Author Topic: Chuck Todd: Donald Trump’s Delegitimization of Press ‘Un-American,’ ‘Not a Laughing Matter’  (Read 18697 times)

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Offline musiclady

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I'm a lawyer, so I'm usually analytical as hell when it comes to this stuff, but I think there's a pretty good argument for fighting dirty versus not fighting at all....

The single biggest problem the conservative movement has is that the primary schools, the colleges, the media, and the entertainment elites are all lined up against us.  Because of that, it is extremely difficult to get our message out without having it overwhelmed by the above-mentioned opinion-shapers.  That's particularly true when it comes to the young.  So we gradually see our vision of the country eroded.   The messaging from the left is inexorable, and we tend to lose the public on issue after issue because they get them young, and keep most of them.

What the conservative movement -- and the country as a whole  -- needs is a return of the skeptical, mistrustful voter/consumer of information.  We need more people -- especially young people - to quit relying on what they are told by those elites.  We're not going to have a shot at persuading anyone if that dynamic does not change.

Trump is an embarrassing doofus in many respects.  But I don't think there is any doubt that he has been successful at raising mistrust of the media to historic highs.  The almost embarrassingly simplistic-sounding "fake news" label has actually caught on, to the point where I think a lot more people are being much more skeptical when they hear/see things in the media.  Even if they ultimately don't agree with Trump, that burst of independent-thinking is absolutely invaluable.  I don't think we as conservatives can survive without it.

If we burn down the house of trusting the press, the soil that remains will be fertile for conservatives because we are right.  But our message is never going to get a fair airing is someone doesn't kneecap those opinion-shaping leftist elites.  And Trump -- for all his many flaws -- is the first party leader we've had who has actually done that to this extent.

I have no problems with your assessment of the media, and the universal knowledge that it is an enemy to conservatism.  On that we agree.

Where I disagree is that the only two alternatives are acting like a spoiled, irresponsible, over-sensitive pre-adolescent, or doing nothing at all.

Why not discuss what an adult might do or say to fight the media without acting the buffoon? 

While we may be getting our jollies right now with what Trump is "doing" to the media, we are mistaken if we believe it to be anything but temporarily satisfying.  They are not, in reality, being destroyed by his words, but may, in fact, become stronger through his childish behavior.

In the end, his immaturity and his being an "embarrassing doofus" (plus his not actually believing in conservatism, but behaving as the negative media stereotype of conservatives) is going to sully conservatism for a generation.

I have very little doubt that conservative values are going to suffer for the rest of my life on earth because of the damage Trump is doing.

All of this is my opinion, of course.......... but it hasn't changed since the election.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline XenaLee

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Not if it is a Pyrrhic victory, and the war for conservative principles and truth are lost in the battle.....

"Kicking ass," while it may be temporarily satisfying, doesn't really achieve anything in the end other than making you feel good.

Well..... after nine looong years of not feeling good....(more like feeling like crap)....

due to radical leftist (Soros, BLM, Clintonistas, etc.) control....

I'll gleefully take what good feelins I can get these days.....

pyrrhic or not.
No quarter given to the enemy within...ever.

You can vote your way into socialism, but you have to shoot your way out of it.

Offline musiclady

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Well..... after nine looong years of not feeling good....(more like feeling like crap)....

due to radical leftist (Soros, BLM, Clintonistas, etc.) control....

I'll gleefully take what good feelins I can get these days.....

pyrrhic or not.

THAT........... I understand.

We've been frustrated for a long time, and Trump cleverly tapped into that anger in his entertaining way.  Whether he believes anything on principle or not (I don't believe he does), he now has a personal vendetta against people he probably supported a year or so ago, and is lashing out at them.

It makes us feel like finally something is being done.

Even if, in the long range, it destroys us.......
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline musiclady

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@musiclady

His exaggerations and habitual lying will never cease - Chaos is his name.

@Victoria33

I have no idea why rational people think he transformed into something other than what he's always been just because he got elected.

I'm just glad everyone here hasn't jumped on his magical bandwagon.  Good to know critical thinking still exists.....
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline sneakypete

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4) It's a shame I have to remind "conservatives" of this.

@Weird Tolkienish Figure

It's a shame you think you are a conservative.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline truth_seeker

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Offline XenaLee

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THAT........... I understand.

