California — has passed a law that would ban hate speech on the internet in California. Hate speech

[Elderberry]

Gunther Eagleman™ reposted
Wall Street Apes
@WallStreetApes

Even Tucker Carlson is raising awareness that California is ending Free Speech with passed legislation

Elon Musk needs to be aware of this

“The state of California — has passed a law in the state legislature, both chambers of the state legislature, it awaits a signature from Gavin Newsom, that would ban hate speech on the internet in California. Hate speech.

Now, how do they define hate speech? I actually have the definition. I actually wrote it down because I was so shocked by it that this is happening. The state of California, if Gavin Newsom signs this law, and he has until October 13th to do it, he, people will be fined if the censors determine that speech constitutes, and we're quoting now, "Violence, intimidation, or coercion..."

What's intimidation or coercion — coercion based on race, religion, gender, sexual orientation, immigration status, or other protected characteristics. Obviously, white Christian men are not covered under that

- The state of California under Gavin Newsom is about to, we think, censor the opinions of Americans. Not to protect anybody, but to shield themselves from criticism so they can continue to do what they want to do in secret.”

https://twitter.com/WallStreetApes/status/1971345596301897911

[Kamaji]

If this law stands, it will effectively either ban free speech anywhere, or else cause all social media sites other than progressive sites to geoblock all of California.  The state will become as isolated as its political fellow travelers in Russia and China.

[Smokin Joe]

If this law stands, it will effectively either ban free speech anywhere, or else cause all social media sites other than progressive sites to geoblock all of California.  The state will become as isolated as its political fellow travelers in Russia and China.

How else can that bunch of incompetents selected on a basis other than merit survive, politically?

This is their wet dream, to silence all dissent, so they can say there is none in opposition.

All they have to do is learn Mandarin...

[jafo2010]

What California is doing is the foundation for communist totalitarian control.  If they can get away with this nonsense, it may well spread to other liberal lunatic bastions, New York, Illinois, Michigan, etc.

Imagine being setenced to years in prison for what you wrote on the Internet.  California is England on steroids.  Not good!

[Free Vulcan]

This is the state that gives Antifa aid and quarter, yet they think they have the right to define hate speech.

[DB]

If this law stands, it will effectively either ban free speech anywhere, or else cause all social media sites other than progressive sites to geoblock all of California.  The state will become as isolated as its political fellow travelers in Russia and China.

How can this law stand? It is a direct afront to the first amendment.

[Kamaji]

How can this law stand? It is a direct afront to the first amendment.

Hopefully CA will be sued before it takes effect by someone with the money to afford the litigation.  In the meantime, the longer it takes to get that result, the more platforms will shut out California out of self-preservation.  Take this forum for example- I rather doubt that myst has the financial wherewithal to handle a prosecution from CA and litigate to the Supreme Court, as stalwart a defender of free speech as she is.  Small forums may simply have to geoblock CA based viewers until the law is invalidated.

[Smokin Joe]

Hopefully CA will be sued before it takes effect by someone with the money to afford the litigation.  In the meantime, the longer it takes to get that result, the more platforms will shut out California out of self-preservation.  Take this forum for example- I rather doubt that myst has the financial wherewithal to handle a prosecution from CA and litigate to the Supreme Court, as stalwart a defender of free speech as she is.  Small forums may simply have to geoblock CA based viewers until the law is invalidated.

In that vein, what about TOS?

[Kamaji]

In that vein, what about TOS?

Same problem.  Hope they’ve got IT skills or good lawyers.

[Smokin Joe]

Same problem.  Hope they’ve got IT skills or good lawyers.

The site was one of the leaders in the fight to establish 'fair use' doctrine, which lets us quote part of an article and provide a link, for discussion purposes. I question whether they are ready for that fight, but IIRC, their servers are located within California, and that might present a problems for them. I remember when Free Dominion had to move their hosts out of Canada before the censorship witch hunt intensified. It was nice being able to keep up with the issues there, mainly because Canada (Saskatchewan) is far closer to me than DC (or even Fargo, for that matter).

[Fishrrman]

Gonna be a lot more folks in California signing up for VPNs so they can't be so easily tracked...

[Sighlass]

In that vein, what about TOS?

Censorship and liberal government has already proven to be a perfect formula to kill the TOS... It has already killed the Canadian branch of TOS... (FreeDominion)....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Dominion


J.R. should of got out of that Hellhole years ago while his health was still somewhat manageable. Being a vet, maybe he had a good doctor close by. Don't know, just know he did me wrong.

