The Briefing Room
General Category => Elections 2024 => Topic started by: mystery-ak on May 15, 2023, 01:41:39 pm
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May 15, 2023 7:22am EDT
Trump hits DeSantis on abortion, suggests 6-week abortion ban is ‘too harsh’
Former president refused to clarify his own abortion stance, saying he looked at 'all options'
By Anders Hagstrom | Fox News
Former President Trump attacked Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis for his abortion stance on Monday, suggesting in an interview that Florida's six-week ban was "too harsh."
Trump made the statement in a wide-ranging interview with The Messenger published on Monday. Trump refused to elaborate on his own stance regarding abortion, however, instead claiming to have heard that pro-life voters opposed DeSantis' bill.
"He has to do what he has to do," Trump said when asked about Florida's six-week ban. "If you look at what DeSantis did, a lot of people don't even know if he knew what he was doing. But he signed six weeks, and many people within the pro-life movement feel that that was too harsh."
When asked about whether he would support a six-week ban, Trump replied, "I'm looking at all options."
more
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-hits-desantis-abortion-suggests-6-week-abortion-ban-too-harsh
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Conservative Donny strike again. /s
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I agree with Trump on this
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I agree with Trump on this
"Looking at all options"? You agree with that vagueness.
You realize his end product might look like a democratic solution?
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"Looking at all options"? You agree with that vagueness.
You realize his end product might look like a democratic solution?
You’re probably not going to get much public support for a 6 week ban. Things like partial birth or abortions up to the 9 month ban can get support
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You’re probably not going to get much public support for a 6 week ban. Things like partial birth or abortions up to the 9 month ban can get support
Agree there, but like with other outlandish things Trump has proposed lately, I really don't trust him.
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Keep Big Government out of the womb and the OBGYN's office.
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Keep Big Government out of the womb and the OBGYN's office.
....and let the voters decide for each of their own states what level of service is available. That is the law now.
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From the article….
"He has to do what he has to do," Trump said when asked about Florida's six-week ban. "If you look at what DeSantis did, a lot of people don't even know if he knew what he was doing. But he signed six weeks, and many people within the pro-life movement feel that that was too harsh."
Who are these “many people within the pro-life movement” that feel that that was too harsh?
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When asked about whether he would support a six-week ban, Trump replied, "I'm looking at all options."
What is this supposed to mean? The Florida law is available for anyone to peruse. Either you support it or you don't. Maybe Donald should learn what is happening on the other side of the moat.
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Conservative Donny strike again. /s
Until the point of viability outside the womb, with all supportive medical technology, the state has no role in this decision.
The decision until that point is one of free will, between the woman and God. Wanna help here? Get on your knees and pray with the woman, but leave the damn state out of it.
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Until the point of viability outside the womb, with all supportive medical technology, the state has no role in this decision.
The decision until that point is one of free will, between the woman and God. Wanna help here? Get on your knees and pray with the woman, but leave the damn state out of it.
We sure are learning all kinds of things about you lately aren't we?
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We sure are learning all kinds of things about you lately aren't we?
This has always been my position @catfish1957 The state has no business in the decision until the life is viable outside the womb.
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Until the point of viability outside the womb, with all supportive medical technology, the state has no role in this decision.
So in other words, it's open season until 10-12 years of age, or whenever they can feed themselves.
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So in other words, it's open season until 10-12 years of age, or whenever they can feed themselves.
Of course not. Viable is the ability to breathe and process sustenance outside the womb.
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Strike two Mr. Trump!
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Until the point of viability outside the womb, with all supportive medical technology, the state has no role in this decision.
The decision until that point is one of free will, between the woman and God. Wanna help here? Get on your knees and pray with the woman, but leave the damn state out of it.
BS @Right_in_Virginia ! A human fetus is viable the instant sperm penetrates the egg wall unless some outside force interferes with its development.
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And just like that *snaps fingers* Ol Tumpy destroys the only lasting gain he could claim.
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I take a hard line on abortion. Abortion is murder. It is, IMO, within a states purview to do something about it.
FWIW Abortion in Idaho is illegal from fertilization. The ban allows exceptions for rape, incest, or maternal health.[2] The law took effect on August 25, 2022. I can live with that.
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From the article….
"He has to do what he has to do," Trump said when asked about Florida's six-week ban. "If you look at what DeSantis did, a lot of people don't even know if he knew what he was doing. But he signed six weeks, and many people within the pro-life movement feel that that was too harsh."
