He chose poorly.
He didn't think Trump had a chance of winning and thought he would come out looking good.
Wrong on both counts.
I don't think that's why people were critical of Trump after the recording came out. It's more likely that they were disgusted by his comments along with how he acted during the primaries. I didn't vote for Trump because I didn't believe he had the character to actually do what he said he would do. I'm glad to say I was wrong about that, but I understand the reasoning for not supporting Trump after hearing a grown man talk about grabbing women by their private parts and being able to do whatever he wants.
Today the situation is different. Trump has shown he will try to do what he said he would do and even though he may be flawed in other ways he deserves our support because of the policies he pursues.
I don't think that's why people were critical of Trump after the recording came out. It's more likely that they were disgusted by his comments along with how he acted during the primaries. I didn't vote for Trump because I didn't believe he had the character to actually do what he said he would do. I'm glad to say I was wrong about that, but I understand the reasoning for not supporting Trump after hearing a grown man talk about grabbing women by their private parts and being able to do whatever he wants.
Today the situation is different. Trump has shown he will try to do what he said he would do and even though he may be flawed in other ways he deserves our support because of the policies he pursues.
The fact that Trump bragged about grabbing women’s genitals...
He said that he could. He was commenting on the sort of women who are so attracted to celebrity.
For some of us the situation is not different.
The fact that Trump bragged about grabbing women’s genitals and now Republicans don’t care because he gets things done doesn’t make the party more attractive.
It just makes us not want to be Republicans.
And the kind of creep who takes advantage of them and brags about doing it just because he can.....
For some of us the situation is not different.
The fact that Trump bragged about grabbing women’s genitals and now Republicans don’t care because he gets things done doesn’t make the party more attractive.
It just makes us not want to be Republicans.
Americans who disapprove of President Donald Trump are likely to do so not necessarily because of his policies, but because of his personality and character, a new poll says......
http://time.com/4857210/president-trump-poll-personality-policies/ (http://time.com/4857210/president-trump-poll-personality-policies/)
Trump is proving to be an effective President in spite of all the fake news, false accusations and those within his own party trying to derail his agenda. Interesting that it is becoming apparent that those politicians who have or are supporting his agenda are winning.
No, I don't like his character and anyone who brags about being able to grab women's female parts should be ashamed and not given a free pass. Molesting others is an offense. With his rants, raves, tweets and 'bragging', he tarnished the campaign arena and made a mockery out of the electoral process.
Nonetheless, America voted for his agenda. I look at it from the perspective that perhaps people were more sickened and disgusted by the past 8 years of B.O. that they wanted nothing to do with politicians and took a chance on an outsider, knowing he was far from prefect.
In spite of his past lack of character and morality, he has surprised me and I believe he has displayed patriotism and leadership; in addition he has appointed 1 conservative SCOTUS justice and hopefully Kavanaugh will prove to be a conservative as well.
It just makes us not want to be Republicans.
In addition, Trump ran on issues. He was very honest about what he wanted to do; immigration reform and a wall, end obamacare, rebuild our military, get rid of bad trade deals, tax cuts and tax reform, appoint conservative judges. Trump has tried to deliver on all of these issues. It's the Pub party that has failed. I will take a flawed person any day who tries to keep the previously listed promises over a "gentleman" who doesn't.
And the kind of creep who takes advantage of them and brags about doing it just because he can.....
You must really hate Bill Clinton then. He did much more than talk about abusing women.
Okay, you can take the moral high ground but until Jesus returns all politicians will be flawed in some way. I'm not excusing Trump's past, but I am willing to recognize he is doing what he said he would do and I do agree with the policies.
I didn’t realize that continuing to believe in moral values was something to be derided.
Isn’t it funny how when ‘our guy’ does reprehensible things it somehow becomes no big deal.
For me it IS big deal...... until Jesus returns and throughout eternity.
(Not my rules..... HIS rules).
I do.
You’re very perceptive.
He said that he could. He was commenting on the sort of women who are so attracted to celebrity.
Correct. And I certainly know bs when I see it
I do.
You’re very perceptive.
He chose poorly.What a shame Minnesota just loves them some Trump . Trump's polling in the near 40's. When will the GOP recognize how to win a state?
Correct. And I certainly know bs when I see it
Musiclady has the posts and history to prove it, you not so much.
He said that he could. He was commenting on the sort of women who are so attracted to celebrity.
He chose poorly.
I don't think that's why people were critical of Trump after the recording came out. It's more likely that they were disgusted by his comments along with how he acted during the primaries. I didn't vote for Trump because I didn't believe he had the character to actually do what he said he would do. I'm glad to say I was wrong about that, but I understand the reasoning for not supporting Trump after hearing a grown man talk about grabbing women by their private parts and being able to do whatever he wants.
Today the situation is different. Trump has shown he will try to do what he said he would do and even though he may be flawed in other ways he deserves our support because of the policies he pursues.
Americans who disapprove of President Donald Trump are likely to do so not necessarily because of his policies, but because of his personality and character, a new poll says......
http://time.com/4857210/president-trump-poll-personality-policies/ (http://time.com/4857210/president-trump-poll-personality-policies/)
Trump is proving to be an effective President in spite of all the fake news, false accusations and those within his own party trying to derail his agenda. Interesting that it is becoming apparent that those politicians who have or are supporting his agenda are winning.
No, I don't like his character and anyone who brags about being able to grab women's female parts should be ashamed and not given a free pass. Molesting others is an offense. With his rants, raves, tweets and 'bragging', he tarnished the campaign arena and made a mockery out of the electoral process.
Nonetheless, America voted for his agenda. I look at it from the perspective that perhaps people were more sickened and disgusted by the past 8 years of B.O. that they wanted nothing to do with politicians and took a chance on an outsider, knowing he was far from prefect.
In spite of his past lack of character and morality, he has surprised me and I believe he has displayed patriotism and leadership; in addition he has appointed 1 conservative SCOTUS justice and hopefully Kavanaugh will prove to be a conservative as well.
And the kind of creep who takes advantage of them and brags about doing it just because he can.....
I didn’t realize that continuing to believe in moral values was something to be derided.
Isn’t it funny how when ‘our guy’ does reprehensible things it somehow becomes no big deal.
For me it IS big deal...... until Jesus returns and throughout eternity.
(Not my rules..... HIS rules).
@musiclady
Maybe if some man had ever been interested in grabbing your genitals,you wouldn't spend all your time running around doing your little "Church Lady Superiority Dance"?
He said that he could. He was commenting on the sort of women who are so attracted to celebrity.
And the part is bold is about what he's done in the past by his own words. He pays women to be silent under legal threat if they speak. So there's no way to know how many women he's treated badly and want to speak out.
Not sure where that came from or if it's legit but I do know the opinion you voiced at the end is not correct. One woman has complained and she is a prostitute who was paid for her services.You don't remember "Grab ’em by the p**sy."? It's the Access Hollywood tape from before the election...before the primaries I think. and @DB is referencing the non-disclosure agreements used to shutup prostitutes that felon attorney Michael Cohen specialized in for his clients Trump, RNC finance chairman Elliott Broidy, and I assume Hannity.
There is nothing to keep any woman from speaking out. George Soros would probably pay them big bucks.
Trump was a horn dog and engaged in some vulgar locker room talk but I don't think he's been evil in his treatment of women
Not sure where that came from or if it's legit but I do know the opinion you voiced at the end is not correct. One woman has complained and she is a prostitute who was paid for her services.
There is nothing to keep any woman from speaking out. George Soros would probably pay them big bucks.
Trump was a horn dog and engaged in some vulgar locker room talk but I don't think he's been evil in his treatment of women
He said that he could. He was commenting on the sort of women who are so attracted to celebrity.
That’s exactly right. He never said he “grabbed†women, only that you “could,†presumably because some of them were so desperate to ingratiate themselves to a Hollywood powerbroker that they would do anything.
Not sure where that came from or if it's legit but I do know the opinion you voiced at the end is not correct. One woman has complained and she is a prostitute who was paid for her services.
There is nothing to keep any woman from speaking out. George Soros would probably pay them big bucks.
Trump was a horn dog and engaged in some vulgar locker room talk but I don't think he's been evil in his treatment of women
I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait. And when you’re a star, they let you do it. You can do anything.
Even when you put it right in front of their faces they can't see it @DB . Republican's don't care about this stuff. I wonder if they ever did.
