Author Topic: BREAKING>> Active Shooter Florida High School... Developing... Multiple victims...  (Read 24217 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Gefn

  • "And though she be but little she is fierce"-Shakespeare
  • Cat Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,380
  • Gender: Female
  • Quos Deus Vult Perdere Prius Dementat
Schizophrenia typically manifests itself at around that age - late teens to early 20's. And it is a horrendous disease that affects the wealthy and the poor and everyone in between.

For several years I worked as a finance manager of a private social work agency. They provided private case management and psychotherapy and ran a group home for schizophrenics among other services like providing hospitals and school systems with social workers (licensed MSW’s) on either a temporary or long term basis.

One of our “clients” was a 40 something year old man who had firsts been diagnosed with schizophrenia in his early 20’s. From what I understood and knew about him, early on in his life, he was very normal and actually exceptionally bright, a promising mathematician and on track to become an aerospace engineer and his parents, who seemed to be good and deeply religious (Jewish) people, and were quite wealthy and loved him dearly.

But his schizophrenia really started manifesting while he was in grad school and his parents had him committed to a private and well known psychiatric hospital several times, but since he had by then reached adulthood, they couldn’t keep him there against his will unless he was posing a real and credible threat to himself or others. As long as he was on his meds and getting counseling and psychiatric care, he was OK, no - not quite normal, but not stark raving mad.

But as his schizophrenia and its delusions and paranoia got worse and worse, he became increasingly non-compliant and preferred living on the streets and homeless and his parents couldn’t do anything about it until he was arrested for threating people or committing petty theft, but even then it was typically a 48-hour hold.

I remember him coming in to get counselling as a condition to get his small allowance, which would have been increased if he only he would agree to living in a group home and taking his meds. But he would comply just enough to get his small allowance and then disappear for weeks or months at a time. And OMG! he stunk to high heaven. I can’t begin to describe the extreme BO he had.

He would come into our office to get his “allowance” that his parents provided in hopes that it would be the carrot as opposed to a stick to get him into a more stable and controlled and safe environment. I’d had interactions with him when his social worker walked him to my office to get his allowance. Sometimes he was charming and engaging and obviously highly intelligent, even sometimes showed empathy like the day he saw me with a walking cast on my ankle due to a severe sprain and asked me about it and wanted to know that I was OK and not in too much pain, but at other times - not so much.

Most others in the office including some of the social workers were afraid of him and didn’t want to have anything to do with him nor be anywhere near him because of his stench and unpredictable. 

One day he came in unexpected and knew enough to come to me as he knew I kept the petty cash (and FWIW, my office was outside of the main office and so no one but me knew he was there – not a good security set up in retrospect which was later changed).

He wanted his allowance and when I told him that I couldn’t give it to him unless he saw his social worker first as was the agreement, he freaked out and shouted and then screamed at me and called me the worst names imaginable and threatened to kill me unless I gave him his $20.

But I kept my composure and in my calmest and the most reassuring voice I could muster - what I used to and still, call my “Mister Rogers” voice (which I’ve sometimes found also helpful in dealing with toddlers having a meltdown), I talked him down enough that I could, under the guise of not having the cash in my office, to call for help.

I left that job about a year later and still to this day wonder what ever happened to him. I didn’t see him as a bad or evil person or demon possessed, although sometimes he acted that way, but rather I saw him as being a very sick person.  By the Grace of (fill in your deity here) go I (or you or someone you love).

@Neverdul , thank you so much for sharing. Not only are you cool for liking "South Park" but you are amazing to have the career you did.

I've known a lot of schizophrenics when I was in academia too. Brilliant minds that had to drop out of school in their senior year or graduate school.

Medication is so tricky because you feel better but the side effects are miserable. So when you get stable you go off them. It's a no win. And hospitals for the most part are getting worse, because they are understaffed and they shove in the haldol and prop patients in front ofTV.

That's my experience of working with the hospitals near me anyway.
G-d bless America. G-d bless us all                                 

Adopt a puppy or kitty from your local shelter
Or an older dog or cat. They're true love❤️

Offline Sanguine

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 35,986
  • Gender: Female
  • Ex-member
But I guess you think because of your hatred of all mediations and the psychiatric profession, that you would rather see someone like him living on the streets and sometimes posing real threats to his own wellbeing and to others.

@Neverdul tried to blow me off by marginalizing me as a "Hater".

Consider the frame of reference, the automatic genulflection, the bending of the knee, that's been ingrained into society by this con job.

Then cite me an actual cure.

Psych is not one electron, proton or neutron closer to curing anything than it was in Joseph Mengele's experiments.

