Trump Backs 'Red Flag' Laws That Could Impact Veteran Gun Ownership

[Cyber Liberty]

The predicate clause establishes the reason for the Right of the People, but not like commonly interpreted.

Not to be part of that well (controlled) regulated Militia (standing army), but to keep it well regulated by the force, if necessary, of the overwhelming force of arms of the entire populace. This was discussed in The Federalist Papers which were, in essence, the case made in the public forum for the Constitution and the Republic.
Federalist 46 James Madison:.

Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation, the existence of subordinate governments, to which the people are attached, and by which the militia officers are appointed, forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of.

Sounds like Jimbo didn't want us to keep and bear arms just to shoot Bambi or paper targets.

[roamer_1]

Sounds like Jimbo didn't want us to keep and bear arms just to shoot Bambi or paper targets.

But he's simply talking about the federalized National Guard, doncha know. 

[Smokin Joe]

They want to send physically fit officers to do the confiscation dirty work.  They're too chicken to face @roamer_1 themselves, so they'll send mercenaries.

That is the unfortunate result of people making rules they, themselves, are insulated from (in all aspects).

[Smokin Joe]

Sounds like Jimbo didn't want us to keep and bear arms just to shoot Bambi or paper targets.

No, it was (and remains) all about securing our Liberties in case the Government 'forgot' why it was founded.

[Smokin Joe]

But he's simply talking about the federalized National Guard, doncha know. 

That would require almost a Biblical level of prophetic prescience.

Consider

"National Guard" became a standard nationwide militia title in 1903, and specifically indicated reserve forces under mixed state and federal control since 1933.

In 1986, Congress passed the Montgomery Amendment, which prohibited state governors from withholding their consent to overseas deployments. The Supreme Court upheld this law in 1990, ruling against Minnesota's governor in Perpich v. Department of Defense.[4]

In 2006, Congress passed the 2007 National Defense Authorization Act, which gave the president the authority to mobilize National Guard units within the U.S. without the consent of state governors.[5][6]

source

and 10 u.s. code § 246 is from 1956

[txradioguy]

@Right_in_Virginia well regulated = well ordered and disciplined in their drills (marching as well as combat) and use of their weapons. It doesn’t mean regulation on the use And ownership of firearms.

Oh and as the Category Mod for the Second Amendment Section of TBR...nothing is getting locked.

I wouldn’t come into the category YOU Mod and and start suggesting topics get shut down.

Show me the same respect.

[Right_in_Virginia]

@Right_in_Virginia well regulated = well ordered and disciplined in their drills (marching as well as combat) and use of their weapons. It doesn’t mean regulation on the use And ownership of firearms.

Oh and as the Category Mod for the Second Amendment Section of TBR...nothing is getting locked.

I wouldn’t come into the category YOU Mod and and start suggesting topics get shut down.

Show me the same respect. 

Please  don't get so worked up over a suggestion that folks may need to walk away for a bit and regain composure.  It wasn't an order; just a recommendation.

The poster I was directing my comments to had "Cat Mod" under his name.   Good grief @txradioguy I'll never understand the things you take so personally or why you get so angry.   

[Axeslinger]

 Can I just go on the record and say if JH says the word “efficacious”, I may be tempted to beat him to death with it.

[roamer_1]

Can I just go on the record and say if JH says the word “efficacious”, I may be tempted to beat him to death with it.

Yeah... It'd be good for a beer drinking game, except we'd all be sh*tfaced by page two... 

[Cyber Liberty]

[Cyber Liberty]

Please  don't get so worked up over a suggestion that folks may need to walk away for a bit and regain composure.  It wasn't an order; just a recommendation.

The poster I was directing my comments to had "Cat Mod" under his name.   Good grief @txradioguy I'll never understand the things you take so personally or why you get so angry.   

"Cat Moderator" is anybody with any Category.  The active Mod has green squares over the Avatar.  Honest mistake, since I recently did a realignment of the permissions for Mods.  It wasn't always like that.

[roamer_1]

That's a weird lookin tater...

[Cyber Liberty]

That's a weird lookin tater...

It's a spud, alright.  I was thinking of finding Nagin's bat, with the barbed wire, but I went with the caveman club.....

[EdJames]

Ummm...I don't see it.

No.  We've been lucky so far, in that we haven't had to lock either of the "Red Flag" threads that have been running fevered the past week, and we don't want to start now, especially if the criteria (vague as they may be) have not been breached.  We're more likely to remove/edit posts that are meant to cause a thread to be locked.

