Las Vegas: Active shooter reported near Mandalay Bay

[driftdiver]

Paddock did not go those routes but if one wants to make an equivalent between trying to knife as many people in a crowd of 22,000 vs. a sniper's nest, fine.

@TomSea

The nice France attack killed more with a truck. 

If someone wants to do bad stuff like this guy did they will go d a way.  All your focus on controlling people won't matter.

It would also guarantee Trump loses the second and have about 50m people pushing for impeachment.  Tell your minders to try some new talking points.

[thackney]

Do gun-rights advocates think one should be able to buy 33 weapons of this caliber in one year?

@TomSea

These are your words.  How do you keep track of individual's purchases over a year without some type of registry?  And how is it useful if it does not include private sales as well as those from a dealer?

[driftdiver]

And right next to shoulder-fired missiles. Those are arms too.

@TomSea

It's almost like you have a set of talking points.   Shocking

[Sanguine]

@TomSea

The nice France attack killed more with a truck. 

If someone wants to do bad stuff like this guy did they will go d a way.  All your focus on controlling people won't matter.

It would also guarantee Trump loses the second and have about 50m people pushing for impeachment.  Tell your minders to try some new talking points.

I don't think that's fair, @driftdiver.  I don't think Tom has minders, I think he actually believes this stuff.  Gun control can be an emotionally appealing argument after these horrible events, if one doesn't understand the Constitution and all that that entails. 

[driftdiver]

@TomSea

These are your words.  How do you keep track of individual's purchases over a year without some type of registry?  And how is it useful if it does not include private sales as well as those from a dealer?

Not to mention registries are always used for confiscation.

[Cyber Liberty]

@TomSea

It's almost like you have a set of talking points.   Shocking

I'm surprised he didn't mention Tactical Nukes.   

(For the record, I have no problem with shoulder-fired RPGs, but I understand I'm more permissive than many.)

[Sanguine]

Not to mention registries are always used for confiscation.

Yes, I should have included "history" and "human nature" in my last comment.

[roamer_1]

3 high powered weapons a month for a year. Sorry, no sale on this argument.

If I had the money, that sounds like something I would do...
Not that I would do so through a dealer though. I don't like paper. And it's a phone call or two to buy a case of guns right off the street.

Your papered route means nothing. Nothing at all. The trade in guns off the books can't even be reckoned. It makes me laugh that you think you can control how many guns I buy per day/week/month by controlling the retail counter.
 

[driftdiver]

I don't think that's fair, @driftdiver.  I don't think Tom has minders, I think he actually believes this stuff.  Gun control can be an emotionally appealing argument after these horrible events, if one doesn't understand the Constitution and all that that entails.

@Sanguine

Gun controll is about people controll.  They are ok with the govt having guns.  Just not law abiding citizens.   They will also remove the right of self defense.

Oh and it's completely fair.

[TomSea]

Mexico cartels go bargain gun shopping in Houston
Chris Baltimore6 Min Read

HOUSTON (Reuters) - Mexican drug gangs looking for weapons powerful enough to stop a vehicle, penetrate a bullet-resistant vest or confront an army detachment need look no further than the Houston area’s 1,500 gun shops, where merchandise is priced to move.

Continued at: http://www.reuters.com/article/us-crime-guns-texas/mexico-cartels-go-bargain-gun-shopping-in-houston-idUSTRE54S04A20090529

The laws are there, fine with me if they stop someone from buying 100 $1,550 rifles at a time. It should be seen, this likewise, is the logic of some arguing no laws should exist.

Guns bought in Houston through ‘straw purchases’ have been traced to dozens of murders in Mexico. One or two are purchased at a time, making them harder to track because of the sheer number of seemingly legitimate buyers who only buy a few guns from any given store.

Just in the state of Nevada and not counting any other states, I think the 33 guns bought should have been seen as suspicious. They aren't that highly of a populated state.

[edpc]

The laws are there, fine with me if they stop someone from buying 100 $1,550 rifles at a time. It should be seen, this likewise, is the logic of some arguing no laws should exist.
Just in the state of Nevada and not counting any other states, I think the 33 guns bought should have been seen as suspicious. They aren't that highly of a populated state.

You should be having this conversation about Mexican gang purchases with Obama and Holder.

[thackney]

The laws are there, fine with me if they stop someone from buying 100 $1,550 rifles at a time. It should be seen, this likewise, is the logic of some arguing no laws should exist.
Just in the state of Nevada and not counting any other states, I think the 33 guns bought should have been seen as suspicious. They aren't that highly of a populated state.

