Leftover Discussion Thread: AL Special Election

[Hoodat]

When it comes time to vote on something that matters, there is no such thing as a pro-life Democrat, no matter how loudly they claim otherwise.

[RetBobbyMI]

As posted in another thread 92% voter turnout amongst registered Dems which are out numbered in the first place, smells of voter fraud because most of that is in rural poverty areas that don’t normally vote, much less register to vote.

90+% anywhere is unheard of

[Bigun]

@Frank Cannon ...   You say Roy Moore is a "Constitutional illiterate" and offer a liberal version of the events on his second removal as proof. 3 arguments in your article you quote... I will address only one.

Lets just say even the liberal NYsLimes takes issue with it. Stupid classless jokes and articles that don't even scrape at truth are a waste of time to read in my opinion.

Try these two articles that at least somewhat honestly get to the constitutionality of Moore's position. There is better in depth articles, but I would have to dig through a lot of junk to find them (if they are even still valid URLs).. 

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/no-the-1960s-havent-returned-to-alabama/article/2560096

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/11/magazine/in-sort-of-defense-of-roy-moore.html

Your disingenuous article claims "Moore thought his opinions entitled him to disregard federal court orders.".....

The truth is the federal judge left a loophole and Moore being a good Constitutional scholar used it to defend the Alabama constitution as he was elected to do. This of course pissed off a lot of folks, so they put forth the unelected lawyer group to dismiss him because he was too witty to pin down otherwise.

There is a saying in Alabama... Bo knows... (reference to Bo Jackson knows lots of stuff)... Well Roy knows how to fight and do it constitutionally... despite how liberal media tries to spin it later on.

__________

Ping to @bigum (and thanks)...

@Sighlass

Thank YOU my friend for getting the TRUTH out there!  What you posted here is EXACTLY the reason why the Washington elites could not allow Roy Moore entrance into their very exclusive club!   

[Bigun]

Moore was a flawed candidate AND he was knifed in the back.

He was only flawed by the fact that he knows the games that are being played in Washington and how to deal with them.  If you wish to call those flaws!  I do not!

[RetBobbyMI]

@Sighlass

Thank YOU my friend for getting the TRUTH out there!  What you posted here is EXACTLY the reason why the Washington elites could not allow Roy Moore entrance into their very exclusive club!

Imagine how two constitutional protagonists like Moore and Cruz could tag team the whole GOPe.

[Jazzhead]

Keep telling yourself Moore was flawed. The electorate cannot take responsibility for its inability to discern a hit job. After all the mob is always right, and if you don't think so, they'll stone you or burn you at the stake to prove it.

Lying media and stupid voters get most of the credit, but mostly lying media.

The Alabama electorate knew damn well that Moore was a terrible candidate.  Whining about how folks are stupid is just sore-loserism.       

[musiclady]

He was only flawed by the fact that he knows the games that are being played in Washington and how to deal with them.  If you wish to call those flaws!  I do not!

Some of us think that overt racism is actually a flaw.

Interesting to find out who doesn't mind that about him.........

[Smokin Joe]

I'd like to see her out, I think her seat is up in 2018. Yes, it is.

They do a balancing act, they can toss out a bone to show they aren't for gun control or for a farm bill; that might get them reelected.

But at the state level in ND, they have definitely passed pro-life legislation with support from Democrats.

So, the general question seems to be, are there conservative democrats? Maybe at the state level, not really in DC.

At the State Level in ND, the Democrats are a minority. The reason they dominated so long at the Federal Level was farm bills, until some folks  reminded people that a Republican would vote for those Farm Bills, too, if they were from North Dakota. Heitkamp's policy blunder was in voting with the Dem herd on the CRA to remove the Methane Rule that Obama left behind, causing some pain for the Oil and Gas industry, which, with coal is the other big revenue source in the State besides agriculture. That was the one Environmental Rule that survived the transition which was subject to Congressional Revocation, and her voting with the Dems (and McCain, Collins, the usual RINO turncoats) meant that instead of being revoked immediately, any alterations or revocation of the rule had to go through the full review process.