I suspect that these threads are going to continue, especially when we get a glimpse of the actual bills brought forth in each chamber.

And when they actually vote on them.

The only way that they will ever end, is if Trump refuses to sign them, and tells us that he won't in the future.

Alternatively, if he does mistakenly sign anything like what is being proposed, these threads (or their derivatives) will never end....

 

.

[Smokin Joe]

I suspect that these threads are going to continue, especially when we get a glimpse of the actual bills brought forth in each chamber.

And when they actually vote on them.

The only way that they will ever end, is if Trump refuses to sign them, and tells us that he won't in the future.

Alternatively, if he does mistakenly sign anything like what is being proposed, these threads (or their derivatives) will never end....

 

.

The Democrats are coming back from recess a week early to 'work on gun control'. Consider that they have thrown enough legislation in the hopper during relatively ordinary instances of violence to mop up the blood and then some, and this likely indicates that they are going to go overboard with 'suggestions' which will likely pass the House on a Party Line Vote.

I really don't see them holding back for fear of being voted out, and unfortunately I foresee Republicans caving under the pressure to "Do Something!!", especially with the media doing their best to maintain the panic they have stirred up. (Really? People in Times Square scrambling for cover at a motorcycle backfiring?). 

Unfortunately, the GOP might not be so reticent to vote for such schemes because they have long adopted the stance of "Well, so what? Who else are you going to vote for?".

As a country, we're in possibly very deep doo-doo.

[sneakypete]

Can I just go on the record and say if JH says the word “efficacious”, I may be tempted to beat him to death with it.

@Axeslinger

You have MY vote. Anyone that actually uses that word in a conversation deserves to be beaten to death with it.

[Axeslinger]

@Axeslinger

You have MY vote. Anyone that actually uses that word in a conversation deserves to be beaten to death with it.

@sneakypete
I’m sure his last words would be “...and reasonableeeeeee!!!”

[txradioguy]

The Democrats are coming back from recess a week early to 'work on gun control'. Consider that they have thrown enough legislation in the hopper during relatively ordinary instances of violence to mop up the blood and then some, and this likely indicates that they are going to go overboard with 'suggestions' which will likely pass the House on a Party Line Vote.

I really don't see them holding back for fear of being voted out, and unfortunately I foresee Republicans caving under the pressure to "Do Something!!", especially with the media doing their best to maintain the panic they have stirred up. (Really? People in Times Square scrambling for cover at a motorcycle backfiring?). 

Unfortunately, the GOP might not be so reticent to vote for such schemes because they have long adopted the stance of "Well, so what? Who else are you going to vote for?".

As a country, we're in possibly very deep doo-doo.

The one to watch in the Senate is S.66

DiFi is back with a vengeance with the Assault Weapons ban of 2019.  There's a similar bill in the House as well.

[sneakypete]

The one to watch in the Senate is S.66

DiFi is back with a vengeance with the Assault Weapons ban of 2019.  There's a similar bill in the House as well.

@txradioguy

MY question is "Will ANYONE in the US Senate or Congress have the stones to go on the floor when the cameras are running,and ask if Di Fi's husband is still the Chief US Consul,and POSSIBLY a stock holder in the US branch of the company, for the Chinese weapons manufacturer known as Norinco?

You all remember Norinco,right? Imported semi-auto AK's,SKS's,repop 1911A 45 ACP handguns,and others into the US,and were doing a booming business until somebody dropped a dime on them to the BATF because they were also importing full-auto AK-47's into the US and selling them to gangbangers,the Mexican drug cartels,etc,etc,etc?

Unfortunately for everyone but them and Di-Fi's husband,the BATF were required by law to brief a Senate Committee chaired by Di-Fi before they could pull the raid off,so they did,the day before the raid was scheduled to happen.

Oddly enough,EVERY SINGLE Chinese employee of NORINCO living in the US flew out of the US that very night to avoid having the arrest warrants sworn out on them served.

I am sure the fact that Di-Fi's husband was their business partner and the US Norinco legal rep was just a coinkydink because Di-Fi hates guns and would never tip off people importing machine guns to sell to criminals,right?

Anybody that does this MUST do it on live tv or it will never be seen or heard.

[DCPatriot]

[txradioguy]

@txradioguy

MY question is "Will ANYONE in the US Senate or Congress have the stones to go on the floor when the cameras are running,and ask if Di Fi's husband is still the Chief US Consul,and POSSIBLY a stock holder in the US branch of the company, for the Chinese weapons manufacturer known as Norinco?

