Author Topic: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas  (Read 3656 times)

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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #150 on: July 07, 2025, 06:39:21 pm »
Sometimes shit just happens.  Try as they might the weather does not come with a California type warning label.  Life is hazardous to your health.
Yep. Something comes off a truck going down the highway and takes a bad hop, and 'game over'. You don't get to hit 'reset' and play again. When you consider that we joke about weathermen (What other job can you get it wrong every day and still have a job tomorrow>), these guys did pretty well.

Four AM is a bad time for most folks, which is why a lot of dynamic entry raids are done then--because people are at their worst in terms of being able to respond to most anything--especially something unexpected. Just one more hole in the swiss cheese that lined up...
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
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Offline berdie

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #151 on: July 07, 2025, 07:09:37 pm »
Excellent post, and Kudos to the meteorologist who presented it. Some things are beyond our ability to predict, and the confluence of rare and serious events can often have tragic consequences.



This is a horrible event. I understand folks wanting to place blame. It's a natural reaction. But, frankly, sometimes nature overcomes humans. It's been that way since the beginning of time.

I wouldn't give 2 cents for these politicians trying to point fingers. It's disgusting.

Offline Bigun

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #152 on: July 07, 2025, 07:32:55 pm »
Yep. Something comes off a truck going down the highway and takes a bad hop, and 'game over'. You don't get to hit 'reset' and play again. When you consider that we joke about weathermen (What other job can you get it wrong every day and still have a job tomorrow>), these guys did pretty well.

Four AM is a bad time for most folks, which is why a lot of dynamic entry raids are done then--because people are at their worst in terms of being able to respond to most anything--especially something unexpected. Just one more hole in the swiss cheese that lined up...

That very thing nearly happened to me some years ago. I was driving along minding my own business when something fell off a drilling rig approaching me, bounced one time, and exploded the door window right behind my head. A couple of milliseconds later and I would have been history.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2025, 07:34:24 pm by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Bigun

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #153 on: July 07, 2025, 07:37:59 pm »
People have been living and flourishing in the Texas hill country since LONG before the advent of the national weather service. How can that be?
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #154 on: July 07, 2025, 07:44:34 pm »
People have been living and flourishing in the Texas hill country since LONG before the advent of the national weather service. How can that be?
Well, (and from studying a few pre-european native campsites) you camp far enough away from the water that the outhouse (or whatever) doesn't make the water foul, and it takes the kids long enough to go to the river for water and come back that you have the opportunity to make another one.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
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Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline deb

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #155 on: July 07, 2025, 08:18:37 pm »

https://twitter.com/Nerdy_Addict/status/1942232529169182960

These girls are the same age as my granddaughters. Oh sweet Jesus, have mercy on us. This is too hard.
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #156 on: July 07, 2025, 08:31:04 pm »
When you consider that we joke about weathermen (What other job can you get it wrong every day and still have a job tomorrow>), these guys did pretty well.
My dad was a meteorologist for the Navy in WW2 and later for his entire career with the US Weather Service.

He heard all the jokes over the years and told me once "Son, don't ever say 100% chance of rain, make it 90% chance because someone, somewhere will get no rain and think you incompetent.  Same goes in reverse for 0% chance of rain."

Ask any sailor and they will tell you how difficult it is to predict the weather, even when their lives depended upon it.

One never gets it right all the time.

Oh BTW, when he retired my dad bought a lakehouse that he scouted out that was in a 100 year flood zone.  After he passed, the house got under water twice.  Even the best can err.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #157 on: July 07, 2025, 09:07:05 pm »
These girls are the same age as my granddaughters. Oh sweet Jesus, have mercy on us. This is too hard.
I have great grands in this age group. Prayers up for the families...
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Bigun

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #158 on: July 07, 2025, 09:12:12 pm »
These girls are the same age as my granddaughters. Oh sweet Jesus, have mercy on us. This is too hard.

I would never recover had this happened on my watch. My heart breaks for all involved including the survivors.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #159 on: July 07, 2025, 09:12:32 pm »
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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #160 on: July 07, 2025, 09:13:48 pm »
These girls are the same age as my granddaughters. Oh sweet Jesus, have mercy on us. This is too hard.