We've been frustrated for a long time, and Trump cleverly tapped into that anger in his entertaining way.  Whether he believes anything on principle or not (I don't believe he does), he now has a personal vendetta against people he probably supported a year or so ago, and is lashing out at them.

It makes us feel like finally something is being done.

Even if, in the long range, it destroys us.......

It remains to be seen how things will turn out, ultimately.  But one thing I know (if nothing else).... our fate would be much more certainly dim and doomed had Hillary and the rats won the WH and Congress.   At least this way and now...

we have a chance to turn this mess around.  Slim, maybe.  But still, at least a chance.
No quarter given to the enemy within...ever.

You can vote your way into socialism, but you have to shoot your way out of it.

Offline musiclady

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It remains to be seen how things will turn out, ultimately.  But one thing I know (if nothing else).... our fate would be much more certainly dim and doomed had Hillary and the rats won the WH and Congress.   At least this way and now...

we have a chance to turn this mess around.  Slim, maybe.  But still, at least a chance.

But not as good a chance as we would have had if someone honorable and conservative had been our nominee and would have beaten Hillary (as surely he/she would have done).

Again, I don't see how we succeed in the long run by sacrificing all our conservative principles, but I could be wrong.....

......I never have been before in my life, but I suppose there's always a first time.  :dx1:
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline truth_seeker

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"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline XenaLee

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But not as good a chance as we would have had if someone honorable and conservative had been our nominee and would have beaten Hillary (as surely he/she would have done).

That's true enough.  But we're where we are now.  No point in wishful thinking.

Quote
Again, I don't see how we succeed in the long run by sacrificing all our conservative principles, but I could be wrong.....

......I never have been before in my life, but I suppose there's always a first time.  :dx1:

I don't plan on sacrificing my principles.   
No quarter given to the enemy within...ever.

You can vote your way into socialism, but you have to shoot your way out of it.

Offline Machiavelli

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I've removed a questionable graphic as well as the posts discussing it.

Offline musiclady

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I've removed a questionable graphic as well as the posts discussing it.

Thank you!
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline musiclady

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That's true enough.  But we're where we are now.  No point in wishful thinking.

I don't plan on sacrificing my principles.

I know that, @XenaLee .......and neither are the vast majority of posters here.

I just happen to think the "wishful thinking" is that Trump will be anything other than who he really is as President.



(btw, I hope you caught the tongue in cheek comment about my never being wrong.  I've been wrong at least twice in my life!  :laugh:)
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline alicewonders

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I have no problems with your assessment of the media, and the universal knowledge that it is an enemy to conservatism.  On that we agree.

Where I disagree is that the only two alternatives are acting like a spoiled, irresponsible, over-sensitive pre-adolescent, or doing nothing at all.

Why not discuss what an adult might do or say to fight the media without acting the buffoon? 

While we may be getting our jollies right now with what Trump is "doing" to the media, we are mistaken if we believe it to be anything but temporarily satisfying.  They are not, in reality, being destroyed by his words, but may, in fact, become stronger through his childish behavior.

In the end, his immaturity and his being an "embarrassing doofus" (plus his not actually believing in conservatism, but behaving as the negative media stereotype of conservatives) is going to sully conservatism for a generation.

I have very little doubt that conservative values are going to suffer for the rest of my life on earth because of the damage Trump is doing.

All of this is my opinion, of course.......... but it hasn't changed since the election.

Well, so far you've been completely wrong in every one of your predictions about Donald Trump, so - here's hoping your record stays at 100%!

 :finger:
Don't tread on me.   8888madkitty

We told you Trump would win - bigly!

Offline XenaLee

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I know that, @XenaLee .......and neither are the vast majority of posters here.

I just happen to think the "wishful thinking" is that Trump will be anything other than who he really is as President.



(btw, I hope you caught the tongue in cheek comment about my never being wrong.  I've been wrong at least twice in my life!  :laugh:)

Lol!  Sore subject.  I've been wrong so many times, I've lost count!  Oh well...

nobody's perfect....heh.
No quarter given to the enemy within...ever.

You can vote your way into socialism, but you have to shoot your way out of it.

Offline musiclady

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Well, so far you've been completely wrong in every one of your predictions about Donald Trump, so - here's hoping your record stays at 100%!

 :finger:

Wrong about predictions of his election (because I overestimated "Republican" voters).

