Author Topic: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread  (Read 46409 times)

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Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #750 on: January 06, 2023, 04:05:35 pm »
The stupidity of conservatives since 2020 cannot be understated. I'm not talking about "RINOS" either.

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #752 on: January 06, 2023, 04:07:27 pm »
   If Chip Roy gets his concession, it will only take 1 vote of No Confidence to force another Speaker vote.

Which will be the poltical equivalancy of McRINO of being an Organ Grinder Monkey.
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Online corbe

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #753 on: January 06, 2023, 04:07:42 pm »
   They got rid of Boehner (Freedom Caucus) and they will at least shackle McCarthy to prevent him from working with the dems.
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #754 on: January 06, 2023, 04:08:50 pm »
   They got rid of Boehner (Freedom Caucus) and they will at least shackle McCarthy to prevent him from working with the dems.

But, I wonder how binding these agreements really are.  It's not like a politican won't lie, steal, or cheat.
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Offline Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #755 on: January 06, 2023, 04:09:56 pm »
There is an ocean of difference  between perception and reality.  And in the world of politics, you know which prevails.

We all know as political junkies the details of the game.  The noobs don't, and don't forget....they vote.

The perception of the FC will determine their popularity among other reps, and whether their own members will stick and/or new members join.  So that perception does impact reality.

Online corbe

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #756 on: January 06, 2023, 04:10:07 pm »
Anyone have an idea of how many in the FC holdouts are in the Roy camp? 

   I think it's safe to assume that Boebert and Gaetz don't see eye to eye with Roy and possibly a few others.
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Online corbe

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #757 on: January 06, 2023, 04:11:39 pm »
But, I wonder how binding these agreements really are.  It's not like a politican won't lie, steal, or cheat.

   That's why Roy and others are demanding it be in writing and to be signed by McCarthy himself.   
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Offline Free Vulcan

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #758 on: January 06, 2023, 04:12:15 pm »
But, I wonder how binding these agreements really are.  It's not like a politican won't lie, steal, or cheat.

They still got the leverage of a narrow majority to hold the Speaker's feet to the fire.

Still, once the details are worked out, it needs to be on paper and made public for all to see.
The Republic is lost.

Offline Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #759 on: January 06, 2023, 04:14:21 pm »
They'll forget about if the MSM let them forget about it; on the other hand, if it becomes the foundation for a constant drumbeat of "look how bad the republicans are at running things", then they won't.  Let us not underestimate the power of political propaganda spread by mass media.

This is particularly true given that we are likely to be entering a recession, and the Dems/MSM will be looking for a scapegoat.  And if the GOP-led House is objectively dysfunctional, and can't pass legislation, we're handing them their fall guy on a silver platter.

Offline Kamaji

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #760 on: January 06, 2023, 04:14:52 pm »
This is particularly true given that we are likely to be entering a recession, and the Dems/MSM will be looking for a scapegoat.  And if the GOP-led House is objectively dysfunctional, and can't pass legislation, we're handing them their fall guy on a silver platter.

Quite likely.

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #761 on: January 06, 2023, 04:16:09 pm »
The perception of the FC will determine their popularity among other reps, and whether their own members will stick and/or new members join.  So that perception does impact reality.

Nope......  That "reality" is determined by primary voters in red districts, and their desire for what  level conservative zeal in the preference of  their candidates.

As the dims continue their push to take us over the socialist cliff, the FC will only get larger and stronger in inverse proportion.  Think Newton's 3rd Law.....
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Offline Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #762 on: January 06, 2023, 04:17:23 pm »
   I think it's safe to assume that Boebert and Gaetz don't see eye to eye with Roy and possibly a few others.

Gaetz and Boebert have obviously let it become personal, whereas some of the rest seem to be treating it as business.

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #763 on: January 06, 2023, 04:19:07 pm »
They still got the leverage of a narrow majority to hold the Speaker's feet to the fire.

Still, once the details are worked out, it needs to be on paper and made public for all to see.

You mean like Newt's Contract with America in 1994 which basically had the same value as toilet paper by 1996?

There is a reason that there are 535 slugs in DC who can't be trusted for anything under any circumstance.
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #764 on: January 06, 2023, 04:21:32 pm »
Gaetz and Boebert have obviously let it become personal, whereas some of the rest seem to be treating it as business.

I think Biggs has taken it more personally than Boebert.