Who are these “many people within the pro-life movement” that feel that that was too harsh?
I think what Trump was trying to do there was equate DeSantis with himself, only problem is that unlike Trump, DeSantis does actually know how our government works :silly: I see this as just a slightly more polished Trump insult turd implying that DeSantis is too ignorant to understand what comes across his desk, you know like those insane spending bills that Trump just rubber stamped. If the people of Florida wanted the abortion law that was sent to him then good on him for upholding the will of Floridians.
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Until the point of viability outside the womb, with all supportive medical technology, the state has no role in this decision.
The decision until that point is one of free will, between the woman and God. Wanna help here? Get on your knees and pray with the woman, but leave the damn state out of it.
So murder then, is an act of free will... Between a human and God. And the state has no business in it. Because that is the very same thing, or you will hit a logic loop that will take your sanity.
And under which conditions can a state sanction death? Because that is really the question.
DeSantis is wrong, surely, because six weeks is too much. The state has *no* grounds to sanction the children's death.
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Of course not. Viable is the ability to breathe and process sustenance outside the womb.
No, Viable is viable. If you leave the baby be, it IS viable, right up through birth and beyond.
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I take a hard line on abortion. Abortion is murder. It is, IMO, within a states purview to do something about it.
FWIW Abortion in Idaho is illegal from fertilization. The ban allows exceptions for rape, incest, or maternal health.[2] The law took effect on August 25, 2022. I can live with that.
It's the only thing that makes sense. Kudos.
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BS @Right_in_Virginia ! A human fetus is viable the instant sperm penetrates the egg wall unless some outside force interferes with its development.
Exactly...well said.
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Of course not. Viable is the ability to breathe and process sustenance outside the womb.
There is no survival outside the womb without a great deal of care and investment over the course of many years. That is why the viability argument has always been a copout. Parents are responsible for their offspring from the moment of conception (the beginning of life, according to biology) until the child reaches adulthood.
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BS @Right_in_Virginia ! A human fetus is viable the instant sperm penetrates the egg wall
If this were true @Bigun ---- there would not be something called a miscarriage
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If this were true @Bigun ---- there would not be something called a miscarriage
BZZZZ! Wrong again!
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I am also not certain about a 6-week ban - it is too early, in my opinion. 12-15 weeks would be more achievable in our current environment.
But it is none of my business, outside of my own state.
That was the basis of the Supreme Court's decision last year - the Federal government has no interest in the matter of abortion, but state governments do.
No one really knows how Trump personally feels about abortion or about many other things, because whatever the subject he uses it to personally attack anyone he perceives to be a rival.
Abortion is the most emotional and divisive issue in the nation, and self-evidently, opinions vary enormously on the subject.
As such, I believe that Republicans need to coalesce around a message that appeals to the broad center of American opinion, and also one that abjures the extremes on both sides. I would argue that Democrats are considerably more extreme than Republicans about abortion, but we do have some who now promote a national ban, when such a thing would be plainly unconstitutional, and support for which would lead to electoral disaster.
We ought to begin by opposing partial-birth abortion in each of our own states, for which there is both moral authority and a sizable majority of voters who would agree. We need to work on changing hearts and minds both, before greater restrictions will gain more adherents.
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No, Viable is viable. If you leave the baby be, it IS viable, right up through birth and beyond.
Right. If a sperm is viable and an egg is viable they can join in a continuation of life. Viability is inherent.
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There is no survival outside the womb without a great deal of care and investment over the course of many years.
True. But you're referring to nurture, I was referring to nature ---- the essential ability of the body to physically, naturally process oxygen and sustenance on its own.
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BZZZZ! Wrong again!
How?
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How?
A miscarriage does not require the interference of ANY outside force. They can and do occur naturally.
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A miscarriage does not require the interference of ANY outside force. They can and do occur naturally
True, and it's a fair point @Bigun But, the existence of spontaneous miscarriage also supports viability outside the womb is a function of time plus development.
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True, and it's a fair point @Bigun But, the existence of spontaneous miscarriage also supports viability outside the womb is a function of time plus development.
Not by me it doesn't! Nor has it for 99.44% of human history.
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If this were true @Bigun ---- there would not be something called a miscarriage
No - The exception proves the rule: the miscarriage IS the determination that the baby is non-viable.