I know..my granddaughter is eight... :crying:
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Offline libertybele

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #161 on: July 07, 2025, 09:29:10 pm »

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #162 on: July 07, 2025, 09:32:18 pm »
I have to take a break posting on this thread...I just can't take it anymore.



https://twitter.com/Joe_S_Pure/status/1942370995764969616
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #163 on: July 07, 2025, 10:56:37 pm »
I have to take a break posting on this thread...I just can't take it anymore.

https://twitter.com/Joe_S_Pure/status/1942370995764969616

I give you mega credit for staying on it so long @mystery-ak

I want social media to stop trying to elicit emotional reactions from people.  At this point we understand the horror, the injustice, the magnitude of the loss.  The focus should now be on coordinating and promoting prayer services and contributions to help the families, towns and communities heal.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #164 on: July 07, 2025, 11:59:39 pm »
I give you mega credit for staying on it so long @mystery-ak

I want social media to stop trying to elicit emotional reactions from people.  At this point we understand the horror, the injustice, the magnitude of the loss.  The focus should now be on coordinating and promoting prayer services and contributions to help the families, towns and communities heal.
Let's go one more. How about warning systems tied to actual stream flow, and not conjecture. On the ground, sirens and the like.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline jafo2010

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #165 on: July 08, 2025, 12:21:56 am »
Well, we all know it was climate change and Trump's fault.


Jeez, these Democommies are just too much. 

I will say, with all our technology expertise, we should be able to establish systems that warn people in advance.  People end up dying in these flash floods across the USA with some frequency.  My first wife, her mother lived at the top of a small mountain, and below, at the base, during a flash flood, I believe 26 people were swept away from their homes and died in Shadyside, Ohio, folks that lived along the tiny roadside stream that became a huge flash of flooding water.

It happens frequently enough that the time has come to establish a process for warning people on a national basis when this type event happens. 

Most are old enough here that they remember being trained on what to do if we have a nuclear attack.  We were instructed to hide under our desks like that would provide protection.  I am not suggesting something stupid, but perhaps a system put in place where when a certain type siren goes off, people know to scramble to high ground ASAP. 

Long overdue that we do something as a nation to prevent this type of tragedy from happening.

Online Lando Lincoln

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #166 on: July 08, 2025, 07:38:45 am »
For those wondering how this happened, why there wasn't more warning, etc., this video from a Houston meteorologist explains the weather that caused the flooding pretty well, as well as laying out the timing of events:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOA6lowVozQ

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Online Lando Lincoln

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #167 on: July 08, 2025, 07:52:23 am »
I have to take a break posting on this thread...I just can't take it anymore.



https://twitter.com/Joe_S_Pure/status/1942370995764969616

Thank you @mystery-ak as always. Now that names, faces, family members and rescuers are becoming known, this tragedy becomes so personal. You have done an amazing job.
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Offline mountaineer

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #168 on: July 08, 2025, 08:22:08 am »
The Shadyside flood @jafo010 mentioned is commemorated every year. It's painfully etched on the collective memory of the upper Ohio valley. Less than a month ago, nearby Wheeling experienced flooding that took 9 lives.

It happens all too frequently - Texas, Appalachia, wherever - and sometimes the warnings are insufficient, too late, not heard, or simply ignored.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2025, 11:12:50 am by mountaineer »
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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #169 on: July 08, 2025, 09:47:26 am »
United Cajun Navy says 'mentally tough' combat veterans assisting in search for Texas flood victims

United Cajun Navy Vice President Brian Trascher told “Fox & Friends” on Tuesday that a specialized team of mainly combat veterans is helping search for victims of the central Texas flooding.

“It’s something that you never get over,” Trascher said in reference to finding young victims.

“Normally in these kind of missions we will put out like a wide call for volunteers... but we stuck to what we call special ops volunteers who are pretty much all combat veterans – very mentally tough, very able to handle anything emotionally,” he said. “They do come across some things that are really hard to see.”

Trascher also said the devastation in central Texas is similar to what his organization saw following Hurricane Helene in North Carolina.

“The biggest contrast is the response is completely different. The coordination between the state of Texas and the federal government was from day one and it has been highly professional and highly effective in our opinion. It makes our job as easier as volunteers,” he said.

The United Cajun Navy describes itself as a “grassroots nonprofit organization” based in Louisiana.