[DB]

Gonna be a lot more folks in California signing up for VPNs so they can't be so easily tracked...

Only if the posting is to a private messaging system. Post here, TOS, etc. the post is out in the open for them to go after. The VPN just secures the path in between you and where you posted.

[Smokin Joe]

Censorship and liberal government has already proven to be a perfect formula to kill the TOS... It has already killed the Canadian branch of TOS... (FreeDominion)....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Dominion


J.R. should of got out of that Hellhole years ago while his health was still somewhat manageable. Being a vet, maybe he had a good doctor close by. Don't know, just know he did me wrong.

e never did me wrong, per se, but I could see the looming storm and got out before I got myself banned. I still have an account over there and can even post, just rarely go there, and then, usually to post a prayer request. (Sometimes it's fun to lurk and see what they are doing).

[Fishrrman]

DB wrote:
"Only if the posting is to a private messaging system. Post here, TOS, etc. the post is out in the open for them to go after. The VPN just secures the path in between you and where you posted."

When I'm signed into my VPN, my IP address (as reported here) is at a different location than when I sign on without it.

Please explain further.

[Kamaji]

The law won’t go after individual posters, it will go after the platform/forum itself.  A VPN might be a way to get past geoblocking if a particular platform has geoblocked all of California.  The platform itself shouldn’t be affected by the use of a VPN as long as it didn’t facilitate such use.

[DB]

DB wrote:
"Only if the posting is to a private messaging system. Post here, TOS, etc. the post is out in the open for them to go after. The VPN just secures the path in between you and where you posted."

When I'm signed into my VPN, my IP address (as reported here) is at a different location than when I sign on without it.

Please explain further.

If your public post was something they wanted to legally charge, they'd simply subpoena your records from your provider. VPN really only prevents your connection from being spied on.

[roamer_1]

No matter what, the packets of information that your machine is requesting must be able to be received by your machine. That means there is a path. And that means there is a record.

Think of a VPN as a pipe that all your information flows through - You cannot see it in the pipe - But you can see where the end of the pipe is, and if you can find one end, you can find the other.

A true onion router is a little more complicated because that pipe passes through several (maybe many) anonymous servers which change all the time. That adds layers of obfuscation, but still -the packets have to arrive at your machine. The record is there.

I can find you through a vpn. I might could find you through an onion - But I would really have to want to, and that requires that your connection remains live. Each instance is a different thread, and each thread may consist of multiple threads (MiMo, like a torrent). That makes it really hard to do. But while it might stop me, (probably would stop me) - It won't stop uncle nanny if he wants to find you... Just like torrents.

I have said it before, and I will say it again: The ONLY way to be anonymous on the internet is with a portable device (laptop, tablet) with NO traceable information that can point to you, operated ONLY from public locations - Never from your own home or work. And even then, you have to watch out for cams.

So... From a hotel parking lot, inside a van, with a laptop you bought for cash, Probably running linux, probably with a mac addy spoofer...

That's pretty anonymous - But anything you do from there has to be different identity from what you use at home - You can't log in here with that box (as you) and then log on at home too.

It requires a whole nuther identity. With no connection to you or any of your present identities. At some point it is self defeating.

[DB]

No matter what, the packets of information that your machine is requesting must be able to be received by your machine. That means there is a path. And that means there is a record.

Think of a VPN as a pipe that all your information flows through - You cannot see it in the pipe - But you can see where the end of the pipe is, and if you can find one end, you can find the other.

A true onion router is a little more complicated because that pipe passes through several (maybe many) anonymous servers which change all the time. That adds layers of obfuscation, but still -the packets have to arrive at your machine. The record is there.

I can find you through a vpn. I might could find you through an onion - But I would really have to want to, and that requires that your connection remains live. Each instance is a different thread, and each thread may consist of multiple threads (MiMo, like a torrent). That makes it really hard to do. But while it might stop me, (probably would stop me) - It won't stop uncle nanny if he wants to find you... Just like torrents.

I have said it before, and I will say it again: The ONLY way to be anonymous on the internet is with a portable device (laptop, tablet) with NO traceable information that can point to you, operated ONLY from public locations - Never from your own home or work. And even then, you have to watch out for cams.

