Author Topic: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives  (Read 2406 times)

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Offline roamer_1

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2025, 08:27:05 pm »
Can't the same be said of "democracy" @Cyber Liberty ?

Is not our guardrail against wanton mob rule our rooting in the rule of law, not of men?

Liberty has responsibilities.
Freedom has consequences.

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2025, 08:32:11 pm »
Liberty has responsibilities.
Freedom has consequences.

Both go hand in hand for those who understand.
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Offline DominusVobiscum

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2025, 08:45:02 pm »
You mean that elections are too dangerous to be entrusted to the common people?

To an extent, yes.  That's why there is the electoral college. It offers some protection against the mob.

Offline roamer_1

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #28 on: March 10, 2025, 08:52:41 pm »
Both go hand in hand for those who understand.

More one pursuant to the other... One is only 'free' if one accepts the responsibility of liberty. It is a fine line...

But ANY other 'freedom becomes ones doom... and is rife with consequences.

So one is never really free, in the sense that we see 'freedom' today.
freedom in its ancient form IS liberty. And it only persists as one continues to maintain its responsibilities - THAT is the danger of populism. It chases freedom, not liberty.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #29 on: March 10, 2025, 09:35:48 pm »
We will have to agree to disagree, and I know we'll do that agreeably, as we always do.   happy77

I'm trying to figure out what we agree or disagree about @Cyber Liberty   :laugh:

It is my opinion that whenever there is the empowerment of the non-elites, there is the potential for mob rule.   Thankfully, our system was formed with multiple guardrails to prevent mob rule ---- we are a constitutional republic, where actions are rooted in the rule of law, not the passions of men. Those rails have taken direct hits through our history, but they're still standing and functioning as designed.

US Populism is evidence that there is a growing dissatisfaction among citizens and they're wanting specific changes.  This is nothing to fear.

Do we agree or agree to disagree on this?  Thanks.


Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #30 on: March 10, 2025, 09:40:49 pm »
You mean that elections are too dangerous to be entrusted to the common people?

Where in God's name did you get that from?

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #31 on: March 10, 2025, 09:48:20 pm »
I'm trying to figure out what we agree or disagree about @Cyber Liberty   :laugh:

It is my opinion that whenever there is the empowerment of the non-elites, there is the potential for mob rule.   Thankfully, our system was formed with multiple guardrails to prevent mob rule ---- we are a constitutional republic, where actions are rooted in the rule of law, not the passions of men. Those rails have taken direct hits through our history, but they're still standing and functioning as designed.

US Populism is evidence that there is a growing dissatisfaction among citizens and they're wanting specific changes.  This is nothing to fear.

Do we agree or agree to disagree on this?  Thanks.

Basically, we do.  I just trifle at the term "mob rule."  The precise definition varies wildly.
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Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #32 on: March 10, 2025, 10:56:16 pm »
In 1967 well over 75% of Americans opposed interracial marriage.

In a Democracy, that issue would have stood zero chance of changing, however, in a Constitutional Republic, the Will of the Majority is tempered by guaranteed rights that cannot be set aside by the weight of he entirety of the voting population.

To me, the term "populism" (as applied to our current political "mood") is akin to a general feeling by the population to set aside a lot of the sociopolitical crap the left has been shoving down our throats for the past 16 years.
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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #33 on: March 10, 2025, 11:11:02 pm »
To an extent, yes.  That's why there is the electoral college. It offers some protection against the mob.

Yup.  It keeps us from 5 major cities from ruin normal people lives.
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Offline MeganC

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #34 on: March 10, 2025, 11:11:24 pm »
To an extent, yes.  That's why there is the electoral college. It offers some protection against the mob.

Fair enough. I agree.
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #35 on: March 11, 2025, 09:13:19 am »
Basically, we do.  I just trifle at the term "mob rule."  The precise definition varies wildly.

Okay, my friend....I just don't understand your POV.  I surrender  :truce:


"Populism" is just another word for "mob rule."






« Last Edit: March 11, 2025, 09:29:53 am by Right_in_Virginia »

Online DCPatriot

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #36 on: March 11, 2025, 09:34:12 am »
Okay, my friend....I just don't understand you POV.  I surrender  :truce:

Trying to understand it myself.   :pondering:   :shrug:

Perhaps Black Lives Matter mobs and the ANTIFA mobs consider themselves Populists" inside the Democratic Party.
 

https://news.stanford.edu/stories/2020/03/populism-jeopardizes-democracies-around-world

Populism is a political problem that is putting democracy at risk...
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Online jafo2010

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #37 on: March 11, 2025, 11:02:30 am »
Adam Zivo, the author of this article is largely talking smack.

Are there folks in the USA that believe Russia is as he stated?  Sure there are.   But their numbers are INSIGNIFICANT.  I suspect the ones that believe that way are those that believed QAnon was real, and that Russia was actually the good guys with their attack upon Ukraine.  Mind you, I am not defending Ukraine, because I know it has been a hotbed for money laundering.

Back to Russia, the differences between Russia and the USA are significant.  First, there is RULE OF LAW.  We have it, they don't.  Russia is largely a lawless society in every aspect.  One can murder or beat a person of color there, and nothing may happen to the perp.  One can murder or beat a gay person, and nothing much will happen.  The protections in their society are not existent across the board.  Even for women, they are routinely abused.

