Leftover Discussion Thread: AL Special Election

[edpc]

While we have a majority now unfortunately we do not know what the political scene will look like in 2020.

Now is the crucial time and our chances of any real reform are now greatly diminished.

If we were going to have any real reform, it would have happened between the inauguration and now. The problem was not the absence of Sessions or the person filling his seat in the interim.

[Frank Cannon]

Yeah! Except for the fact that Roy Moore wasn't one you would be correct!

But I really am excited that so many phony conservatives here have managed to out themselves over the last few weeks.  More even today.

Yes. So being Conservative in 2017 means thinking America is the root of evil in the free world, jailing gays, having a Jewish lawyer and arguing the bible supersedes the Constitution......or at least the parts you agree with (These are all things Roy Moore said out of his own mouth in front of a camera).

Good luck with that. 

[DiogenesLamp]

I already explained that in the post you quoted.  He would’ve had more competent people around him to fend it off.

That is hand waving.   That is a "fact"  not in evidence.   Just how do you defend a man against accusations that he dropped an investigation in exchange for a Senate appointment?   
Especially since the governor in question did ACTUALLY resign and is considered "dirty".   


All the media has to do is keep repeating it,  and the usually suspects around here (and elsewhere)  would say "we can't support this deeply flawed candidate."   

Can I prove it? No – not anymore than you can prove he would’ve lost.

I think pointing out numerous past examples where this same tactic has been employed to cause a loss is pretty good evidence that it would once again be employed and would have likely been successful in this last election. 

[XenaLee]

Alabama is a conservative state.   It was impossible for Jones to win without "conservatives"  going over to the other side.   

Conservatives, at least 'real conservatives', didn't ""go over to the other side"".  They just didn't vote.  They allowed the seriousness of the charges/accusations against Moore to weigh in on their decision not to vote.  Just as.... many will sit home next year, rather than vote for a RINO-controlled GOP that has betrayed them pretty much every step of the way.  Unfortunately, many have no clue just how critical it is that the Democrats, including the RINOs, be kept out of power.  They will find out...

the hard way.

[dfwgator]

They will find out...

the hard way.

Good and hard.

[XenaLee]

And of course Mitch will bend over for them.

And drop trow.  That's what RINO bitches do for leftists, after all.

[skeeter]

If we were going to have any real reform, it would have happened between the inauguration and now. The problem was not the absence of Sessions or the person filling his seat in the interim.

Beg to differ. Halving the majority from 2 to 1 senate seats is very significant. Especially in this very unusual political situation we have right now.

TO say nothing about how the victory has energized the left.

[txradioguy]

I heard. And I'm sure many of Moore's critics will be back here shortly, complaining about the lack of progress Trump's been able to make on moving his agenda forward.

You and I both know they will.

[Free Vulcan]

Fourteenth Amendment.  I'll say it slowly - F-O-U-R-T-E-E-N-T-H Amendment.   

What a load of crap. A very selective application of the Fourteenth, equality only given to those who are expedient for political gain.

[DiogenesLamp]

What situation? He was a private citizen by the time he was touting Roy Moore in August, prior to the runoff. 

Exactly.   Roy Moore was a shoe in candidate at this point.   He was known to be hostile to the "establishment",   and so he was exactly the sort of person which Bannon was already trying to support.   

By previously stating the situation he was ‘handed,’ you make it sound like he came in at the 11th hour to make chicken salad out of chicken sh*t.

He had chicken salad,   and it was turned into chicken sh*t,   primarily because of the accusations made by Democrats and their Vichy Republican allies. 


At the time Bannon signed on to the deal,   it was a very good deal.   It was turned to shite by lies and accusations coupled with the media weapon spreading their propaganda.   

The fact is, he fed the chickens, shoveled the manure, put it in a bowl, stirred it, and served it up. Enjoy.

It's statements like this that make me think i'm talking to mentally ill people.    It's like people didn't even see what happened,   and now imagine some completely screwy scenario occurred instead.   


We can't even see the same set of facts in this discussion.   I would plot you a graph of Moore support and mark it with correlations of the accusations if I thought it would work,   but since we were all here and should have seen it with our own eyes,    I don't think there is any real point to presenting evidence to support the claim that what we all saw happen,  really happened. 


You must have been watching a different television program or something. 

[Hoodat]

The right of gays to marry was found in the 14th amendment

This is wrong on several counts.  First of all, the right to marry is found in the 10th Amendment, not the 14th Amendment.  Second, there is no restriction against sexual preference in any marriage law.  It simply does not exist.  And there is not a single State in the Union that prevents gays from marrying.  Third, the right to same-sex marriage is also found in the 10th Amendment as is the right to polygamy and the right to marry siblings.  For each of these, the absence of federal law yields control to the States.