That’s exactly right. He never said he “grabbed†women, only that you “could,†presumably because some of them were so desperate to ingratiate themselves to a Hollywood powerbroker that they would do anything. That was the point of his private comment.
I don’t think he was saying anything we didn’t already know goes on in Hollywood.
I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait. And when you’re a star, they let you do it. You can do anything.
Even when you put it right in front of their faces they can't see it @DB . Republican's don't care about this stuff. I wonder if they ever did.
Exactly @aligncare I am disappointed that we are still talking about that to the extent that we're supposed to read that whole conversation.
Why bring that up again? Why detail it? It was brought out by his enemies during the campaign. Many of us didn't particularly care for it at all but it was hardly a criminal offense.
People knew about it then and he was nominated and elected. It's almost as though repeating it here will have some effect other than to make us a little uncomfortable.
I don't believe that Trump abused women. With all the forces of evil trying to find every negative thing possible about Trump and with all the money behind those forces, if Trump had abused women, we would know about it.
Why can't we just let that alone? It doesn't make us any more virtuous to continue expressing horror over it.
If you want to let the womanizing side of Trump keep you from supporting him, then do it, but I get a little sick of the virtue proclaiming.
Oh, I think most of them used to. Just no more.
Which is why I am no longer a Republican. They no longer represent the 'family values' they once claimed were so important.
By all indications, the young Donald Trump behaved as males throughout history have behaved. Sometimes overcome by desire for beautiful women that they lose all judgment and fall from the right path. I fell once or twice. Perhaps even @INVAR might admit to that.
It's about time we stopped caring about "that kind of stuff". The left lies and smears good people on
the right and we idiots buy almost every time. They lied about Judge Moore and we lost a Senate
seat. As long as no felonies are committed I don't give a damn about a politician's personal life.
Live and let live.
Some of us were raised with morals that we did not discard because animal impulses overrode self control. Something Trump still has not mastered.
I agree with all these comments.
In addition, Trump ran on issues. He was very honest about what he wanted to do; immigration reform and a wall,
get rid of bad trade deals
Trump has tried to deliver on all of these issues.
If you're looking for morality from government, you're looking in the wrong place.
@musiclady If you want to change your party (and, in so doing, support a really evil party) that is totally your business.
It's beginning to seem like I'm not the one who is obsessed with crudeness. Other people seem to enjoy talking about it so they can say how offended they are.
As usual - you Trump fanatics are disgustingly wrong - just like your Leftist counterparts who also engage in defining deviancy down and ascribing it to everyone so as to excuse the one whom they have made their ruler. Except you guys have tossed a nice twist in there "Let us sin all the more that grace may abound!"
Some of us were raised with morals that we did not discard because animal impulses overrode self control. Something Trump still has not mastered.
@Emjay
And they are doing their little superiority dances while doing it. If they didn't have something to offend them,they just wouldn't be happy and have to invent it themselves. Which is a large part of what they do here. They post what they post so that everyone can see how much more moral and proper they are than anyone else.
The truth is that deep down they are nastier than Trump has ever been.
@sneakypete I'm not gonna say that and I don't even think it but Luke had a little something to say about virtue signaling:
"The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed this prayer: 'I thank you, God, that I am not a sinner like everyone else. For I don't cheat, I don't sin, and I don't commit adultery. I'm certainly not like that tax collector!"
There are people who should take that verse to heart.
@INVAR
Your mommy must be SOOO proud of you for finding so much pleasure in so much denial.
"The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed this prayer: 'I thank you, God, that I am not a sinner like everyone else. For I don't cheat, I don't sin, and I don't commit adultery. I'm certainly not like that tax collector!"
There are people who should take that verse to heart.
I imagine you were likely one of the very people outraged over Bill Clinton's behavior.
We probably should have just ignored it and instead continued to think of him as good, moral, upright and a great statesman - or risk damnation for "judging" him.
As usual, you people do as the Left, and pervert the verse to accommodate licentiousness as something we should ignore in the character of our leaders and not consider or mention or discuss when it is OUR GUY in the White House.
For some of us the situation is not different.
The fact that Trump bragged about grabbing women’s genitals and now Republicans don’t care because he gets things done doesn’t make the party more attractive.
It just makes us not want to be Republicans.
@Emjay
Thank you! I had to laugh out loud at the line about the tax collector.
Well, @INVAR I was outraged over Clinton's behavior.
And I'm glad you are a good person. We need all the good people we can get.
We'll how about dumping the proof on the board about my denial there god. Obviously you must be that all-knowing omniscient fairy tale imaginary being to be able to know how I comported myself among women decades ago to claim I am denying having behaved like Trump.
@INVAR You are hopeless. You've twisted everything I said. I don't think you are stupid but you are obviously blinded by hatred. I'm putting you back on ignore because it's depressing to read clueless idiocy over and over again.
@INVAR
The truth hurts,doesn't it?
No, @sneakypete the truth does not hurt @INVAR ... he is immune and totally insulated from it. I tried being nice to him and reasoning with him.
He twisted all my words and attributed stuff to me I never thought nor said. It is better to just ignore him.
Well, @INVAR I was outraged over Clinton's behavior. But Clinton abused or raped at least two women on record and probably many more. To say nothing of actually having sex with a young employee in the Oval Office. And, yes, it was with another complicit woman. I think he and his wife were criminals.
But Trump simply indulged in some locker-room talk and he was actually amazed and decrying the behavior of women around a celebrity or especially a rich celebrity. We see women hanging around concerts and sports venues offering themselves to the guys. It's sad.
I don't personally think that Trump abused women. Used, maybe.
And I'm glad you are a good person. We need all the good people we can get.
Your problem isn't really with the "party", though. The party establishment detested Trump. They just didn't have the votes to defeat him.
Your problem really is with those voters who voted for Trump in the primary, and presumably with those who support him now. Absent that support from those ordinary voters/citizens, he'd be a footnote of a failed Presidential campaign.
But it should be realized that the voters whom you dislike aren't going go away just because Trump eventually will. Third party efforts will run into the same core problem: there simply are not enough voters who see things the way you do.
Unfortunately, I realize that.
Constitutionalism, morality, honor, integrity........... just a minority view now. Neither the Democrats, nor the Republicans care about any of those things.
Just power. Control. Populism. Being OK with distortions of decency and law because "our guy" is doing it.
The people who once at least claimed to believe in the same things that most of us used to believe in, no longer do.
I've not only lost the party I once belonged to. I realize that in doing so, the country is lost.
I've not only lost the party I once belonged to. I realize that in doing so, the country is lost.
QuoteNo, @sneakypete the truth does not hurt @INVAR ... he is immune and totally insulated from it. I tried being nice to him and reasoning with him.
He twisted all my words and attributed stuff to me I never thought nor said.
@Emjay
Yet he wants to condemn everyone else in sight for not being more truthful and Godly.QuoteIt is best to just ignore him.
You can't ignore evil because if you do,you give it permission to spread. You MUST speak out against the tyrants that want to control everyone's lives or there will be no freedom to do anything but follow orders.
How long has it been that way and we foolishly believed, hoped, otherwise?
Yet he wants to condemn everyone else in sight for not being more truthful and Godly.
You can't ignore evil because if you do,you give it permission to spread. You MUST speak out against the tyrants that want to control everyone's lives or there will be no freedom to do anything but follow orders.
As opposed to you, who condemns everyone who believes in God and does not support Trump as evil??
Ah yes, I'm "evil" for advocating biblical morality and moral character be upheld. A morality that YOU reject as "evil" and assert it is being forced on everyone, simply because we advocate it. Like the Godless Left - you are no more interested in liberty than they are - and would happily silence everyone who speaks that which offends you.
No marvel, for even the religious rulers in Yeshua's day accused Him of being a demon for speaking that which they had rejected.
How does an agnostic or atheist even talk about the concept of "evil?" It's just a made-up concept.
If there is no God, there is no good, and if there is no opposition to God and His Laws, there is no evil.
When the foundation of truth is removed, there is nothing but air.
As we are discovering, sans God and biblical morality as a standard people are individually governed by; "evil" becomes whatever men say that "evil" is. Own a gun? Own property? Believe in God? Believe in merit? In secular Collectivist societies; those things are always declared to be 'evil' and purged via arbitrary 'laws'.
Likewise what is 'good' changes with the wind too. Perversion, lies, graft, corruption, assassination, mass murder... all become 'good' as men redefine it to suit their own stations.