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True, and it's a fair point @Bigun But, the existence of spontaneous miscarriage also supports viability outside the womb is a function of time plus development.
What a ridiculous assertion!
The fact of occasional failure supposes failure throughout? Absurd.
Under that rubric, Because humans sometimes tip over and die for no reason, any human can be killed willy-nilly.
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What a ridiculous assertion!
The fact of occasional failure supposes failure throughout? Absurd.
No, it's really not ridiculous. If all life were viable from the moment of conception, there would be no such thing as a miscarriage. Viability outside the womb is a real and naturally occurring phenomenon. Until this point is reached, the state has no say in the pregnancy, whatsoever.
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No, it's really not ridiculous. If all life were viable from the moment of conception, there would be no such thing as a miscarriage. Viability outside the womb is a real and naturally occurring phenomenon. Until this point is reached, the state has no say in the pregnancy, whatsoever.
Viability inside the womb is a real and naturally occurring phenomenom.
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No, it's really not ridiculous. If all life were viable from the moment of conception, there would be no such thing as a miscarriage. Viability outside the womb is a real and naturally occurring phenomenon. Until this point is reached, the state has no say in the pregnancy, whatsoever.
If you end your pregnancy in THIS state as a matter of convenience, I'll assure you that the state will have something to say about that.
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BS @Right_in_Virginia ! A human fetus is viable the instant sperm penetrates the egg wall unless some outside force interferes with its development.
Come on, @Bigun @catfish1957 @whomever else needs to know
We all agree that's true...the fertilized egg is a potential human.
But until that fetus isn't dependent upon its mother to breathe, grow and develop, only the mother can decide what happens. SURELY, what @Right_in_Virginia is saying is that under no circumstances, should the State interfere.
Geez...RIV...you've really riled up the turkey buzzards this morning! :yowsa:
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No, it's really not ridiculous. If all life were viable from the moment of conception, there would be no such thing as a miscarriage. Viability outside the womb is a real and naturally occurring phenomenon. Until this point is reached, the state has no say in the pregnancy, whatsoever.
NONSENSE! 'Viability outside the womb' is a fallacy! People stop being viable all the time outside the womb. Sometimes for reasons we can't understand.
So viability in the womb or out of the womb is a distinction without a difference.
There is no there there.
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Come on, @Bigun @catfish1957 @whomever else needs to know
We all agree that's true...the fertilized egg is a potential human.
But until that fetus isn't dependent upon its mother to breathe, grow and develop, only the mother can decide what happens. SURELY, what @Right_in_Virginia is saying is that under no circumstances, should the State interfere.
No! @DCPatriot A fertilized egg IS a human that will continue to develop nicely unless interfered with!
I has worked that way for a VERY long time now.
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Come on, @Bigun @catfish1957 @whomever else needs to know
We all agree that's true...the fertilized egg is a potential human.
But until that fetus isn't dependent upon its mother to breathe, grow and develop, only the mother can decide what happens. SURELY, what @Right_in_Virginia is saying is that under no circumstances, should the State interfere.
Exactly wrong, @DCPatriot The state has a direct and undeniable DUTY to protect LIFE.
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So what should happen to a woman who finds out she’s pregnant but decides that she doesn’t want to be a mother? Her reasons may be selfish. But she has made the choice that she doesn’t want to be a mother.
Should she be forced to carry? How should that be enforced? How would that be enforced?
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Exactly wrong, @DCPatriot The state has a direct and undeniable DUTY to protect LIFE.
The brainwashing has been effective for some.
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Come on, @Bigun @catfish1957 @whomever else needs to know
We all agree that's true...the fertilized egg is a potential human.
But until that fetus isn't dependent upon its mother to breathe, grow and develop, only the mother can decide what happens. SURELY, what @Right_in_Virginia is saying is that under no circumstances, should the State interfere.
Geez...RIV...you've really riled up the turkey buzzards this morning! :yowsa:
And I did so without even trying to @DCPatriot :shrug:
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So what should happen to a woman who finds out she’s pregnant but decides that she doesn’t want to be a mother? Her reasons may be selfish. But she has made the choice that she doesn’t want to be a mother.
Should she be forced to carry? How should that be enforced? How would that be enforced?
Women have many ways to prevent pregnancies BEFORE they occur. I would suggest picking one of them.