“Armed with boats, trucks, and an unyielding sense of community, the United Cajun Navy specializes in delivering life-saving rescue efforts, humanitarian aid, and logistical support in areas severely affected by floods, hurricanes, and other catastrophic events,” it said on its website.
Posted by Greg Norman
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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #170 on: July 08, 2025, 09:49:41 am »
33 min(s) ago
National Weather Service says 'isolated pockets of heavy rainfall are possible' in central Texas

The National Weather Service said Tuesday that “isolated to scattered afternoon and early evening showers and storms are forecast across the Coastal Plains, I-35 corridor, and eastern Hill Country” in Texas.

“Isolated pockets of heavy rainfall are possible,” its Austin/San Antonio office said. “Chances of rain will decrease gradually Tuesday. Drier and warmer conditions are forecast Wednesday through the weekend.”
Posted by Greg Norman
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Offline mystery-ak

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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #172 on: July 08, 2025, 10:04:20 am »
 Texas dad refused to let go of ‘his babies’ during flood — and all were swept away, witness says
By Steven Vago and
Anthony Blair   
Published July 7, 2025, 5:15 p.m. ET


KERRVILLE, Texas — A stricken dad clinging to a tree while holding “his babies” during the floods refused to toss the kids to residents, and they were all soon swept away, a shattered local said Monday.

“My husband was in the water trying to ask them, ‘Please throw me your baby!’ The man was holding tight to his babies, and he just got swept away,” said Lorena Guillen, owner of the Blue Oak RV Park in Kerr County, the region hardest hit by the state’s catastrophic flooding last week.

The tragic dad, John Burgess, who lived in Liberty, Texas, is among the confirmed dead, KWTX reported.


John Burgess died while holding onto his children during the floods at Blue Oak RV Park in Kerr County, Texas, during the flood last week. Facebook

His wife, Julia, and two young sons are still missing, while the couple’s daughter, who was staying at a nearby summer camp, is safe.

The family had come to the RV park for the July 4 holiday, Guillen said.

more
https://nypost.com/2025/07/07/us-news/texas-dad-refused-to-let-go-of-his-babies-during-flood-and-all-were-swept-away-witness-says/
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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #173 on: July 08, 2025, 10:32:37 am »
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #174 on: July 08, 2025, 01:42:57 pm »
Let's go one more. How about warning systems tied to actual stream flow, and not conjecture. On the ground, sirens and the like.

Sure @Smokin Joe.   Methinks it's unrealistic, but if it offers much needed hope in this moment, count me in.

Offline DefiantMassRINO

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #175 on: July 08, 2025, 01:56:57 pm »
Possible with an integrated system of rain measures, flood prediction modeling, satellite measures, buoys, and guages.

Coast Guard and NOAA use ocean buoys to measure wave height, tides, storm surges, and tsunamis.

Canada may even have such capabilities to monitor the Bay of Fundy, which has extreme tides.  Bay of Fundy, Canada, would be a great testing ground for a flash flood monitoring and warning system because those extreme tide cycles occur twice a day with variations caused by moon cycles and storms.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2025, 01:58:39 pm by DefiantMassRINO »
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Offline rangerrebew

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #176 on: July 08, 2025, 03:13:34 pm »
TEXAS HORROR: Demonic Democrats Scrambling to Blame Trump for the Deadly Texas Floods, Express Contempt and Scorn for the Victims
By Pamela Geller - on July 8, 2025
 
Speaking of the tragedy in Texas, it was dispiriting to see that the Democrats and many in the media created a hoax that the National Weather Service failed to warn that flash floods were coming due to staffing shortages.

Neither claim was true, but that didn’t stop it spreading like wildfire.

The horror of the this tragedy is unfathomable. The Democrat reaction, pure evil. Just when you thought they couldn’t possibly get worse…..
 
