Dreamers Reject Trump’s Amnesty Plan: ‘A White Supremacist Ransom Note’

[Oceander]

"Not trying to belittle you in any way"

I call em like I see em.  If’n you don’t like it:  too bad, so sad. 

[Chosen Daughter]

So you want a wall now.  I want a new tv but it has to be paid for first.  It sounds like no compromise, no solution, no legislation is acceptable to you until a wall is built.  The wall is not built.  I don't believe there is enough popular support for a wall only approach, and I'm not sure where President Trump goes from there, but I do appreciate your reply.  Thank you.

@libertybele is only holding Trump to his word.  If it wasn't possible Trump should not have paraded it across the country.  We all know that the crowds went wild as Trump rolled out his mass deportation agenda.  Because working Americans are tired of it.  The only people not tired of it are politicians, bankers and corporations looking for an illegal immigrant welfare hand out.

[To-Whose-Benefit?]

Rio Grande. Genetically engineered freshwater sharks.

That's one way.

What I'd prefer is the National Guard move into California and put down the Cabal who've seized the Government in that State.

Constitution guarantees a Republican Form of Government to every State, and Moonbeam et all are about as far away from representing the people they ride herd on as can be imagined.

Then Ca. can at least officially recognize that they Have a border with Mexico.

[INVAR]

Mass deportation may indeed never happen, but that's what is needed.

It would be needed to illustrate that the rule of law will be upheld and that breaking the law will not earn you a 'right' to have your life provided for by the taxpayers.  This will never happen.  A sovereign nation who will not punish lawlessness and uphold the law itself - is no longer a sovereign nation.  It is beholden to the passions of money and power derived from catering to constituencies demanding provision and nothing else.  In short, a government that willingly makes and caters to willing slaves.

What is actually more needed than mass deportation, is an immovable requirement that a distinct American culture must be taught and accepted by anyone seeking to reside on these shores from another place.  That applies to anyone seeking residency or citizenship.

But, since the culture, population and government no longer believe in a distinct American culture - we must of necessity - go the way Rome did, only much faster and with a greater, more massive and immediate decline into oblivion than the three centuries it took Rome to succumb to collapse.

[skeeter]

I wrote that, not Oceander.

OK got it.

My two cents - there were times this country did deport illegals on sight - it required no Stasi, no suspension of constitutional rights. References to above are just silly.

But times have changed, its certainly not politically feasible at the moment owing to alot of hysterical and irrational people.

It wouldn't be necessary anyway. Its not novel to suggest that removing the economic incentives while mounting a sustained policy of inland enforcement would have the same effect in just a few years. In addition to this, though, is that unlike the others a barrier would be much less subject to the ebb & flow of the political scene.

Even if Trump can't get a wall funded he might still be successful stepping up enforcement and pushing welfare reforms, hopefully public attitudes towards illegals will further harden over the net several years to the point where more muscular enforcement policies become politically possible.

The absolute worse thing he could do is agree to legalize another large lot of 'em, even if the democrats do agree to actually give something in return - our country is split about square down the middle as it is, a few million more instant democrats might just put it in the bag for them.

[skeeter]

I call em like I see em.  If’n you don’t like it:  too bad, so sad.

You are a straight shooter, Oceander. Thats fer durn tootin.

[Right_in_Virginia]

You are a straight shooter, Oceander. Thats fer durn tootin.

 

[Formerly Once-Ler]

@libertybele is only holding Trump to his word.  If it wasn't possible Trump should not have paraded it across the country.  We all know that the crowds went wild as Trump rolled out his mass deportation agenda.  Because working Americans are tired of it.  The only people not tired of it are politicians, bankers and corporations looking for an illegal immigrant welfare hand out.

If you're going to hold President Trump to his word then Mexico has to pay for the wall and it must be invisible.  But I got it.  No amnesty.  No compromise.

I don't mind de facto amnesty.  It's been working OK since 86.  I'm against curbs in legal immigration, building the wall, and ripping families apart, although I'm generally for increasing border security to reduce crime and terrorism.  I think a good way to solve that problem by reducing the number of illegals crossing the boarder, and making it easier to spot criminals and terrorist, would be to increase legal immigration to supplant the illegals.  My thinking on this is a decade ago the music industry was losing billions in sales to illegal downloads.  iTunes is making a killing right now selling music because they figured out how to make it more convenient and more cost effective to download legally than illegally.  Make it easier to enter the USA legally and it will reduce the illegals since those jobs will be taken by legal immigrants.   I'd like to see some kind of legal status for the dreamers and other illegals because many of them are being exploited by unscrupulous businesses, and criminals.  They have no where to turn for fear of deportation.  Just my opinion.  I know you believe they need to go and I understand your and Liberty's reasons.  I just disagree.

