Terrible! Just found out that Obama had my "wires tapped" in Trump Tower just before the victory. Nothing found. This is McCarthyism!

[bigheadfred]

You are throwing a whole lot of babies out with the bath water. Without DHS, we've had another 9/11 event. Maybe multiple. This is not to say we shouldn't have concerns about our civil liberties, but security and freedom are ALWAYS a balancing act....and yes, we should err on the side of freedom. That does not, however, mean we disregard security entirely.

uh huh

The Patriot act was signed by bush 45 days after 9/11. It was the plan all along.

[Mesaclone]

We had in place many 'security agencies.' Adding another layer of bureaucracy might not be the way to go to enhance security.

We had many, and they were poorly integrated with one another. That is far less true today under a single agency, and as I said...without DHS, we'd have had more 9/11's.

[Oceander]

You are throwing a whole lot of babies out with the bath water. Without DHS, we've had another 9/11 event. Maybe multiple. This is not to say we shouldn't have concerns about our civil liberties, but security and freedom are ALWAYS a balancing act....and yes, we should err on the side of freedom. That does not, however, mean we disregard security entirely.

Proving counterfactuals is a fools' errand.  Prove it.

[endicom]

We had many, and they were poorly integrated with one another. That is far less true today under a single agency, and as I said...without DHS, we'd have had more 9/11's.

The CIA Director had that responsibility. Now someone has some greater responsibility.

[Mesaclone]

Proving counterfactuals is a fools' errand.  Prove it.

The proof I could give, I certainly can't give. I'm not at a Senior level in DHS...not in a national sense anyway, but I've seen more than enough to be clear that without this agency many more Americans are not alive today.  I realize this is not going to convince you, but that does not make it any less true. I've seen the enemy in his homeland and in ours, and he is very real.

As I said, this does not mean DHS hasn't overstepped its bounds in some ways, nor that it doesn't need to be closely monitored and limited in its scope...but it HAS done much to save American lives and prevent major attacks.

[Victoria33]

...but Trump is still as corrupt and dishonest as he was when you didn't like him....... no matter whom he "kept us from."

@musiclady
@mystery-ak
@Oceander
@CatherineofAragon
@txradioguy
@Weird Tolkienish Figure
@Cripplecreek

This whole day has been a mess on every cable news channel.  No one knows who is doing what or when they did it or didn't do it or if it was done at all.  One argues with the next.  One tweet from Trump caused this chaos - we have been in chaos due to him from the first day he was president and it will stay this way every single day he is president.  I think, at this point of watching this after so short a time and the mess it is now, he won't remain as president; something will happen and I don't know what that will be.

I don't trust any report from anyone in his government at this point because no one knows what is really happening.  Did Trump blow up due to Sessions removing himself from any investigation about the election of Trump/the Russian connection?  Did he lose his temper with Bannon/Priebus, blame them for Sessions removing himself and messing up the glowing aftermath of his wonderful "read" talk to congress, then stalk out and go to Florida without them?  Then, make that tweet Saturday morning about being wiretapped by Obama?  Well, yes, we know he made that tweet that set off bombs in various government agencies.  He also wants an investigation done on Pelosi and Schumer.  That is only the beginning - remember he is the king of suing others.  He will want govn. investigations against every government person he doesn't like.  He has brought up a picture of Schumer with Putin back in 2003. He wants him investigated. 

What is his next move tonight on twitter or tomorrow morning on twitter to keep the chaos going?
musiclady, every day is the same, one more tweet and it keeps going.  This is a nightmare that won't end.

I believe this, know this, and will not answer any poster who attacks me - it is the way it is.

[Emjay]

@musiclady
@mystery-ak
@Oceander
@CatherineofAragon
@txradioguy
@Weird Tolkienish Figure
@Cripplecreek

This whole day has been a mess on every cable news channel.  No one knows who is doing what or when they did it or didn't do it or if it was done at all.  One argues with the next.  One tweet from Trump caused this chaos - we have been in chaos due to him from the first day he was president and it will stay this way every single day he is president.  I think, at this point of watching this after so short a time and the mess it is now, he won't remain as president; something will happen and I don't know what that will be.

I don't trust any report from anyone in his government at this point because no one knows what is really happening.  Did Trump blow up due to Sessions removing himself from any investigation about the election of Trump/the Russian connection?  Did he lose his temper with Bannon/Priebus, blame them for Sessions removing himself and messing up the glowing aftermath of his wonderful "read" talk to congress, then stalk out and go to Florida without them?  Then, make that tweet Saturday morning about being wiretapped by Obama?  Well, yes, we know he made that tweet that set off bombs in various government agencies.  He also wants an investigation done on Pelosi and Schumer.  That is only the beginning - remember he is the king of suing others.  He will want govn. investigations against every government person he doesn't like.  He has brought up a picture of Schumer with Putin back in 2003. He wants him investigated. 

