Never-Trumpers vs. Reluctant Trumpers

[geronl]

I can't see how one of them is any less evil than the other, really.

supporters that were fine with a woman rotting in jail over her faith,

Trump being one of those

[GtHawk]

I will not think any less of someone who decides willingly or reluctantly to vote for Trump. If they think less of me because I just can't, then they are the one with the problem.

I will not be voting for a NY Liberal. My conscience says "hell no". But my state of WA will go for Hillary regardless of how I vote, so come Wednesday morning following the election my conscience will be clear.

I am of the same mind as you and being in California the same situation also.

[Norm Lenhart]

Rewarding evil with your vote only begets more evil.  If there is anything we should have learned by now that is it.

Many people want evil. Just a brand of it they 'feel' comfortable with in public. That way they can keep going to parties and not be ostracized by their fellow liberals.

Orwell had a thing or two to say about doublethink IIRC.

[XenaLee]

That's what keeps the game going. If the lesser evil argument won't sway the day, ramp it up another notch. I'm not blaming you, personally, by all means vote your conscience.
I'm just seeing the whole charade for what it is.

I just see it as continuing the very definition of insanity.....ie voting for that "lesser" of two evils and expecting a different result. 

In the end, you will never have a better outcome....since you are still, in effect, voting for evil.  It took me quite a while to come around to that logic.  I remember arguing with folks at TOS in 2008 and 2012 about their insistence on NOT voting in those elections.  I just didn't see how they were helping the situation.  I see now that they were merely sticking to their own principles, which I laid aside...both times.  As they say....third time is the charm.

I would love to be able to channel the founding fathers and find out what they have to say about all this.  I think I already know, but confirmation would be great.

[Norm Lenhart]

I can't see how one of them is any less evil than the other, really.

Trump being one of those

Indeed.

[Norm Lenhart]

I just see it as continuing the very definition of insanity.....ie voting for that "lesser" of two evils and expecting a different result. 

In the end, you will never have a better outcome....since you are still, in effect, voting for evil.  It took me quite a while to come around to that logic.  I remember arguing with folks at TOS in 2008 and 2012 about their insistence on NOT voting in those elections.  I just didn't see how they were helping the situation.  I see now that they were merely sticking to their own principles, which I laid aside...both times.  As they say....third time is the charm.

I would love to be able to channel the founding fathers and find out what they have to say about all this.  I think I already know, but confirmation would be great.

We do know. Alexander Hamilton stated it rather clearly. However the Trumpists think they are smarter than one of America's founders. They are of course, not that smart.

[Eowyn]

Trump does not deserve to be President either.

Trump has not been elected to office and then abused that position and power though.  Hillary has.  She was not held accountable by those in the position to do so, but we the American people can hold her accountable.

[Norm Lenhart]

Trump has not been elected to office and then abused that position and power though.  Hillary has.

Out here in the AZ desert, there's a few rattlesnakes that havent bitten me either. But I'm not about to go kiss one and bring it home as a pet.

[Frank Cannon]

I'll probably end up voting for Trump because Hitlary is just such a POS, but if he gets elected I will fund any organizations working to impeach him.

[Norm Lenhart]

I'll probably end up voting for Trump because Hitlary is just such a POS, but if he gets elected I will fund any organizations working to impeach him.

That makes as much sense as having sex with an AIDS patient and then funding AIDS research after  to try saving yourself from the consequence of your ill considered action.

[XenaLee]

Many people want evil. Just a brand of it they 'feel' comfortable with in public. That way they can keep going to parties and not be ostracized by their fellow liberals.

Orwell had a thing or two to say about doublethink IIRC.

And many of those same people, who want to keep going to parties and living that party lifestyle....are too dense to realize that the people they are voting in and supporting for CIC....are the very ones that will bring (and are bringing) in hordes of Muslims that will exact punishment upon each and every one of those partiers....whether by legal (Sharia) means or by unlawful means (See:  Muslim ongoing attacks on women that don't dress "appropriately").

[Frank Cannon]

That makes as much sense as having sex with an AIDS patient and then funding AIDS research after  to try saving yourself from the consequence of your ill considered action.

Not at all. My goal would be a President Pence.

[Smokin Joe]

I don't trash anyone. Your vote is your own, and so are your reasons.

Just let it be known that not all who pull the Trump lever in November think he's even a great candidate. Would rather have preferred Cruz.

I understand that reasoning. It is where Conservatives have been for far too long, yielding a begrudging vote to a nominee to keep someone else believed to be even worse out.
It hasn't worked for 4 of the last 6 elections. 

I agree on the preference for the candidate, too. Too many folks didn't, unfortunately, which leave us where we are...again.
 

[Norm Lenhart]

Not at all. My goal would be a President Pence.

A liberal in the Whitehouse is something for oppose, not shoot for. The man bought into Trumps BS and joined him. He has no integrity, no principles and his record shows he's rather willing to sell out to whats popular as opposed to what is right. IE standard Democrat.

[Norm Lenhart]

I understand that reasoning. It is where Conservatives have been for far too long, yielding a begrudging vote to a nominee to keep someone else believed to be even worse out.
It hasn't worked for 4 of the last 6 elections. 

I agree on the preference for the candidate, too. Too many folks didn't, unfortunately, which leave us where we are...again.