RNC Research: Following the tragic  news, Democrats over the weekend peddled grossly  false and disgusting  narratives in an attempt to politicize this natural disaster. Senator Chris Murphy: “There are consequences to Trump’s brainless attacks…” Democrat House Leader Hakeem Jeffries: “Republicans spent months threatening to condition disaster assistance…” Texas Congressman Joaquin Castro : “I don’t think it’s helpful to have missing key personnel from the National Weather Service not in place to help prevent these tragedies.” Vermont Congresswoman Becca Balint: “We knew that these cuts would have deadly consequences.” Democrat Senate Leader Chuck Schumer even opened a partisan investigation.All of these attacks – attempting to blame these floods on the Trump administration and spending cuts – have one thing in common: they’re lies. The NWS said its “forecasting offices were operating normally at the time of the disaster.” Meteorologists say the National Weather Service did its job in Texas and even “had extra staff on duty during the storms.” Houston meteorologist Matt Lanza: “We have seen absolutely nothing to suggest that current staffing or budget issues within NOAA and the NWS played any role at all in this event. Anyone using this event to claim that is being dishonest.” CBS Austin Meteorologist Avery Tomasco: “The National Weather Service … did their job and they did it well.” Even far-left Ohio Democrat Nina Turner said that attempts by the left to capitalize on this tragedy were “morally bankrupt.” (RNC Research)

The Associated Press, WIRED, and many other publications looked into the allegations and all concluded that the accusations were false. (Associated Press, WIRED).

https://gellerreport.com/2025/07/texas-horror-demonic-democrats-scrambling-to-blame-trump-for-the-deadly-texas-floods-express-contempt-and-scorn-for-the-victims.html/
« Last Edit: July 08, 2025, 03:14:26 pm by rangerrebew »
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Offline libertybele

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #177 on: July 08, 2025, 03:55:40 pm »
I sat and watched a brief question and answer session this morning with the mayor and sheriff's team ... obviously they were holding back a lot of emotion and those asking questions were heartless wanting information so that they could point fingers.

The response from the sheriff and mayor is that they have lives to save and find right now which is our priority.

Offline DB

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #178 on: July 08, 2025, 04:00:00 pm »
The issues are getting people to heed the warnings and to not send warnings that don't pan out very often. Sending warnings that don't materialize repeatedly encourages people to ignore them. The warnings also need to be localized to where the real issues are. Broad warnings also end up getting ignored because they often don't apply to them and just becomes background noise.

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #179 on: July 08, 2025, 04:18:13 pm »
3 hour(s) ago
Noem describes breaking down inside Camp Mystic cabin, heartbreaking interactions with parents there

Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem said Tuesday that she had broken down inside a cabin at Camp Mystic in Texas while touring the facility over the weekend in the wake of the devastating flooding.

“I had walked through the cabin where all the little girls died,” Noem said during a Cabinet meeting. “And I had kind of fallen apart in there, but I walked out of the cabin and a gentleman was standing there, and he said ‘that man over there needs a hug.’ And so I walked over to him and I hugged him, and I said, ‘do you work here?’ And he said ‘no, my little girl was in that cabin.’ And he said ‘and I just found her best friend about an hour and a half ago, she had passed away.’ And he just fell apart. And so then we just, hugged and talked for probably an hour about that.”

“There was a dad there of one of the counselors. The counselor was alive, but she was dealing with the fact that she had hung on to some of these girls and was trying to keep them out of the floodwaters, and had gotten hit by something and had lost two of the girls and wasn't able to hang on to them and was going to live the rest of her life, thinking about that moment when she wasn't able to hang on to these girls,” Noem told President Donald Trump.

“These parents were picking up their kids’ belongings out of the mud and throughout the camp and putting them in bags,” Noem also said. “And then one of the dads said, ‘I knew 50 of these girls here, so I knew that was her dress, my daughter's friends dress.’ So he was picking it up and putting it in a bag to return to her parents.”

Noem said during the meeting that “We're still looking for a lot of little girls and, other family members that were camping along that river” and “they will continue until they find every single person.”
Posted by Greg Norman
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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #180 on: July 08, 2025, 04:19:39 pm »
The death toll from the flooding in central Texas over the Fourth of July weekend has reached 109, according to the latest numbers from officials.

Deaths have been reported in six Texas counties – Kerr, Burnet, Travis, Kendall, Williamson and Tom Green, FOX Weather reported.

Kerr County Sheriff Larry Leitha said Tuesday that “As of 8 a.m. central time, 87 deceased have been recovered in Kerr County, including 56 adults and 30 children.

“Identification is pending for 19 adults and seven children, with one additional person still unidentified. At present, five Camp Mystic campers and one counselor still remain unaccounted for,” he added.