So... From a hotel parking lot, inside a van, with a laptop you bought for cash, Probably running linux, probably with a mac addy spoofer...

That's pretty anonymous - But anything you do from there has to be different identity from what you use at home - You can't log in here with that box (as you) and then log on at home too.

It requires a whole nuther identity. With no connection to you or any of your present identities. At some point it is self defeating.

Just to add to that. You can use a high gain directional antenna and connect to various public WiFi locations from several miles away as long as it is line of sight. And no one is the wiser...

[mystery-ak]

Would locking the forum just to members work...keep guests from seeing what is posted?

The only problem I see with that it will be hard to approve new members...it would be a private forum.

TBR has accounts at X, GETTR and TS...whatever I post here I also post on those sites..would I have to close them to?

[Kamaji]

Would locking the forum just to members work...keep guests from seeing what is posted?

The only problem I see with that it will be hard to approve new members...it would be a private forum.

TBR has accounts at X, GETTR and TS...whatever I post here I also post on those sites..would I have to close them to?

No.  If a member is located in CA, then that would be a problem.

[Hoodat]

California State Constitution

Article 1

Section 2(a) - Every person may freely speak, write and publish his or her sentiments on all subjects, being responsible for the abuse of this right. A law may not restrain or abridge liberty of speech or press.

[roamer_1]

Would locking the forum just to members work...keep guests from seeing what is posted?

The only problem I see with that it will be hard to approve new members...it would be a private forum.

TBR has accounts at X, GETTR and TS...whatever I post here I also post on those sites..would I have to close them to?

A while back a whole bunch of Christians were getting axed off of youtube, FB, and Twitter... Kinda during the lockdown particularly.

Many of them created FB like sites with presentation, both forum posting and messaging, and an app (phone) to access it. Even if they got let back on Youtube, their posts there were pretty plastic banana, and the real deal is still on those apps

[roamer_1]

Just to add to that. You can use a high gain directional antenna and connect to various public WiFi locations from several miles away as long as it is line of sight. And no one is the wiser...

 

Used to do something like that stumbling, looking for open routers in residential and SOHO neighborhoods. 

Me, being me, I could have really messed people up (open routers were everywhere back in the day), but I was only interested in the hack for anon transmission purposes. 

[Sighlass]

DB wrote:
"Only if the posting is to a private messaging system. Post here, TOS, etc. the post is out in the open for them to go after. The VPN just secures the path in between you and where you posted."

When I'm signed into my VPN, my IP address (as reported here) is at a different location than when I sign on without it.

Please explain further.

I just go to other forums and use the name Fishrrman ... say what I want...(with a VPN)

[Fishrrman]

DB wrote:
"If your public post was something they wanted to legally charge, they'd simply subpoena your records from your provider. VPN really only prevents your connection from being spied on."

When you say "provider", do you mean this board, or do you mean my ISP?

What "records" does The Briefing Room maintain on individuals, other than username, email, etc.?

When on a VPN, is it not true that one's ISP (such as Comcast, ATT, Verizon, etc.) cannot "see" to "the other end" to which one is connecting? All they know is that you're connected to a VPN, and nothing more.

Seems to me that the feds would have to go to the records of the VPN provider.
Is that what you mean?

Having said that, my VPN provider doesn't even know my name or email.
One buys time with them by purchasing "a card" (kind of like a gift card with a set of numbers on it). And then, enter it into the VPN, and you get a set amount of time to use them until some future date. They're in Europe, and I understand their record-keeping is... well... not really much at all.
There's no name, email... anything... other than the card number, which is just a set of random numbers.

So... please explain further.
I welcome comment from anyone in the know.

[DB]

DB wrote:
"If your public post was something they wanted to legally charge, they'd simply subpoena your records from your provider. VPN really only prevents your connection from being spied on."

When you say "provider", do you mean this board, or do you mean my ISP?

What "records" does The Briefing Room maintain on individuals, other than username, email, etc.?

When on a VPN, is it not true that one's ISP (such as Comcast, ATT, Verizon, etc.) cannot "see" to "the other end" to which one is connecting? All they know is that you're connected to a VPN, and nothing more.

Seems to me that the feds would have to go to the records of the VPN provider.
Is that what you mean?

Having said that, my VPN provider doesn't even know my name or email.
One buys time with them by purchasing "a card" (kind of like a gift card with a set of numbers on it). And then, enter it into the VPN, and you get a set amount of time to use them until some future date. They're in Europe, and I understand their record-keeping is... well... not really much at all.
There's no name, email... anything... other than the card number, which is just a set of random numbers.

