800,000 government workers may need financial assistance as shutdown continues

[catfish1957]

Give me a break.  When I was a state employee (MO), we were paid once a month. These people,  who earn more than their private sector counterparts,  can't budget?

My first professional job out of college was as a State Worker.  The head of the group I was working on ....on day 1 told me..   "Take care of your personal business on state time.  We aren't paid enough.....   Really hit me strange, with the work ethic I had before, and always did have.

He also told me...   "Pace yourself, otherwise our budget and manpower will be scrutinized".   BTW....   this was a professional position that required a degree, a and professional registration. NOT A UNION

Since then my opinion and the need for truly "non-essential services" of state and federal workers has been low.  If that rubs anyone here badly, ohhhh well.

[Right_in_Virginia]

It is sad those here are dumping on government workers.  Eighty thousand people took a job, have done their work and won't get paid. 

Eight hundred thousand @Victoria33  800,000.

Right there is the problem.

[Bigun]

My first professional job out of college was as a State Worker.  The head of the group I was working on ....on day 1 told me..   "Take care of your personal business on state time.  We aren't paid enough.....   Really hit me strange, with the work ethic I had before, and always did have.

He also told me...   "Pace yourself, otherwise our budget and manpower will be scrutinized".   BTW....   this was a professional position that required a degree, a and professional registration. NOT A UNION

Since then my opinion and the need for truly "non-essential services" of state and federal workers has been low.  If that rubs anyone here badly, ohhhh well.

You could walk through any government workplace I have ever seen, with the exception of the military, and summarily fire every third person. When you got done, no one would even know you had been there except for their desk mates.
 

[kevindavis007]

It is sad those here are dumping on government workers.  Eighty thousand people took a job, have done their work and won't get paid.  These are workers with families, just like you.  One man's wife died and he won't get a pay check today, and can't put a headstone at her grave.

Trump had a letter put on line so workers can print a letter to give to their mortgage company, their power company, others, to tell them they are not getting paid. Trump only thinks of himself and his family, and no one else.  He said workers without their paycheck are Democrats - that means he doesn't care if they die.

 

[Snarknado]

You could walk through any government workplace I have ever seen, with the exception of the military, and summarily fire every third person. When you got done, no one would even know you had been there except for their desk mates.

That would still leave 2 "workers" for each actual job...

[Bigun]

That would still leave 2 "workers" for each actual job...

Very likely true.

[Victoria33]

RIV, I see you pinged me to a message from you.  You are wasting your finger power commenting on my posts - I do not read them and did not read this one.

[Right_in_Virginia]

RIV, I see you pinged me to a message from you.  You are wasting your finger power commenting on my posts - I do not read them and did not read this one.

Oh, okay @Victoria33   Thanks for sharing.   

[Victoria33]

 

@kevindavis

I left off a zero on the number not paid - it is 800,000, not 80,000.  The government had jobs and people took them. 
When one works, one expects to get paid for that work, it keeps him/her and their family alive.

[Smokin Joe]

@kevindavis

I left off a zero on the number not paid - it is 800,000, not 80,000.  The government had jobs and people took them. 
When one works, one expects to get paid for that work, it keeps him/her and their family alive.

I might be more sympathetic to their plight if it was not for the 30+% taxes I pay in good years, just to hear cheering when I lose my job to plunging oil prices. When times are good, all we in the oil industry hear is bitching, when we're out of work, people cheer cheap fuel. 

So, no, I really don't give a damn, they can budget their paycheck like we have to to survive, and maybe the experience will show them how to not piss away the taxpayer's money.

[Victoria33]

RIV, I didn't read the last one, either.  Want to try for three?

[Victoria33]

[quote author=Smokin Joe link=topic=345707.msg1879250#msg1879250 date=154610
So, no, I really don't give a damn, they can budget their paycheck like we have to to survive, and maybe the experience will show them how to not piss away the taxpayer's money.
[/quote]
@Smokin Joe

I don't wish hardship on anyone.  We don't know the financial hardship of any of these 800,000, but they need their money for the work they are doing and those furloughed who will get no money in the future unless they are allowed to come back for that job.