Religious freedom.  We have it here in the USA, and it is virtually nonexistent in Russia.  Yes, the Russian Orthodox church gets to operate in Russia, in large part, because they are in the pocket of their current dictator, Putin.  And yes, Putin is an absolute dictator.  Speak out against him, and you end up in prison with a long sentence, or you end up dead.

And I know missionaries that have traveled to Russia representing Christians religions going to remote areas of Russia, and they were seized and deported from Russia.  ALL OF THEM DEPORTED.

Free speech.  We have it in the USA, and it is nonexistent in Russia.  I met 15-20 journalists years ago from Russia visiting the USA, and they were asked if they had freedom to report on their political leaders freely.  No one verbally responded.  NO ONE.  But 2-3 of them very subtly shook their heads side to side to indicate NO.

Media is completely controlled by the Putin government.  There is no free press in Russia.

So, the folks that Zivo is speaking about are literally inconsequential.  They are in the same category as Rachel Dolezal.  Dolezal is white identifying as black.  She is a member of a group that is tiny.  So is the group that identify Russia as being anything noble.

Russia is an evil state.  It has a history of not valuing life as we do here in the USA and other western nations.  There is NOTHING about Russia that is noble.  There is NOTHING conservative about Russia.  It is in fact a Godless nation, because most do not believe in God. 

They are so poor, their primary means of birth control is abortion.  My wife had one patient that had 34 abortions.  Abortion is something that is readily available, and virtually every woman has a number of them.

Last, marriage.  Marriage happens for most when they are young, like 18.  And they are typically divorced in 1-2 years, almost no exception.  The pressure in Russia is what existed here many years ago on women.  If you are not married by 18, you are considered an old maid.  Literally!  There is immense pressure on women to marry by age 18.  They are a society right out the Twilight Zone.

Productivity  In the USA, productivity is important, and in evidence in almost everything we do.  In Russia, it is virtually nonexistent, and that is why Russia has a hard time attracting capital for investment.

I could go on, but the differences are stark, and this is why I constantly reference us not going down the road to be anything like Russia.  And even if Putin goes away, I am 90% certain he is replaced with someone equally bad, or worse.





« Last Edit: March 11, 2025, 11:06:01 am by jafo2010 »

Offline MeganC

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Re: How Putin hoodwinked American conservatives
« Reply #38 on: March 11, 2025, 12:55:24 pm »
Adam Zivo, the author of this article is largely talking smack.

Are there folks in the USA that believe Russia is as he stated?  Sure there are.   But their numbers are INSIGNIFICANT.  I suspect the ones that believe that way are those that believed QAnon was real, and that Russia was actually the good guys with their attack upon Ukraine.  Mind you, I am not defending Ukraine, because I know it has been a hotbed for money laundering.

Back to Russia, the differences between Russia and the USA are significant.  First, there is RULE OF LAW.  We have it, they don't.  Russia is largely a lawless society in every aspect.  One can murder or beat a person of color there, and nothing may happen to the perp.  One can murder or beat a gay person, and nothing much will happen.  The protections in their society are not existent across the board.  Even for women, they are routinely abused.

Religious freedom.  We have it here in the USA, and it is virtually nonexistent in Russia.  Yes, the Russian Orthodox church gets to operate in Russia, in large part, because they are in the pocket of their current dictator, Putin.  And yes, Putin is an absolute dictator.  Speak out against him, and you end up in prison with a long sentence, or you end up dead.

And I know missionaries that have traveled to Russia representing Christians religions going to remote areas of Russia, and they were seized and deported from Russia.  ALL OF THEM DEPORTED.

Free speech.  We have it in the USA, and it is nonexistent in Russia.  I met 15-20 journalists years ago from Russia visiting the USA, and they were asked if they had freedom to report on their political leaders freely.  No one verbally responded.  NO ONE.  But 2-3 of them very subtly shook their heads side to side to indicate NO.

Media is completely controlled by the Putin government.  There is no free press in Russia.

So, the folks that Zivo is speaking about are literally inconsequential.  They are in the same category as Rachel Dolezal.  Dolezal is white identifying as black.  She is a member of a group that is tiny.  So is the group that identify Russia as being anything noble.

Russia is an evil state.  It has a history of not valuing life as we do here in the USA and other western nations.  There is NOTHING about Russia that is noble.  There is NOTHING conservative about Russia.  It is in fact a Godless nation, because most do not believe in God. 

They are so poor, their primary means of birth control is abortion.  My wife had one patient that had 34 abortions.  Abortion is something that is readily available, and virtually every woman has a number of them.

Last, marriage.  Marriage happens for most when they are young, like 18.  And they are typically divorced in 1-2 years, almost no exception.  The pressure in Russia is what existed here many years ago on women.  If you are not married by 18, you are considered an old maid.  Literally!  There is immense pressure on women to marry by age 18.  They are a society right out the Twilight Zone.

Productivity  In the USA, productivity is important, and in evidence in almost everything we do.  In Russia, it is virtually nonexistent, and that is why Russia has a hard time attracting capital for investment.

I could go on, but the differences are stark, and this is why I constantly reference us not going down the road to be anything like Russia.  And even if Putin goes away, I am 90% certain he is replaced with someone equally bad, or worse.

Exceptional post.  :patriot:
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