FOX Weather's Steven Yablonski contributed to this report.
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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #181 on: July 08, 2025, 04:22:19 pm »
Austin firefighters union accuses chief of delayed flood response, plans no confidence vote

The Austin Firefighters Association said it is holding a no confidence vote against Fire Chief Joel Baker, claiming he delayed the deployment of firefighters to assist in flood relief efforts in Kerrville.

“It brings the Austin Firefighters no pleasure to report to the community that the Austin Fire Chief DENIED the deployment of Austin firefighters to Kerrville until very late into the event (so today!), with the exception of only 3 AFD rescue swimmers who helped staff helo teams (which still were NOT deployed until the afternoon of the 4th),” the organization wrote on Instagram on Monday.

“The Austin Firefighter Special Operations teams are specially trained for Hill Country swift water rescue and are some of the best, if not the best, swift water boat teams in the State of Texas,” it added.” It is absolutely outrageous that the Austin Fire Chief, Joel G. Baker, would not allow highly trained firefighters from Austin to respond to Kerrville. Because of this egregious dereliction of duty, LIVES WERE VERY LIKELY LOST BECAUSE OF CHIEF BAKER’S DECISION!”

The Austin Fire Department did not immediately respond to a request for comment from Fox News Digital on Tuesday.

In an interview with KXAN, Baker said he was aware of three requests for deployment on the Fourth of July as floods were ravaging central Texas: one for an assistant chief who chose not to head there, another for a dispatcher which was denied and a third for rescue swimmers, which were sent over.

“It’s important that we are able to function and maintain a certain level of readiness in the city of Austin. Now, to keep in mind — again — I was not sure how much of the weather would impact my city — the city of Austin. I need to make sure that I have an adequate amount of resources within the city so I can respond for my mutual aid calls and my automatic aid calls around the city of Austin,” Baker told the station.
Posted by Greg Norman
https://www.foxnews.com/live-news/texas-floods-latest-updates-july-8-2025
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“Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.”
-Matthew 6:34

Offline libertybele

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #182 on: July 08, 2025, 04:26:39 pm »
3 hour(s) ago
Noem describes breaking down inside Camp Mystic cabin, heartbreaking interactions with parents there

Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem said Tuesday that she had broken down inside a cabin at Camp Mystic in Texas while touring the facility over the weekend in the wake of the devastating flooding.

“I had walked through the cabin where all the little girls died,” Noem said during a Cabinet meeting. “And I had kind of fallen apart in there, but I walked out of the cabin and a gentleman was standing there, and he said ‘that man over there needs a hug.’ And so I walked over to him and I hugged him, and I said, ‘do you work here?’ And he said ‘no, my little girl was in that cabin.’ And he said ‘and I just found her best friend about an hour and a half ago, she had passed away.’ And he just fell apart. And so then we just, hugged and talked for probably an hour about that.”

“There was a dad there of one of the counselors. The counselor was alive, but she was dealing with the fact that she had hung on to some of these girls and was trying to keep them out of the floodwaters, and had gotten hit by something and had lost two of the girls and wasn't able to hang on to them and was going to live the rest of her life, thinking about that moment when she wasn't able to hang on to these girls,” Noem told President Donald Trump.

“These parents were picking up their kids’ belongings out of the mud and throughout the camp and putting them in bags,” Noem also said. “And then one of the dads said, ‘I knew 50 of these girls here, so I knew that was her dress, my daughter's friends dress.’ So he was picking it up and putting it in a bag to return to her parents.”

Noem said during the meeting that “We're still looking for a lot of little girls and, other family members that were camping along that river” and “they will continue until they find every single person.”
Posted by Greg Norman

Absolutely heartbreaking! 8888crybaby

Offline libertybele

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #183 on: July 08, 2025, 04:28:28 pm »
Austin firefighters union accuses chief of delayed flood response, plans no confidence vote

The Austin Firefighters Association said it is holding a no confidence vote against Fire Chief Joel Baker, claiming he delayed the deployment of firefighters to assist in flood relief efforts in Kerrville.

“It brings the Austin Firefighters no pleasure to report to the community that the Austin Fire Chief DENIED the deployment of Austin firefighters to Kerrville until very late into the event (so today!), with the exception of only 3 AFD rescue swimmers who helped staff helo teams (which still were NOT deployed until the afternoon of the 4th),” the organization wrote on Instagram on Monday.