What is his next move tonight on twitter or tomorrow morning on twitter to keep the chaos going?
musiclady, every day is the same, one more tweet and it keeps going.  This is a nightmare that won't end.

I believe this, know this, and will not answer any poster who attacks me - it is the way it is.

You are dead wrong.  Don't bother to answer.  Hahahaha.

[Emjay]

@musiclady
@mystery-ak
@Oceander
@CatherineofAragon
@txradioguy
@Weird Tolkienish Figure
@Cripplecreek

This whole day has been a mess on every cable news channel.  No one knows who is doing what or when they did it or didn't do it or if it was done at all.  One argues with the next.  One tweet from Trump caused this chaos - we have been in chaos due to him from the first day he was president and it will stay this way every single day he is president.  I think, at this point of watching this after so short a time and the mess it is now, he won't remain as president; something will happen and I don't know what that will be.

I don't trust any report from anyone in his government at this point because no one knows what is really happening.  Did Trump blow up due to Sessions removing himself from any investigation about the election of Trump/the Russian connection?  Did he lose his temper with Bannon/Priebus, blame them for Sessions removing himself and messing up the glowing aftermath of his wonderful "read" talk to congress, then stalk out and go to Florida without them?  Then, make that tweet Saturday morning about being wiretapped by Obama?  Well, yes, we know he made that tweet that set off bombs in various government agencies.  He also wants an investigation done on Pelosi and Schumer.  That is only the beginning - remember he is the king of suing others.  He will want govn. investigations against every government person he doesn't like.  He has brought up a picture of Schumer with Putin back in 2003. He wants him investigated. 

What is his next move tonight on twitter or tomorrow morning on twitter to keep the chaos going?
musiclady, every day is the same, one more tweet and it keeps going.  This is a nightmare that won't end.

I believe this, know this, and will not answer any poster who attacks me - it is the way it is.

Ahem.  This is a forum, not a place for your personal diatribes which you demand not be answered.

I cannot even imagine the disappointment you would feel if you got up and discovered to your horror that Trump had not tweeted or said or done anything for you to rail about.

This is not a nightmare  A nightmare would be if Hillary got elected.  Another nightmare would be if the Obama forces from the cozy home close to the White House ... the one where Valerie Jarrett lives ..if those forces manage to harm Trump or his presidency.

You are so childish.  Trump is nobody's (well, almost nobody) first choice but he was elected.  He's president and doing a good job.  A bunch of Bills were introduced in Congress today all of which I think will improve our country.

Your self-indulgent bitching is doing nothing but help Hillary, Obama and your own very large ego.

[sneakypete]

The security apparatus was let out of the cage in 2001 with the PATRIOT Act.  We've done more damage to our own civil liberties than the terrorists could ever have imagined.

@Oceander
 

[sneakypete]

We had many, and they were poorly integrated with one another. That is far less true today under a single agency, and as I said...without DHS, we'd have had more 9/11's.

@Mesaclone

That's the "company line". There is no way of knowing how many,if any,attacks were thwarted because of some Mega Mother intelligence organization.

[libertybele]

@musiclady
@mystery-ak
@Oceander
@CatherineofAragon
@txradioguy
@Weird Tolkienish Figure
@Cripplecreek

This whole day has been a mess on every cable news channel.  No one knows who is doing what or when they did it or didn't do it or if it was done at all.  One argues with the next.  One tweet from Trump caused this chaos - we have been in chaos due to him from the first day he was president and it will stay this way every single day he is president.  I think, at this point of watching this after so short a time and the mess it is now, he won't remain as president; something will happen and I don't know what that will be.

I don't trust any report from anyone in his government at this point because no one knows what is really happening.  Did Trump blow up due to Sessions removing himself from any investigation about the election of Trump/the Russian connection?  Did he lose his temper with Bannon/Priebus, blame them for Sessions removing himself and messing up the glowing aftermath of his wonderful "read" talk to congress, then stalk out and go to Florida without them?  Then, make that tweet Saturday morning about being wiretapped by Obama?  Well, yes, we know he made that tweet that set off bombs in various government agencies.  He also wants an investigation done on Pelosi and Schumer.  That is only the beginning - remember he is the king of suing others.  He will want govn. investigations against every government person he doesn't like.  He has brought up a picture of Schumer with Putin back in 2003. He wants him investigated. 

What is his next move tonight on twitter or tomorrow morning on twitter to keep the chaos going?
musiclady, every day is the same, one more tweet and it keeps going.  This is a nightmare that won't end.

I believe this, know this, and will not answer any poster who attacks me - it is the way it is.