You all remember Norinco,right? Imported semi-auto AK's,SKS's,repop 1911A 45 ACP handguns,and others into the US,and were doing a booming business until somebody dropped a dime on them to the BATF because they were also importing full-auto AK-47's into the US and selling them to gangbangers,the Mexican drug cartels,etc,etc,etc?

Unfortunately for everyone but them and Di-Fi's husband,the BATF were required by law to brief a Senate Committee chaired by Di-Fi before they could pull the raid off,so they did,the day before the raid was scheduled to happen.

Oddly enough,EVERY SINGLE Chinese employee of NORINCO living in the US flew out of the US that very night to avoid having the arrest warrants sworn out on them served.

I am sure the fact that Di-Fi's husband was their business partner and the US Norinco legal rep was just a coinkydink because Di-Fi hates guns and would never tip off people importing machine guns to sell to criminals,right?

Anybody that does this MUST do it on live tv or it will never be seen or heard.

I remember all of that and the answer to your question is...sadly...no

[txradioguy]

Yup that's what their vehicles will look like! 

[DCPatriot]

Yup that's what their vehicles will look like! 

 

[Smokin Joe]

Yup that's what their vehicles will look like! 

Unfortunately, what they show up in will look more like (with a .50 up top).

[txradioguy]

Unfortunately, what they show up in will look more like (with a .50 up top).

I'm willing to bet that...outside of the deep blue Liberal big cities...you'd be hard pressed to find a County or City law enforcement agency willing to show up in a Cougar 6x6 MRAP (that's the military designation for that vehicle)like that to take guns from either you or me.

[Cyber Liberty]

I'm willing to bet that...outside of the deep blue Liberal big cities...you'd be hard pressed to find a County or City law enforcement agency willing to show up in a Cougar 6x6 MRAP (that's the military designation for that vehicle)like that to take guns from either you or me.

The optics of doing so would be incredibly bad, because videos of LEOs using that beast to collect guns would probably spark a real shooting war that will cause cops to not go home safe after the watch.

[txradioguy]

The optics of doing so would be incredibly bad, because videos of LEOs using that beast to collect guns would probably spark a real shooting war that will cause cops to not go home safe after the watch.

I agree.  That's a Mine Resistant Ambush Protected (MRAP) vehicle.  Rode in them many times when I was outside the wire in Afghanistan.  It's a light armored personnel carrier.  The optics of that rolling up in a neighborhood and cops jumping out the back merely to take someones guns because of an unconstitutional law would turn millions into gun owners and/or advocates overnight.

[Smokin Joe]

I'm willing to bet that...outside of the deep blue Liberal big cities...you'd be hard pressed to find a County or City law enforcement agency willing to show up in a Cougar 6x6 MRAP (that's the military designation for that vehicle)like that to take guns from either you or me.

Well, I'm betting on that to a point, but when the US Military decided to give some of them to LEOs, a lot of good ol' boy Departments were more than willing to take one (or more) off their hands. "Tactical rescue vehicle".

[Smokin Joe]

The optics of doing so would be incredibly bad, because videos of LEOs using that beast to collect guns would probably spark a real shooting war that will cause cops to not go home safe after the watch.

By some scenarios, then the National Guard will be deployed, and not on their home turf. Then people (including Guard Members) start taking sides over unlawful orders, and the whole deal goes south as the ivory tower folks call for Martial Law and suspend Posse Comitatus (which "...restricts the armed forces from acting “as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws,” except “in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress.")

In any scenario in which the widespread and universal confiscation of private firearms is decreed, I really don't think Congress would have any trouble expressly authorizing the use of whatever force was "necessary".  They'd already have made packing material out of the Constitution.

The bottom line question is one of how many would follow that unlawful order.

[txradioguy]

The bottom line question is one of how many would follow that unlawful order.

I think you'd be surprised how many wouldn't.

Which is why Obama was trying to create a civilian paramilitary force equivalent to the Military.

He knew we wouldn't follow unlawful orders so he had to create a backup plan.

[Smokin Joe]

I think you'd be surprised how many wouldn't.

Which is why Obama was trying to create a civilian paramilitary force equivalent to the Military.

He knew we wouldn't follow unlawful orders so he had to create a backup plan.

I would be happy to be surprised in that regard. In many ways, we depend heavily on the NCOs there who are motivated more by patriotism than politics, and are where the rubber meets the road.

We all depend on you guys for more than most are aware.