Good and evil then become whatever men say they are and everyone does what is right in his own eyes.
As we are discovering, sans God and biblical morality as a standard people are individually governed by; "evil" becomes whatever men say that "evil" is. Own a gun? Own property? Believe in God? Believe in merit? In secular Collectivist societies; those things are always declared to be 'evil' and purged via arbitrary 'laws'.
Likewise what is 'good' changes with the wind too. Perversion, lies, graft, corruption, assassination, mass murder... all become 'good' as men redefine it to suit their own stations.
Good and evil then become whatever men say they are and everyone does what is right in his own eyes.
Good is anything that damages their enemies. Evil is anything that damages them.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Means and truth irrelevant. Only results matter. 100% tyranny. The very definition of.
I used to believe that only on leftist websites the concepts of good and evil would be so distorted and that good would be attacked as evil and evil supported as good.
For me, this is the crux of the problem. There no longer is a 'side' where the truth is still defended by the majority and where we are not under attack for what used to be the basis of conservative thought and belief.
O Jerusalem! How I longed... But you would not....
Now we know exactly how that happens.
Yes we do.
Among other things history teaches that this people willfully pretend cannot happen here.
It is happening even now, and has been for a long, long time. A people does not lose its moral sense overnight. It has just become so evident it can no longer be denied. I grieve for what will come.
It is happening even now, and has been for a long, long time. A people does not lose its moral sense overnight. It has just become so evident it can no longer be denied. I grieve for what will come.
Yeah. I can just effing imagine how trained you are....
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B0Zod4lIEAETizB.jpg)
So I will not be speaking to you or about you again.
Wouldn't it be wonderful if we could all count on this @sneakypete ?
@INVAR @musiclady
I'm honestly curious about something:
Are you folks saying that it is impossible for someone to have a good moral code unless they have faith in (the Judeo-Christian) God?
Absolutely not.
But all that is good comes from (the Judeo-Christian) God, so anyone who does good or lives morally is reflecting the fact that they are made in His image....... whether they understand that or not.
How does an agnostic or atheist even talk about the concept of "evil?" It's just a made-up concept.
So, he is always on Ignore (one of two here, the other one who just stabs me with her hatpin
@INVAR @musiclady
I'm honestly curious about something:
Are you folks saying that it is impossible for someone to have a good moral code unless they have faith in (the Judeo-Christian) God?
Fine. But if someone can be a good and moral person without believing in God at all simply because they are made in his image, then I don't understand:
Fair question....
To an agnostic or atheist, who doesn't believe in God, or doesn't acknowledge Biblical truth, the concept of evil shouldn't even exist. If man is the sole arbiter of what is right and there is no absolute standard, there is no evil.
An example of that may be the leftist concept that began in the '60's........ "If it feels good, do it." When you get to the core of that concept, anything you want to do is OK if you want to do it. There is no right or wrong. So, if I feel like cheating on my spouse, punching someone in the face, or killing my unborn child because he or she is an inconvenience, there is no standard to say that it is right or wrong, or evil. It's just a made up concept.
Does that make any sense?
@INVAR @musiclady
I'm honestly curious about something:
Are you folks saying that it is impossible for someone to have a good moral code unless they have faith in (the Judeo-Christian) God?
I used to believe that only on leftist websites the concepts of good and evil would be so distorted and that good would be attacked as evil and evil supported as good.
For me, this is the crux of the problem. There no longer is a 'side' where the truth is still defended by the majority and where we are not under attack for what used to be the basis of conservative thought and belief.
I'm honestly curious about something:
Are you folks saying that it is impossible for someone to have a good moral code unless they have faith in (the Judeo-Christian) God?
Yes. Yes they are ... and always have. @Maj. Bill Martin Not only faith in the Judea-Christian God, but faith according to their rules.
That's why I asked this question in the first place, because it does not match up with my own observations in life.QuoteBut my brother, who is a good, moral person with a well-developed moral code, has been an atheist since his teens.
@Maj. Bill Martin
No... The Bible itself describes good folk who have never heard the Gospel. But, for the purposes of a political forum, The emphasis should be put upon the Judeo-Christian Ethic... The American sense of right and wrong.
You will find that as that sense erodes, so too will the general tenor of health in this nation. There cannot be multiple systems of right and wrong (moral relativism), and yet remain as a people. There literally can be no mechanical means (read LE and Jurisprudence) to enforce 'right and wrong' if no one agrees upon what that is.
...As we already can see. EVERY problem infesting this nation is a matter of morality, or moral collision.
And finally, be careful what you wish for - We live in a country where our sense of right and wrong, like our sense of rights, comes from on high, above the courts of men.
When that is no longer the case, who then will determine your rights, and your sense of right and wrong? And just within the course of my lifetime, our experiment in exactly that, has wrought every bit of the illness our nation suffers from.
Whether you like it or not, we are rooted in the Judeo-Christian ethic, and cutting us off there-from is nothing other than death to this nation.
How does an agnostic or atheist even talk about the concept of "evil?" It's just a made-up concept.
But if that is correct, then there shouldn't be any way for someone who is agnostic or atheist (or believes in anything other than the Judeo-Christian God) to have a good moral code. Yet, you clearly acknowledged that such people can have a good moral code. So your explanation doesn't address the question.
Yes and no.
Yes, in that it is an explanation for why someone who doesn't believe in God may live a hedonistic, amoral/immoral existence.
No, in that it doesn't explain how an agnostic/atheist can have a good moral code, which you've already acknowledged can happen.
And just to be clear on this, I am a Christian, and consider myself to have a good moral code even though I sometimes fail to live up to it as well as I would wish. But my brother, who is a good, moral person with a well-developed moral code, has been an atheist since his teens. That's why I asked this question in the first place, because it does not match up with my own observations in life.
I would say that an honest belief in God makes it more likely that someone will have a good moral code, and generally live by it. But it is certainly possible for those who don't believe in God to do the same.
None of that has anything to do with the specific point I was addressing with @musiclady . You are talking about the general benefits a belief in God has on a nation as a whole. I was addressing a very specific statement that pertains to individuals:
Let me bring it back around then.
I have had this exact conversation more than once... And what is odd in the conclusions drawn from that, IMHO: Though atheists tend to espouse a doctrinal unity (via 'book learning' as it were), their perception of that doctrine varies according to culture...
A western American atheist is different than an eastern American atheist, which is again, different from a Brit, or one from France, and etc.
In every case where I have had this conversation, the atheist must finally admit his sense of right and wrong is borrowed from either an exposure to an ethic in his culture, or the antithesis thereof (leading to the conclusion that the thesis is of value).
Which brings us once again to the moral sense of a people, and not the person... Because the person is not forged in a vacuum. He is necessarily infused with an ethical sense by his cultural norms.
There is no moral vacuum.
Which brings us once again to the moral sense of a people, and not the person... Because the person is not forged in a vacuum. He is necessarily infused with an ethical sense by his cultural norms.
There is no moral vacuum.
BINGO.
Saw this firsthand living in India. Their cultural morality is stupefying to a Westerner. I mean, when you watch an old woman beaten to near death by her own sons because she is a widow and her shadow touched them - and this was said to be a good and righteous thing to do ... it blows the mind. Same with how they treat the Dalits and Adhi Andrha - starving humans begging in the streets while exceedingly fat cows and water buffalo adorned with flowers and ornaments are revered and walk the streets.
And then there is their sense of 'justice', which is totally based on caste. Being ripped off by a shopkeeper or a bank - as a Christian or a Dalit - you will go to jail after a beating for complaining about it, because a lower caste may not dispute someone who is from a higher caste. Then there's the child brides and dowry still practiced there. Where 8 year olds are married to forty-somethings. All of that considered a moral, and righteous ethic - because the bible had no presence or influence in their pagan society whatsoever and their society is structured upon a morality system we int he West would see as evil.
It is that God-given conscience, acknowledged or not, that gives them any sense of right and wrong they possess.
I believe we all know people who are agnostic or atheist who do have a moral code. They just don't accept where it actually comes from.
In the essence of it, well refined, that is ultimately right.
But in the effect, or even quite possibly only the affect, community serves as the greater impetus (the conscience of a people). Moral sense I think is found first in mimicry. It is when one rises above that infused sense to question further that one may well meet God.
But be that as it may, it serves us well to pay mind to that mimicry. For as I said, the ethic of the people is infused into the person... And to start in the premise that one is infused with the Judeo-Christian Ethic, no matter how well or poorly, starts one from a better position than one might have otherwise have had attributed.
When it was an awful thing to be caught pregnant without marriage, there was far, far less instance of unwed mothers and bastard children... A good example of that ethical norm guiding those who were less encumbered by ethics, as now can be clearly shown.
The only hope we have, IMO, is another Great Awakening, where we are, as a culture, spiritually revived.
If that happens, and I pray it does, there is a chance America will survive.
If this board is a microcosm of 'Republican' or "conservative thought", then I'm afraid that the notion of a spiritual revival is as eschewed and held in contempt as it is among secular Leftists.
Just took at the contempt, ridicule and disdain over the discussion of moral principles, even by those who self-identify as "Christian".
I think we have fully become a people who now only believe and do that which they think is right in their own eyes. There is no other standard by which they will allow themselves to be measured, except by whatever the culture or government dictate.
Unfortunately, I fear you are right. :shrug:
This is probably the most balanced forum I've ever been on, and the ridicule I've taken for beliefs that were once accepted and honored, is startling.
Unfortunately, I fear you are right. :shrug:
This is probably the most balanced forum I've ever been on, and the ridicule I've taken for beliefs that were once accepted and honored, is startling.
We have lost that in America because we have abandoned our Judeo-Christian roots, and are as a result, swirling the drain.
You know what? I think you're right on all counts because I was bitterly opposed to Trump in the primaries and I changed my opinion of him.
But for a Republican candidate to use that language prior to an election was not just poor taste, it was a death knoll.
@musiclady
Maybe you Thumpers can all get together and elect a Saint? Find a old building with a chimney and release white smoke when you have decided who our new Maximum Leader Who Must Be Obeyed is named?
@sneakypete represents the best of the American experiment. The ideal that the founders envisioned; a government that respects individual freedom and liberty to live one’s life according to the individual’s conscience, a life free from coercion by government or by a state church or by society.
:beer: sneakypete
Only to other republicans, not to any democrats, who support their people, no matter what. When are conservatives going to get smart?
I agree, I wish all the rest of the people would understand that, SO JUDGMENTAL about a great PRESIDENT!
Excellent conversation @INVAR @musiclady @roamer_1 @Maj. Bill Martin :hands:
And that in but a moment, @musiclady ... I long for Mayberry RFD, not out of some allegiance to some old TV show... But because I remember it IRL.
Not just here.
In the meat-world now as well.
Justification for everything from stealing to adultery.
No one wants to hear about biblical morals, unless they can be used to attack the 'other party'. If their party and people do it - then they applaud it and say that is what we need, and when lies are pointed out - they say that we need to be lied to in order to keep us safe and keep us voting the right way.
It really existed. Anyone who says it didn't is trying to rewrite history and deny reality.
When Biblical morality was the underpinning of American society, it was a sweeter place.
When Biblical morality was the underpinning of American society, it was a sweeter place.
I'm thankful for men like @Maj. Bill Martin , who can disagree civilly and respond to honest responses with honest questions.
It shouldn't be so rare.
Oh, how the mind does play tricks. We were a sweeter place with slavery, voting rights discrimination, whites only water fountains, back of the bus rules, whites only schools, systemic occupational segregation, etc. @musiclady ?
Oh, how the mind does play tricks. We were a sweeter place with slavery, voting rights discrimination, whites only water fountains, back of the bus rules, whites only schools, systemic occupational segregation, etc. @musiclady ?Oh, how I wish Christians had led the way towards Emancipation, Women's Rights, and Civil Rights. Ignorant post @Right_in_Virginia
Oh, how the mind does play tricks. We were a sweeter place with slavery, voting rights discrimination, whites only water fountains, back of the bus rules, whites only schools, systemic occupational segregation, etc. @musiclady ?
Spoken like a true carpetbagger @Right_in_Virginia ... Or a Redleg. You decide.
Neither. But I see you're unable to comment on the substance of my post about the "sweeter times" America lived under. It sure does appear the truth has pierced a nerve. 888blackhat
Spoken like a true carpetbagger @Right_in_Virginia ... Or a Redleg. You decide.
:bs:That's all I get? Christian sarcasm. I didn't know you would deny so quickly.
There is nothing more futile or useless than trying to talk sense to the people you are trying to talk sense to @Right_in_Virginia but if it's any comfort at all, I agree with you.
Wheat and tares my friend. The threshing is revealing them.
I don't take anything from one of the high priests of the Christian Pharisees seriously. I know Jesus' judgment of them.
There is nothing more futile or useless than trying to talk sense to the people you are trying to talk sense to @Right_in_Virginia but if it's any comfort at all, I agree with you.
Oh, how I wish Christians had led the way towards Emancipation, Women's Rights, and Civil Rights. Ignorant post @Right_in_Virginia
He chose poorly.
I had intended to thank you for discussing morality with a adeptness that I have never found in my walk with Jesus. I've never been comfortable explaining my faith. Even conversing with my brothers and sisters. I found this conversation insightful.
Extending an olive branch to civil discourse starts with you...
and by that I mean us...
and if I'm being honest I means me.
I can justify my angry words by pointing at the people who instigated it, but in the end they are my words. I've come to know you as very well-natured woman. More civil than I am. I'm not surprised you would also praise @Maj. Bill Martin . I don't know anyone who would say he was prone to hyperbole or argued dishonestly.
I hope that isn't perceived as an insult in anyway.
I believe it answers it specifically. A person who is an atheist or agnostic can have a good moral code without recognizing that there is no good apart from God. As I mentioned earlier, we are ALL created in God's image and for all but the most severely disturbed, that comes with a conscience.
It is that God-given conscience, acknowledged or not, that gives them any sense of right and wrong they possess.
I believe we all know people who are agnostic or atheist who do have a moral code. They just don't accept where it actually comes from.
Okay -- I see what you are saying. I think that if an atheist or agnostic has a good moral code, even if they don't believe it comes from God, they're perfectly able to talk about it. They may explain it rationally -- "the world would be a better place if people all acted morally, therefore it is logical to act that way", or emotionally "I just can't stand to see suffering", etc., but to them, that is no more pulling morality from the air than is faith-based morality.
In any case, I completely agree with the larger point that good religious faith is, overall, a very positive force for morality as a whole. While some people who don't believe in God can still have a good moral code and live by it, many others cannot. I think that in particular, raising children in faith provides best possible basis for good moral development. Even if that child later strays from faith, many of those moral teachings will remain.
As a nation, we could use a lot more of that right now than we currently have. One place you really see the difference is in the inner cities. It is the families and kids that still have a strong belief in God who are often the only things holding those communities together.
Neither. But I see you're unable to comment on the substance of my post about the "sweeter times" America lived under. It sure does appear the truth has pierced a nerve. 888blackhat
Wheat and tares my friend. The threshing is revealing them.
He was right then and he is right now. The GOP is a party of ideas, not a cult of personality.
@roamer_1 , I think, hit the nail on the head when he talked about the influence of a civil society based on Christianity (which we used to have). Our laws and our code of ethics is directly Biblical. Our culture used to reflect that sense of ethics and so a kind of "peer pressure" kept many others behaving well.....but does so less and less, and what remains of that ethic is still a result of a country......... the only one in the entire world........ that was founded on Judeo-Christian principles.
You are so very correct, that I wish you could truly understand the depth of that accuracy.
I naively thought that human-beings innately yearned for liberty and righteousness, and that was a falsehood rectified firsthand when I lived in India. A nation without any kind of foundation in biblical principles exists on a morality that stymies and bewilders. Life is cheap and liberty is non existent outside of freedoms permitted under strict caste rules. Dalits are not considered human and killing them if you are a higher caste member is always excused and/or covers up with help of the local corrupt police. Bribes are an integral part of how Indian society works. Don't pay a bribe, you don't get service or your item, even if you paid for it. Women are only half a human being until they are married, which is nothing more than a business transaction as the brides family has to usually pay about half their wealth to the family of the groom in dowry. Once married, she becomes a slave and moves into her in-laws home to care for the groom's family and eventually raise their children until they have enough income to rent their own place. Even in the Christian church there, men routinely beat their wives - one elder did so because his curry was not made to his liking. Trying to explain to them that they are to love their wives and treat them as Christ loved the church was rejected as incompatible with Indian society.