It CAUSED the situation we are in. And next election the unprincipled go along get along 'conservatives' will rally to an even more left wing GOP candidate because thats the pattern to date. Every GOP fraud more liberal than the election prior.

[Frank Cannon]

A liberal in the Whitehouse is something for oppose, not shoot for. The man bought into Trumps BS and joined him. He has no integrity, no principles and his record shows he's rather willing to sell out to whats popular as opposed to what is right. IE standard Democrat.

Of all the people that will be on the ballot, Pence is the only one even mildly Conservative. Johnson/Weld, Donny, Hitlary/Eyebrows and Stein are all big govt' Leftists. Castle is just plain fruitloops.

[Norm Lenhart]

And many of those same people, who want to keep going to parties and living that party lifestyle....are too dense to realize that the people they are voting in and supporting for CIC....are the very ones that will bring (and are bringing) in hordes of Muslims that will exact punishment upon each and every one of those partiers....whether by legal (Sharia) means or by unlawful means (See:  Muslim ongoing attacks on women that don't dress "appropriately").

They WANT the Muslim hordes/Sharia. They are, after all, supporting those playing games with America's immigration to win political points/issues/elections.

Likewise, they WANT Abortion, the Gay Rights agenda and the rest. WANT IT. Because likewise, they are enabling those things by electing people that push those things.

People can scream bloody murder, but any 2 year old understands you don't ask for things you don't want. Their vote is their approval. Thats what a vote 'IS".

[Norm Lenhart]

Of all the people that will be on the ballot, Pence is the only one even mildly Conservative. Johnson/Weld, Donny, Hitlary/Eyebrows and Stein are all big govt' Leftists. Castle is just plain fruitloops.

Write in Cruz. Or yourself. Or me. But stand on principle and oppose the evil the GOP is pushing. Pence is not marginally anything. His record shows if anything he challenges Bhoner for the title of Captain Caveman.

[Norm Lenhart]

Of all the people that will be on the ballot, Pence is the only one even mildly Conservative. Johnson/Weld, Donny, Hitlary/Eyebrows and Stein are all big govt' Leftists. Castle is just plain fruitloops.

I'd add this:

You really think people too gutless to walk anon into a voting booth and cast a ballot for a conservative are gonna man the hell up and openly impeach a Republican? Thats is a mental trick people use to asuge their conscience. AKA Kicking the responsibility can down the road in the 'Hope' for 'Change' at some mythical future point.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

Write in Cruz. Or yourself. Or me. But stand on principle and oppose the evil the GOP is pushing. Pence is not marginally anything. His record shows if anything he challenges Bhoner for the title of Captain Caveman.

Writing in is pointless IMO. Just stay home and don't waste your time in that case.

[Doug Loss]

If we're going to get our Constitutional Republic back, it has become obvious that neither the Democrat Party not the Republican Party will sanction that goal. Both engage in the accumulation and usurpation of power, strengthening a central and increasingly totalitarian government at the expense of the Rights of the States and the People.

If I am to lose those rights through the machinations of the major parties' leadership, it will happen without my sanction. I will at least spend the rest of my days advocating for another choice, for freedom from either Plantation, and for a return to our Constitutional Republic.

It will take time, it will take work, and it will not be something which will bring the heady instantaneous gratification of winning major elections in the next 4, 8, even 12 years, but the steps to freedom are first to cut the chains and get off the plantation, and that applies, no matter which plantation you've been on.

This is why I'm supporting the Convention of States movement, calling for an Article V amending convention.  I'll vote against both Hillary and Donald in this election, but most of my effort will go toward the only possibility we have of limiting the ability of the federal government to harm us, either the executive, the judicial, or the legislative branches.

[Norm Lenhart]

Writing in is pointless IMO. Just stay home and don't waste your time in that case.

I'd call your Trump vote pointless, but it isn't. It's helping to destroy your country.

I'll stand on the principles the Founders laid down. You can stand with whatever liberal you like.

[Smokin Joe]

And many of those same people, who want to keep going to parties and living that party lifestyle....are too dense to realize that the people they are voting in and supporting for CIC....are the very ones that will bring (and are bringing) in hordes of Muslims that will exact punishment upon each and every one of those partiers....whether by legal (Sharia) means or by unlawful means (See:  Muslim ongoing attacks on women that don't dress "appropriately").

In DC? there's a herd of alphabet people up there (all consonants) who might fly off buildings if the Muslims ever completely got a hold of that place, too.

[Smokin Joe]

It CAUSED the situation we are in. And next election the unprincipled go along get along 'conservatives' will rally to an even more left wing GOP candidate because thats the pattern to date. Every GOP fraud more liberal than the election prior.

I agree. Which is why I am voting Constitution Party. I wrote letters, I withheld contributions, I showed up at meetings, but couldn't stop that leftist progression. The party keeps going that way. I can't stop the GOP train, but I don't have to ride.

[Norm Lenhart]

I agree. Which is why I am voting Constitution Party. I wrote letters, I withheld contributions, I showed up at meetings, but couldn't stop that leftist progression. The party keeps going that way. I can't stop the GOP train, but I don't have to ride.

When the 'right wing leftists' finally crash America into a wall, Me conscience will be clear. I have fought this lurch left for many years while they made excuses. They can bitch all they want us and mock us for our principles. My favorite line they use is 'You think you are so much more conservative/pure/better than we are", or some version thereof.

Yes. We are. And I am not ashamed of the truth of it. Screw them.