Wall St closes lower as Trump sets 25% tariffs, manufacturing data dips

[libertybele]

Credit where credit is due, previous trump admin had a good economy until the Covid thing.

I always look at tariffs as a punitive measure only and while china certainly needs a spanking, not sure the reasoning for canada and mexico, our traditional allies and good neighbors.

Good neighbors?  No.  Both are letting fentanyl into the country, both are allowing ILLEGALS into the country and for the most part they find their way on our doorstep. They are charging us higher tariffs then we are charging them, but I thought that was remedied through Trump's re-negotiation of NAFTA.

[catfish1957]

I for one for selfish reasons would love to see a decent correction.  '87, '00, '09 and '20 as you can see don't come around very often.  I still see this market right now as easily over 50% over-valued

My take on these tariffs is mixed.  In a lot of ways its the economic version of playing "Chicken".  Prior posters are correct in the matter that this is basically a imposed value added tax. That never works out well in and if that is the only strategy.

Except, here, I am early on going to give DJT the benefit of the doubt.  I will take him on his word, that these are being imposed as a leveling of the playing field versus, and potentially a spiraling out control trade war.  If we can get that equity, and the tariffs eased,  this is a master stroke.... If not....   this could backfire fugly. 

Ask me again in 6 months...   

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Experts are predicting another 8 to $12,000 added onto the price of a car due to his latest round of tariffs . So what do you think consumers are gonna do? They’re not gonna go out and buy cars that’s for sure.

Ok, I'll bite.

Where did your source for 'experts' come from?  Maybe Fiat or ?

And how does an American made car which BTW, are overwhelmingly most cars sold in the USA, go up by that amount since it has no tariffs?

Do you know that the EU slaps a 10% tariff on American made cars while We only put a 2.5% tariff on European made cars?

Do you believe that to be fair or do you believe we have been getting screwed when dealing with the EU?

[libertybele]

Ok, I'll bite.


Where did your source for 'experts' come from?  Maybe Fiat or ?

And how does an American made car which BTW, are overwhelmingly most cars sold in the USA, go up by that amount since it has no tariffs?

Do you know that the EU slaps a 10% tariff on American made cars while We only put a 2.5% tariff on European made cars?

Do you believe that to be fair or do you believe we have been getting screwed when dealing with the EU?

The U.S. has been getting screwed also from Canada, China and Mexico.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

That's literally what conservatism is all about, RiV. Change for change's sake is bad.

Really?  Then you still ride mules and wash clothes on a scrubboard?

[IsailedawayfromFR]

I for one for selfish reasons would love to see a decent correction.  '87, '00, '09 and '20 as you can see don't come around very often.  I still see this market right now as easily over 50% over-valued

My take on these tariffs is mixed.  In a lot of ways its the economic version of playing "Chicken".  Prior posters are correct in the matter that this is basically a imposed value added tax. That never works out well in and if that is the only strategy.

Except, here, I am early on going to give DJT the benefit of the doubt.  I will take him on his word, that these are being imposed as a leveling of the playing field versus, and potentially a spiraling out control trade war.  If we can get that equity, and the tariffs eased,  this is a master stroke.... If not....   this could backfire fugly. 

Ask me again in 6 months...

Thinking like an old timer who has already built up his wealth.

We must think about the manufacturing base and those jobs.  Fundamental to keeping our military from being compromised.

I try to buy local and rather pay a bit more for what I know is American made rather than Chinese.

We have been a huge sinkhole for countries to unload into, taking our money out of the country.  DT is trying to lessen that sucking sound and give the value to American citizens.

The more we get them to work, then the less welfare we need, and the more taxes come into the Treasury.

Will not be quick, and may take a couple of years as tariffs have a way of being reciprocally reduced over time, as countries realize the best course is to limit tariffs between them.  I saw where we might be trading tariff free with Argentina, which might be a powerhouse partner.

[libertybele]

It is not going to be painless but we will eventually be better off as a country, especially if we also see a balanced budget.

That is what he needed to better explain to the American people last night.

Then there are the mid-terms ... hopefully things will begin to turn  around before that ....

[LMAO]

Ok, I'll bite.

Where did your source for 'experts' come from?  Maybe Fiat or ?

You need to expand your sources of information


"You're going to see folks looking at buying used cars or keeping their cars longer because by and large Americans are very unlikely to want to pay a 4 or 5 or $8,000 penalty for buying a product now that they didn't have to pay a month ago," said Patrick Anderson, CEO of Anderson Economic Group, a Michigan based automotive consultant.

https://www.khou.com/article/news/local/president-trumps-tariffs-canada-mexico-china-auto-prices/285-a7a3f360-2c9b-48bb-8fa8-5b281b05cc46


Personally, I give more credence to people who study this  stuff for a living versus a many times over failed businessman who crashed the economy the  first time he was president and whose first round of tariffs caused economic harm

You choose differently. And we’re gonna see who’s right although I see he’s backing down somewhat

[LMAO]

It is not going to be painless but we will eventually be better off as a country, especially if we also see a balanced budget.

That is what he needed to better explain to the American people last night.

Then there are the mid-terms ... hopefully things will begin to turn  around before that ....

Lol

That should sell to the electorate. I don’t think American people are willing to suffer just for Donald Trump’s ego


I don’t know which is more ridiculous. Telling people they must suffer with already higher prices going higher  or doing what the Biden administration did and pretended inflation wasn’t a problem.

[libertybele]

Lol

That should sell to the electorate. I don’t think American people are willing to suffer just for Donald Trump’s ego


I don’t know which is more ridiculous. Telling people they must suffer with already higher prices going higher  or doing what the Biden administration did and pretended inflation wasn’t a problem.

I have faith in Trump handling the economy and our country period.

[DefiantMassRINO]

Biden's people did not understand supply and demand.  Trump's people understand supply and demand.

They are using creative destruction in an attempt to build a more favorable business investment environment in the United States.

Creating a positive business investment environment requires navigating a fondue of local, county, regional, state, and Federal regulatory authorities.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

You need to expand your sources of information


"You're going to see folks looking at buying used cars or keeping their cars longer because by and large Americans are very unlikely to want to pay a 4 or 5 or $8,000 penalty for buying a product now that they didn't have to pay a month ago," said Patrick Anderson, CEO of Anderson Economic Group, a Michigan based automotive consultant.

https://www.khou.com/article/news/local/president-trumps-tariffs-canada-mexico-china-auto-prices/285-a7a3f360-2c9b-48bb-8fa8-5b281b05cc46


Personally, I give more credence to people who study this  stuff for a living versus a many times over failed businessman who crashed the economy the  first time he was president and whose first round of tariffs caused economic harm

You choose differently. And we’re gonna see who’s right although I see he’s backing down somewhat

And you need to actually read your source articles.

It says UP TO those additional prices, and that is NOT a quote from 'experts' like you said it is.

Go ahead and buy a German made car if you like, and try to keep the hyperventilating to a minimum, will you?

[catfish1957]

Want to see a strange oddity?  The VIX is only up in the mid 20's. That tells me that the market movement is more facilitated  by fundamentals than emotion.  And that is a good thing for 2 reasons:

1. The large market players are fully understanding that this is a negotiation strategy rather than invoking a trade war.
2. That the finely placed tariffs are not going to have as much damage as what is being advertised. 

I really expect some positive movement in the next few weeks, between all parties, except the Chicoms. They have a whole lot more to lose in the short term than we do.   Their sabre rattling make get a little louder, especially if we have positive movement on the Ukraine situation.  That will be 2 losses for them, on 2 fronts.