I think President Trump actually does want to find a solution because of these two tweets...
Does anybody really want to throw out good, educated and accomplished young people who have jobs, some serving in the military? Really!.....
...They have been in our country for many years through no fault of their own - brought in by parents at young age. Plus BIG border security
       Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump 5:35 AM - Sep 14, 2017

I hope I am right.

[Chosen Daughter]

If you're going to hold President Trump to his word then Mexico has to pay for the wall and it must be invisible.  But I got it.  No amnesty.  No compromise.

I don't mind de facto amnesty.  It's been working OK since 86.  I'm against curbs in legal immigration, building the wall, and ripping families apart, although I'm generally for increasing border security to reduce crime and terrorism.  I think a good way to solve that problem by reducing the number of illegals crossing the boarder, and making it easier to spot criminals and terrorist, would be to increase legal immigration to supplant the illegals.  My thinking on this is a decade ago the music industry was losing billions in sales to illegal downloads.  iTunes is making a killing right now selling music because they figured out how to make it more convenient and more cost effective to download legally than illegally.  Make it easier to enter the USA legally and it will reduce the illegals since those jobs will be taken by legal immigrants.   I'd like to see some kind of legal status for the dreamers and other illegals because many of them are being exploited by unscrupulous businesses, and criminals.  They have no where to turn for fear of deportation.  Just my opinion.  I know you believe they need to go and I understand your and Liberty's reasons.  I just disagree.

I think President Trump actually does want to find a solution because of these two tweets...
Does anybody really want to throw out good, educated and accomplished young people who have jobs, some serving in the military? Really!.....
...They have been in our country for many years through no fault of their own - brought in by parents at young age. Plus BIG border security
       Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump 5:35 AM - Sep 14, 2017

I hope I am right.

I hope you are not.  What you are advocating is hardly anything different since 1986.  If families want to stay together they can go home together the same way they came together.

[skeeter]

I hope you are not.  What you are advocating is hardly anything different since 1986.  If families want to stay together they can go home together the same way they came together.

Those who have no problem with legalizing those illegals currently here should just lobby to make immigrating without permission legal.

Because whether they know it or not thats simply what they are endorsing.

[Formerly Once-Ler]

OK got it.

My two cents - there were times this country did deport illegals on sight - it required no Stasi, no suspension of constitutional rights. References to above are just silly.

That is why I said nothing of the sort.  Perhaps you are confusing me with another poster again?

But times have changed, its certainly not politically feasible at the moment owing to alot of hysterical and irrational people.

It wouldn't be necessary anyway. Its not novel to suggest that removing the economic incentives while mounting a sustained policy of inland enforcement would have the same effect in just a few years. In addition to this, though, is that unlike the others a barrier would be much less subject to the ebb & flow of the political scene.

Even if Trump can't get a wall funded he might still be successful stepping up enforcement and pushing welfare reforms, hopefully public attitudes towards illegals will further harden over the net several years to the point where more muscular enforcement policies become politically possible.

The absolute worse thing he could do is agree to legalize another large lot of 'em, even if the democrats do agree to actually give something in return - our country is split about square down the middle as it is, a few million more instant democrats might just put it in the bag for them.

I don't necessarily disagree that you propose a logical course of action.  Rip apart a few hundred thousand illegal families and those with the ability to leave will search for a friendlier home.  The question is does the GOP have the stamina to watch a few hundred thousand illegal families get deported?

[Chosen Daughter]

Those who have no problem with legalizing those illegals currently here should just lobby to make immigrating without permission legal.

Because whether they know it or not thats simply what they are endorsing.

Truth!

[Formerly Once-Ler]

I hope you are not.  What you are advocating is hardly anything different since 1986.  If families want to stay together they can go home together the same way they came together.

I agree with President Reagan.

[Chosen Daughter]

I agree with President Reagan.

Right, a steady stream of illegal immigrations since 1986.

[skeeter]

That is why I said nothing of the sort.  Perhaps you are confusing me with another poster again?

I don't necessarily disagree that you propose a logical course of action.  Rip apart a few hundred thousand illegal families and those with the ability to leave will search for a friendlier home.  The question is does the GOP have the stamina to watch a few hundred thousand illegal families get deported?

First paragraph was a general, not targeted, comment.

As I said, its not politically viable to 'rip apart families' now. Perhaps after the number of American voters who fully understand the immense societal costs to the nation of tolerating illegal immigration reaches critical mass it will be.