Boebert has tenious situation at home, and has zero margin of error for mis-steps.  I can see her agreeing if if looks like the FC is breaking toward McCarthy
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Online corbe

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #765 on: January 06, 2023, 04:23:04 pm »
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline Free Vulcan

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #766 on: January 06, 2023, 04:23:16 pm »
You mean like Newt's Contract with America in 1994 which basically had the same value as toilet paper by 1996?

There is a reason that there are 535 slugs in DC who can't be trusted for anything under any circumstance.

With a narrow majority, those same 20 can withhold their vote at any time and sink a bill.

If the Swampy's want to go court Rat votes, then the primaries come quickly.

Sadly conservatives don't have alot of leverage right now.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2023, 04:30:38 pm by Free Vulcan »
The Republic is lost.

Offline Maj. Bill Martin

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #767 on: January 06, 2023, 04:25:12 pm »
Nope......  That "reality" is determined by primary voters in red districts, and their desire for what  level conservative zeal in the preference of  their candidates.

As the dims continue their push to take us over the socialist cliff, the FC will only get larger and stronger in inverse proportion.  Think Newton's 3rd Law.....

I was referring to the election for Speaker, but if you want to talk about the electorate in general, fine.

But in that case, I'm not sure you're right.  Just because more voters don't want actual socialism doesn't mean they agree with everything the FC stands for.  There are still a lot of voters in that great squishy middle, and they'll lean towards whomever seems the most reasonable.

Newton's Third law doesn't have to be balanced by the Freedom Caucus. It could be balanced in the eyes of those voters by just sticking with less socialistic people in the middle who seem more reasonable.

So, whether they perceive a particular conservative as offering a reasonable alternative is critical.  And that's often not just an issue of policy, but also about presentation/rhetoric.  So while it clearly is important to stick to principles, it is equally important for purposes of expanding support to not just pander to your base with red-meat rhetoric.  All that does is get you high fives from your base, while alienating people you might otherwise have been able to persuade.

How candidates are perceived impacts the reality of how people vote.

« Last Edit: January 06, 2023, 04:36:11 pm by Maj. Bill Martin »

Offline Kamaji

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #768 on: January 06, 2023, 04:28:39 pm »
I was referring to the election for Speaker, but if you want to talk about the electorate in general, fine.

But in that case, I'm not sure you're right.  Just because more voters don't want actual socialism doesn't mean they agree with everything the FC stands for.  There are still a lot of voters in that great squishy middle, and they'll lean towards whomever seems the most reasonable.

Newton's Third law doesn't have to be balanced by the Freedom Caucus. It could be balanced in the eyes of those voters by just sticking with less socialistic people in the middle who seem more reasonable.

So, whether they perceive a particular conservative as offering a reasonable alternative is critical.  And that's often not just an issue of policy, but also about presentation/rhetoric.  So while it clearly is important to stick to principles, it is equally important for purposes of expanding support to not just pander to your base with red-meat rhetoric.  All that does is get you high fives from your base, while alienating people you might otherwise have been able to persuade.




:thumbsup:

Online corbe

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #769 on: January 06, 2023, 04:31:20 pm »
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline cato potatoe

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #770 on: January 06, 2023, 04:33:36 pm »
What you are calling the Arson Caucus to some of us, are 20 patriots who don't want to give RINO McCarthy the green light toward full capitualtion to the Biden agenda. 

You don't think he's Turdle Jr?  Prove me wrong.

The caucus has lost perspective.  2022 midterms were a disaster.  By a pretty wide margin, most of the incoming house will be dem and moderate pub.  McCarthy' ACU lifetime is 84%, which is left of everyone here, but right of the person who will be elected by a coalition.  Total capitulation is not happening --- he knows the base needs to turn out in 2024 if another disaster is to be averted.  McCarthy has promised oversight and investigations.  Other than blocking the power grabs the dems are contemplating, that is the most he can do until the numbers shift.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2023, 04:36:06 pm by cato potatoe »


Online corbe

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #772 on: January 06, 2023, 04:44:08 pm »
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline Free Vulcan

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #773 on: January 06, 2023, 04:44:32 pm »
Video link to today's proceedings:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XITN9wtsUvM
The Republic is lost.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: House Speaker Vote Live 2nd Thread
« Reply #774 on: January 06, 2023, 04:45:38 pm »


Can both things be bad?

Like I said, idiots.