Author Topic: Has the invisible primary for conservative third party candidate already begun?  (Read 1731 times)

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Offline sinkspur

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http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/has-the-invisible-primary-for-conservative-third-party-candidate-already-begun/article/2584586

Has the invisible primary for conservative third party candidate already begun?

By PHILIP KLEIN (@PHILIPAKLEIN) • 3/1/16 10:18 AM


As the prospect of a Donald Trump nomination becomes increasingly likely, many conservatives have been floating the idea of a conservative mounting a third party challenge. But then comes the trickier part — figuring out who that challenger should be. Following the conversation on the Right over the past week, I've begun to wonder, are we already at the beginning of the invisible primary for the third party nominee?

The arguments for a third party are quite obvious — many principled conservatives cannot stomach Trump's toxic blend of racism, liberalism and unseriousness, and will not vote for him. I've personally declared that were he the nominee, I would either vote for a third party conservative if available, or stay home. But in addition to the principled reason, many conservatives feel it's important to have somebody at the top of the ticket giving conservatives a reason to go to the voting booths, or else GOP Senate and House candidates would be collateral damage of the anti-Trump protest.

But, given how quickly events are moving, many conservatives have already blown past the idea of the need to have a third party and have now started to consider the how.

The fact that Mitt Romney, who hasn't endorsed anybody, has spent the past week attacking Trump over his failure to release tax returns and his refusal to denounce the KKK and David Duke, has people such as HotAir's Allahpundit more convinced he's gonna run third party.

 
But Erick Erickson laid down a marker: "I don't think Mitt Romney should be a third party candidate. I think it needs to be someone else." He instead floated Rick Perry, or using the Constitution Party as a vehicle to help with ballot access issues.

It's easy to see the arguments on both sides. In the pro-Romney camp, the argument would be that he's the only person with the national profile and fundraising network to mount a serious third party challenge. Whatever people's reservations about Romney in 2012, staring at the prospect of a Clinton vs. Trump race, he may suddenly look like the second coming of Ronald Reagan. In the con camp, there would be the argument that the whole reason that the Trump candidacy succeeded in the first place was that conservatives were tired of being spoon fed candidates like Romney. If conservatives have reached the point at which they're ready to bolt the Republican Party, they may as well go for broke. Why settle for a "more electable" third party candidate that they have to hold their noses for when any third party candidate will be a long shot anyway? Additionally, Romney's credibility is undermined by having courted Trump's endorsement during the 2012 race, holding an event to accept the endorsement when Trump was promoting birtherism. At the time, I wrote that was the biggest blunder of Romney's candidacy. Little did I know what we'd be staring at four years later.

Even moving past Romney, the argument doesn't end there. If conservatives demand a not-Romney third party candidate, who will it be? Should it be runners up, Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio? Or are they out because they already showed they couldn't beat Trump and signed an RNC pledge? Does that also apply to Perry? If none of them are ruled out, doesn't that start to trigger a kind of "what if primary" — essentially, replaying the GOP primary as if Trump never ran.

Does that mean somebody like Sen. Ben Sasse, who was the first GOP senator to declare he would bolt the party if Trump were the nominee, would have to step up? If Sasse, who has a low national profile, jumps in, would that trigger all sorts of conservatives to come out of the woodwork and raise their hands to say they could mount a third party challenge?

As for using the Constitution Party or Libertarian Party as a vehicle, there would be an advantage in terms of ballot access and they already have candidates and have had their own debates. Would their voters reject being hijacked by Republican refugees?

Ultimately, should a third party challenge emerge, it's going to have to happen very quickly. It might just take one candidate who can raise a lot of money quickly and secure enough commitments as soon as possible after Trump becomes the presumptive nominee. But, either way, there won't be much time to litigate these issues. To make this as successful as possible, conservatives will have to do something they haven't proved adept at doing in recent years — come together.
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Offline ABX

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Existing third party is probably the best option, and I would suggest the Libertarians step up. They are the next most organized and established party and while they do have many kooks, the Constitution Party has more unsavory characters (generally where the 'neo-confederates' (as Buckley called them), sovereign citizen, and conspiracy theorists gravitated to). They also have only been successful in ballot access in s small handful of States while the Libertarians have succeeded in this in most States.

I think there can be a simplified unifying message between Conservatives and Libertarians on small government, maximum personal liberty, and some of the disagreements can be given the federalist approach which would be a compromise probably both sides can agree on.

Offline Carling

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Mitt Romney as the "conservative" choice.  This GOPe meltdown is glorious.  Thanks for the lulz!   :silly:
Trump has created a cult and looks more and more like Hitler every day.
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Offline kevindavis007

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Mitt Romney as the "conservative" choice.  This GOPe meltdown is glorious.  Thanks for the lulz!   :silly:


Mitt Romney is more 'conservative' than Donald Trump. Also at least Mitt respects the Constitution.. Not Donald..
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Offline kevindavis007

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Existing third party is probably the best option, and I would suggest the Libertarians step up. They are the next most organized and established party and while they do have many kooks, the Constitution Party has more unsavory characters (generally where the 'neo-confederates' (as Buckley called them), sovereign citizen, and conspiracy theorists gravitated to). They also have only been successful in ballot access in s small handful of States while the Libertarians have succeeded in this in most States.