I would prefer a Republican in that seat, but with the way the GOP has been acting of late, I'm not sure there is any real benefit to be gained.

[Smokin Joe]

Imagine how two constitutional protagonists like Moore and Cruz could tag team the whole GOPe.

Why do you think McConnell was so anxious to throw him to the wolves? McConnell didn't want Moore in there derailing his gravy train.

[Smokin Joe]

Some of us think that overt racism is actually a flaw.

Interesting to find out who doesn't mind that about him.........

If racism had been a problem, one would think it would have been brought out during the election, so I must ask: "What 'overt racism'?"

It isn't like he was LBJ claiming his "Great Society" would 'have the n*****s voting Democrat for a hundred years' or being a Byrd-like muckity-muck in the KKK.

[RetBobbyMI]

Why do you think McConnell was so anxious to throw him to the wolves? McConnell didn't want Moore in there derailing his gravy train.

He got his gravy train, or soon will. He can go back to sipping his mint juleps and collecting his paycheck and lobbyists perks as minority leads and not have to do anything.

[catfish1957]

He got his gravy train, or soon will. He can go back to sipping his mint juleps and collecting his paycheck and lobbyists perks as minority leads and not have to do anything.

It is time for the GOP to wage all out war at against the slimy dim machine   (Hyperbole intended of course)

! No longer available

[TomSea]

Imagine how two constitutional protagonists like Moore and Cruz could tag team the whole GOPe.

And one of the constitutional protagonists pulled his endorsement of the other. Imagine that.

[Frank Cannon]

Yaaay!  1,000 posts!

Wow! Look what you win!

[Cyber Liberty]

Wow! Look what you win!

Kewl!  But I was kinda hoping for a fifth of Johnny Walker Blue.

[TomSea]

When it comes time to vote on something that matters, there is no such thing as a pro-life Democrat, no matter how loudly they claim otherwise.

Okay, that is your opinion, for the State of Louisiana, a black female Democrat Senator did sponsor a pro-life bill and then Governor Jindal signed it.  So, philosophically speaking, I can see where one can say one would never be a pro-life democrat because of their party platform, that is true absolutely. In turn, this other in individual states could represent a gray area and by actually sponsoring a pro-life bill and seeing it carried into law has to be something.

Louisiana Gov. Jindal Signs Pro-Life Ultrasound-Abortion Bill
State   Steven Ertelt   Jun 8, 2012   |   11:18AM    Baton Rouge, LA

The Louisiana legislature passed SB 708, the Hear the Heartbeat Act, authored by Senator Sharon Weston Broome, a pro-life Democrat.

http://www.lifenews.com/2012/06/08/louisiana-gov-jindal-signs-pro-life-ultrasound-abortion-bill/

So, naturally the question would be why stay in that party? I agree. It'd be interesting to see what this woman has done in recent years.

@Hoodat

Looks like she is a mayor now of Baton Rouge.

[Hoodat]

Keep telling yourself Moore was flawed.

Flawed?  No.  Incompetent?  Yes.

Good grief, the Saturday before election day, he sat at home watching a football game while Doug Jones spent the day shaking every hand he could find.

Moore thought the seat was going to be given to him without any effort on his part.  Just like Hillary.

[Hoodat]

Okay, that is your opinion, for the State of Louisiana, a black female Democrat Senator did sponsor a pro-life bill and then Governor Jindal signed it.  So, philosophically speaking, I can see where one can say one would never be a pro-life democrat because of their party platform, that is true absolutely. In turn, this other in individual states could represent a gray area and by actually sponsoring a pro-life bill and seeing it carried into law has to be something.
So, naturally the question would be why stay in that party? I agree. It'd be interesting to see what this woman has done in recent years.

