Poll

IF DONALD TRUMP is our nominee, will you vote for him in the General?

YES! HE WAS CHOSEN AT THE CONVENTION
61 (36.1%)
NO! I WILL STAY HOME OR VOTE DOWN TICKET
68 (40.2%)
I WILL WRITE IN TED CRUZ!
37 (21.9%)
I WILL VOTE FOR HILLARY!
3 (1.8%)

Total Members Voted: 158

Voting closed: May 07, 2016, 04:02:57 am

Author Topic: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?  (Read 71360 times)

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Offline Sanguine

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #150 on: April 28, 2016, 09:46:17 pm »
The way I see it is Trump has no track record to look at whereas Hilary was a long one. We are at a stage in the politics where both major parties are about the same. Not the voters, the parties.

In order to break this spell they have over the electorate, we must find someone to who can work some magic out side the box. Trump might not be that person but, he's not beholden to either party or the lobbyists.

I didn't vote for Trump in the TX primary but, it's fairly clear that Cruz isn't going to be the nominee. Since both of these candidates claim to be anti-establishment and have garnered most of the votes, I'm pretty confident most of them want what I was describing...a revolution of sorts in the political process.

I feel that if we lose this opportunity, it won't be available later. This current generation mostly believes socialism is the way forward. We need to change their minds NOW!

I have to disagree with you, Wolfcreek.  First of all, DT does have a long track record, and it's one of a flamboyant, narcissistic, thin-skinned, belligerent, inconsistently successful, ethically challenged, politically leftish, businessman. 

Secondly, not sure why you say Cruz can't win.  We always knew this week's primaries were not going to favor Cruz.  He's in the same place he was before this round, and still in a position to win. 

Offline wolfcreek

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #151 on: April 28, 2016, 09:54:42 pm »
I have to disagree with you, Wolfcreek.  First of all, DT does have a long track record, and it's one of a flamboyant, narcissistic, thin-skinned, belligerent, inconsistently successful, ethically challenged, politically leftish, businessman. 

Secondly, not sure why you say Cruz can't win.  We always knew this week's primaries were not going to favor Cruz.  He's in the same place he was before this round, and still in a position to win.
That's not a political track record and it sounds like how the Left describe most Conservatives. ;)

Cruz can't get the necessary delegates to go into the convention with 1237. it's not mathematically possible.

Offline wolfcreek

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #152 on: April 28, 2016, 09:58:14 pm »
What actually disturbs me is the amount of posters here and elsewhere who are willing, even after being disappointed for the last two election, to sit on their asses at home and let Hillary have the presidency.

That makes me want to puke.

Offline musiclady

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #153 on: April 28, 2016, 10:10:19 pm »
What actually disturbs me is the amount of posters here and elsewhere who are willing, even after being disappointed for the last two election, to sit on their asses at home and let Hillary have the presidency.

That makes me want to puke.

If Donald Trump is our nominee, it will guarantee that Hillary becomes President.

THAT should make you "puke" as well.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

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Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline wolfcreek

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #154 on: April 28, 2016, 10:14:17 pm »
If Donald Trump is our nominee, it will guarantee that Hillary becomes President.

THAT should make you "puke" as well.

It won't despite what the establishment and the media have tried to lead us to believe.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #155 on: April 28, 2016, 10:17:56 pm »
That's not a political track record and it sounds like how the Left describe most Conservatives. ;)

Of course it's a political track record.  It goes to where he is on the political spectrum and how he would govern, if given the chance.

Quote
Cruz can't get the necessary delegates to go into the convention with 1237. it's not mathematically possible.

No, he can't, and it may well be that DT can't either.  So....what's your point?

Offline PROCON

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #156 on: April 28, 2016, 10:18:33 pm »
What actually disturbs me is the amount of posters here and elsewhere who are willing, even after being disappointed for the last two election, to sit on their asses at home and let Hillary have the presidency.

That makes me want to puke.

You're preaching to the choir with me. I'm a Cruz guy and have supported him financially as I've been able to this campaign season.

But I will hold my nose, just like I and many others have been doing since '92 and vote for the "lesser of 2 evils", tRump in this case.

The nation WILL NOT survive a Hillary Clinton Presidency.

Just remember, the same "conservatives" who stayed home and didn't vote for Romney helped to give us 4 more years of the 0bama nightmare.

#neverhillary

Offline sinkspur

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #157 on: April 28, 2016, 10:27:22 pm »
It won't despite what the establishment and the media have tried to lead us to believe.