But not wrong once about his character, or lack thereof.

And that's what the entire point is here.

btw, that's the least nasty post you've written to, or about me, in about a year.  Thanks for saying something that I could actually respond to, and not just ignore, as I usually have to do.  ^-^
« Last Edit: February 17, 2017, 11:06:21 pm by musiclady »
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline musiclady

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Lol!  Sore subject.  I've been wrong so many times, I've lost count!  Oh well...

nobody's perfect....heh.

I, of course, have been too.  I'm in the dead center of the "nobody's perfect" category!  ^-^


But as I see it, with the dire condition my beloved country is in because of the last three elections, the best thing we can do is laugh at ourselves.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2017, 11:02:46 pm by musiclady »
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Online DCPatriot

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Waiting for Grandpa on Marine One helicopter landing on South Lawn.


« Last Edit: February 17, 2017, 11:10:31 pm by DCPatriot »
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

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"It was only a sunny smile, and little it cost in the giving, but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living" F. Scott Fitzgerald

Offline Machiavelli

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The political cartoon [edited] was taken from this site.

The initial point of posting was to demonstrate how hard-hitting political discourse has been, in America's political history.

Unfortunately we have members that can't tell propaganda from satire.

[edited]

I guess that I should not be surprised that censorship is used here, in order to dumb down the discourse.

There are many compilations of old political cartoons, but the children here must have their eyes covered, apparently.

I am at a loss as to what is "questionable" about historical American political cartoons, or discussion thereof.

@truth_seeker

First of all here is the post of yours that initiated this.

I'm not in favor of censorship or overmoderation and I strongly resist letting my mod position go to my head.

I know that you did not intend to offend anyone when you posted that image. You're OK in my book.  ^-^

This was a case of the thread getting derailed. I'm normally not fussy about thread drift but in this situation I ask everyone to return to the original topic.  ^-^

« Last Edit: February 17, 2017, 11:17:25 pm by Machiavelli »

Offline sneakypete

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It remains to be seen how things will turn out, ultimately.  But one thing I know (if nothing else).... our fate would be much more certainly dim and doomed had Hillary and the rats won the WH and Congress.   At least this way and now...

we have a chance to turn this mess around.  Slim, maybe.  But still, at least a chance.

@XenaLee

Amen,amen!

The chance would improve if some so-identified "conservatives" would try to be part of the solution by backing Trump,than a part of the problem by backing the neo-cons and the Dims.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Emjay

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@Victoria33

I have no idea why rational people think he transformed into something other than what he's always been just because he got elected.

I'm just glad everyone here hasn't jumped on his magical bandwagon.  Good to know critical thinking still exists.....

Ladies, I would love to know what you hope to accomplish with your constant demeaning of Trump.

We all knew his personal faults, and they are many, but we should be past that by now and encourage him to be the best president he can be.

So far he's exceeded my expectations.

Besides personal gratification at feeling superior what else do you think you are doing to make the world a better place.
Against stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in vain.

Offline Emjay

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Dammit, I gave my pearls to my daughter-in-law.  I have nothing to clutch.
Against stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in vain.

Offline truth_seeker

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@truth_seeker

First of all here is the post of yours that initiated this.

I'm not in favor of censorship or over moderation and I strongly resist letting my mod position go to my head.

I know that you did not intend to offend anyone when you posted that image. You're OK in my book.  ^-^

This was a case of the thread getting derailed. I'm normally not fussy about thread drift but in this situation I ask everyone to return to the original topic.  ^-^
It got derailed because one of the site's bigshots, suggested I was posting klan propaganda, and further suggested it reflected my views, which was false, and which I resent.

I was posting a political cartoon from an American historical anti-Catholic compilation, to show the reality of our nation's historical political discourse.

Here is the link again, to prove it was anti-Catholic, not klan propaganda, for the record.

"16 Old-Time Anti-Catholic Political Cartoons to Put Things in Perspective"(the title)

https://churchpop.com/2016/01/11/16-old-time-anti-catholic-cartoons-to-put-things-in-perspective/

Perhaps you could request the owner, to counsel her "advisor" to use more mature judgment, in the future, instead of making patently false accusations (however subtly)


 
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Offline truth_seeker

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Sleep it off .
Wrong. Haven't had a drink for over 23 years.
"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln