House to vote Thursday on ObamaCare repeal...[updated...House Passes]

[Emjay]

Right_in_Virginia wrote:
"Now the Senate gets its say ... I'm happy the bill is on the move!"

As am I.

Remember back only a few weeks ago -- folks can remember back that far, I suppose?
Remember how the first iteration of obamacare repeal failed, and how folks in here wailed, that that was the end? That Congress would do no more?

Where are they now?
Why of course they're STILL HERE, and STILL WAILING.

Pay no mind to them (I don't).
They won't change, they'll never come around (until the democrat/communists win again, perhaps then they'll be smiling).

What passed the House today is -a start-, and now the effort begins to get it through the senate. Hopefully, without too much changed.

If this can get passed by Congress, and signed by Mr. Trump, then it becomes time to "chip away further" at the obamacare edifice.

The left has understood for decades that they can't get all they want at once. So they move incrementally, bit by bit, a little at a time towards building their colossus. This is why they win. Two steps forward, one back, but they keep pushing, always pushing.

We can't tear down that colossus at once. Like them we must gird our loins (to use a repetitive term from Joseph Smith's writings) and keep struggling as well.

It's often said here that once enacted, an entitlement is here to stay. Today the Congress took the first steps to dismantling an "enacted entitlement". That they got even this far is somewhat astonishing. Rather than condemn them for not "repealing the whole thing", we should be encouraging them onward.

A hat tip to the forum members who have supported such notions with many more postings, better than any I could write.

And to the Trump haters here, who scowl at anything the guy tries to do, well... I fart in your general direction!

Thanks, Fishrrman.  Good post .  I also wonder how much Trump hatred has to do with the general dislike of the bill. 

I know Corbe (and others) are sincere but they are Trump haters.

[Emjay]

We have control of the governmental branches, and conservatives are trying to convince themselves that this double decker crap sandwich is better than the triple decker crap sandwich...that it's all we can hope for.

No.  No, it isn't.  It's not nearly good enough. 

I sincerely marvel at the endless capacity of people on our side to absorb insults, lies, etc. from the scam artists who take their votes, and still come crawling back for more.  This is why they can lie openly to us without any intention of keeping their promises.

Once again, it's the old, oh, let's kick the can down the road, this is just the beginning, it's going to get done later delusion.  That's a fool's dream.

You know better than that.  The legislative process is cumbersome and we have far too many Republicans who are moderate.

The majority of the country wants Obamacare out and I have hope that we will eventually do just that.  But not if we reject every attempt made in that direction as not good enough.

The alternative to kicking the can down the road is leaving the can right in our path and continuing Obamacare totally unchanged.

[txradioguy]

You know better than that.  The legislative process is cumbersome and we have far too many Republicans who are moderate.

The majority of the country wants Obamacare out and I have hope that we will eventually do just that.  But not if we reject every attempt made in that direction as not good enough.

The alternative to kicking the can down the road is leaving the can right in our path and continuing Obamacare totally unchanged.

Excuses... you know what they are like right??

[Emjay]

Excuses... you know what they are like right??

How would I know?  I never have to make excuses.

[txradioguy]

How would I know?  I never have to make excuses.

Yeah sure. 

You just spent several hundred words making excuses for this Obamacare lite debacle that the House passed...barely...this afternoon.

[corbe]

Thanks, Fishrrman.  Good post .  I also wonder how much Trump hatred has to do with the general dislike of the bill. 

I know Corbe (and others) are sincere but they are Trump haters.

   Again with the Trump hater stuff, @Emjay I do appreciate the back handed comment about sincerity though but if you really think I hate the Man it makes me a hypocrite also because I have stated many times in this Forum that granted I don't love, or even like him very much at all and I have congratulated him for the few 'good' things he's done so far but I think your somehow confusing that with hate, an emotion that would only indicate he has that kinda power over me, which he does not.
   I will forever reserve the right to criticize in a hopefully, constructive, informative and sometimes entertaining way. 

 

[Emjay]

Yeah sure. 

You just spent several hundred words making excuses for this Obamacare lite debacle that the House passed...barely...this afternoon.

Actually, I have a few more words.  I have not spent any making excuses for the bill so I have those left.

I have expressed my opinion that we needed to pass a bill.  I really believe that.  This bill was good enough to get support from some people I respect.  It has some things.  It lacks some things.  It may lack more than it has but it HAS something.

Your way ...if you've actually figured it out ... we would have nothing.

[Emjay]

   Again with the Trump hater stuff, @Emjay I do appreciate the back handed comment about sincerity though but if you really think I hate the Man it makes me a hypocrite also because I have stated many times in this Forum that granted I don't love, or even like him very much at all and I have congratulated him for the few 'good' things he's done so far but I think your somehow confusing that with hate, an emotion that would only indicate he has that kinda power over me, which he does not.
   I will forever reserve the right to criticize in a hopefully, constructive, informative and sometimes entertaining way. 

 

Sorry. I should not have included your name in that post.  Sometimes I can be a little thoughtless.

[XenaLee]

This bill is a start. No more. But make no mistake, it IS step one in a PROCESS of repeal and replace.  It is madness to see this as anything other than tremendous progress towards the goal of pulling government back from its attempted takeover of the entire health care system.

Looks like a start in the wrong direction to me.  The GOP now have their grubby fingerprints all over the ObamaCare disaster that it is.  They will now get the blame.  ALL of the blame, of course.

The GOP promised full repeal of ObamaCare.  Not an edit.  Not a patch.  Not an amendment and not a targeted surgery.  Full friggin repeal.   It's clear and obvious that they lied and never intended to fulfill that promise.  Once again, we've been had.

I'm now officially on a hunger strike indefinitely.   These crap sandwiches are making me fat (and sick).

[corbe]

Sorry. I should not have included your name in that post.  Sometimes I can be a little thoughtless.

   No apologies necessary, @Emjay us girls gotta stick together :wink:

[corbe]

   The Great One's take:

Health care bill is a ‘ITSY BITSY little step in the right direction’ – Mark Levin

    May. 4, 2017 7:44 pm by SooperMexican •

The Great One had a really interesting video on the health care bill they just passed in the House of Representatives.

ROLL THE TAPE MISTER PRODUCER:

http://therightscoop.com/heath-care-bill-is-a-itsy-bitsy-little-step-in-the-right-direction-mark-levin/

[DCPatriot]

   Again with the Trump hater stuff, @Emjay I do appreciate the back handed comment about sincerity though but if you really think I hate the Man it makes me a hypocrite also because I have stated many times in this Forum that granted I don't love, or even like him very much at all and I have congratulated him for the few 'good' things he's done so far but I think your somehow confusing that with hate, an emotion that would only indicate he has that kinda power over me, which he does not.
   I will forever reserve the right to criticize in a hopefully, constructive, informative and sometimes entertaining way. 

 

Oh, please.   Stop the bullshit with the semantics.

You do NOT like him.   You DISLIKE HIM.   Very, very, very much.

ERGO....you hate him.

Just because you claim you acknowledge any good he's accomplished so far...doesn't mean anything.

You wouldn't boo or wish failure on a player traded to your favorite team....but here you are.

[Silver Pines]

   Again with the Trump hater stuff, @Emjay I do appreciate the back handed comment about sincerity though but if you really think I hate the Man it makes me a hypocrite also because I have stated many times in this Forum that granted I don't love, or even like him very much at all and I have congratulated him for the few 'good' things he's done so far but I think your somehow confusing that with hate, an emotion that would only indicate he has that kinda power over me, which he does not.
   I will forever reserve the right to criticize in a hopefully, constructive, informative and sometimes entertaining way. 

 

@corbe

I'm trying to figure out what's wrong with disliking Trump or any other politician.  The simple answer is---nothing.  The people of this country are under no obligation to like any public servant.  It's silly to try and guilt posters over it. 

Don't worry about whether I "like" Trump or anyone else.  Worry about what he's doing, or failing to do, for the nation.

[jmyrlefuller]

What more do people want? Seriously?

Look, what is it that we hate about Obamacare? And before you knee-jerk respond "all of it," I mean it. Think good and hard about what, specifically, is wrong with this law. Then consider what this bill does to remedy those things.

The individual mandate of course is first and foremost. Yes, this bill gets rid of that. The federal government will not coerce you to buy a business's product under this act. (The SCOTUS precedent that allowed this, alas, will ensure that we are no longer safe from future attempts, but that's something Congress cannot fix.)

Employer mandates—as I understand it, and I admit I might be wrong on this because I don't know for sure, this bill gets rid of that. No more 29-hour work weeks just to avoid these mandates.

Once those mandates are out of the way, and customers are no longer required to buy particular insurance to cover a mandate, the rest falls into place. What is stopping an insurance company from offering lower-priced products without the bells and whistles required under the ACA? What is stopping a customer, who is no longer required to buy coverage with specific bullet-lists to cover a mandate, from buying it if he or she so chooses?

Plus, while we didn't get everything with the pre-existing conditions, we did make progress to soften the blow. This bill is not by any means a double-decker crap sandwich; far from it. With this bill, we make significant progress toward fixing the health insurance system that Obamacare mangled up. The problem is, it was already broken before, and going back to that without addressing the problems that led to Obamacare in the first place is not going to make anyone happy.

I'll take this.

[Emjay]

Looks like a start in the wrong direction to me.  The GOP now have their grubby fingerprints all over the ObamaCare disaster that it is.  They will now get the blame.  ALL of the blame, of course.

The GOP promised full repeal of ObamaCare.  Not an edit.  Not a patch.  Not an amendment and not a targeted surgery.  Full friggin repeal.   It's clear and obvious that they lied and never intended to fulfill that promise.  Once again, we've been had.

I'm now officially on a hunger strike indefinitely.   These crap sandwiches are making me fat (and sick).

Well, Xena, we elected those congress people and bitterness right now is not the solution.

In fact, most of the people venting against this bill have no idea of a solution.  I mean a real solution.  This bill is not perfect and it BARELY passed.

If we wait for a perfect bill, what are we actually waiting For?  For the congress critters to have a epiphany and become more conservative?

For us to elect more conservatives next election and wait for them to do something?

There is no satisfactory solution right now and I am willing to swallow the bill and hope for improvements. 

So, rant on, everyone.  It's fun.
[/quote]

[EasyAce]

@corbe

I'm trying to figure out what's wrong with disliking Trump or any other politician.  The simple answer is---nothing.  The people of this country are under no obligation to like any public servant.  It's silly to try and guilt posters over it. 

@CatherineofAragon
I consider politicians to be members of the nation's largest organised crime family.

As of right now, I refuse:

a) to vote for any man or woman to Congress who does not run on the single plank of proposing one and only
one piece of legislation to read, A bill to reject as illegal, unbunding, and unenforceable any legislation passed
by any Congress or signed by any President without tangible proof that every member of Congress and the
President has read it in its entirety at least once;

b) to vote for any man or woman who didn't have to be dragged kicking and screaming into running for office
in the first place.

[Emjay]

What more do people want? Seriously?

Look, what is it that we hate about Obamacare? And before you knee-jerk respond "all of it," I mean it. Think good and hard about what, specifically, is wrong with this law. Then consider what this bill does to remedy those things.

The individual mandate of course is first and foremost. Yes, this bill gets rid of that. The federal government will not coerce you to buy a business's product under this act. (The SCOTUS precedent that allowed this, alas, will ensure that we are no longer safe from future attempts, but that's something Congress cannot fix.)

Employer mandates—as I understand it, and I admit I might be wrong on this because I don't know for sure, this bill gets rid of that. No more 29-hour work weeks just to avoid these mandates.

Once those mandates are out of the way, and customers are no longer required to buy particular insurance to cover a mandate, the rest falls into place. What is stopping an insurance company from offering lower-priced products without the bells and whistles required under the ACA? What is stopping a customer, who is no longer required to buy coverage with specific bullet-lists to cover a mandate, from buying it if he or she so chooses?

Plus, while we didn't get everything with the pre-existing conditions, we did make progress to soften the blow. This bill is not by any means a double-decker crap sandwich; far from it. With this bill, we make significant progress toward fixing the health insurance system that Obamacare mangled up. The problem is, it was already broken before, and going back to that without addressing the problems that led to Obamacare in the first place is not going to make anyone happy.

I'll take this.

Woo hoo, Jim.  You said it all and said it better.  The bill does get rid of those two things that were most onerous to the people of the country.

It is refreshing to see a post by someone who has actually considered the pros and cons of the bill and who recognizes the pros as dang good.

[Bigun]

Oh, please.   Stop the bullshit with the semantics.

You do NOT like him.   You DISLIKE HIM.   Very, very, very much.

ERGO....you hate him.

Just because you claim you acknowledge any good he's accomplished so far...doesn't mean anything.

You wouldn't boo or wish failure on a player traded to your favorite team....but here you are.

So in your world anyone who's heart doesn't race at the meer mention of the name Trump hates him?  I don't think so!

[corbe]

Oh, please.   Stop the bullshit with the semantics.

You do NOT like him.   You DISLIKE HIM.   Very, very, very much.

ERGO....you hate him.