[txradioguy]

Don't these shutdowns always end up being a paid vacation for the ones who don't work and double pay for the ones who do?

Pretty much.  The employees that are actually furloughed get all the pay they missed on the back end once they go back to work.

There are so many workarounds where "furloughed" employees are brought back in to work like normal because they are in a "critical" position it's not even funny.

[edpc]

The US Office of Personnel Management tweeted out sample letters for federal employees to send to their creditors, mortgage companies or landlords. The letters suggest that employees ask to pay a reduced amount or create a payment plan in the coming months because they are out of work and not getting paid during the shutdown.


https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/12/28/politics/shutdown-second-week/index.html?r=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F

[truth_seeker]

How about a novel idea:

Permanently eliminate most of these so-called "non-essential" positions.

Wipe them off of "TO & E." (table of equipment and personnel)

AZap them off the "baseline" budget basis.


Zero them out, and do Zero Base Budeting?"

As a former "budget manager" for a Fortune 500 Corp, I can attest that IT WORKS, top corporate executives grumble, then say it was really a greatsuccess. It needed to be done.


You must justify each and every position, function,, etc.

[Bigun]

How about a novel idea:

Permanently eliminate most of these so-called "non-essential" positions.

Wipe them off of "TO & E." (table of equipment and personnel)

AZap them off the "baseline" budget basis.


Zero them out, and do Zero Base Budeting?"

As a former "budget manager" for a Fortune 500 Corp, I can attest that IT WORKS, top corporate executives grumble, then say it was really a greatsuccess. It needed to be done.


You must justify each and every position, function,, etc.

   Been all for that for years!

[Restored]

How about a novel idea:

Permanently eliminate most of these so-called "non-essential" positions.

I am a non-essential government employee. But I make sure the payroll gets run every pay period and the pay gets deposited. I make sure the I-9 process works. I make sure people get W-2's and 1042's. When I am on vacation, I have to be reachable in case something breaks.
Meanwhile, the guy handing out towels at the Congressional gym is considered "essential".

[mountaineer]

You must justify each and every position, function,, etc.

Something never done in federal employment (and most government employment, I'd wager).

[truth_seeker]

Cutting budgets is really hard. It takes ongoing commitment from the top.

Presidents come and go. But the ones heading government agencies are "ongoing."

I remember a very senior exec. with a tough reputation. He wanted budget staff, to show him where to cut. He said "give me the ammo, I'll fire it."

Rumors went around, that he couldn't read. No shite, just like Trump. When he retired he wrote his autobiography, traveled, rached in his native Colorado.  Illiterate, he was NOT.

He was a disruptor, par excellence.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Cutting budgets is really hard. It takes ongoing commitment from the top.

Presidents come and go. But the ones heading government agencies are "ongoing."

I remember a very senior exec. with a tough reputation. He wanted budget staff, to show him where to cut. He said "give me the ammo, I'll fire it."

Rumors went around, that he couldn't read. No shite, just like Trump. When he retired he wrote his autobiography, traveled, rached in his native Colorado.  Illiterate, he was NOT.

He was a disruptor, par excellence.

You do realize don't you that we have been operating under continuing resolutions since 2006?

One cannot cut a budget that one does not have.

CRs are the problem, as NO budget is being brought up, and Congress and Executive simply continue proliferate spending of an inefficient government bureaucracy.

Not a single private company would survive using that same mindset.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

I might be more sympathetic to their plight if it was not for the 30+% taxes I pay in good years, just to hear cheering when I lose my job to plunging oil prices. When times are good, all we in the oil industry hear is bitching, when we're out of work, people cheer cheap fuel. 

So, no, I really don't give a damn, they can budget their paycheck like we have to to survive, and maybe the experience will show them how to not piss away the taxpayer's money.

Yep, we both realized when we set out on our career (or found out rather quickly) that we needed to remain aware at all times the downturns come. 

At one time with kids in college, I was unemployed for two years until I could find another job.

No media came out with articles crying about my plight.  I sucked it up and went out to succeed in spite of that.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

[quote author=Smokin Joe link=topic=345707.msg1879250#msg1879250 date=154610
So, no, I really don't give a damn, they can budget their paycheck like we have to to survive, and maybe the experience will show them how to not piss away the taxpayer's money.