Tell me the law you believe would have prevented Paddock from killing a lot of people.  Unless you can explain that, there isn't a reason for another gun law.

[TomSea]

Anyway, if people are talking about "gun rooms" now, I know 10 people with one, we are starting to talk about more what sounds like what are collections not mere "bearing arms."

Anyway, it would have been fine if this fellow had been popped and buying 3 high powered rifles a month in a state like Nevada should have been a tip off.

[txradioguy]

Tell me the law you believe would have prevented Paddock from killing a lot of people.  Unless you can explain that, there isn't a reason for another gun law.

[txradioguy]

Anyway, if people are talking about "gun rooms" now, I know 10 people with one, we are starting to talk about more what sounds like what are collections not mere "bearing arms."

Anyway, it would have been fine if this fellow had been popped and buying 3 high powered rifles a month in a state like Nevada should have been a tip off.

What part of "shall not infringe" confuses you.

The U.S. has 16,000 laws from the city to the federal level on the regulation of firearms.

What would have one more law prevented? 

[Smokin Joe]

They watch all those gun shops on the border, that's why they have some laws on suspicious transactions. Not sure what this is about and we are hardly talking about $250 Soviet era surplus but high powered weaponry, preferred weapons; probably like what this fellow Paddock was often buying.

Oh, those were only $250 when the market was flooded with them (these things happen in waves). That $99 SKS is triple that or better now, and the AK is a $500 gun, easy if it's in good shape--especially the Soviet or East German ones. Which is my point. Popular arms will go up in value, so as an investment it pays to get in while they are cheap. Even if you are just trading for that one you missed out on when, in time the trading value of the firearm will go up as the market price does.

As far as East bloc weapons go, don't be a snob. A Dragunov will still hit nicely with a round that is cheap, readily available and the equivalent of the .30-06. At one time they were a fair bit cheaper ($700) than they are now ($3-5K). The AK-74 shoots a round ballistically similar to the .5.56, and maybe even a smidgin better. Either is in the same weight class as the average AR, be that AR-15 or AR-10 (once $500 or less, now up to three times that, if you can find one). The action may have a little slop in it, but that's actually a feature that allows the owner/user to get away with some slack maintenance when things are busy and still have a functioning rifle. At one time these were all quite a bit cheaper than they are now.

Now, whatever you invest in, I think the goal is to buy low, sell high.

Imagine if someone put a limit on how many shares of stock you could buy (aren't those used to launder money?) Or bars of gold or silver or Hummel figurines or tulip bulbs or beanie babies or whatever turns your crank. If you are a collector, too, suddenly that one every thirty days limit gets pretty nasty, and the opportunity to buy two and keep one that the other one pays for later goes out the window.

How about ammo? Even the (once) $5.00 a brick (500 rounds) of .22 Ammo was selling for $75 to $100 for a while. Would you limit ammo purchases, too?

How about magazines? When the big Assault Weapons Ban was on I gave a couple of pre-ban 25 round magazines for a popular .22 rifle to each of my boss' older sons for Christmas. I hadn't paid much for them (about $20 each) but the current market value for a pre-ban 25 round magazine for that popular .22 rifle had gone through the roof (worth about $100 each when I gave them to them). LOL! They thought I was awesome and even my boss was impressed. I had bought a dozen of them when they were much cheaper. 

As in all markets, timing is everything. If you are hobbled by regulation, there is not much of a free market, is there?

[Smokin Joe]

The laws are there, fine with me if they stop someone from buying 100 $1,550 rifles at a time. It should be seen, this likewise, is the logic of some arguing no laws should exist.
Just in the state of Nevada and not counting any other states, I think the 33 guns bought should have been seen as suspicious. They aren't that highly of a populated state.

Funny thing, but the reason there isn't that much population in Nevada is that the Federal Government owns over 90% of the State.

If you want states with low populations look at places like North Dakota, Wyoming, and Montana, which still have low crime and very unobtrusive gun laws, with the exception of the ones the Feds impose. They sell gun safes in every hardware, and farm and ranch store--oh, and the gun dealers sell them, too. The only thing that stops people from buying enough guns to fill one or two every year is the expense.

[txradioguy]

Funny thing, but the reason there isn't that much population in Nevada is that the Federal Government owns over 90% of the State.

