Author Topic: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]  (Read 141308 times)

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Offline Bigun

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"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #976 on: August 01, 2024, 03:50:22 pm »
So YOU say! I happen to believe General Flynn knows WAY to much as far as our current "Government" is concerned which is EXACTLY why they had to deep six him!
I agree about that but will take a pass on nationwide Martial Law. There have been occasions in cities where it has been necessary to gain control over rioting (in the '60s, National Guard with shoot looters orders), but even those operations were subject to the civil authority.

The problem with Martial Law is that once the troops are deployed, if the wrong person is giving the orders, you are screwed. There is no guarantee someone even within the military might not 'arrange' for 'unfortunate events' leading to that situation.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #977 on: August 01, 2024, 03:51:43 pm »

https://twitter.com/amuse/status/1818717939954262049
Is every executive branch agency completely corrupt?

Maybe not every, completely, but the taint is strongly present in some and overwhelming in others.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline 240B

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #978 on: August 01, 2024, 03:53:52 pm »

Catherine Herridge Identifies BOMBSHELL From Secret Service Senate Hearing: ‘Incomprehensible’

Trending Politics
Mark Steffen
August 1, 2024

Veteran Capitol Hill reporter Catherine Herridge singled out remarks by the acting chief of the Secret Service on Tuesday suggesting that the federal government’s ability to coordinate with local officials may be no better than it was before 9/11 despite billions of dollars spent to break down the information siloes that led to the attacks. She also identified an “incomprehensible” admission regarding a drone operated by the shooter, Thomas Matthew Crooks.

The bombshell disclosure came during Robert Rowe’s testimony before a joint Senate committee investigating how lapses in security allowed a deranged gunman to come within an inch of killing former President Donald Trump last month. The director affirmed a question by Sen. Gary Peters (D-MI) asking if it’s accurate that local authorities had “no way of communicating with the Secret Service” or a counter-sniper for at least 30 seconds before they reported the gunman was on a nearby roof. “Would that be enough time to react prior to the firing of those shots?” the senator asked.

“Senator, if we’d had that information they’d have been able to address it more quickly. It appears that that information was stuck or siloed in that state or local channel,” Rowe admitted before pointing to other ways in which the Secret Service did its best to partner with police in Butler, Pennsylvania that day. “It is troubling to me that we did not get that information as quickly as we should have. We didn’t know that there was this incident going on, and the only thing we had was, locals were working on an issue at the 3 o’clock, which was to the president’s right which was where the shot came. Nothing about the man on the roof, nothing about a man with a gun, none of that information ever made it over our net.

(more)
https://trendingpoliticsnews.com/catherine-herridge-identifies-bombshell-from-secret-service-senate-hearing-incomprehensible-mstef/

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You cannot "COEXIST" with people who want to kill you.
If they kill their own with no conscience, there is nothing to stop them from killing you.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #979 on: August 01, 2024, 03:55:14 pm »
If SCOTUS had upheld their Constitutional responsibility and heard Texas vs Pennsylvania in 2020 we probably would not be in this mess!
:yowsa:

That critical abdication of primary jurisdiction was one of the worst things SCOTUS has done.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

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Offline roamer_1

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #981 on: August 01, 2024, 04:07:14 pm »
The problem with Martial Law is that once the troops are deployed, if the wrong person is giving the orders, you are screwed. There is no guarantee someone even within the military might not 'arrange' for 'unfortunate events' leading to that situation.

The thing with martial law is the precedent it sets. If it pushes against its traces, next time it has a bit more room.

Martial law has almost only and exclusively employed under the guise of local and state LEOS (supplementing them) in cases of rioting and natural disasters. That's the acceptable base line. Boots on the ground to augment local control.

Now ponder what the covid lockdowns added to that - Control of banks, ports, and businesses... Picking and choosing....

Now lets envision the next lockdown, where the two are joined together... Because the precedent has been set, and they did not get in trouble for it... So that is compliance. Boots on the ground and control of goods and services...

All that's left is military courts and our Constitution is subsumed.

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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #983 on: August 01, 2024, 04:13:44 pm »
Yet here we are, with Briefers speaking in approving tones, of a military junta on the right. WTF, ALREADY?

Good rule of thumb: power you would not give to your enemy should nether be given to your friend.