@Smokin Joe

I don't wish hardship on anyone.  We don't know the financial hardship of any of these 800,000, but they need their money for the work they are doing and those furloughed who will get no money in the future unless they are allowed to come back for that job.

Why are you persevering on this?

These are non-essential employees, like many who lose their jobs find out suddenly and dramatically in the private sector.

There is no guarantee of jobs when one works in the public sector.  Just like the private sector.

They need to reassess their position and find a place to make money or go hungry, just like I had to do when I lost a job.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

How about a novel idea:

Permanently eliminate most of these so-called "non-essential" positions.

Wipe them off of "TO & E." (table of equipment and personnel)

AZap them off the "baseline" budget basis.


Zero them out, and do Zero Base Budeting?"

As a former "budget manager" for a Fortune 500 Corp, I can attest that IT WORKS, top corporate executives grumble, then say it was really a greatsuccess. It needed to be done.


You must justify each and every position, function,, etc.

The best companies use this brilliantly to prosper.  Meanwhile, our sorry Congress has not passed a budget since 2006

[Smokin Joe]

[quote author=Smokin Joe link=topic=345707.msg1879250#msg1879250 date=154610
So, no, I really don't give a damn, they can budget their paycheck like we have to to survive, and maybe the experience will show them how to not piss away the taxpayer's money.

@Smokin Joe

I don't wish hardship on anyone.  We don't know the financial hardship of any of these 800,000, but they need their money for the work they are doing and those furloughed who will get no money in the future unless they are allowed to come back for that job.

I'm not wishing hardship on them, but I'm not moved by their whinging either.

When I am in an industry where your income can go from six figures to zero at any time, through factors not of your control, you learn to sack money away for a rainy day, make sure you can meet your obligations with zero income (from savings). I have done that without doing my main career job for as long as two years, supporting my family from savings, because work is tied to global commodity prices. When you're "overqualified" and the "price of oil will come back any day", people won't hire you for slug jobs because they are sure you'll be gone as soon as oil activity picks up.
And Americans regularly cheer such hardships in the form of low gas prices, and even call for more, justifying their celebration because people got paid well for doing a difficult and dangerous job.

So I have little sympathy for people who normally get a steady paycheck and don't prepare for their own economic survival.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

I am a non-essential government employee. But I make sure the payroll gets run every pay period and the pay gets deposited. I make sure the I-9 process works. I make sure people get W-2's and 1042's. When I am on vacation, I have to be reachable in case something breaks.
Meanwhile, the guy handing out towels at the Congressional gym is considered "essential".

Here's some other "essentials" example, from Michelle Obama's staff:

List of Michelle Obama's Staff
Here is a list of Michelle Obama's staff and their salaries in 2010.

Natalie F. Bookey Baker, executive assistant to the chief of staff to the first lady, $45,000;
Alan O. Fitts, deputy director of advance and trip director for the first lady, $61,200;
Jocelyn C. Frey, deputy assistant to the president and director of policy and projects for the first lady, $140,000;
Jennifer Goodman, deputy director of scheduling and events coordinator for the first lady, $63,240;
Deilia A.L. Jackson, deputy associate director of correspondence for the first lady, $42,000;
Kristen E. Jarvis, special assistant for scheduling and traveling aide to the first lady, $51,000;
Camille Y. Johnston, special assistant to the president and director of communications for the first lady, $102,000;
Tyler A. Lechtenberg, director of correspondence for the first lady, $50,000;
Catherine M. Lelyveld, director and press secretary to the first lady, $85,680;
Dana M. Lewis, special assistant and personal aide to the first lady, $66,000;
Trooper Sanders, deputy director of policy and projects for the first lady, $85,000;
Susan S. Sher, assistant to the president and chief of staff and counsel to the first lady, $172,200;
Frances M. Starkey, director of scheduling and advance for the first lady, $80,000;
Semonti M. Stevens, associate director and deputy press secretary to the first lady, $53,550;
and Melissa Winter, special assistant to the president and deputy chief of staff to the first lady, $102,000.