LOL!! Trump IS the establishment.  He's bought and paid for politicians (mostly Democrats) his entire life.  When has Trump EVER stood against Washington or any political entity? 

He NEVER has.

Trump's a con artist.  It's how he's made his living:  Trump University, Trump steaks, Trump vodka, Trump vitamins, Trump phones....all MLM scams that screwed gullible people over.

It's happening again. That you would play the role of mark to this charlatan is surprising. 

You go right ahead.  I am #NeverTrump.  Ever.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2016, 10:28:17 pm by sinkspur »
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline musiclady

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #158 on: April 28, 2016, 11:22:13 pm »
It won't despite what the establishment and the media have tried to lead us to believe.

Trump's a corrupt insider.  The only thing I think about him is what HE has said and done.

The media has nothing to do with the fact that he's a despicable human being, and a Progressive.

That makes me "puke" because at least Hillary tells the truth about her being a leftist.  Trump lies.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline RetBobbyMI

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #159 on: April 29, 2016, 12:22:36 pm »
Just for the sake of conjecture, let me pose this question.  We know a candidate must get 1237 delegate votes at the convention (not popular votes at primaries). We know that Trump has 994 and Cruz has 566, more or less, currently.  The question, assuming Trump might not get 1237, how many of the 994 delegates are Cruz supporters after they are unbound?
"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid."  -- John Wayne
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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #160 on: April 29, 2016, 02:13:20 pm »
:boring:

Thank you for conceding the point. 

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #161 on: April 29, 2016, 02:17:00 pm »
Just for the sake of conjecture, let me pose this question.  We know a candidate must get 1237 delegate votes at the convention (not popular votes at primaries). We know that Trump has 994 and Cruz has 566, more or less, currently.  The question, assuming Trump might not get 1237, how many of the 994 delegates are Cruz supporters after they are unbound?

Most likely substantially more than would be Trump supporters given that Cruz has been running rings around Trump in the project of selecting the actual individuals who will fill those delegate spots.  There is an article elsewhere of Cruz' abilities in this area as applied to Virginia: Trump won the delegates' first vote, but Cruz has apparently succeeded in picking all of almost all of the individuals who will fill those delegate spots.  If Trump doesn't win the first vote, I very much doubt if many of the Virginia delegates will vote for Trump on subsequent ballots. 

Offline Nickname

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #162 on: April 29, 2016, 07:04:54 pm »
Nick... Your avatar is reminiscent of a long-time forum member who moved on for her own reasons a couple years back. She used that very avatar.  Welcome!

Hiya, thanks for the welcome.

About the avatars! It may be one that she created. I picked it from the menu for customizing your appearance here but I'm thinking that all of the personal avatars end up on that list. I will look into finding something unique for myself.  ^-^

Offline Sanguine

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #163 on: May 01, 2016, 06:09:32 pm »
OK, I've been pondering the question for 7 pages now, and you Trumpsters have finally convinced me!

If Trump is the candidate, I will not vote for him.  And, I will hold all of you who pushed him upon us responsible for whomever wins; whether it be Trump or Clinton. 

Offline HootOwl

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #164 on: May 01, 2016, 07:22:00 pm »
I voted no, but that's only as of the last couple of days.  It's not as much his policies that bother me -- I could accept his non-conservative positions on a lot of issues just to get the Supreme Court.  What I can't accept is how he has run his campaign -- winning by trying to destroy personally other candidates.  If mocking other candidates with juvenile names is the new paradigm for winning a nomination, the GOP is done, and with it any real hope for the conservative movement. 

And as Rush apparently said a while back, Trump is essentially running an independent campaign from within the GOP, and has absolutely no loyalty to other GOP elected officials at all.  It's all about him, and if he gains appeal by trashing other Republicans, he'll do it.  So for me, I'd rather try to survive four years of The Beast and try to hang on to Congress, then condone what Trum is doing and let him wreck the party.

We don't have the time to worry about personalities Trump is doing the same thing as Cruz.  Both have called each other cry-babies, liars, Canadian, Tax cheaters ( has Trump even released his returns :amen:--no, but goes after Cruz,  for not declaring a loan from a few yrs. ago--0  what ever Four years is too late.  We'll have a one-sided SCOUS  that will care nothing about laws  just what is good for liberals.  I will vote for either  even a semi-conservative--if we don't  our culture, country, etc.  will be gone.  We got loads of stuff on Hillary--these guys should be fighting Demos  not Republicans--other stuff is trivial.