Look, we recognize that you have an unreasoning hatred of the medical and mental health professions.  No need to attack member posters here because they don't agree with you.

Offline Neverdul

  • Moderator Gubernatorial and State Races
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,596
  • Gender: Female
@Neverdul

real threats to his own wellbeing and to others.

https://www.madinamerica.com/2014/11/psychiatrists-psychologists-reliable-expert-witnesses/


https://www.amazon.com/Whores-Court-Psychiatric-Testimony-American/dp/0060391979


What? Nothing from the "church" of Scientology?  Never mind. It turns out that the writer and the founder and president of that website, Robert Whitaker - Mad In America, is supported by, funded by, touted by, and promotes Scientology.

Get thee to thy E-meter.  (And shell out all of your life savings and become a slave to that cult)

22222frying pan

https://mentalillnesspolicy.org/myths/mad-in-america.html

https://www.madinamerica.com/2013/07/robert-whitaker-speaks-at-nami-national-convention/
So This Is How Liberty Dies, With Thunderous Applause

Offline Neverdul

  • Moderator Gubernatorial and State Races
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,596
  • Gender: Female
@Neverdul

I think the point is the drugs aren't a cure.  All they do is cover up the symptoms and have severe side effects.  Our mental health system is broken and people are dying because of it.

Sorry if that makes you feel bad but it's not an attack on you.

No one, and certainly not me are saying that drugs can cure schizophrenia, there is no cure. But it has been found to be a brain chemistry disorder that can be hereditary and can be ameliorated and kept at bay by a combination of  pharmaceuticals and behavioral therapy and yes, sometimes as necessary, forced commitment for the safety of the schizophrenic and others in the general public.

Sorry if that makes you "feel" bad.
So This Is How Liberty Dies, With Thunderous Applause

Offline Neverdul

  • Moderator Gubernatorial and State Races
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,596
  • Gender: Female
But I guess you think because of your hatred of all mediations and the psychiatric profession, that you would rather see someone like him living on the streets and sometimes posing real threats to his own wellbeing and to others.

@Neverdul tried to blow me off by marginalizing me as a "Hater".

Consider the frame of reference, the automatic genulflection, the bending of the knee, that's been ingrained into society by this con job.

Then cite me an actual cure.

Psych is not one electron, proton or neutron closer to curing anything than it was in Joseph Mengele's experiments.

@To-Whose-Benefit?

I never said you were a "Hater". Project much?

 22222frying pan
So This Is How Liberty Dies, With Thunderous Applause

Offline austingirl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8,734
  • Gender: Female
  • Cruz 2016- a Constitutional Conservative at last!
The schizophrenics I worked with as an RN in a State Mental Hospital were often disorganized, unable to plan, and incapable of carrying out a plan like Cruz did.
Principles matter. Words matter.

Offline Neverdul

  • Moderator Gubernatorial and State Races
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,596
  • Gender: Female
<>

I already posted it and you can do your own research on Scientology and their crusade against the mental health profession. Mad In America is associated with or has been infiltrated by Scientologists and the Citizens Commission on Human Rights (CCHR) which has ties to Mad In America, is a Scientology associated group.

https://whyweprotest.net/threads/rethinking-psychiatry-accused-of-being-front-groups-for-scientology-front-group-cchr.120564/


https://www.mikerindersblog.org/scientologys-view-on-psychiatry/
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 05:07:20 pm by MOD3 »
So This Is How Liberty Dies, With Thunderous Applause

Offline Neverdul

  • Moderator Gubernatorial and State Races
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,596
  • Gender: Female
@Neverdul

<>

Produce my exact words in any post where I ever called you "Hater". I did note "your hatred of all medications and the psychiatric profession". Is that not true by your very own words and numerous posts here?
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 05:07:46 pm by MOD3 »
So This Is How Liberty Dies, With Thunderous Applause

Offline MOD3

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 613
Reminder:

In order to keep personal insults from continuing to derail this thread and demean this topic, Mods will be departing from normal activities and will be removing any responses that are clearly personal insults. 

This is a serious topic: 17 kids and adults shot dead in a school.  Take the personal insults elsewhere.

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7,613
  • Gender: Male
    • Wulf Anson Author
@Neverdul

You are trying to get this thread locked down because views that contradict your own cannot be tolerated, or for that matter, even viewed.

Take control. Dehumanize, Discredit, and Shut it off.

It's the Psychiatric way.

Take a chemical or 220V to 440V electric pole line transformer to those that annoy you and slug them into silence.

I've already provided copious links to the drugs.

Earlier, another poster claimed that we used to (past tense) use electric shock on patients.