Just because you claim you acknowledge any good he's accomplished so far...doesn't mean anything.

You wouldn't boo or wish failure on a player traded to your favorite team....but here you are.

   He's not on my Team, @DCPatriot he's on yours and I have a good analogy for you since you brought up the Sports thing, I have never liked Tony Parker (point guard/Spurs) I've been kicked off the floor of the AT&T center mid game for calling him what he is, 'a flopper', that aside, he went down with what appears is a career ending injury last night playing my Rockets and at a young age of 34. The other forum I hang in was ecstatic about this and I admonished them also for their misguided compassion for, get ready, another platitude, the human spirit, needless to say I'm not very welcome there either, Life does go on.

[Silver Pines]

@CatherineofAragon
I consider politicians to be members of the nation's largest organised crime family.

As of right now, I refuse:

a) to vote for any man or woman to Congress who does not run on the single plank of proposing one and only
one piece of legislation to read, A bill to reject as illegal, unbunding, and unenforceable any legislation passed
by any Congress or signed by any President without tangible proof that every member of Congress and the
President has read it in its entirety at least once;

b) to vote for any man or woman who didn't have to be dragged kicking and screaming into running for office
in the first place.

@EasyAce

I share your opinion of them.  They're up there celebrating and drinking beer tonight.  Celebrating what?  Lying to all of us?  Giving us their own version of Obamacare?

[Silver Pines]

I just watched a clip of Trump saying that Australia has better healthcare than the U.S.

Australia has universal healthcare.

[Emjay]

Woo hoo, Jim.  You said it all and said it better.  The bill does get rid of those two things that were most onerous to the people of the country.

It is refreshing to see a post by someone who has actually considered the pros and cons of the bill and who recognizes the pros as dang good.

Well, hate and basketball aside, I want to go back to Jim's post.

You know those mandates punishing ... punishing... US citizens if they didn't buy something Obama was selling was the closest thing to tyranny we've gotten in a long time.  I hope we never get that close again.

The same is true for the companies and that not only hurt them, it hurt their employees.  These companies were not mean and they would have preferred to work their employees a regular 40 hour week but Obama didn't want them to.

Now, getting rid of those two things is just plain wonderful.

[XenaLee]

Well, Xena, we elected those congress people and bitterness right now is not the solution.

Speak for yourself.  I only voted for conservatives.  And this isn't bitterness on my part.  I'm pissed.  Big difference.

In fact, most of the people venting against this bill have no idea of a solution.  I mean a real solution.  This bill is not perfect and it BARELY passed.

The solution that was promised, more than once, is full repeal.  Period.  They lied.

If we wait for a perfect bill, what are we actually waiting For?  For the congress critters to have a epiphany and become more conservative?

Why should we have to wait?  We gave them majorities in Congress and control of the Executive Branch.  For fux sake, what more do they need?  Yet another excuse to NOT fulfill the promise they ran on in the last two elections?

For us to elect more conservatives next election and wait for them to do something?

If more conservatives had been elected, vs. the rathole "moderates" (RINOs), we wouldn't be having this issue.

There is no satisfactory solution right now and I am willing to swallow the bill and hope for improvements. 

Sure there is.  Full repeal..... like they promised.  By all means.... swallow away.  That is your choice, not mine.  I'm done with their crap.

So, rant on, everyone.  It's fun.

No, it's not only not fun.... it's not funny.  And I'm FTFU with their lies.

[Bigun]

   He's not on my Team, @DCPatriot he's on yours and I have a good analogy for you since you brought up the Sports thing, I have never liked Tony Parker (point guard/Spurs) I've been kicked off the floor of the AT&T center mid game for calling him what he is, 'a flopper', that aside, he went down with what appears is a career ending injury last night playing my Rockets and at a young age of 34. The other forum I hang in was ecstatic about this and I admonished them also for their misguided compassion for, get ready, another platitude, the human spirit, needless to say I'm not very welcome there either, Life does go on.

You're fine here as far as I'm concerned.   But I do have a problem with those who demand us being 100% loyal to any political figure just because they are. 

I happen to be  in the camp that congratulates them when they get it right and raise hell with them when they dont..  i think that is a perfectly reasonable approach  for anyone to take.

[Silver Pines]

@XenaLee

Sure there is.  Full repeal..... like they promised.  By all means.... swallow away.  That is your choice, not mine.  I'm done with their crap.

No, it's not only not fun.... it's not funny.  And I'm FTFU with their lies.

This.