Not to mention that I think whomever gets elected is going to be facihttp://www.gopbriefingroom.com/Smileys/default/th_1lg147amen.gifng a severe economic downturn, and likely set the other party up to do very well in 2020.

Offline Rivergirl

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #165 on: May 01, 2016, 08:50:43 pm »
Interesting that GBR posters are to remain civil. That is definitely not a word in the tRump lexicon.
To say nothing of his vulgarian behavior.

A-Lert

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #166 on: May 01, 2016, 08:59:14 pm »
Interesting that GBR posters are to remain civil. That is definitely not a word in the tRump lexicon.
To say nothing of his vulgarian behavior.

Why shouldn't we remain civil?

Offline wolfcreek

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #167 on: May 02, 2016, 12:42:37 pm »
You're preaching to the choir with me. I'm a Cruz guy and have supported him financially as I've been able to this campaign season.

But I will hold my nose, just like I and many others have been doing since '92 and vote for the "lesser of 2 evils", tRump in this case.

The nation WILL NOT survive a Hillary Clinton Presidency.

Just remember, the same "conservatives" who stayed home and didn't vote for Romney helped to give us 4 more years of the 0bama nightmare.

#neverhillary

So we have people with short memories or obvious subversives.

Offline wolfcreek

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #168 on: May 02, 2016, 12:44:11 pm »
LOL!! Trump IS the establishment.  He's bought and paid for politicians (mostly Democrats) his entire life.  When has Trump EVER stood against Washington or any political entity? 

He NEVER has.

Trump's a con artist.  It's how he's made his living:  Trump University, Trump steaks, Trump vodka, Trump vitamins, Trump phones....all MLM scams that screwed gullible people over.

It's happening again. That you would play the role of mark to this charlatan is surprising. 

You go right ahead.  I am #NeverTrump.  Ever.

Speaking of scam and con-artists.....

Offline Sanguine

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #169 on: May 02, 2016, 01:17:51 pm »
Speaking of scam and con-artists.....

Trump?

Offline musiclady

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #170 on: May 02, 2016, 01:31:17 pm »
Trump?

Indeed!  Good to see Wolfcreek coming over to the light.  :smokin:
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline Neverdul

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #171 on: May 02, 2016, 01:46:43 pm »
I have not voted in the poll as I wish there was another option on the poll that fit me – “Maybe, but with great reservation”.

As I sure in Hell do not want to see Hillary as POTUS, I am not absolutely #NeverTrump but I am #serious-doubts-on-Trump. If Trump shifts liberal in the general however, as I believe he will, I will have to consider and assess whether there is a whole hill of beans difference between the two.

How Trump would govern as POTUS is also a big question mark. His idea of being POTUS seems to stem from his business experience as the sole owner and CEO of his many companies – “this is what I want – make it so” – and all he has to do is just sign a memo (or as POTUS – an executive order).

If he wins the nomination, which I think he will after a bloody battle, I predict that going into the general election he will shift back to his “former” liberal side.  He’s already said he wants to court Bernie Sander supporters.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/29/politics/donald-trump-bernie-sanders/

Quote
“The next morning, Trump said on MSNBC: "Bernie Sanders has a message that's interesting. I'm going to be taking a lot of the things Bernie said and using them."

“Trump’s advisers say these comments are a preview of more explicit overtures the campaign is ready to make to Sanders’ supporters once the populist liberal exits the 2016 race. That strategy is based on the broad areas of overlap between voters attracted to Trump and those who have flocked to Sanders. Both have angrily denounced the political system as corrupt and expressed deep frustration that Washington is not helping ordinary people. They both oppose international trade deals, saying they hurt American jobs.”

It is exactly this “overlap” that concerns me in addition to:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M78Tt40zXU


Someone on another site tried to tell me that “Bernie's supporters, in addition to wanting free sh!t, also tend to be white, protectionist, anti-immigrant, hate SJWs, hate Hillary,”

My response:

“Those” Bernie supporters who are anti-immigrant and hate the SJWs must not have ever gone to Bernie’s website and read his positions like his pro-immigration policy:

https://berniesanders.com/issues/a-fair-and-humane-immigration-policy/

And there is a good amount of SJW’s stuff there: Racial Justice; Fighting for LGBT Equality; Fighting for Affordable Housing; Fighting for Women’s Rights (Pro-Choice and Pro fully funding Planned Parenthood); Climate Change; Living Wage, Free College….

https://berniesanders.com/issues/

I do however see several issues that would be crossover issues between Trump and Sanders supporters and that is what concerns me.