It's the same damn government.

And by the way, the ones who would stop martial law from either direction would be red state governors. Not blue ones.
Spot on.

While I agree with @MeganC that the imposition of a totalitarian regime by Harris or other Democrats would be facilitated by their perfusion in the Administrative (deep) State, those selfsame people would drool at the possibility of increasing their power and lack of accountability already enjoyed under any boss,  with the intent of turning that power to serving their own ambitions later.
You can use a hammer to build or to demolish, but first, you gotta get a hammer. From there, the world is a keg of nails, and you get to choose which ones get hit.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline roamer_1

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #984 on: August 01, 2024, 04:19:56 pm »
You can use a hammer to build or to demolish, but first, you gotta get a hammer. From there, the world is a keg of nails, and you get to choose which ones get hit.

Oh, that's niiiice. That one is in the file. I will use it often.  :beer:

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #985 on: August 01, 2024, 04:29:32 pm »
"Clearly, it's an inside job"

Yes, and clearly what a devious, well-organized plot it was. They got this super-trained assassin, Crooks, to crawl along a roof where everybody could see him and let him get off eight shots.
I mean why hire expert marksmen to do the job when you can get an untrained, mentally ill loner with negligible stealth skills to make an attempt?
It was just a massive screwup by the SS.....nothing more, nothing less. No evil plotting involved.
This ignores the sound analysis that showed two shooters.
Transit time from the bullet arriving (sonic 'crack') and the sound of the rifle discharging is different, showing two rifles involved (the bullet gets there first). If one shooter was located beneath or above and behind crooks, along a very similar azimuth from the stage, trajectories might not sort out the difference. It would be ideal to have the 'pro' located near the patsy, azimuth wise, and if dressed as one of the myriad different groups of LEOs present, they could just walk away.

As for finding 8 cartridge cases on the roof, expended .223 (or 5.56) brass is common as cat crap. Google it if you don't believe me, it is sold in bulk, and often found at rifle ranges. It is doubtful that Crooks reloaded, so brass from his rifle may have been available at the range where he shot.
But with a tendency to not ask all the questions (just stop with the 'answers' that fulfill the narrative), that brass could have been fired by most anyone, anywhere, any time, and there were lots of people who shoot it there that day on the security crew. While hardly sufficient, IMO, as evidence, some rifles will leave characteristic deformations or markings on expended cartridge cases, either by the location and depth of penetration of the firing pin, the extractor, or by the process of extraction. So much so that some states required cartridge cases to be filed when purchasing a firearm, and some I bought in ND which were NIB and obviously from states which restricted magazine size, came from the factory with an expended case in an envelope to file with TPTB. They were sold by an FFL here because the whole sale process in ND was much simpler.

With that in mind, has any analysis of the cartridge cases allegedly from Crooks'  rifle been conducted with cases obtained by test firing that rifle?
Have the head stamps on the cartridge cases been checked?
Are they even from the same manufacturer?
Have any recovered bullets (have any even been recovered) been subjected to ballistic analysis with bullets fired from Crooks' rifle for comparison?
Or are we just taking their word for everything, the word of the SS people who have been caught lying before Congress and the world?
« Last Edit: August 01, 2024, 04:33:39 pm by Smokin Joe »
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline berdie

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #986 on: August 01, 2024, 05:47:58 pm »
Oh, that's niiiice. That one is in the file. I will use it often.  :beer:



Mine as well.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #987 on: August 01, 2024, 05:52:33 pm »
Oh, that's niiiice. That one is in the file. I will use it often.  :beer:
@berdie  :beer:
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Bigun

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #988 on: August 01, 2024, 06:08:48 pm »
I agree about that but will take a pass on nationwide Martial Law. There have been occasions in cities where it has been necessary to gain control over rioting (in the '60s, National Guard with shoot looters orders), but even those operations were subject to the civil authority.

The problem with Martial Law is that once the troops are deployed, if the wrong person is giving the orders, you are screwed. There is no guarantee someone even within the military might not 'arrange' for 'unfortunate events' leading to that situation.