With my understanding of the situation, the bottom line lies with Sessions and the fact that he recused himself from investigation into the Trump campaign ... not just specifically Russia.  So any wiretapping that the may have been done to Trump, Sessions will not be a part of the investigation meaning it goes to the Deputy AG who is temporarily Boente, who has been asked to decide to appoint a special prosecutor, BUT also Trump is supposed to appoint  Rod Rosenstein tomorrow to replace the temporary position of Boente. Rosenstein is the U.S. attorney for Maryland, one of the only George W. Bush-appointed U.S. attorneys that President Barack Obama kept!!  This will go absolutely no where and Trump is going to look like a royal buffoon.  IMHO this is why Trump was so enraged with Sessions and rightfully so!  Sessions knew this was coming down the pike and he bailed!

[txradioguy]

This is McCarthyism!

Ummm...looks like someone doesn't understand that term and isn't using it in the proper form.

No one was trying to root out communists in the Government.

[txradioguy]

You are throwing a whole lot of babies out with the bath water. Without DHS, we've had another 9/11 event. Maybe multiple. This is not to say we shouldn't have concerns about our civil liberties, but security and freedom are ALWAYS a balancing act....and yes, we should err on the side of freedom. That does not, however, mean we disregard security entirely.

Formation of the DHS was an unnecessary move that has done little if anything to coordinate or streamline efforts to prevent future terrorist attacks.  the agencies that were working on it before 9/11 are still working it now.

The over arching umbrella agency of DHS was jsut an unnecessary expansion of government.

[Idiot]

Ahem.  This is a forum, not a place for your personal diatribes which you demand not be answered.

I cannot even imagine the disappointment you would feel if you got up and discovered to your horror that Trump had not tweeted or said or done anything for you to rail about.

This is not a nightmare  A nightmare would be if Hillary got elected.  Another nightmare would be if the Obama forces from the cozy home close to the White House ... the one where Valerie Jarrett lives ..if those forces manage to harm Trump or his presidency.

You are so childish.  Trump is nobody's (well, almost nobody) first choice but he was elected.  He's president and doing a good job.  A bunch of Bills were introduced in Congress today all of which I think will improve our country.

Your self-indulgent bitching is doing nothing but help Hillary, Obama and your own very large ego.

@Emjay
Marry me!   

[LonestarDream]

@Emjay
Marry me!   

I saw her first.

 

[Idiot]

I saw her first.

 

You can have her on holidays and weekends. 

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

Ahem.  This is a forum, not a place for your personal diatribes which you demand not be answered.

I cannot even imagine the disappointment you would feel if you got up and discovered to your horror that Trump had not tweeted or said or done anything for you to rail about.

This is not a nightmare  A nightmare would be if Hillary got elected.  Another nightmare would be if the Obama forces from the cozy home close to the White House ... the one where Valerie Jarrett lives ..if those forces manage to harm Trump or his presidency.

You are so childish.  Trump is nobody's (well, almost nobody) first choice but he was elected.  He's president and doing a good job.  A bunch of Bills were introduced in Congress today all of which I think will improve our country.

Your self-indulgent bitching is doing nothing but help Hillary, Obama and your own very large ego.

Think it's time to put yo on the Bozo list, Emjay. Since you do nothing but personal attacks lately.

[mystery-ak]

Emjay that was a personal attack on Victoria

If I delete it I have to delete all the posts that quoted it therefore butchering the thread.

Everyone please refrain from personal attacks..

[Right_in_Virginia]

Think it's time to put yo on the Bozo list, Emjay. Since you do nothing but personal attacks lately.

The post by @Emjay was not a "personal attack".  It was a well-reasoned and well-written assessment of the opinion posted by @Victoria33 ---

[Rivergirl]

Evidently the KlintonDictionary is in wide use here.   One person's definition of a good job is someone else's definition of nothing but ranting.
We all have a right to our opinion without being called a HATER.   If people want to change their minds from one day to the next that is fine.  This is not a site than decides to ban people who disagree with the owner/operator.

[endicom]

If I delete it I have to delete all the posts that quoted it therefore butchering the thread.

The thread has long been ground beef.

[Wingnut]

The thread has long been ground beef.

When life gives you ground beef...make chili!

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

The post by @Emjay was not a "personal attack".  It was a well-reasoned and well-written assessment of the opinion posted by @Victoria33 ---

This isn't a personal attack?

You are so childish.  Trump is nobody's (well, almost nobody) first choice but he was elected.  He's president and doing a good job.  A bunch of Bills were introduced in Congress today all of which I think will improve our country.[/size]Your self-indulgent bitching is doing nothing but help Hillary, Obama and your own very large ego.

@Emjay needs to learn from you, RiV. I dont have you on ignore because I enjoy your contrary, reasoned opinion on Trump.


Not so with @Emjay .

[libertybele]

When life gives you ground beef...make chili!

Seems to me there was a how to make the best chili discussion in this forum before...definitely a time for a diversion to stop some from all the unnecessary attacks ... cheese or wine anyone?

[skeeter]

This isn't a personal attack?




@Emjay needs to learn from you, RiV. I dont have you on ignore because I enjoy your contrary, reasoned opinion on Trump.


Not so with @Emjay .

If anyone knows personal attacks its you. You've slung some humdingers.