Getting Big Money Out of Politics and Restoring Democracy
-Both Trump and Sanders think we are a Populist Democracy rather than a Constitutional Republic. When has Trump ever mentioned the Constitution? His new BFF Ben Carson even thinks that the Electoral College (outdated) should be eliminated and I never saw Trump say otherwise.


Creating Jobs Rebuilding America
-Creating “government” jobs to rebuild the infrastructure – can you say FDR part 2? Now I do agree that our infrastructure is aging, many problems with bridges in particular. However, saying “I will build great roads and make the trains run on time” might not be the best campaign slogan.

Caring for our Veterans
-Sanders – “Fully fund and expand the VA so that every veteran gets the care that he or she has earned and deserves.” Trump – “We’ve got to take care of our veterans” and he also wants to pour more money into the VA and expand it and wants to tie it into Medicare. Not that I disagree that veterans deserve better than what the VA is doing for them, but expanding the VA, IMO is not the answer. Trump has said that veterans should be able to see any doctor that accepts Medicare which sounds like he envisions some sort of tie in between the two and an expansion of both. Not good IMO.

Medicare for All
-Sanders wants to eliminate all private insurance and go full bore socialized medicine, free to everyone – single payer. Trump has said he wants to “repeal and REPLACE Obamacare” and is for more open competition for insurance companies, but he has also said things in past sounding a lot like he supports single payer and more recently “everybody has to be taken care of…who is going to pay for that? – The Government”. Trump has also said numerous times that he “will take care of all the women on healthcare issues…whatever that means, and has said he wants to expand Medicare – see above.


Fighting to Lower Prescription Drug Prices- NEGOTIATE A BETTER DEAL (Where have I heard that before…)
-Sanders and Trump are completely aligned here but I have my concerns over price controls that IMO would stifle R&D and new drugs. Both also say Americans should be able to buy Rx drugs from Canada – so much for “protectionism” and both say that Medicare should be able to negotiate for much lower prices. The problem with that is if Medicare is greatly expanded as both Sanders and Trump want, there will not be any real “negotiation”. The federal government will set a “fair” price for anyone receiving Medicare and or VA benefits and the pharmaceutical companies will have to suck it up by a combination of increasing prices on those with private insurance or cost cut for R&D, on new drug development or move their drug manufacturing to countries with lower costs and less regulation – Mexico, China, India…?

Reforming Wall Street
-Again, Trump and Sanders have alignment here. Both hate people who make money on Wall Street, “hedge fund” managers and both think the “wealthy” should pay more taxes. Both Sanders and Trump seem to have ideas of government control of private business.

There are others issues such as the Iran deal – Sanders is all for it and Trump while criticizing it, saying that Iran should not have nukes (South Korea and Japan and Saudi Arabia OTHO?), he just thought we could have negotiated a better “deal”. But what kind of deal? A deal indicates some sort of concessions from both sides. But I’ve never seen what Trump would have been willing to give up for the “better deal”.

Sanders and Trump also want to “save Social Security”. Sanders by expanding it and ending the income cap on payroll withholding and Trump via cost savings, cutting waste and an increase in domestic jobs. But neither are interested in a free market solution or in the move to the privatization of retirement savings.

So I see those issues where Trump and Sanders intersect as being the very same reasons why I am very concerned about Trump.

If Trump reverts back to many of his former liberal positions in the general, I might have to vote my conscience and vote for the Libertarian candidate as I did in ’96 when neither Clinton or Dole or Perot were acceptable choices.
So This Is How Liberty Dies, With Thunderous Applause

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #172 on: May 02, 2016, 02:04:34 pm »
I'm anybody but Hillary, personally. I worry about Trump's handling of the economy, and I think protectionism could actually make a bad situation much, much worse. That being said, I am not someone who thinks that Trump will appoint a liberal to the supreme court. I actually do think he'll be advised well on the USSC. That alone will earn him my vote.

But I do worry about the economy.

Offline Bigun

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Re: (POLL #2) VOTE! IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE WILL YOU VOTE FOR HIM?
« Reply #173 on: May 02, 2016, 02:10:39 pm »
Personally I wish there had been a "not only no but HELL no"  category!
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