After six months I was not only sick with dysentery, I began to hate the country and people I was there to serve. That came on because of my ignorance in their morality; the daily assaults on decency and outright brutality and the cheapness of life literally short-circuited my mind. It freaked me out that a society could literally treat others the way they do and consider it not only okay - but a righteous duty. Scripture tells us that the day is coming that those who kill Christians consider it a duty to God. I had never witnessed it in living color before then.
We are indeed unique in all the world in that our society was built upon a biblical foundation and the liberty enshrined for us was dependent upon that foundation being maintained by the people. Because when that is gone, our own society will devolve into what governs the rest of the third world, even if technology and wealth make it more devious. Human nature in it's base form unrestrained by biblical morality, is brutal and cruel - and so is their morality.
I was in India for only two weeks (visiting our daughter who was there for a year freeing slaves), and I saw a lot of the same issues even in that short of a time. The filth, the disregard for life, the treatment of women and lower castes was sickening.
I was involved in a discussion here on TBR quite a while ago, arguing that it was the Hindu religion that was the basis of the horrific conditions in India, and whoever I was arguing with was screeching the same things about my "arrogance."
Seeing Christianity belittled and bashed here makes me heartsick.
This people do not want liberty or the morality that is necessary to maintain it. They have grown to dispose and loathe those things as much as the Left has, which is why like the Left - they empower politicians and government to impose what they think they want and gravitate to cheerleading venal and crass men who say what they want to hear.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend. @Emjay?
You agree with the snark and sarcasm against those who believe that morality in American culture is better than amorality?
It is "talking sense" to mock Christianity? It is "talking sense" to say that times are better now when America is besieged with the amorality of the left, propagandized about homosexuality, promiscuity and self-absorbtion??
Really?? This is what you believe??
I've known you for years and I never would have guessed that you believe immorality is actually better than morality. :shrug:
They have been woefully and grievously misinformed. Purposefully misinformed.
And without the wherewithal to extend an argument beyond 140 char, and draw their attention for more than catch phrases and money shots, they will remain that way.
What a pity.
I cannot even fathom what could possibly lead you to the conclusion that I am in favor of immorality.
I am not.
I'm not in favor of stupidity either but I can't seem to eradicate it around here.
Read your words of approval to the mockery of those who stand for morality.
IS the enemy of your enemy your friend, or are you going to stand on your own for your own belief in the moral principles this country was founded on? Are you going to stand with the mockers of people of faith, or stand on your own in support of the faith we (and you) believe in?
Or is it impossible to "talk sense" to you?
I will reply to you one more time and never again. You cannot be reasoned with. I can only guess that you resented my supporting @Right_in_Virginia on a post she made, because that is the only post I've made on this desiccated thread in a long time.
Please don't make foolish accusations against me again. It hurts both of us.
I'm asking a serious question here because your approval of RiV's ripping Christianity is puzzling.
Do you agree that America is better with less Christian influence, as she does, or do you not?
If you don't, then your approval of her post was not what you actually believe (as I suspect is true).
I'm not 'accusing.' I'm clarifying. Because I don't believe you meant what you intended when you said you agreed with her. You just don't like the people she was mocking in her post. (which, btw, includes me).
Oh, Good Lord. You WILL NOT give it up. I entered that discussion at the end. I don't know what went on before I saw @Right_in_Virginia's post. All I saw was her assertion that America was not perfect in the past, and it was not. And I saw ignorant, self-righteous people insulting and abusing her. I just wanted to give her a friendly pat.
Because I give someone a friendly pat does not mean I believe everything that person thinks or stands for, but I do think RIV is at least as moral as some of the people who were abusing her.
Now, can we PLEASE end this ridiculous discussion?
Unfortunately it seems in the desire to restore our Christian Foundings we chose a man openly immoral.
Actually, not one person she was mocking said "America was perfect in the past." Her point was entirely pointless, other than to mock.
And the men and women you accuse and call "ignorant," are the ones who have Biblical knowledge to support their positions and have over and over again given facts to support their views. In fact, the entire history of our country supports their views.
RiV was not the abused. She was the abuser.
Now this conversation will end. I understand which side you are on, and that you never, ever again want me to call you on it.
I concede, and will not do it again.
She was definitely abused and by the same holier than thou people who constantly proclaim their perfect morality on this forum. I despise all of them and Jesus would too.
It just helps me realize that liberty here in this country is not coming back and that John Adams' statement regarding liberty lost, was in effect a prophecy that is being fulfilled.
This people do not want liberty or the morality that is necessary to maintain it. They have grown to dispose and loathe those things as much as the Left has, which is why like the Left - they empower politicians and government to impose what they think they want and gravitate to cheerleading venal and crass men who say what they want to hear.
“But a Constitution of Government once changed from Freedom, can never be restored. Liberty, once lost, is lost forever.â€
I thought you wanted the conversation to be over. :shrug:
It's over.
There are times when my inherent male immaturity presses me to say something stupid for my own amusement. Like....
Catfight!
Then my better judgement takes over, and I don't. That usually saves me from said females teaming up against me.
Well I think that last bit answered your question. Jussayin. :shrug: :whistle:
Shiny things. I cannot believe it of Conservatives... That they would be swayed by sensationalism. That the 'Big Show' would attract them more than the actual record, but that seems to be the case.
I still don't believe that to be the case. And while not impugning the character of those holding their nose and trying to make lemonade out of bullshit... The events of this election only cause me to question the 'conservatism' of his acolytes.
The record is plain, and I will stand on that. Thinking a leopard changed his spots overnight the day after the election was secured is beyond my ability to suspend disbelief.
Not a catfight. It takes two for that, and I ain't participating. happy77
RiV was not the abused. She was the abuser.
Election results do not transform characters.
Seems to me that if it was like Quix told me the other day that Trump was Gods Chosen and there are prophesies dating back that Trumps character would have been righteously polished by the election. He sure wouldn't be saying his favorite verse was eye for eye. Certainly he wouldn't say I don't need forgiveness. And I don't believe his cabinet and advisors were all divine appointment either.
I'm asking a serious question here because your approval of RiV's ripping Christianity is puzzling.
Shouldn't this thread, be moved now to the Religion category?
I consider you the high priestess of the Christian Pharisee (and this is not a compliment, dear).
Shouldn't this thread, be moved now to the Religion category?
a preacher who doesn't know and doesn't feel the true spirit of Jesus' words. I consider you the high priestess of the Christian Pharisee (and this is not a compliment, dear).
I hear the same thing from those who are busy trying to convince me that homosexuality is not a sin and that Gay Marriage is something that God approves of.
Some people have convinced themselves of what they want to believe.
I know gay couples with whom I wouldn't hesitate to leave my grandchildren ...and I know straight couples whom I wouldn't even consider.
Just being objective here, but the same members here always seem to get into these never-effing-ending debates about whose moral compass is true, ...whose needs adjusting.
Wow...great minds and all that. Been tempted to call them out for two pages now.... LOLI saw a new term, at least to me. "PC" I guess for "Principled Conservative"
Have not once entered this thread to post...seven pages plus, but I've followed it.
Just being objective here, but the same members here always seem to get into these never-effing-ending debates about whose moral compass is true, ...whose needs adjusting.
And by coincidence, they're all....
...nevermind. :laugh:
@DCPatriot
A serious question:
How are the principles of Social conservatism any different than the principles of Fiscal, Defense and Foreign Policy, or Civil-Libertarian conservatism?
The immovable principles of all of them are well defined. And which of those principles can we blithely ignore?
The Reagan Conservative answer is none of them. They all intertwine.
If you think you can have small government and balanced budgets in the midst of moral turpitude, you've another think coming.
There is no arguing over 'moral compass'. The principles are defined. Either you accept them, or you do not. Just like the rest of Conservatism.
I'm your huckleberry... :laugh:
Look...we all share the basic tenets of Conservatism. But some like you, are more fanatic ... thinking you're always waving at us from above...that you're more enlightened, because you're true to your principles and seemingly, we're not.
We get it.
It's the reason you give us for never being able to participate in supporting the President. Because he's a flawed man in your eyes.
We get that too.
What we don't understand is your inability to assess the current landscape...your surroundings. It's a wonder you haven't been mugged yet.
The cultural elites, plus an entire generation since September 11th 2001 are liberal progressive. Anything that portrays a threat to their freedoms and lifestyle will be knocked down.
How do you 'sell' Conservatism as the answer to that crowd?
Answer: You find a plain-spoken non-ideological Conservative who claw and scratch/bite back against the bad image attempts against the GOP in the media.
You find a Donald J. Trump (thank you Lord Jesus)
The perfect likeable character when the other choice is insane Socialism.
Wow...great minds and all that. Been tempted to call them out for two pages now.... LOL
Have not once entered this thread to post...seven pages plus, but I've followed it.
Just being objective here, but the same members here always seem to get into these never-effing-ending debates about whose moral compass is true, ...whose needs adjusting.
And by coincidence, they're all....
...nevermind. :laugh:
Raising Kids With Religion Or Spirituality May
Protect Their Mental Health: Study
Alice G. Walto
(http://thumbor.forbes.com/thumbor/960x0/https%3A%2F%2Fspecials-images.forbesimg.com%2Fdam%2Fimageserve%2F529467318%2F960x0.jpg%3Ffit%3Dscale)
A new study from Harvard’s T.H. Chan School of Public Health finds that kids and teens who are raised with religious or spiritual practices tend to have better health and mental health as they age. But not to worry if you’re not a service-attender. The research, published last week in the American Journal of Epidemiology, finds that people who prayed or meditated on their own time also reaped similar benefits, including lower risk of substance abuse and depression later on.
The team looked at data from 5,000 people taking part in the long-term Nurses' Health Study II and its next generation Growing Up Today Study (GUTS). They were interested in whether the frequency with which a child/teen attended religious services with their parents or prayed/meditated on their own was correlated with their health and mental health as they grew into their 20s. The young people were followed for anywhere from eight to 14 years.
more at: http://www.forbes.com/sites/alicegwalton/2018/09/17/raising-kids-with-religion-or-spirituality-may-protect-their-mental-health-study/#1759f39a3287 (http://www.forbes.com/sites/alicegwalton/2018/09/17/raising-kids-with-religion-or-spirituality-may-protect-their-mental-health-study/#1759f39a3287)
__________________________________________________________
I would think this might support the 'theory' :laugh: that if a child is taught right from wrong, and to treat people with respect, etc., that he would never have to follow/attend religion in order to be a wonderful human being.
I have to say that the people I really have a hard time stomaching on this forum are the very ones who think they are perfect.
I'm your huckleberry... :laugh:
Look...we all share the basic tenets of Conservatism.
But some like you, are more fanatic ... thinking you're always waving at us from above...that you're more enlightened, because you're true to your principles and seemingly, we're not.
We get it.
It's the reason you give us for never being able to participate in supporting the President. Because he's a flawed man in your eyes.
We get that too.
What we don't understand is your inability to assess the current landscape...your surroundings. It's a wonder you haven't been mugged yet.
The cultural elites, plus an entire generation since September 11th 2001 are liberal progressive. Anything that portrays a threat to their freedoms and lifestyle will be knocked down.
How do you 'sell' Conservatism as the answer to that crowd?
We have to 'love' them all, @Emjay
9999hair out0000
I would think this might support the 'theory' :laugh: that if a child is taught right from wrong, and to treat people with respect, etc., that he would never have to follow/attend religion in order to be a wonderful human being.
Awww crap....forget it, just saw it's from Harvard. :laugh:
"Well HE went to Haahvid!"
Since my attempt to distract people I like from bashing each other over the head failed miserably, I suppose I'll get a little bit serious and suggest that the following prayer is probably a good one to remember when it comes to forum arguments:God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference
@DCPatriot You were wise to refrain from entering this thread. I made one post ... just to encourage a friend who was being horribly abused and it brought a whole s**t storm down on me starting with someone I had not spoken to.
About 2 pages ago, I begged the Mods to shut this sucker down after someone posted a whole page of stuff from the Bible justifying her own intolerance.
I should have begged when one person wanted to ruin another thread fighting. I guess you completely ignored the post I think it is 181 which actually is about Tom Pawlenty. And reading the information it appears that his agenda is Trumps agenda. His only mistake was to criticize the Trump. I would call that major intolerance, but mostly insecurity. And a symptom of Trumps narcissism that he is willing to destroy a persons career because they didn't talk nice about him.
Putin- Communist dictator good (talks nice about Trump) Pawlenty-Conservative with same agenda as Trump campaigned on , bad. (made comments Trump didn't like)
Well, let me suggest that with Vladimir Putin, you know where you stand walking in.
You always try to introduce yourselves in an appropriate manner. In President Trump's case, he'd hope that we could find common ground with which to work to solve Middle East and EU issues.
For this, you claim that he embraced Putin instead of condemning him while he's standing ten feet away...?
Come on...we've argued that till the cows came home.
As far as not being a fan of Pawlenty?
Two words: Jeff Flake Who needs another back stabber on the team? :shrug:
I should have begged when one person wanted to ruin another thread fighting. I guess you completely ignored the post I think it is 181 which actually is about Tom Pawlenty. And reading the information it appears that his agenda is Trumps agenda. His only mistake was to criticize the Trump. I would call that major intolerance, but mostly insecurity. And a symptom of Trumps narcissism that he is willing to destroy a persons career because they didn't talk nice about him.
Putin- Communist dictator good (talks nice about Trump) Pawlenty-Conservative with same agenda as Trump campaigned on , bad. (made comments Trump didn't like)
Get over yourself Emjay. I have to sit through your tirades.
BTW you are the "ignore" queen. You are always talking about how you have people on ignore. What a liar. If you had me on ignore you wouldn't have seen it because nobody reposted it.
Since you don't have me on ignore I will give you a trophy
(http://i.imgur.com/UlpZLwz.jpg?1)
We are not talking about Jeff Flake we are talking about Pawlenty
Pawlenty voted for President Donald Trump and "support most of what's he's doing, nearly all of what he's doing on a policy level." In 2016 Pawlenty had expressed disapproval of Trump's "comments and language and behavior", calling the president "unsound, uninformed, unhinged and unfit" during his campaign. Pawlenty stated that since the election, "he's made a lot of great progress as leader of our country and president of the United States in terms of policy priorities and the outcomes."[181]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Pawlenty (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Pawlenty)
Tim Pawlenty on the issues. Everyone should read it. He's a Conservative. The only reason this is happening to anyone is because they have criticized Trump at one time or the other. Trump demands absolute admiration. Otherwise regardless of whether you are working toward Trumps goals or not you are gone.
http://www.ontheissues.org/Tim_Pawlenty.htm#Immigration (http://www.ontheissues.org/Tim_Pawlenty.htm#Immigration)
More on Tim Pawlenty at the link.
I like the guy even more now. Why because he is just like us. Honest. He voted for Trump and gave Trump recognition for what he does right. But he's honest. Trump acts like a Senior Citizen child.
I'll drink to that. :beer: 0005 :drunk: :shotglass: ***wine :martini:God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference
BUZZZZZ!!! Sorry, @Chosen Daughter no sale.
He should have kept his opinion to himself. Some win. Some lose.
@Chosen Daughter It's not nice to call people liars. Jesus hates liars and people who lie about other people.
I don't know when you decided I am your enemy and I never put you on ignore. But I have noticed you trail around wherever you see my posts and try to disparage me.
Hey, I'm not all that flattered by the attention and you can shove that award up your virtue hole.
Its OK you gave me the answer that was correct. It is the same answer as to why we have all the fighting on this forum. Because with the Trump presidency nobody is allowed to call out the president when he is wrong. Especially not when he is acting stupid. I have been a Republican all my adult life and there isn't a president that I have not called out when they are wrong. Not one that I would not have stated my opinion. Yes, Trump is unique. I don't remember any with such childish insecurity and desire for total admiration without exception.
And it is absolutely hilarious that Trump and FOX News has latched onto Gang of 8 Graham. Like he is the authority opinion for the Republican party. So much for Trumps immigration policy. What a sham.
Jesus hates liars and people who lie about other people.
Emjay you always do that. You say some person.............etc. I was the only person who posted a page of stuff related to the Bible. As if people cannot figure out who you are talking about.
Not only is Trump unique, but Pawlenty was right about him. No one should be punished for a (correct) negative opinion about ANY President.
This is the first time that this has happened.
It is downright un-American to be told to shut up and follow the leader. It's one thing to have disagreements and discussions about policy, but to demand that no one criticize anything about Trump........... well, this is a first.
You did not just post one page... you posted several pages and I will tell you right now that I reported it to the mods. We have been asked repeatedly not to get into religious or Bible discussions.
You violate that constantly. I didn't name you as a courtesy and, in fact, you are not the only one who is guilty.
Wow, I shouldn't have skimmed...I guess I missed that major character development, when the loving Jesus turned hateful!
And as far as I can see that is the only reason for destroying his career. He voted for Trump and has given him praise for the good things he has done.
You did not just post one page... you posted several pages and I will tell you right now that I reported it to the mods. We have been asked repeatedly not to get into religious or Bible discussions.
Of course you did. I am sure that you do a lot of reporting. LOL! Even if the Mods decided to shut me down I have already said mostly anything I could about my opinion on politics. I don't separate my faith from my politics. God is what shapes my political opinions. I think I made it clear in this thread alone that God is not a political savior. He is interested in hearts. But this election made God about politics. And no matter how much you run to the MODS this whole presidency had been about religion. From all of Trumps Evangelical advisors to the kooks who claim that his election was a miracle. A fulfillment of Prophesy.
I would love to disregard what all that is about. Even refrain from the need to bring up religious aspects of this presidency. But since he claims it (most prayerful president) The fulfillment of prophesy. Gods chosen president........... then I think we have to examine it in a spiritual way.
And since we are on the topic there are several on this forum who like to trash the Christians (ones who got Trump elected) for discussing the same thing Trump claims is his success. His meetings with spiritual advisors............etc.
Yes, but as a Christian, he responded rightly to Trump's bragging about molesting women, and so he has to be punished.
I should add that this HAS happened before............... Obama's minions wouldn't let anyone say anything negative about him either.
It just has never happened on our side of the aisle.
I am sure you are wrong. I almost never report. And obviously you think your right to spout off boring pages about your religious beliefs supersedes the requests of the owner of this forum.
As far as the rest of your post, it's the same old blah, blah, blah.
How about you use that ignore feature there then since discussing the bible and religion in the current political/cultural context aggravates you so, same as it does our resident Atheist?
Verging very close on dictatorship where people are not allowed free speech.
The Obama groupies and the Trump groupies (not those who voted for him or support some of the things he's done, but the groupies) would LOVE to have their guy be dictator.
Fortunately, what's left of our Constitution still prevents that from happening.
It is completely inappropriate to complain about the discussion when it is germane to the problems we have right now, and it is impossible for those of us whose faith is intertwined with our thoughts and opinions, to detach one from the other.
As one rabid Trump supporter told me - "God belongs in church, not on a public forum" - and yet this same person constantly insists for everyone to pray for Trump on a public forum.
They only want to hear accolades and praise for their anointed leader, and silence those things that sear their consciences and bother their ears because deep down they know they are true.
And they do not want to hear it.
They want to hear smooth things. Easy things. To hear illusions and to be told lies... because they keep us 'safe'.
@INVAR
@musiclady
I just realized that the image on top of the forum is Ark of Covenant with priest blowing shofar. I wonder if its anything like Qanon clues?! Hidden messages.
Yes, but as a Christian, he responded rightly to Trump's bragging about molesting women, and so he has to be punished.
We used to have somebody very unambiguous on the masthead... /s
That was back when this was a right wing site. Now it is the gender bending home of cross dressers, Bi's, malcontents, Progressives, Regressives, Communists, Anarchists and all around Trump Hating nuts.
That was back when this was a right wing site. Now it is the gender bending home of cross dressers, Bi's, malcontents, Progressives, Regressives, Communists, Anarchists and all around Trump Hating nuts.
I just realized that the image on top of the forum is Ark of Covenant with priest blowing shofar.
It's the Day of Atonement for our Jewish friends on the board and those Christians who observe the biblical feasts.
I'm your huckleberry... :laugh:
Look...we all share the basic tenets of Conservatism. But some like you, are more fanatic ... thinking you're always waving at us from above...that you're more enlightened, because you're true to your principles and seemingly, we're not.
We get it.
It's the reason you give us for never being able to participate in supporting the President. Because he's a flawed man in your eyes.
We get that too.
What we don't understand is your inability to assess the current landscape...your surroundings. It's a wonder you haven't been mugged yet.
The cultural elites, plus an entire generation since September 11th 2001 are liberal progressive. Anything that portrays a threat to their freedoms and lifestyle will be knocked down.
How do you 'sell' Conservatism as the answer to that crowd?
Answer: You find a plain-spoken non-ideological Conservative who claw and scratch/bite back against the bad image attempts against the GOP in the media.
You find a Donald J. Trump (thank you Lord Jesus)
The perfect likeable character when the other choice is insane Socialism.
@DCPatriot
Donald J. Trump is the definition, the embodiment, the very essence of "the elite."
Dude. Come on.
We used to have somebody very unambiguous on the masthead... /s
@DCPatriot
Donald J. Trump is the definition, the embodiment, the very essence of "the elite."
Dude. Come on.
That was back when this was a right wing site. Now it is the gender bending home of cross dressers, Bi's, malcontents, Progressives, Regressives, Communists, Anarchists and all around Trump Hating nuts.
Of course, he's a member of the elite but I said "cultural elite".
Looking at all that gold leaf filigree .... all this taste is in his mouth. (And in his wives.) :laugh:
Gosh. Thank God you're back to clear these matters up.
And now simply unapologetic HUB of 24-7-365 #nevertrupism, very heavy on insulting Trump supporters.
@DCPatriot
Well, I'm not going to argue with that, lol.
Quote from: DCPatriot on Today at 07:08:04 PM
We used to have somebody very unambiguous on the masthead... /s
FrankCannon
That was back when this was a right wing site. Now it is the gender bending home of cross dressers, Bi's, malcontents, Progressives, Regressives, Communists, Anarchists and all around Trump Hating nuts.
:beer:
WHATEVER..
WHATEVER..
"There's only one thing you can do when you've got the wolf by the ears."
"You eat the wolf up one bite at a time, starting with his nose."
Old Viking saying.
Which is how I see Trump: eating the wolf up one bite at a time.
That was back when this was a right wing site. Now it is the gender bending home of cross dressers, Bi's, malcontents, Progressives, Regressives, Communists, Anarchists and all around Trump Hating nuts.
That was back when this was a right wing site. Now it is the gender bending home of cross dressers, Bi's, malcontents, Progressives, Regressives, Communists, Anarchists and all around Trump Hating nuts.
I resent being called a malcontent.
You forgot scruffy looking nerf herders and, although you included Trump hating nuts, you forgot the most worthless nuts of all: Buckeyes.
Most, lefts, liberals, progressives, are thumpers.
:laugh:
WHATEVER..
I resent being called a malcontent.
You know what is funny ?
Then feel free to pick one of the other choices.You tried to rape me at a party. I don't remember when, or where, or how I got there. I don't know who invited me or who else was there. But I know you raped me and you were drunk.
You tried to rape me at a party. I don't remember when, or where, or how I got there. I don't know who invited me or who else was there. But I know you raped me and you were drunk.
You know what is funny ? How people have not been identified by NAME, as to what they are considered to BE. So, they volunteer themselves , and say, "I am not a malcontent". I think, that has to do with being, CONVICTED SPIRITUALLY?
888mouth
I think it is classy how you self edited "Go eff yourself" and did the "Whatever". You are an example we should all follow.
The only part of that story you got right is that I was drunk, but that covers everyday since Reagan was shot.I'm demand a full investigation.
I think it is classy how you self edited "Go eff yourself" and did the "Whatever". You are an example we should all follow.
You are a genuine clown. A loser politician who barely squeaked out 2 elections for Gov because of 58 people on the ballot and then ran the state into the ground through ridiculous bonds for sports arenas was rejected because he is a loser no one wants. His state hates him and they showed that by not voting for his stupidity. As much as you Trump Hating fools try to prop up this incompetent boob who routinely fails at being elected by name dropping Jesus and morality, he is still an incompetent boob.
That's not what I read. I know Minnesota normally prefers the weird and Liberals like Jesse Ventura and creepy Muslim Kieth Ellison.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSNy4JyNaC2dBVG3YftjuQRPIEKuoydqgL0nrSBjEs7Y9ApVAUm)
Most, lefts, liberals, progressives, are thumpers.
I'd take Ventura over your pal Bush any day. Probably wouldn't have to have a high school drop out in the TSA stick his finger up my ass when I fly to Nebraska if he was President.