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The brainwashing has been effective for some.
What brainwashing? @Bigun
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What brainwashing? @Bigun
God's laws are immutable @Right_in_Virginia they DO NOT change over time and especially not where life is concerned.
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So what should happen to a woman who finds out she’s pregnant but decides that she doesn’t want to be a mother? Her reasons may be selfish. But she has made the choice that she doesn’t want to be a mother.
Should she be forced to carry? How should that be enforced? How would that be enforced?
The long time divide (through history) has been to deny abortion. The woman can carry to term and offer the child up for adoption or raise the child. A shotgun wedding would be best. You broke it, you bought it... The first cause of the state should be to see them marry. Only after that should child support be assessed.
But abortion, while always available, has always been frowned upon.
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No! @DCPatriot A fertilized egg IS a human that will continue to develop nicely unless interfered with!
I has worked that way for a VERY long time now.
GAWD LUV YAH!!
I never said differently. Where are we disagreeing?
What I'm noticing however is that the 'Usual Suspects' are dog-packing somebody who is speaking the truth.
Strip all the bullshit away...you know, the way, @roamer_1 does all the time, defending his bedrock Conservative fiscal responsibilities as being the one and only litmus test necessary to pass muster as a candidate.
The mother is necessary for that fertilized egg to become a physical human being...unless it's grown on an orbiting ship like in the movie OBLIVION. :laugh:
That's the WAY it has worked for a wink777 long time now!
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Women have many ways to prevent pregnancies BEFORE they occur. I would suggest picking one of them.
All men need to do is keep it zipped. Maybe prosecuting sperm donors for reckless endangerment is the solution we've ignored for too long.
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Women have many ways to prevent pregnancies BEFORE they occur. I would suggest picking one of them.
That is certainly true. But I can tell you from personal experience they’re not 100%.
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All men need to do is keep it zipped. Maybe prosecuting sperm donors for reckless endangerment is the solution we've ignored for too long.
I'm pretty damned sure that sperm donors can be held accountable these days and definitely should be.
You knock her up, you're responsible. End of story.
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I'm pretty damned sure that sperm donors can be held accountable these days and definitely should be.
You knock her up, you're responsible. End of story.
I'm not referring to child support..... Reckless endangerment demands prison time.
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I was a huge Rush Limbaugh fan when he was alive. I don’t think we’ll ever find any other that can replace him. And it was a nice gesture for him to get the presidential freedom before he passed away.
And he said something early on in his career about this issue that I 100% agree with. You don’t keep passing laws against abortion. You work to change the hearts and minds of people so that they choose life. Rush Limbaugh was pro life, but he took the most practical conservative position on this issue that I found myself agreeing with.
And it’s the same as Mr. conservative Barry Goldwater’s position on it
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I'm not referring to child support..... Reckless endangerment demands prison time.
I'm not either! But it takes two to tango and that's been so from day one! Everyone needs to be held accountable for their actions.
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The brainwashing has been effective for some.
A STUNNING position. Both legally and morally. Utterly bereft of thought or conscience.
I don't see how folks fall for it. **nononono*
An interesting aside, if one goes beyond the Bible, some prophets predicted in the end that the love of many would grow cold, and use the example of 'mothers having abortions within their wombs'. Historically, that has been interpreted as a failure of pregnancy... But we know better now. The Bible hints at this too... in the end, "even the women..."
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
KJV Rom 1:24-26 [...]
'Even the women' - Like this is a special astonishment... Like women, of all things, would be the least likely...
Motherhood is such a hard-wired thing in every critter. Kipling got it right in 'The Female of the Species'... It is truly the most unnatural state for a female to kill her offspring. Especially in the womb.
Nothing is more pitiful and shameful than a mother choosing to kill her own child.
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All men need to do is keep it zipped. Maybe prosecuting sperm donors for reckless endangerment is the solution we've ignored for too long.
Wise advise. 100-200 years ago, a lot of young men strangely disappeared for sullying a man's daughter's honor. Frontier justice is the best.
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Strip all the bullshit away...you know, the way, @roamer_1 does all the time, defending his bedrock Conservative fiscal responsibilities as being the one and only litmus test necessary to pass muster as a candidate.
Oh believe me @DCPatriot , I will rise to defend Life, before everything, anything.
In fact, I rise to defend any number of Conservative principles, and the Coalition itself... Fiscal conservatism is just the most inarguable low hanging fruit when it comes to the Tumpster.
