   EVER!!!!

One can lead a horse to water, .....

[berdie]

I don't know any of those people. Seriously. I can't claim one as a "buddy" and would not claim the others because we have nothing in common.
 
Russia invaded Ukraine (again). Ukraine is fighting back.

I support  that, as much as I am for the Confederates kicking the Yankees out of Manassas (twice). We helped kick the Germans out of most of Europe (twice). At least this time our direct military involvement is very limited, and we aren't claiming the Soviets are our friends.

It isn't an either/or proposition.

We can spend money we don't have on both securing our border and helping Ukraine, but the will is not present in this administration to secure our border. Instead this administration has spent billions bringing in illegals and at least two of the people in that picture support that emphasis and a host of other policies I do not.

Zeleneskey is doing what any politician would do to try to save his country from being overrun. He's gone to the most capable people (US DoD and the rest of NATO) who might be opposed to Ukraine being overrun, and brought in the NATO countries, too. If that means making some concessions in stated policy to get the help to face an existential threat, so be it. What you practice doesn't have to flange up with the words, if it keeps your country from being overrun. As for corruption, there will be some, somewhere, sure. But this is the guy who defeated the previous corrupt regime there, and I'm willing to give him some benefit of the doubt.  He was already rich when he was elected, being an entertainer and the Ukrainian equivalent of media mogul. It's the underlings who will be more tempted to steal funds, most of which I doubt ever make it to Ukraine, just as some of the ordnance has not.

Great post!

[catfish1957]

One can lead a horse to water, .....

 

Respect your opinion, but just don't agree.  In the past 30 years we've thrown Trillions at wars away from here, that have yielded us nothing but massive debt.   My opinion might change, if we had some decent leadership who can clearly explain why this is a good idea, and why a power 7K miles away and that is 11th in GDP (and dropping like a rock) is a threat to the American way.   While mostly up to recent the real ones with vested interest (EU/NATO) haven't even proportionally contributed.

Till then?   

[Kamaji]

Respect your opinion, but just don't agree.  In the past 30 years we've thrown Trillions at wars away from here, that have yielded us nothing but massive debt.   My opinion might change, if we had some decent leadership who can clearly explain why this is a good idea, and why a power 7K miles away and that is 11th in GDP (and dropping like a rock) is a threat to the American way.   While mostly up to recent the real ones with vested interest (EU/NATO) haven't even proportionally contributed.

Till then?   

The thing is, you're so easily led by the nose.  All one has to do is to align someone I don't want you to like with a democrat, and you hate that person is a most pavlovian manner.

[MeganC]

  We are $35T in debt.  15M have poured across  the boarder, the past few years,  and this is seen as the existential threat?

One more time: this is a very tired Russian troll talking point. So why do you like it so much?

[Hoodat]

?  I am of the camp that a picture can speak a 1000 words.  And in this case....   maybe 10,000.  And there is absolutely no earthly reason that I will agree with those two.....   EVER!!!!

@catfish1957

Something you and Zelenskiy have in common then.  Because he damn sure doesn't agree with Congress enriching the State Department and the Defense Department at the expense of Ukraine getting weapons.  But then you knew that already.  Or at least you should since it has been explained to you dozens of times already.

Again, Zelenskiy is fighting for the survival of Ukraine.  Russia wants to take over all of it.  In order to defend Ukraine against this Russian takeover, Zelenskiy needs weapons.  He needs them by any means necessary.  And if that means sucking up to the current US political regime in order to get $2.5 billion in scraps from a $20 billion Defense Department drawdown, then that's what he'll do.  He ends up with $2.5 billion in obsolete US equipment that he wouldn't have had if he had not engaged in the first place.  Yet you're pissed off at him because Biden/Pelosi/Harris are bragging about the $20 billion they just gave Ukraine even though 88% of that never left the US.

You are pissed off at the wrong people here.  Giving Ukraine $2.5 billion in equipment doesn't really cost us a dime since that money was budgeted back in the 80s.  Or even better, stop standing in the way of other NATO countries contributing weapons.  But the Biden regime can't do that.  They are getting as much graft off of this as they possibly can.  They are the corrupt entity here, not Zelenskiy.

So if you want to bitch and moan about taxpayer dollars, then direct it where it belongs - at the current regime.  Zelenskiy is only trying to save his country, not get rich off of it.

[Kamaji]

@catfish1957

Something you and Zelenskiy have in common then.  Because he damn sure doesn't agree with Congress enriching the State Department and the Defense Department at the expense of Ukraine getting weapons.  But then you knew that already.  Or at least you should since it has been explained to you dozens of times already.

Again, Zelenskiy is fighting for the survival of Ukraine.  Russia wants to take over all of it.  In order to defend Ukraine against this Russian takeover, Zelenskiy needs weapons.  He needs them by any means necessary.  And if that means sucking up to the current US political regime in order to get $2.5 billion in scraps from a $20 billion Defense Department drawdown, then that's what he'll do.  He ends up with $2.5 billion in obsolete US equipment that he wouldn't have had if he had not engaged in the first place.  Yet you're pissed off at him because Biden/Pelosi/Harris are bragging about the $20 billion they just gave Ukraine even though 88% of that never left the US.

You are pissed off at the wrong people here.  Giving Ukraine $2.5 billion in equipment doesn't really cost us a dime since that money was budgeted back in the 80s.  Or even better, stop standing in the way of other NATO countries contributing weapons.  But the Biden regime can't do that.  They are getting as much graft off of this as they possibly can.  They are the corrupt entity here, not Zelenskiy.