[Formerly Once-Ler]

Those who have no problem with legalizing those illegals currently here should just lobby to make immigrating without permission legal.

Because whether they know it or not thats simply what they are endorsing.

Like I said, I'm fine with doing nothing, and that is, in truth, what I expect from the GOP.  In 2006 the GOP passed immigration reform in the House and Senate but Speaker of the House, and pedophile, Dennis Hastert refused to appoint a conference committee.  The bill died just like dozens of Obamacare repeals.  There is probably little need to worry about the Congress passing anything before the next elections.

[Oceander]

OK got it.

My two cents - there were times this country did deport illegals on sight - it required no Stasi, no suspension of constitutional rights. References to above are just silly.

But times have changed, its certainly not politically feasible at the moment owing to alot of hysterical and irrational people.

It wouldn't be necessary anyway. Its not novel to suggest that removing the economic incentives while mounting a sustained policy of inland enforcement would have the same effect in just a few years. In addition to this, though, is that unlike the others a barrier would be much less subject to the ebb & flow of the political scene.

Even if Trump can't get a wall funded he might still be successful stepping up enforcement and pushing welfare reforms, hopefully public attitudes towards illegals will further harden over the net several years to the point where more muscular enforcement policies become politically possible.

The absolute worse thing he could do is agree to legalize another large lot of 'em, even if the democrats do agree to actually give something in return - our country is split about square down the middle as it is, a few million more instant democrats might just put it in the bag for them.

Nonsense.  Provide proof. 

[Formerly Once-Ler]

First paragraph was a general, not targeted, comment.

Sorry.  That was unclear to me.

As I said, its not politically viable to 'rip apart families' now. Perhaps after the number of American voters who fully understand the immense societal costs to the nation of tolerating illegal immigration reaches critical mass it will be.

I agree with the first sentence.  I've been arguing about immigration reform for almost 20 years.  Maybe you have too.  I don't see much movement to the right or left on the issue over the last 2 decades.

[Formerly Once-Ler]

Right, a steady stream of illegal immigrations since 1986.

Since before the founding of our country.

[skeeter]

Nonsense.  Provide proof.

California, a swing state as far back as anyone could remember, went solid blue after "1.6 million" (plus the chain migrating relatives) were legalized.

Doesn't matter what you, I or anyone else believes, it just happened that way.

[Fantom]

California, a swing state as far back as anyone could remember, went solid blue after "1.6 million" (plus the chain migrating relatives) were legalized.

Doesn't matter what you, I or anyone else believes, it just happened that way.

Right, cause and effect.

Simple really.

[skeeter]

Right, cause and effect.

Simple really.

Its hard to believe that 60% of Californians voted to cut public assistance money to illegals as recently as 1993. OF course a judge decided against us and that was that.

Its just gone downhill since. Now we're turning illegal murderers arrested holding smoking guns loose. State legislators are considering a law that will throw anyone who cooperates with ICE in jail.

No, I'm really not in any mood to babytalk illegals anymore.

[Fantom]

Its hard to believe that 60% of Californians voted to cut public assistance money to illegals as recently as 1993. OF course a judge decided against us and that was that.

Its just gone downhill since. Now we're turning illegal murderers arrested holding smoking guns loose. State legislators are considering a law that will throw anyone who cooperates with ICE in jail.

No, I'm really not in any mood to babytalk illegals anymore.

Right, but until the majority rise up ... in the streets.. this black robed tyranny will continue. When the ballot box no longer works.... there is only one last box.

[Formerly Once-Ler]

California, a swing state as far back as anyone could remember, went solid blue after "1.6 million" (plus the chain migrating relatives) were legalized.

Doesn't matter what you, I or anyone else believes, it just happened that way.

I remember rat Governor Jerry Brown was elected Governor in 1974.  He served two 4 year terms.  His rat father Pat Brown was elected Governor in 1958 and also served two 4 year terms.

I also remember republican Governor Schwarzenegger serving 2 terms near the beginning of this century.

just sayin 

[Formerly Once-Ler]

Its hard to believe that 60% of Californians voted to cut public assistance money to illegals as recently as 1993. OF course a judge decided against us and that was that.

Its just gone downhill since. Now we're turning illegal murderers arrested holding smoking guns loose. State legislators are considering a law that will throw anyone who cooperates with ICE in jail.

No, I'm really not in any mood to babytalk illegals anymore.

Those illegals are likely behind this too... http://www.nationalreview.com/article/455795/california-waiters-straws-jail-time
Or maybe it is pure homegrown American liberalism.