Flake calls for 2020 Trump primary challenger

[corbe]

   You are correct, My Friend, @mescalone on all 3 points, you have quite simply and eloquently, I might add, utterly destroyed my attempt at logic in my prior post.  Kudo's Sir.   

[Mesaclone]

   You are correct, My Friend, @mescalone on all 3 points, you have quite simply and eloquently, I might add, utterly destroyed my attempt at logic in my prior post.  Kudo's Sir.   

Perhaps you're overstating my "victory". I'm a huge Reagan guy so I tend to see all things conservative in his reflected light!

I believe that Reagan was principled, but always pragmatic...his goal was conservative policy and legislation but he was willing to take what he could get even if it didn't pass the conservative "purity" test. For example, if other nation's are unfairly closing their markets to our industry...while we hold ours open...that's not fair trade. So a tariff, when used with discrimination, can pry open markets to create more genuinely free trade. So the goal is a conservative one, though the method of using tariffs is an imperfect...but perhaps necessary tool.

DACA is similar to Reagan's amnesty. Give some on an amnesty issue to create a long term conservative fix to immigration. In Reagan's case, the Dems failed to uphold the "security" side of the deal...Trump has learned from that and WILL ensure the security side of such a deal IS upheld this time. So, again, the goal is a conservative one though it does necessitate some concessions to achieve.

Pragmatism is not a byword for setting aside principles. It is the necessary application of common sense and practicality that allows us to get the MOST conservative solution possible into legislation. Without pragmatism, we get a bunch of folks running around feeling good about their conservative purity...and absolutely nothing achieved in terms of furthering conservative principles and legislation.

Anyway, I expound to much...partly because I enjoy discussing issues with you. You have a sharp and open mind...and a strong set of principles. So kudos to you, sir.

[LauraTXNM]

Perhaps you're overstating my "victory". I'm a huge Reagan guy so I tend to see all things conservative in his reflected light!

I believe that Reagan was principled, but always pragmatic...his goal was conservative policy and legislation but he was willing to take what he could get even if it didn't pass the conservative "purity" test. For example, if other nation's are unfairly closing their markets to our industry...while we hold ours open...that's not fair trade. So a tariff, when used with discrimination, can pry open markets to create more genuinely free trade. So the goal is a conservative one, though the method of using tariffs is an imperfect...but perhaps necessary tool.

DACA is similar to Reagan's amnesty. Give some on an amnesty issue to create a long term conservative fix to immigration. In Reagan's case, the Dems failed to uphold the "security" side of the deal...Trump has learned from that and WILL ensure the security side of such a deal IS upheld this time. So, again, the goal is a conservative one though it does necessitate some concessions to achieve.

Pragmatism is not a byword for setting aside principles. It is the necessary application of common sense and practicality that allows us to get the MOST conservative solution possible into legislation. Without pragmatism, we get a bunch of folks running around feeling good about their conservative purity...and absolutely nothing achieved in terms of furthering conservative principles and legislation.

Anyway, I expound to much...partly because I enjoy discussing issues with you. You have a sharp and open mind...and a strong set of principles. So kudos to you, sir.

I would agree with you, @Mesaclone , that President Reagan was a conservative though those three items weren't conservative policies.  He was being pragmatic to achieve what he sought as conservative goals. 

The problem I see now, with regard to immigration in particular, is window-dressing in place of two actual reforms that would curb our illegal immigration problem.  Without mandatory nationwide e-Verify and thorough biometric VISA entry and exit exams, we will not make a dent in the incursion.  Even ending chain migration will take 20 years.  And I don't believe we'll realistically see a total halt on immigration -- at the very least, people with money or skills will still gain entry. 

[Mesaclone]

Honestly, if they have “money and “skills” they are welcome to enter via LEGAL immigration. I entirely agree with you on everify and other measures...any DACA amnesty MUST be accompanied by a host of security and administrative measures or its no deal. The Reagan adventure in 1987 has taught us all that we must not cede the follow through to the Dems...the amnesty must come only AFTER all of the new security measures are put in place.