If you want states with low populations look at places like North Dakota, Wyoming, and Montana, which still have low crime and very unobtrusive gun laws, with the exception of the ones the Feds impose. They sell gun safes in every hardware, and farm and ranch store--oh, and the gun dealers sell them, too. The only thing that stops people from buying enough guns to fill one or two every year is the expense.

I've got six guns in a house with three people in it.  Why?  Because I can and because owning and shooting guns has become a hobby with my wife and I.

The only thing limiting us from having more right now is cost and not enough time to shoot the ones we have.

At the end of the day that's a couple of only of a handful factors that should limit a person's ownership of guns.

[driftdiver]

Anyway, if people are talking about "gun rooms" now, I know 10 people with one, we are starting to talk about more what sounds like what are collections not mere "bearing arms."

Anyway, it would have been fine if this fellow had been popped and buying 3 high powered rifles a month in a state like Nevada should have been a tip off.

How many pens should be people allowed to buy?   

[TomSea]

Nevada is on the list of more dangerous states by gun laws.

I just think the purchases of AK-47s and the like should be a tip off, especially if one is buying a lot of them.

Chicago always gets criticized, isn't it interesting though, as a state, Illinois rate is actually pretty low for gun violence, I believe this graph is from cerca 2014.

[driftdiver]

Funny thing, but the reason there isn't that much population in Nevada is that the Federal Government owns over 90% of the State.

If you want states with low populations look at places like North Dakota, Wyoming, and Montana, which still have low crime and very unobtrusive gun laws, with the exception of the ones the Feds impose. They sell gun safes in every hardware, and farm and ranch store--oh, and the gun dealers sell them, too. The only thing that stops people from buying enough guns to fill one or two every year is the expense.

Funny how having a gun safe is now bad.

[driftdiver]

Nevada is on the list of more dangerous states by gun laws.

I just think the purchases of AK-47s and the like should be a tip off, especially if one is buying a lot of them.

Chicago always gets criticized, isn't it interesting though, as a state, Illinois rate is actually pretty low for gun violence, I believe this graph is from cerca 2014.

If Trump wants to be impeached he should go with your gun law ideas.    A few million gun owners would be all over it.

[txradioguy]

Great now we have so called "conservatives" using graphics from Rolling Stone as a "credible" source.

[txradioguy]

 

How can some one be pro life and anti-2nd Amendment at the same time?

 

[roamer_1]

Anyway, if people are talking about "gun rooms" now, I know 10 people with one, we are starting to talk about more what sounds like what are collections not mere "bearing arms."

You are obviously not a hunter. If one hunts, there is a wide array of guns necessary for the task.
Deer are usually found in the bottoms, in brushy country - A terrain dependent weapon might be anything from a shotgun to a carbine, to a 308 or 30.06 . All are required in possession.

But none of those are necessarily good for mtn goat or sheep, which are usually a long shot, or likewise antelope. Those guns are more game specific. A 300win would not be a good choice for antelope, but good for a sheep or a long shot on an elk. Antelope are usually a long shot, but you'll want a little caliber, because the critter is smallish, and a big bullet will wreck the meat if you happen upon a short shot.

Elk, moose, and bear, you'll want a whole lot of knock down power - but again, that depends upon terrain. A big bore carbine for brush or deep woods, or a big bore with a scope for open area.

Right there is an array of 5-10 'high powered' rifles, depending upon your financial ability, and I really haven't addressed shotguns and differences in ducks, geese and upland bird hunting. Nor have I addressed hand guns and protection either. Shoot, my pickup has at least a carbine and two pistols that live there...

Add to that memorabilia guns - that one your daddy bought you that killed your first deer, which you'll never part with... that old .22 you went plinking gophers with when you were but a lad... Your dad's collection which you inherited when he died and will pass down to your boys...

It's dang easy to get a bunch of guns hanging round. Most guys I know would have more if they could afford to.

Anyway, it would have been fine if this fellow had been popped and buying 3 high powered rifles a month in a state like Nevada should have been a tip off.

It would not be uncommon, back in my day, for me to walk away from a gun show with three to five purchases, probably a mix of handguns and rifles. For me to buy three 'high powered' rifles in a day is not even worth mention.

As @Smokin Joe made mention, guns hold value remarkably, and work very well as trade stock. Would those guns I bought hit my private collection? Maybe, but probably not. Most of them went away as trade.

I still have a matched pair of nickel 9's in shoulder holsters that I traded into... That are just to pretty to part with... I tell myself they are for when I get dressed up... They'd be classy with a suit...

But I don't own a suit, and little pop guns like those ain't good for much else.