So if you want to bitch and moan about taxpayer dollars, then direct it where it belongs - at the current regime.  Zelenskiy is only trying to save his country, not get rich off of it.

[MeganC]

@catfish1957

Something you and Zelenskiy have in common then.  Because he damn sure doesn't agree with Congress enriching the State Department and the Defense Department at the expense of Ukraine getting weapons.  But then you knew that already.  Or at least you should since it has been explained to you dozens of times already.

Again, Zelenskiy is fighting for the survival of Ukraine.  Russia wants to take over all of it.  In order to defend Ukraine against this Russian takeover, Zelenskiy needs weapons.  He needs them by any means necessary.  And if that means sucking up to the current US political regime in order to get $2.5 billion in scraps from a $20 billion Defense Department drawdown, then that's what he'll do.  He ends up with $2.5 billion in obsolete US equipment that he wouldn't have had if he had not engaged in the first place.  Yet you're pissed off at him because Biden/Pelosi/Harris are bragging about the $20 billion they just gave Ukraine even though 88% of that never left the US.

You are pissed off at the wrong people here.  Giving Ukraine $2.5 billion in equipment doesn't really cost us a dime since that money was budgeted back in the 80s.  Or even better, stop standing in the way of other NATO countries contributing weapons.  But the Biden regime can't do that.  They are getting as much graft off of this as they possibly can.  They are the corrupt entity here, not Zelenskiy.

So if you want to bitch and moan about taxpayer dollars, then direct it where it belongs - at the current regime.  Zelenskiy is only trying to save his country, not get rich off of it.

 

[Hoodat]

Respect your opinion, but just don't agree.  In the past 30 years we've thrown Trillions at wars away from here, that have yielded us nothing but massive debt.

It is massive social programs and the redistribution of wealth that have yielded us massive debt.  Four trillion dollars in this year alone.  Our involvement in wars is a drop in the bucket compared to that.

My opinion might change, if we had some decent leadership who can clearly explain why this is a good idea, and why a power 7K miles away and that is 11th in GDP (and dropping like a rock) is a threat to the American way.

Can't help you with the decent leadership part.  But tyranny itself is a threat to the American way.  If Russia is left unchecked, they will take over economic control of Europe.  You will find that there is no longer a market in Europe for American LNG, oil, agricultural goods, etc.  So yes, it affects us.

There are massive gas fields surrounding the edges of the Black Sea.  Do you really believe it will be in America's best interest to see them all monopolized by a tyrant who commits the barbarism that is currently being perpetrated against the Ukrainian people?  Same lesson leading up to WWII.  Do nothing, and we end up in a world war.  Or do something to prevent it.  If the French had marched into Germany in 1939 as their army invaded Poland, there wouldn't have been a WWII.  But instead, they sat on their asses and did nothing because they did not render Germany to be a threat.

[Hoodat]

This is cool.

from r/UkraineWarVideoReport

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/comments/1f74rb9/ukrainian_drone_burns_russian_positions_with/

[Hoodat]

from r/UkraineWarVideoReport

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/comments/1f7ckl5/somewhere_in_rostov_this_morning/

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

They should try napalm?

[Hoodat]

And back to politics:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzkwrOXXc5U

[Smokin Joe]

@catfish1957

Something you and Zelenskiy have in common then.  Because he damn sure doesn't agree with Congress enriching the State Department and the Defense Department at the expense of Ukraine getting weapons.  But then you knew that already.  Or at least you should since it has been explained to you dozens of times already.

Again, Zelenskiy is fighting for the survival of Ukraine.  Russia wants to take over all of it.  In order to defend Ukraine against this Russian takeover, Zelenskiy needs weapons.  He needs them by any means necessary.  And if that means sucking up to the current US political regime in order to get $2.5 billion in scraps from a $20 billion Defense Department drawdown, then that's what he'll do.  He ends up with $2.5 billion in obsolete US equipment that he wouldn't have had if he had not engaged in the first place.  Yet you're pissed off at him because Biden/Pelosi/Harris are bragging about the $20 billion they just gave Ukraine even though 88% of that never left the US.

You are pissed off at the wrong people here.  Giving Ukraine $2.5 billion in equipment doesn't really cost us a dime since that money was budgeted back in the 80s.  Or even better, stop standing in the way of other NATO countries contributing weapons.  But the Biden regime can't do that.  They are getting as much graft off of this as they possibly can.  They are the corrupt entity here, not Zelenskiy.

So if you want to bitch and moan about taxpayer dollars, then direct it where it belongs - at the current regime.  Zelenskiy is only trying to save his country, not get rich off of it.

That's how it looks from the cheap seats. Any port in a storm, and desperation doth make for strange bedfellows... Zelenesky had money, could have just left like so many others have done. I recall him saying something to the effect that he needed ammo, not a ride.

If Biden wanted to secure our border, he would not have sold off materials for scrap. It could be done by now, but the opposition was heavy on one side and not absent on the other. No matter. They'd have opened the gates, even if they had to cut holes in the wall to do it.

[Hoodat]

DAY 28 - UKRAINE'S INVASION OF RUSSIA

from r/CombatFootage

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/1f7448g/ukrainian_apc_fires_on_the_positions_of_russian/

[Hoodat]

from r/CombatFootage

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/1f72rdq/drone_footage_of_another_russian_armored_assault/

[Hoodat]

from r/UkraineWarVideoReport

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/comments/1f7dnl9/the_fire_at_the_proletarsk_oil_depot_finally/