So... please explain further.
I welcome comment from anyone in the know.

I mean your VPN/proxy provider.

[DB]

DB wrote:
"If your public post was something they wanted to legally charge, they'd simply subpoena your records from your provider. VPN really only prevents your connection from being spied on."

When you say "provider", do you mean this board, or do you mean my ISP?

What "records" does The Briefing Room maintain on individuals, other than username, email, etc.?

When on a VPN, is it not true that one's ISP (such as Comcast, ATT, Verizon, etc.) cannot "see" to "the other end" to which one is connecting? All they know is that you're connected to a VPN, and nothing more.

Seems to me that the feds would have to go to the records of the VPN provider.
Is that what you mean?

Having said that, my VPN provider doesn't even know my name or email.
One buys time with them by purchasing "a card" (kind of like a gift card with a set of numbers on it). And then, enter it into the VPN, and you get a set amount of time to use them until some future date. They're in Europe, and I understand their record-keeping is... well... not really much at all.
There's no name, email... anything... other than the card number, which is just a set of random numbers.

So... please explain further.
I welcome comment from anyone in the know.

Your VPN/proxy provider knows your IP address. That's all they need to know to expose your activity to law enforcement.

[mystery-ak]

@Fishrrman

What "records" does The Briefing Room maintain on individuals, other than username, email, etc.?

I'm not in the know but I know this..you are correct..that is all this site maintains is your email, IP and and user name....

[Fishrrman]

DB wrote:
"Your VPN/proxy provider knows your IP address. That's all they need to know to expose your activity to law enforcement."

They only "know your IP address" if they choose to.

I was able to obtain the following info from my VPN:
(again, they're in Scandanavia, and fully outside U.S. jurisdiction)
=====================================
What we don't log
We log nothing whatsoever that can be connected to a numbered account's activity:
- no logging of traffic
- no logging of DNS requests
- no logging of connections, including when one is made, when it disconnects, for how long, or any kind of timestamp
- no logging of IP addresses (emphasis added by me)
- no logging of user bandwidth
- no logging of account activity except total simultaneous connections (explained below) and the payment information detailed in this post.
=====================================

How is law enforcement going to obtain this information, if the VPN provider doesn't keep any?

[DB]

DB wrote:
"Your VPN/proxy provider knows your IP address. That's all they need to know to expose your activity to law enforcement."

They only "know your IP address" if they choose to.

I was able to obtain the following info from my VPN:
(again, they're in Scandanavia, and fully outside U.S. jurisdiction)
=====================================
What we don't log
We log nothing whatsoever that can be connected to a numbered account's activity:
- no logging of traffic
- no logging of DNS requests
- no logging of connections, including when one is made, when it disconnects, for how long, or any kind of timestamp
- no logging of IP addresses (emphasis added by me)
- no logging of user bandwidth
- no logging of account activity except total simultaneous connections (explained below) and the payment information detailed in this post.
=====================================

How is law enforcement going to obtain this information, if the VPN provider doesn't keep any?

You go with that...

It is extremely likely that our government monitors everything going in and out of those proxy servers for all the obvious reasons.

I'll add a couple things. You put a big red flag up to the government when you use overseas proxies to try to hide your activity. Even your encrypted traffic has your IP address going between the overseas servers and you. And, when your data leaves this country, it is no longer protected by the fourth amendment.

[Smokin Joe]

DB wrote:
"Your VPN/proxy provider knows your IP address. That's all they need to know to expose your activity to law enforcement."

They only "know your IP address" if they choose to.

I was able to obtain the following info from my VPN:
(again, they're in Scandanavia, and fully outside U.S. jurisdiction)
=====================================
What we don't log
We log nothing whatsoever that can be connected to a numbered account's activity:
- no logging of traffic
- no logging of DNS requests
- no logging of connections, including when one is made, when it disconnects, for how long, or any kind of timestamp
- no logging of IP addresses (emphasis added by me)
- no logging of user bandwidth
- no logging of account activity except total simultaneous connections (explained below) and the payment information detailed in this post.
=====================================

How is law enforcement going to obtain this information, if the VPN provider doesn't keep any?

Somehow I doubt all those massive data centers being built are out hunting for bits of bitcoin.