I think there can be a simplified unifying message between Conservatives and Libertarians on small government, maximum personal liberty, and some of the disagreements can be given the federalist approach which would be a compromise probably both sides can agree on.


Also I think a lot of people from the Constitution Party voted in the GOP Primary.  I agree the Libertarian Party maybe the best option..
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Offline Scottftlc

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I like it, an invisible primary with no voters.  Just some well-heeled life-long politicians figuring out how to keep on raking it in and flipping-off the peasants.
Well, George Lewis told the Englishman, the Italian and the Jew
You can't open your mind, boys, to every conceivable point of view

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Offline sinkspur

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I like it, an invisible primary with no voters.  Just some well-heeled life-long politicians figuring out how to keep on raking it in and flipping-off the peasants.

25% of the GOP will bolt if Trump is the nominee:

http://www.democracycorps.com/attachments/article/1025/Dcor_RPP_Memo_2.29.2016_FOR%20RELEASE.pdf
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Offline ABX

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Mitt Romney is more 'conservative' than Donald Trump. Also at least Mitt respects the Constitution.. Not Donald..

I don't recall him ever threatening to sue people who say distasteful things about him. Nor do I recall him saying he wants to punch is detractors in the face. He may have a lot of position faults (fewer than Trump) but he would be a humble leader who I doubt would step all over the Constitution. He wouldn't rule as a totalitarian as he never seems to have those tendencies. With all his businesses, he also doesn't seem to have a corrupt, cronyistic, qud pro quo type of record.

Offline Carling

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Mitt Romney is more 'conservative' than Donald Trump. Also at least Mitt respects the Constitution.. Not Donald..

I'm a Cruz supporter.  He's much more conservative than either Mittens or Trump.

RomneyCare is such a conservative policy!
Trump has created a cult and looks more and more like Hitler every day.
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Offline Jazzhead

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Existing third party is probably the best option, and I would suggest the Libertarians step up. They are the next most organized and established party and while they do have many kooks, the Constitution Party has more unsavory characters (generally where the 'neo-confederates' (as Buckley called them), sovereign citizen, and conspiracy theorists gravitated to). They also have only been successful in ballot access in s small handful of States while the Libertarians have succeeded in this in most States.

I think there can be a simplified unifying message between Conservatives and Libertarians on small government, maximum personal liberty, and some of the disagreements can be given the federalist approach which would be a compromise probably both sides can agree on.

I like that idea.  Maybe Rand Paul could be persuaded to accept their nomination.   (Of course, he'd have to give up his Senate seat, but you'd think the GOP could recruit a replacement.)   

It's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide

Offline Jazzhead

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RomneyCare is such a conservative policy!

In fact, it is.  It's a conservative alternative to single payor.   
It's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide

Offline kevindavis007

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I don't recall him ever threatening to sue people who say distasteful things about him. Nor do I recall him saying he wants to punch is detractors in the face. He may have a lot of position faults (fewer than Trump) but he would be a humble leader who I doubt would step all over the Constitution. He wouldn't rule as a totalitarian as he never seems to have those tendencies. With all his businesses, he also doesn't seem to have a corrupt, cronyistic, qud pro quo type of record.


Also he has created more jobs.
Join The Reagan Caucus: https://reagancaucus.org/ and the Eisenhower Caucus: https://EisenhowerCaucus.org

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Offline ABX

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25% of the GOP will bolt if Trump is the nominee:

http://www.democracycorps.com/attachments/article/1025/Dcor_RPP_Memo_2.29.2016_FOR%20RELEASE.pdf

A poll the other day actually had the numbers of may not or will never vote for Trump if he is the nominee upwards of 48% of Republicans.



Trump will need to pull a lot of democrats to him to be competitive with numbers like that. What kind of 'deal' will need to be made to win them?

Offline kevindavis007

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I'm a Cruz supporter.  He's much more conservative than either Mittens or Trump.

RomneyCare is such a conservative policy!


It was meant for the state of Massachusetts..  He believes in FEDERALISM...   Something we used to support..
Join The Reagan Caucus: https://reagancaucus.org/ and the Eisenhower Caucus: https://EisenhowerCaucus.org

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Offline Scottftlc

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25% of the GOP will bolt if Trump is the nominee:

http://www.democracycorps.com/attachments/article/1025/Dcor_RPP_Memo_2.29.2016_FOR%20RELEASE.pdf

And 75% will bolt if the well-heeled life long politicians in the establishment try to foist their complete crap candidates, again, on people who don't want them.