But then the right of gays to marry is not what you are supporting.  Instead, you support denying the States from establishing their own marriage laws, which in itself has zero Constitutional basis.  So enough of your 'championing the Constitution' BS.  Because you really don't believe in the Constitution, preferring instead the tyranny of the courts to impose your will upon others at the point of a gun.

[Bigun]

Yes. So being Conservative in 2017 means thinking America is the root of evil in the free world, jailing gays, having a Jewish lawyer and arguing the bible supersedes the Constitution......or at least the parts you agree with (These are all things Roy Moore said out of his own mouth in front of a camera).

Good luck with that.

As I've said several times previously to you directly today, Roy Moore has forgotten more about our Constitution than you, and many others here,  will ever know!

[Hoodat]

Dems are already making noise today about waiting until Jones is seated to vote on tax reform.

And Republicans are stupid enough to allow it.

[Smokin Joe]

LOL. I'm not wasting time on that stupidity. The people here who wrap themselves up in the Founders to get back to "original intent" now think the mechanism they put in place to correct problems is garbage.

The mechanism is just fine. Some of the things that have been done with it are not. Like tools, you can have the best and still do shitty work.

[XenaLee]

Yes. So being Conservative in 2017 means thinking America is the root of evil in the free world, jailing gays, having a Jewish lawyer and arguing the bible supersedes the Constitution......or at least the parts you agree with (These are all things Roy Moore said out of his own mouth in front of a camera).

Good luck with that.

Um.... except that.... all of those comments had more to do with Moore's "religious zeal" than to do with any "conservative" bent he may have claimed to have.  He was, after all, a former DemocRat.

This constant bullshit of blaming Conservatives as usual is asinine, IMO.  But highly indicative of why the nation is as screwed up as it is... and headed for the cliff, once again.

[bigheadfred]

This is why we can't have nice things.

[Cyber Liberty]

You and I both know they will.

Leaves us with a nice, ready answer in our breast pockets, doesn't it?

[DiogenesLamp]

I have to wonder..... if the motivation behind some of the anti-Moore folks wasn't the glaringly obvious fact... that many of those that opposed Moore are also rabid anti-Trumpers.   

Their motivation being the same as the Democrats' motivation.   Get Moore out by handing the seat to a Democrat that will shift the balance of the majority towards the rats in the 2018 election.  Perhaps they are counting on the rats winning control back of Congress next year... so that Trump can be impeached?  I hate to think anyone could or would be willing to trash America and give the Democrats control again.... to the detriment of the entire nation.... just to get rid of Trump.  But....

Does Trump hatred extend to the point that people would deliberately spike the party and the movement just to fulfill their own prophecies about Trump being a "bad" candidate?   


Possibly it was a factor,   but I perceive that there were a lot of people who simply hated Moore because they hate old white religious types becoming involved in politics.   


They looked for reasons to support their disdain for the man,   and embraced any they found unquestioningly. 

[Smokin Joe]

The good news? Now the precendent has been set. And it's time now to turn the tables and get the dirt on the Rats...every single one of them.  They want to play that game? Well guess, what?  We can play it, too.

Well, good luck with that. What is 'dirt' on Republicans is a resume enhancer for a Democrat.

[Cyber Liberty]

Dems are already making noise today about waiting until Jones is seated to vote on tax reform.

I don't think Chinless will fall for that (really!), but he will whiff the vote somehow.  Look for a key defection (probably one of the two Senators from AZ).

[Smokin Joe]

Exactly right.  In case anyone is still wondering why nothing is getting done re: Trump's conservative promises.... look no further than Bitch McConnell.   He is the proverbial snake in the grass Judas... and nothing will change as long as he is there and in charge.

Whoever runs against McConnel in the primary or the General will get my donations, Even if Hillary moves to Kentucky and runs for the seat.

[XenaLee]

@XenaLee

It's one of the great political paradoxes of our times...the voters are likely to cast out Republicans in favor of Democrats because the Republicans failed to undo what Democrats did....

The irony is sublime, ain't it!  Sublime and tragic.

[DiogenesLamp]

You can tie your wagon to the guy who defended himself when asked if he did this kiddy stuff said "No, not generally" or "It was not my customary behavior". Real resounding denial there.

I'll pass on that.

You aren't passing on that,   you are reformulating the premise and conflating it with the worst accusations.    You even use the prejudicial descriptive terms like "kiddy",  and "rape",   and so forth.

We get it.   You didn't like Moore in the first place,   and now you are seeing your own preconceived notions as validated.    How nice for you.   

[XenaLee]

Whoever runs against McConnel in the primary or the General will get my donations, Even if Hillary moves to Kentucky and runs for the seat.

Well..... I would never cast a vote for ANY damned Clinton bitch...

but other than that, I would support anyone running against the McConnell bitch...lol.

[DiogenesLamp]

I hate Moore. I hated Moore before the allegations.

Res ipsa loquitur.