“The Austin Firefighter Special Operations teams are specially trained for Hill Country swift water rescue and are some of the best, if not the best, swift water boat teams in the State of Texas,” it added.” It is absolutely outrageous that the Austin Fire Chief, Joel G. Baker, would not allow highly trained firefighters from Austin to respond to Kerrville. Because of this egregious dereliction of duty, LIVES WERE VERY LIKELY LOST BECAUSE OF CHIEF BAKER’S DECISION!”

The Austin Fire Department did not immediately respond to a request for comment from Fox News Digital on Tuesday.

In an interview with KXAN, Baker said he was aware of three requests for deployment on the Fourth of July as floods were ravaging central Texas: one for an assistant chief who chose not to head there, another for a dispatcher which was denied and a third for rescue swimmers, which were sent over.

“It’s important that we are able to function and maintain a certain level of readiness in the city of Austin. Now, to keep in mind — again — I was not sure how much of the weather would impact my city — the city of Austin. I need to make sure that I have an adequate amount of resources within the city so I can respond for my mutual aid calls and my automatic aid calls around the city of Austin,” Baker told the station.
Posted by Greg Norman
https://www.foxnews.com/live-news/texas-floods-latest-updates-july-8-2025

So many fingers being pointed.  Let's find the missing and then concentrate on the should have, could have and would haves.

Meanwhile ....  continued prayers.

Offline Bigun

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #184 on: July 08, 2025, 05:14:02 pm »
Let's go one more. How about warning systems tied to actual stream flow, and not conjecture. On the ground, sirens and the like.

Forty odd years ago such a system was advanced but shot down by local governments in the area as too expensive. I strongly suspect the powers that be in those areas didn't want it because it might have disrupted the local economy with widespread use.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #185 on: July 08, 2025, 05:15:57 pm »
The issues are getting people to heed the warnings and to not send warnings that don't pan out very often. Sending warnings that don't materialize repeatedly encourages people to ignore them. The warnings also need to be localized to where the real issues are. Broad warnings also end up getting ignored because they often don't apply to them and just becomes background noise.
Yep, that is the problem.

Have stayed at many downtown hotels where the fire alarm goes off and seen unconcerned staff simply saying things like 'Tests are underway' or 'This happens all the time' to 'Some kid likely pulled alarm'.

Alarms are not a remedy to preventing disasters.  They are simply a way to attempt to preventing more deaths or injuries.

Any firefighter will tell you anyone trapped on the top 20 floors of a 50 story building cannot be readily saved from a fire below them.  Is the solution to limit the height of buildings so no one ever dies in a fire beyond the reach of firemen to save?
“You will never understand bureaucracies until you understand that for bureaucrats procedure is everything and outcomes are nothing.” Thomas Sowell

Offline berdie

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #186 on: July 08, 2025, 06:08:47 pm »
The issues are getting people to heed the warnings and to not send warnings that don't pan out very often. Sending warnings that don't materialize repeatedly encourages people to ignore them. The warnings also need to be localized to where the real issues are. Broad warnings also end up getting ignored because they often don't apply to them and just becomes background noise.



That is a huge part of the problem. Myself, when there are tornado warnings I don't immediately go jump in a closet. And in the middle of the night, what happened in this case, I wouldn't even know.

Even with hurricane warnings a lot of people just shrug their shoulders.

I can't help but wonder if sirens would even hold up under a flash flood? They could be washed away.

Offline rustynail

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #187 on: July 08, 2025, 07:29:12 pm »

Nick Sortor
@nicksortor
🚨 BREAKING: A MASSIVE flooding event is unfolding right now in Ruidoso, New Mexico
https://x.com/nicksortor/status/1942715758397497737

Offline corbe

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #188 on: July 08, 2025, 09:45:46 pm »
   Everything you purchase in the Hill Country requires a recommended Kerr County Upcharge.
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline corbe

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Re: Catastrophic flash flooding along Guadalupe River, Texas
« Reply #189 on: July 08, 2025, 10:18:09 pm »
   I've been up here in the Texas Hill Country for 30+ years.  I've seen a few Flash Floods, most catastrophic and I would've seen many more in that time had the COE not built this damn beginning in 58 and finishings it in 64. 



   Did I forget to mention that are in a extreme drought.


   Actually, that is not an image of the Canyon Lake dam, but it is up 10' so now it is only down 20'.


No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.