I have not, and cannot find where General Flynn did either, ever suggested full scale martial law. What I have said is "If there were any justice, every lamppost on Constitution Ave. would have a decoration or two hanging from it."
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #989 on: August 01, 2024, 06:10:25 pm »
I have not, and cannot find where General Flynn did either, ever suggested full scale martial law. What I have said is "If there were any justice, every lamppost on Constitution Ave. would have a decoration or two hanging from it."
And, when the ornaments fell from the bridges across the Potomac, the crabs would run fat.

I'm not against Flynn, I even have a copy of his Citizen's Guide to 5GW, but I am damned leery of concentrations of power.  In some places, at some point, there will be needed shows of force (and, sadly the employment thereof) to get things under control. The question is, "Who, when, where?". The last General we could trust running the country with incredible power was George Washington, and he turned down being King.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2024, 06:15:22 pm by Smokin Joe »
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Bigun

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #990 on: August 01, 2024, 06:18:19 pm »
This ignores the sound analysis that showed two shooters.
Transit time from the bullet arriving (sonic 'crack') and the sound of the rifle discharging is different, showing two rifles involved (the bullet gets there first). If one shooter was located beneath or above and behind crooks, along a very similar azimuth from the stage, trajectories might not sort out the difference. It would be ideal to have the 'pro' located near the patsy, azimuth wise, and if dressed as one of the myriad different groups of LEOs present, they could just walk away.

As for finding 8 cartridge cases on the roof, expended .223 (or 5.56) brass is common as cat crap. Google it if you don't believe me, it is sold in bulk, and often found at rifle ranges. It is doubtful that Crooks reloaded, so brass from his rifle may have been available at the range where he shot.
But with a tendency to not ask all the questions (just stop with the 'answers' that fulfill the narrative), that brass could have been fired by most anyone, anywhere, any time, and there were lots of people who shoot it there that day on the security crew. While hardly sufficient, IMO, as evidence, some rifles will leave characteristic deformations or markings on expended cartridge cases, either by the location and depth of penetration of the firing pin, the extractor, or by the process of extraction. So much so that some states required cartridge cases to be filed when purchasing a firearm, and some I bought in ND which were NIB and obviously from states which restricted magazine size, came from the factory with an expended case in an envelope to file with TPTB. They were sold by an FFL here because the whole sale process in ND was much simpler.

With that in mind, has any analysis of the cartridge cases allegedly from Crooks'  rifle been conducted with cases obtained by test firing that rifle?
Have the head stamps on the cartridge cases been checked?
Are they even from the same manufacturer?
Have any recovered bullets (have any even been recovered) been subjected to ballistic analysis with bullets fired from Crooks' rifle for comparison?
Or are we just taking their word for everything, the word of the SS people who have been caught lying before Congress and the world?

 :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Questions never asked and things never looked for are very often much more important than those that are.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Bigun

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #991 on: August 01, 2024, 06:23:40 pm »
Spot on.

While I agree with @MeganC that the imposition of a totalitarian regime by Harris or other Democrats would be facilitated by their perfusion in the Administrative (deep) State, those selfsame people would drool at the possibility of increasing their power and lack of accountability already enjoyed under any boss,  with the intent of turning that power to serving their own ambitions later.
You can use a hammer to build or to demolish, but first, you gotta get a hammer. From there, the world is a keg of nails, and you get to choose which ones get hit.

Government bureaucrats NEVER have any difficulty figuring out which nails to hit. It's ALWAYS those who have the temerity to challenge anything they say.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2024, 06:31:31 pm by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #992 on: August 01, 2024, 06:25:06 pm »
Government beauracrats NEVER have any difficulty figuring out which nails to hit. It's ALWAYS those who have the temerity to challenge anything they say.
Well, that's because bureaucrats are just low tier totalitarians.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Bigun

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #993 on: August 01, 2024, 06:28:32 pm »

https://twitter.com/HawleyMO/status/1819094175096176770

How typical of the inside the beltway culture! Promote the guilty party to director so he can more effectively cover up his malfeasance!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Bigun

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #994 on: August 01, 2024, 06:34:47 pm »
And, when the ornaments fell from the bridges across the Potomac, the crabs would run fat.

I'm not against Flynn, I even have a copy of his Citizen's Guide to 5GW, but I am damned leery of concentrations of power.  In some places, at some point, there will be needed shows of force (and, sadly the employment thereof) to get things under control. The question is, "Who, when, where?". The last General we could trust running the country with incredible power was George Washington, and he turned down being King.