ECT is still very much in business.

http://psych.ucsf.edu/ECT

Have a look at what it is:

https://www.ect.org/resources/machines.html

Next I suppose you'll tell me that these people are also Scientologists:

http://www.mindfreedom.org/

Here's more on ECT:

http://www.mindfreedom.org/search?SearchableText=ECT

The benefits? of ECT cannot be scientifically justified.

http://www.mindfreedom.org/kb/mental-health-abuse/electroshock/ect-review-2010-read-bentall.pdf/view
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7,613
  • Gender: Male
    • Wulf Anson Author
@MOD3

I will be only too happy to keep it above the level of personal insults.

My previous reply was being composed Before I read your reminder.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline Neverdul

  • Moderator Gubernatorial and State Races
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,596
  • Gender: Female
@Neverdul

You are trying to get this thread locked down because views that contradict your own cannot be tolerated, or for that matter, even viewed.

I did no such thing. I didn't report nor did request that the thread be locked down or to have your posts be removed. The Mods did that on their own.
So This Is How Liberty Dies, With Thunderous Applause

Offline Mod1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,654
 Very many opinions on psychotherapy, drugs, ECT and the like have been expressed, even if they had nothing to do with this shooting. Please stay on topic in future.

Online Cyber Liberty

  • Coffee! Donuts! Kittens!
  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 80,223
  • Gender: Male
  • 🌵🌵🌵
I find it interesting they changed the acronym from EST to ECT.  I had to go to TWB's cites to find that out.  So now they proudly declare these are induced convulsions?  (I basically skimmed, so I may have misread something.)
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed:

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7,613
  • Gender: Male
    • Wulf Anson Author
I did no such thing. I didn't report nor did request that the thread be locked down or to have your posts be removed. The Mods did that on their own.

I asked you for proof that Robert Whitaker is a shill for Scientology.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline Mod1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,654
I asked you for proof that Robert Whitaker is a shill for Scientology.
Like I said ... let's get this thread back on its original subject.

Offline MOD8

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 376
@Neverdul
@To-Whose-Benefit?

Please drop this argument now.  This is not to be a thread about Scientology or adherents thereof.

Offline MOD3

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 613
@MOD3

I will be only too happy to keep it above the level of personal insults.

My previous reply was being composed Before I read your reminder.

Why should we have to remind anyone to avoid personal insults?  Ever?

Online bigheadfred

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,605
  • Gender: Male
  • One day Closer
I don't know if this is related to the topic, but there is a kid that lives down the block, maybe 12 now. He has to have constant adult supervision at school now. They have assigned a person to be with this kid every minute he is at school. To keep him from bullying other kids.

God forbid the little bastard ever has access to firearms.
She asked me name my foe then. I said the need within some men to fight and kill their brothers without thought of Love or God. Ken Hensley

Online Cyber Liberty

  • Coffee! Donuts! Kittens!
  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 80,223
  • Gender: Male
  • 🌵🌵🌵
I don't know if this is related to the topic, but there is a kid that lives down the block, maybe 12 now. He has to have constant adult supervision at school now. They have assigned a person to be with this kid every minute he is at school. To keep him from bullying other kids.

God forbid the little bastard ever has access to firearms.

Very much on topic.  Wonder what kind of parents he has?
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed:

Online bigheadfred

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,605
  • Gender: Male
  • One day Closer
Very much on topic.  Wonder what kind of parents he has?

We think his dad is the local "El Chapo". Never seen either parent leave for the day like they have jobs. But they got a brand new black Camaro last year.

There is a schizo kid that lives down the block. Police were called because he was sporting what appeared to be an assault type rifle a couple of weeks ago. They were Johnny on the spot and disarmed him. But not before he had shot out  the back window of his dad's H2. It was "merely" a pellet gun. He was here a little while ago. Knocking on the door. He makes his rounds trying to bum smokes. Every house up and down the street. Every day. 3 or 8 times a day. We have a note on the door asking not to ask for smokes, but he ignores it.
She asked me name my foe then. I said the need within some men to fight and kill their brothers without thought of Love or God. Ken Hensley

Offline truth_seeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28,386
  • Gender: Male
  • Common Sense Results Oriented Conservative Veteran
When in doubt, do not risk the lives and safety of the many, to coddle the unfortunate mentally ill person.

e.g. STOP MAINSTREAMING.
"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline LauraTXNM

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,661
  • Well-behaved women seldom make history.
Schizophrenia typically manifests itself at around that age - late teens to early 20's. And it is a horrendous disease that affects the wealthy and the poor and everyone in between.