You are a genuine clown. A loser politician who barely squeaked out 2 elections for Gov because of 58 people on the ballot and then ran the state into the ground through ridiculous bonds for sports arenas was rejected because he is a loser no one wants. His state hates him and they showed that by not voting for his stupidity. As much as you Trump Hating fools try to prop up this incompetent boob who routinely fails at being elected by name dropping Jesus and morality, he is still an incompetent boob.
As if you don't like that kind of thing.
I'd take Ventura over your pal Bush any day. Probably wouldn't have to have a high school drop out in the TSA stick his finger up my ass when I fly to Nebraska if he was President.
.....but he was right about Trump and his admission of molestation of women.
How endearing. He viewed Trump as the Jackass
@Chosen Daughter
It's Yom Teruah - YHWH's high Holy Day - The Feast of Trumpets...
I was quite happy to see that in the banner.
Me too Roamer. How did you celebrate?
Mostly just study and observance the last 10 days... I am alone here in my Messianic faith, so not much fellowship, except for a couple places online... I don't have a shofar, so... But it has been a good ten days... A lot of guitar and Bible time...
Tonight at sunset began Yom Kippur... I watched the sun go down and spent the early night in contemplation, getting myself tuned in.., I began my fast mid afternoon, and tomorrow I will limit electronics and try to spend the day directly in prayer... Which is why I am cleaning up posts tonight...
I am mildly disappointed about Sukkot... It was going to be my first walk-off into the woods, but I ain't ready yet. :( Maybe next year...
Chosen is nodding her head. I am going to go off now and do some reading and meditating. Close my night with prayer.
Good night Roamer.
So bragging about banging chicks is now "molestation"? Now I understand why you and the other God sent morality police here are stone cold silent about Pope Frank, The Vicar of Christ, circling the wagons around child rapists and condoning it. I thought that was molestation but here it was actually what I was doing in clubs for years to hustle chicks into bed.
My bad. Carry on.
I know you would. Green Party Bernie Sanders supporter, conspiracy theorist kook Ventura.
Frank probably prefers Al Franken to Pawlenty too.
More his style. *****rollingeyes*****
.
(http://i.imgur.com/QXdACPr.jpg)
Oh nice an atheist cartoonist who has no grasp on God. Biggest loser post.
Harold Stassen in is current state would be better than that loser stiff Pawlenty.
I don't know what's funnier @DCPatriot --- the cartoon or the reactions to it. :laugh:
The cartoon is funny. I smiled. The reactions? Predictable.
Do not confuse @Right_in_Virginia with being the problem it only inflates her Ego even more, she is merely JUST a symptom of the problem.
Do please try to keep up, @corbe
It was @Emjay who @Chosen Daughter responded to....not @Right_in_Virginia
I admit @DCPatriot that after reading the bloodbath between those two on Page 6, which @Emjay said that @Chosen Daughter was pizzed because the aforementioned had agreed with RiV at some time or another, hell, even I have agreed with RiV, on multiple occasions, it was heart breaking because I like both of them so much.
So I jumped to the end to further crap on the Thread and get 50 extra points for pinging @Right_in_Virginia .
I admit @DCPatriot that after reading the bloodbath between those two on Page 6, which @Emjay said that @Chosen Daughter was pizzed because the aforementioned had agreed with RiV at some time or another, hell, even I have agreed with RiV, on multiple occasions, it was heart breaking because I like both of them so much.
So I jumped to the end to further crap on the Thread and get 50 extra points for pinging @Right_in_Virginia .
My apologies @Chosen Daughter it wasn't' you, though I love you too, Mucho.
Do please try to keep up, @corbe
It was @Emjay who @Chosen Daughter responded to....not @Right_in_Virginia
I just got here, I'm still on Page 8, Don't lock it.
This here is Class A effing bullshit and you know it.
It certainly is, Frank, and I think corbe just likes to see other people fight, especially women. I'm disgusted with the whole ugly mess.
Welcome back, @CatherineofAragon Everything okay? :cool:
@DCPatriot@CatherineofAragon
Yes, it is, thanks. We had a hairy few days last week when we were planning for Florence to hit us head on. I look at the scenes from NC...that was going to be us. I feel horrible, if it makes any sense.
Missed ya @CatherineofAragon
@DCPatriot
Yes, it is, thanks. We had a hairy few days last week when we were planning for Florence to hit us head on. I look at the scenes from NC...that was going to be us. I feel horrible, if it makes any sense.
Are you insinuating that I'm full of $hit @CatherineofAragon or have you got me confused with @Frank Cannon again?
wink777
:beer:
Are you insinuating that I'm full of $hit @CatherineofAragon or have you got me confused with @Frank Cannon again?
wink777
@CatherineofAragon
Hey Babe!. Thought you got pissed off at one of the morons and went into hiding! :smokin: 888high58888 :seeya:
@The Ghost
Lol 888high58888
I guess I'm back to piss off and be pissed on
@The Ghost
Lol 888high58888
I guess I'm back to piss off and be pissed on
@corbe I am furious at you. Why would you want to keep this desiccated thread alive. it has turned into vicious attacks against innocent people. Me, for example.
I entered this thread a couple of pages ago for the first time. I was curious to see how and why people could still be talking about Pawlenty.
The first thing I saw was people attacking @Right_in_Virginia .. I know she's one of the few people you admit you don't like and you just love everyone else.
All I did was give RIV a little pat and then two vicious elderly ladies jumped on me like white on rice. They assumed that because I gave RIV a little smile, I agreed with everything she had said on this thread and maybe in her life.
So, I was abused for basically nothing but trying to be nice and then we have people like @goodwithagun jumping in on something she knows nothing about just to get an insult in.
There's nothing in the world that can get meaner than two elderly good Christian ladies.
And you should personally be ashamed, corbe.
Oops, forgot to put claim to be the victim with my previous comment.
LOL! Now I'm a "vicious elderly lady!" What a hoot!
I'm not remotely vicious, and I sure ain't elderly! 888heartkitty
and I sure ain't elderly!
Yeah right. You spend your free time playing canasta and yelling at school kids cutting across your lawn.
Don't knock it. It's a lot of fun (the yelling, not the canasta. I'm not sure what canasta is.)
Don't knock it. It's a lot of fun (the yelling, not the canasta. I'm not sure what canasta is.)
Wow ... Music Lady is vicious? Good grief! Not even funny for heaven's sake.
Yeah right. You spend your free time playing canasta and yelling at school kids cutting across your lawn.
It's like gin rummy... without the gin.
It's like gin rummy... without the gin.
Well then I look forward to that in my dotage.
It's like gin rummy... without the gin.
It’s funny when you use Biblical references to rant about Christians.
You mean you're not in.....oh, sorry, Frank. I thought, well nevermind what I thought. No, I'll tell you, I didn't think anyone could be that curmudgeonly unless he had a lot of practice. Years and years...and years. 888mouth
Being pissed of is genetic, not learned.
@goodwithagun
You have to know the cult mantra to point out the cult hypocrisy.
I'm going into the curmudgeon line of work now. I just put in my last day of work for like, forever. I have an appointment with HR in the morning, and I'm gone bye, bye. No more Mr Nice Guy mask.
Congrats 🍾🥂🍾
I'm so happy! Wheee!
I highly recommend this small investment for debating with some Briefers on TBR @CatherineofAragon (Mine use to be clear).
(http://cdn-sportsunlimitedinc.scdn2.secure.raxcdn.com/mod_productImagesDownload/images/the-north-face-mens-resolve-rain-jacket-custom_mainProductImage_Large.jpg)
Better the former to be than the later!
:cool:
:beer:
@CatherineofAragon
@musiclady hello, friend!
Hi there! Good to "see" you, @CatherineofAragon !
Was out of town today and then lost power for an hour and a half from the storms that blew through, so I'm a bit late in responding!
Hope you're well, my friend!
@musiclady
Yep, we're fine, thanks, and grateful to be that way. Is it still hot where you are?
Don't know if you've told us, but were you in Florence's path?
We've been sweltering, but a storm system dropped us down about 15 degrees in an hour and it's supposed to go down into the 40's tonight!
Just in time for Fall! happy77
@CatherineofAragon
@musiclady
We were just about in the bullseye until the storm shifted. Good for us, but horrible for North Carolina.
The 40s! That's perfect sleeping weather. I can't wait for it.
No need for AC or heat. Perfect, indeed!
Glad you're OK, @CatherineofAragon !