I completely agree with that in its entirety and cannot think of anyone currently around that I would trust more than Mike Flynn!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Bigun

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #995 on: August 01, 2024, 06:35:57 pm »
Well, that's because bureaucrats are just low tier totalitarians.

:yowsa: Which is exactly why we need far fewer of them!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline jafo2010

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #996 on: August 02, 2024, 04:04:23 am »
Rowe in charge of the Secret Service, and the revelation that he was a decision maker in regard to the site in Butler, PA sure does scream conspiracy to me.  Oh yes, you most certainly will hear the truth about what happened that day.

So, who is left to arrive at the truth?  We know both the FBI and Secret Service are in full blown cover up mode.  And don't hold your breath for Congress to get at the answers.  They take a generation to decide anything, in time for their own retirement.

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #997 on: August 02, 2024, 09:45:14 am »
Hawley: Secret Service Whistleblower Alleges Retaliation Against Those Voicing Trump Event Security Concerns

The Secret Service whistleblower alleged Acting Secret Service Director Ronald Rowe made cuts to personnel who could have helped prevent an assassination attempt against former President Donald Trump and that there was retaliation against those who expressed concerns about security at Trump events.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2024/08/02/hawley-secret-service-whistleblower-alleges-retaliation-against-those-voicing-concerns-about-inadequate-security-at-trump-events/
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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #998 on: August 02, 2024, 09:47:56 am »


https://twitter.com/amuse/status/1818717939954262049


Secret Service whistleblower makes stunning claim about director who replaced Kimberly Cheatle and says agents warned of problems for MONTHS before Trump's assassination attempt

DAILYMAIL.COM
By Jon Michael Raasch
1 August 2024

A Republican senator has received 'disturbing information' on Donald Trump's near assassination from a whistleblower alleging a major protocol was broken before the Butler, Pennsylvania, rally.

The latest allegation, from an anonymous whistleblower, contends that the Secret Service's Counter Surveillance Division (CSD) - the unit tasked with evaluating event sites in advance - was not present at the deadly rally and never performed a 'typical evaluation' before the event.

The anonymous whistleblower's complaint is one of several filed to Missouri Republican Sen. Josh Hawley in recent weeks.

In addition, the source alleges that Secret Service Acting Director Ronald Rowe, the freshly minted agency chief after former boss Kimberly Cheatle resigned, is at fault for the huge oversight.

Rowe 'personally directed significant cuts to CSD,' the whistleblower says.

(more)
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13700087/secret-service-whistleblower-trump-shooting-claims-agents-warned.html

This is the same guy who testified ...
"We don't know who was in charge?"
"We don't know who made the decisions?"
"We are a bipartisan bicameral agency!" <- yes, he actually said this to Senator Cruz, who laughed at him
You cannot "COEXIST" with people who want to kill you.
If they kill their own with no conscience, there is nothing to stop them from killing you.
Rational fear and anger at vicious murderous Islamic terrorists is the same as irrational antisemitism, according to the Leftists

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Re: Thread 2...Assassination Attempt Of Pres. Trump [update]
« Reply #999 on: August 02, 2024, 09:52:10 am »
Hawley: Secret Service Whistleblower Alleges Retaliation Against Those Voicing Trump Event Security Concerns

The Secret Service whistleblower alleged Acting Secret Service Director Ronald Rowe made cuts to personnel who could have helped prevent an assassination attempt against former President Donald Trump and that there was retaliation against those who expressed concerns about security at Trump events.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2024/08/02/hawley-secret-service-whistleblower-alleges-retaliation-against-those-voicing-concerns-about-inadequate-security-at-trump-events/

Rowe is toast.
aka "nasty degenerate SOB," "worst of the worst at Free Republic," "Garbage Troll," "Neocon Warmonger," "Filthy Piece of Trash," "damn $#%$#@!," "Silly f'er," "POS," "war pig," "neocon scumbag," "insignificant little ankle nipper," "@ss-clown," "neocuck," "termite," "Uniparty Deep stater," "Never Trump sack of dog feces," "avid Bidenista," "filthy Ukrainian," "war whore," "fricking chump," "psychopathic POS," "depraved SOB," "Never Trump Moron," "Lazarus," and "sock puppet."

"In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act."  ---George Orwell