How's that going to work for you?
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Offline Carling

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25% of the GOP will bolt if Trump is the nominee:

http://www.democracycorps.com/attachments/article/1025/Dcor_RPP_Memo_2.29.2016_FOR%20RELEASE.pdf

75% (Rubio/Cruz/Carson voters) will bolt if the GOPe and its minions steal the nomination. 
Trump has created a cult and looks more and more like Hitler every day.
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Offline Scottftlc

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I don't recall him ever threatening to sue people who say distasteful things about him. Nor do I recall him saying he wants to punch is detractors in the face. He may have a lot of position faults (fewer than Trump) but he would be a humble leader who I doubt would step all over the Constitution. He wouldn't rule as a totalitarian as he never seems to have those tendencies. With all his businesses, he also doesn't seem to have a corrupt, cronyistic, qud pro quo type of record.

I also recall quite vividly him losing badly in a national election very recently...and being entirely incapable of dealing with either Obama or the media.  I also see absolutely no interest in him from the people who are actually voting now.

If you lose the votes, you lose.  The people voting now are speaking.  I really think you guys should propose a system of government that doesn't include voting.  That'd help you a lot.
Well, George Lewis told the Englishman, the Italian and the Jew
You can't open your mind, boys, to every conceivable point of view

...Bob Dylan

Offline Carling

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In fact, it is.  It's a conservative alternative to single payor.   

Well you're voting for HRC, so forgive me for not taking you as a serious poster.

Now RomneyCare is "conservative."   :silly:

The GOPe minions will say anything to try and deny reality.
Trump has created a cult and looks more and more like Hitler every day.
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Offline Meshuge Mikey

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25% of the GOP will bolt if Trump is the nominee:

http://www.democracycorps.com/attachments/article/1025/Dcor_RPP_Memo_2.29.2016_FOR%20RELEASE.pdf


which is precisely why Trumpty Dumpty will not BE the Republican Nominee!!


another perhaps more important reason is that EITHER of the current demowack candidates are still beating Trumpty in HEAD to HEAD POLLS!!


#nevertrump  #never

Have Indentified as a Male since birth!

Offline Carling

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It was meant for the state of Massachusetts..  He believes in FEDERALISM...   Something we used to support..

So Romney enacting a liberal healthcare system in his state means he's a conservative because FEDERALISM!!

Hey, Jerry Brown is a conservative because his liberal policies in CA are only for the state he governs!!  FEDERALISM!!!

 :silly: :silly:  :seeya:
« Last Edit: March 01, 2016, 06:10:34 pm by Carling »
Trump has created a cult and looks more and more like Hitler every day.
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Offline kevindavis007

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So Romney enacting a liberal healthcare system in his state means he's a conservative because FEDERALISM!!

Hey, Jerry Brown is a conservative because his liberal policies in CA are only for the state he governs!!  FEDERALISM!!!

 :silly: :silly: :seeya:


In a way yes.... Or do you prefer the one size fits all approach??
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Offline Carling

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In a way yes.... Or do you prefer the one size fits all approach??

What other power did Romney have as governor of MA than to sign liberal laws for his state?

Saying that makes him a conservative is one of the most ridiculous things I've read here this primary season, and that's a long list.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2016, 06:17:34 pm by Carling »
Trump has created a cult and looks more and more like Hitler every day.
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Offline Jazzhead

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Well you're voting for HRC, so forgive me for not taking you as a serious poster.

Now RomneyCare is "conservative."   :silly:

The GOPe minions will say anything to try and deny reality.

I intend to vote to defeat Trumpism.   You for fascism, bub?   

But let's get serious.   Go ahead and explain to me how the access issue (the ability of persons with pre-existing medical conditions to get affordable health insurance) can be addressed in a properly "conservative" way.   
« Last Edit: March 01, 2016, 06:18:16 pm by Jazzhead »
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Offline Carling

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I intend to vote to defeat Trumpism.   You for fascism, bub?   

But let's get serious.   Go ahead and explain to me how the access issue (the ability of persons with pre-existing medical conditions to get affordable health insurance) can be addressed in a properly "conservative" way.   

I'm not a Trump supporter, "bub?"  I'm a Cruz supporter, even with how pathetic his campaign has been lately, because he is a true fiscal and security conservative.  Saying that Trump supports are supporting "fascism" is such a stupid insult, and is the sign of someone who has little intellectual depth.

You're voting for HRC, and you're defending RomneyCare, and ObamaCare by proxy.

You're no conservative. 
« Last Edit: March 01, 2016, 06:26:35 pm by Carling »
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Offline EdinVA

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Such infantile drivel....
The voters are picking their candidates and the party loyalists don't agree with the voters because we are too stupid, low information and uneducated, in other words we are not part of the elite, the chosen ones with all the crystal balls that foretell all about the future.

Lets just roll back the clock, do away with primaries and have the backroom deals tell us poor ignorant folks what is best for us.