@Hoodat

Looks like she is a mayor now of Baton Rouge.

Thanks for posting that.  Maybe it's that Napoleonic Code thingie.

[musiclady]

If racism had been a problem, one would think it would have been brought out during the election, so I must ask: "What 'overt racism'?"

It isn't like he was LBJ claiming his "Great Society" would 'have the n*****s voting Democrat for a hundred years' or being a Byrd-like muckity-muck in the KKK.

Like it or not, friend, it is overtly racist to look a black man in the eye and say that the days of slavery, when black families were torn to pieces by being sold and separated, were when America was "great" because families were stronger.

If one cares one whit about black families, then one doesn't make comments like this.

Either that, or he is dumber than a box of rocks, and twice as ignorant.

You don't have to be a bleeding heart liberal to know the ravages that slavery inflicted on black families.

You just have to be a decent, caring, educated person.

The fact that the accusation of racism has been abused doesn't mean the reality of it doesn't exist.

(It was stated earlier, that if Moore were a true conservative, he would have taken the opportunity to rant against LBJ's "Great Society," and how it destroyed black families.  But no.  Moore made a fool of himself with his ignorance).

[TomSea]

I think it's often said that blacks had stronger families even in the 1940s and decades plus and minus BEFORE LBJ's "Great Society" program. Everyone knows, black single-parent families are way up. To me, it sounds like Moore was talking about that. I might want to check his exact words:

....Moore responded to a black man who asked when Moore thought America was most recently "great."

Moore said it was during the era of slavery.

"I think it was great at the time when families were united," Moore said, according to a September Los Angeles Times story. "Even though we had slavery, they cared for one another ... Our families were strong — our country had a direction."

http://www.businessinsider.com/roy-moore-controversial-comments-resurface-2017-12

Now, is that so bad in itself? Maybe I'm wrong but I'm not sure if it is.  Maybe there is a fuller quote.

(Edited to add more of the BI article on)

[Cyber Liberty]

Like it or not, friend, it is overtly racist to look a black man in the eye and say that the days of slavery, when black families were torn to pieces by being sold and separated, were when America was "great" because families were stronger.

If one cares one whit about black families, then one doesn't make comments like this.

Either that, or he is dumber than a box of rocks, and twice as ignorant.

You don't have to be a bleeding heart liberal to know the ravages that slavery inflicted on black families.

You just have to be a decent, caring, educated person.

The fact that the accusation of racism has been abused doesn't mean the reality of it doesn't exist.

(It was stated earlier, that if Moore were a true conservative, he would have taken the opportunity to rant against LBJ's "Great Society," and how it destroyed black families.  But no.  Moore made a fool of himself with his ignorance).

It's water under the bridge.  He didn't win (and probably isn't going to get another chance).

[DiogenesLamp]

You're denying reality.   

I really have no interest in reading anything from you that begins with the sentence "You're denying reality."   


I am not the "reality"  challenged individual here.   

[musiclady]

It's water under the bridge.  He didn't win (and probably isn't going to get another chance).

I was asked to explain my comment, and did.

It may be "water under the bridge" for you, but it clearly isn't for others.

[DiogenesLamp]

It had to be both to lose as a Republican in Alabama.

Even with the opposition, Moore didn't put up much of a fight, and it's always the candidate's responsibility to run his or her own campaign. He didn't campaign much, he refused to debate his opponent and (in a nutshell) underestimated what he was up against. There were plenty of things within his power that he could have done to strike back against this.

Strike back against unprovable accusations from a troubled nut-job,  with the accusations amplified by the media-weapon and embraced by his own party?   

What sort of "strike back"  could he have used?   

[DiogenesLamp]

Moore was a flawed candidate AND he was knifed in the back.

This is like saying a car that was smashed by a Semi-Truck had a dent in it before the collision. 


It is a conflation of the Major and the Minor as having equal influence.