For several years I worked as a finance manager of a private social work agency. They provided private case management and psychotherapy and ran a group home for schizophrenics among other services like providing hospitals and school systems with social workers (licensed MSW’s) on either a temporary or long term basis.

One of our “clients” was a 40 something year old man who had firsts been diagnosed with schizophrenia in his early 20’s. From what I understood and knew about him, early on in his life, he was very normal and actually exceptionally bright, a promising mathematician and on track to become an aerospace engineer and his parents, who seemed to be good and deeply religious (Jewish) people, and were quite wealthy and loved him dearly.

But his schizophrenia really started manifesting while he was in grad school and his parents had him committed to a private and well known psychiatric hospital several times, but since he had by then reached adulthood, they couldn’t keep him there against his will unless he was posing a real and credible threat to himself or others. As long as he was on his meds and getting counseling and psychiatric care, he was OK, no - not quite normal, but not stark raving mad.

But as his schizophrenia and its delusions and paranoia got worse and worse, he became increasingly non-compliant and preferred living on the streets and homeless and his parents couldn’t do anything about it until he was arrested for threating people or committing petty theft, but even then it was typically a 48-hour hold.

I remember him coming in to get counselling as a condition to get his small allowance, which would have been increased if he only he would agree to living in a group home and taking his meds. But he would comply just enough to get his small allowance and then disappear for weeks or months at a time. And OMG! he stunk to high heaven. I can’t begin to describe the extreme BO he had.

He would come into our office to get his “allowance” that his parents provided in hopes that it would be the carrot as opposed to a stick to get him into a more stable and controlled and safe environment. I’d had interactions with him when his social worker walked him to my office to get his allowance. Sometimes he was charming and engaging and obviously highly intelligent, even sometimes showed empathy like the day he saw me with a walking cast on my ankle due to a severe sprain and asked me about it and wanted to know that I was OK and not in too much pain, but at other times - not so much.

Most others in the office including some of the social workers were afraid of him and didn’t want to have anything to do with him nor be anywhere near him because of his stench and unpredictable. 

One day he came in unexpected and knew enough to come to me as he knew I kept the petty cash (and FWIW, my office was outside of the main office and so no one but me knew he was there – not a good security set up in retrospect which was later changed).

He wanted his allowance and when I told him that I couldn’t give it to him unless he saw his social worker first as was the agreement, he freaked out and shouted and then screamed at me and called me the worst names imaginable and threatened to kill me unless I gave him his $20.

But I kept my composure and in my calmest and the most reassuring voice I could muster - what I used to and still, call my “Mister Rogers” voice (which I’ve sometimes found also helpful in dealing with toddlers having a meltdown), I talked him down enough that I could, under the guise of not having the cash in my office, to call for help.

I left that job about a year later and still to this day wonder what ever happened to him. I didn’t see him as a bad or evil person or demon possessed, although sometimes he acted that way, but rather I saw him as being a very sick person.  By the Grace of (fill in your deity here) go I (or you or someone you love).

Such a sad story, and I believe there are more people with these kind of problems than we realize.  Individual vs. societal rights is a huge and intractable conflict here; I have a college friend who is a disability advocate who fights against forced medication. 

Much like the police and law enforcement agencies who have a scattershot approach, the mental health system in this country is piecemeal and uncoordinated.  And the two need to work together more closely and better.
Micah 6:8  "...what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?"

Disclaimer: I am a liberal, progressive, feminist, here because I like talking to you all.  We're all this together.

Offline LauraTXNM

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,661
  • Well-behaved women seldom make history.
@Neverdul

I think the point is the drugs aren't a cure.  All they do is cover up the symptoms and have severe side effects.  Our mental health system is broken and people are dying because of it.

Sorry if that makes you feel bad but it's not an attack on you.

For diseases like both schizophrenia and diabetes, there are no cures, only medications that treat the symptoms.  But treating the symptoms is necessary until a cure can be found.
Micah 6:8  "...what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?"

Disclaimer: I am a liberal, progressive, feminist, here because I like talking to you all.  We're all this together.

Offline LauraTXNM

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,661
  • Well-behaved women seldom make history.

We have criminal laws.

When and if 'He' violates them, arrest him.

As for his own 'wellbeing' sending the State in to force him to do what the State considers in his best interest, is a very progressive POV.

Take a Bow.

The shooter in FL has now violated the law and been arrested.  The system worked.  (Adding a /sarc tag, just to be sure.)
« Last Edit: February 17, 2018, 07:32:08 pm by LauraTXNM »
Micah 6:8  "...what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?"

Disclaimer: I am a liberal, progressive, feminist, here because I like talking to you all.  We're all this together.