Yet still y'all try.
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I was a huge Rush Limbaugh fan when he was alive. I don’t think we’ll ever find any other that can replace him. And it was a nice gesture for him to get the presidential freedom before he passed away.
And he said something early on in his career about this issue that I 100% agree with. You don’t keep passing laws against abortion. You work to change the hearts and minds of people so that they choose life. Rush Limbaugh was pro life, but he took the most practical conservative position on this issue that I found myself agreeing with.
And it’s the same as Mr. conservative Barry Goldwater’s position on it
...{cough...cough}
which is exactly what @Right_in_Virginia and myself have been saying.
RIP Rush! :beer:
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I'm not referring to child support..... Reckless endangerment demands prison time.
Hold both parties accountable. Then.....put them together in the same cell.
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All men need to do is keep it zipped. Maybe prosecuting sperm donors for reckless endangerment is the solution we've ignored for too long.
Sperm donors ARE prosecuted. A night of fun can result in twenty years of fortune siphoned away to support bastard children. The male has no right to kill the child or even refuse to pay - the payment is forced upon him, taken from him, often on nothing more than the testimony of the woman.
Meanwhile, women are saddled with no consequence, if they choose. Not even the nine months.
Yeah, men should keep it zipped.
And so should women.
And consequence should go BOTH WAYS.
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RIP Rush! :beer:
Ditto
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Oh believe me @DCPatriot , I will rise to defend Life, before everything, anything.
In fact, I rise to defend any number of Conservative principles, and the Coalition itself... Fiscal conservatism is just the most inarguable low hanging fruit when it comes to the Tumpster.
Yet still y'all try.
You might be fooling others here, but you're not fooling me one bit...coming on with that Tom Selleck cowboy twinkle.
Ya probably look like Bill Pullman in The Ballad of Lefty Brown! wink777 :beer:
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I'm not referring to child support..... Reckless endangerment demands prison time.
It isn't reckless endangerment.
The consequence, for both, should be marriage.
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This is how it's supposed to work. Pay attention now, it's educational:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WonOudGMSdc
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I was a huge Rush Limbaugh fan when he was alive. I don’t think we’ll ever find any other that can replace him. And it was a nice gesture for him to get the presidential freedom before he passed away.
And he said something early on in his career about this issue that I 100% agree with. You don’t keep passing laws against abortion. You work to change the hearts and minds of people so that they choose life. Rush Limbaugh was pro life, but he took the most practical conservative position on this issue that I found myself agreeing with.
And it’s the same as Mr. conservative Barry Goldwater’s position on it
Historically abortion has been against the law in all fifty states far longer than it has been legal.
And your position fails to account for the result: A burgeoning welfare state.
Both Rush and Goldwater were wrong.
Liberty has responsibilities.
Freedom has consequences.
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Ya probably look like Bill Pullman in The Ballad of Lefty Brown! wink777 :beer:
@DCPatriot
A bit more grizzled... twice as big... and usually with a beard down to here. And nobody bends their hat that fool way. I wear a Gus, with the sides laid flat by the snow, and the front and back bent low to drain water. Though proper hat interpretation is prolly lost on city folks. :shrug: happy77
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I was a huge Rush Limbaugh fan when he was alive. I don’t think we’ll ever find any other that can replace him. And it was a nice gesture for him to get the presidential freedom before he passed away.
And he said something early on in his career about this issue that I 100% agree with. You don’t keep passing laws against abortion. You work to change the hearts and minds of people so that they choose life. Rush Limbaugh was pro life, but he took the most practical conservative position on this issue that I found myself agreeing with.
And it’s the same as Mr. conservative Barry Goldwater’s position on it
As was I! And I fail to see any inconsistency in his position. The CONSTITUTION, and all the human history that preceded, it should prevail.
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Laying aside the volatile subject matter, I have a problem with people saying how something is handled but not stating their own position. jmho
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Laying aside the volatile subject matter, I have a problem with people saying how something is handled but not stating their own position. jmho
I think folks on this thread have been pretty clear @berdie happy77
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I think folks on this thread have been pretty clear @berdie happy77
I actually wasn't referring to folks on this thread @Right_in_Virginia. :laugh:
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I actually wasn't referring to folks on this thread @Right_in_Virginia. :laugh:
Thanks. :beer: