Author Topic: Steve Bannon: Republicans will have to "raise taxes on the wealthy" to fulfill Trump's campaign prom  (Read 10225 times)

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Online Cyber Liberty

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Capital gains are taxed when assets are sold, dependent on one's income and whether or not the asset was held for long term or short term.

There has been talk of taxing unrealized capital gains which would be absolutely detrimental.

That would be a Wealth Tax in disguise.
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Offline libertybele

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No use taxing poor people.  They have nothing to tax.

Can't tax the rich people because they own the politicians.

Only thing left is to tax working class and middle class people because they are chumps for going to work everyday thinking they can get ahead.
They go to work everyday to support themselves.  So you think those that aren't considered high income or rich should just sit around and let everyone else pay for them so that they can be on the gov't gravy train?

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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That would be a Wealth Tax in disguise.

Hmmm... isn't a property tax a form of wealth tax in disguise? A true broad based wealth tax would be a nightmare to administer, you'd have to have all your assets assessed by some bureaucracy, just like property taxes. And of course it'd be in their interest to over assess everything you own.

yeah no thanks.

Offline libertybele

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Online DefiantMassRINO

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Why are (long-term) capital gains taxed at a lower rate than earned income?

Are capital gains more virtuous than earned income?

Yes, the Vulture Capitalists and the Pirate Equity guys take risks.  Well so do working folk who invest their time to acquire education and skills, and sometimes at great financial cost and risk.

Why shouldn't all income be taxed at the same rate?

Additional taxation would not be necessary if we had adults in Washington, DC, who could pass (balanced?) budgets on time.
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Online Cyber Liberty

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Hmmm... isn't a property tax a form of wealth tax in disguise? A true broad based wealth tax would be a nightmare to administer, you'd have to have all your assets assessed by some bureaucracy, just like property taxes. And of course it'd be in their interest to over assess everything you own.

yeah no thanks.

In that case, we can reckon all taxes are taxes on wealth.  I agree with you, BTW.
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Online berdie

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I believe that we are equal in the eyes of our creator. And that means, ideally, we get equal opportunity to labor and succeed—which we have never had, nor likely will we ever get. It is not other's labor I wish to profit, but I do not want others to profit off yet others' labor, either, which is how the rich get rich in this country.



I must respectfully disagree. The "rich" provide jobs that allow others to make a living. It is a mutual agreement...your work for wages and enrichment of the company that pays said wages. If an employee is dissatisfied, they can always find another job.

And no...I'm not rich (well, better off than I'd ever thought I would be). But I did benefit thru the years from a steady paycheck and doing everything I could to boost the profits of the company I worked for (45 years) so they would flourish and stay in business. Thereby giving me a paycheck. :laugh:

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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There is also the case of people who inherit their wealth, not all wealth is obtained through behavior, just being in the "lucky sperm" club.

Online berdie

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There is also the case of people who inherit their wealth, not all wealth is obtained through behavior, just being in the "lucky sperm" club.


Sometimes. Remember the  old saying...

The first generation plants the tree.
The second generation enjoys the shade of the tree.
The third generation cuts the tree down.

Offline Hoodat

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Let's say I have $1 billion in diamonds stored in a safety deposit box.  What is my wealth tax?
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Online berdie

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Let's say I have $1 billion in diamonds stored in a safety deposit box.  What is my wealth tax?


A beautiful model wife?

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Offline Kamaji

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I believe that we are equal in the eyes of our creator. And that means, ideally, we get equal opportunity to labor and succeed—which we have never had, nor likely will we ever get. It is not other's labor I wish to profit, but I do not want others to profit off yet others' labor, either, which is how the rich get rich in this country.

:facepalm2:


Bullshit

Offline Hoodat

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If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

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Sometimes. Remember the  old saying...

The first generation plants the tree.
The second generation enjoys the shade of the tree.
The third generation cuts the tree down.

The story of Motorola.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Offline Hoodat

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I believe that we are equal in the eyes of our creator.

@jmyrlefuller

And what is the tax policy of our Creator?  Do rich people pay higher rates while poorer people pay poorer rates?  Or does everyone pay the same 10% rate?
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline jmyrlefuller

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@jmyrlefuller

And what is the tax policy of our Creator?  Do rich people pay higher rates while poorer people pay poorer rates?  Or does everyone pay the same 10% rate?
You'll have to take that up with Him. But I do know we've enshrined the same principle in our Declaration of Independence and Fourteenth Amendment.
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Offline Hoodat

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You'll have to take that up with Him. But I do know we've enshrined the same principle in our Declaration of Independence and Fourteenth Amendment.

So everyone tithes the same percentage.  Got it.  A person making $1 million pays the same percentage as someone making $100.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline DB

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Why are (long-term) capital gains taxed at a lower rate than earned income?

Are capital gains more virtuous than earned income?

Yes, the Vulture Capitalists and the Pirate Equity guys take risks.  Well so do working folk who invest their time to acquire education and skills, and sometimes at great financial cost and risk.

Why shouldn't all income be taxed at the same rate?

Additional taxation would not be necessary if we had adults in Washington, DC, who could pass (balanced?) budgets on time.

The money that purchased that capital investment was already taxed. Buy a house and live in it for 20 years and then sell it. You are taxed capital gains on the difference you bought it for and sold it for in terms of dollars. You equate that with earnings from working? In that twenty years if your house doubled in price and the value of the dollar has halved your house (takes twice as many devalued dollars to purchase it) it hasn't actually gained in real value. But you'll still pay the difference anyway in taxes...

The whole system is corrupt.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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The money that purchased that capital investment was already taxed. Buy a house and live in it for 20 years and then sell it. You are taxed capital gains on the difference you bought it for and sold it for in terms of dollars. You equate that with earnings from working? In that twenty years if your house doubled in price and the value of the dollar has halved your house (takes twice as many devalued dollars to purchase it) it hasn't actually gained in real value. But you'll still pay the difference anyway in taxes...

The whole system is corrupt.

There's no capital gains taxes on your primary residence though. Even I know that.

Edit: appears that's only true for up to $500K.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2024, 01:30:23 am by Weird Tolkienish Figure »

Online DefiantMassRINO

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Do I get to deduct or credit what I have paid in property taxes, mortgage interest, insurance, utilities, maintenance, depreciation expense, and replacement costs against the gross capital gains to only pay capital gains tax on the net capital gain?

I paid payroll taxes on my gross adjusted earned income.  I have to pay for recurring monthly house expenses (property taxes, mortgage interest, insurance, utilities, maintenance) using my net income, which has been taxed for Social Security, Medicare, Federal Income Tax, and State Income Tax.

I only take home 60% of my gross, from which 50%  of the remainder (30% gross income) pays for household expenses.  I don't get to write off depreciation expense like a business does.

If I sell the house, I pay capital gains tax on the gross capital gain, not the net.  My captial gains tax, based upon the gross, is too high when it should be based upon the net capital gain.

So, it is my after-tax income that I use for capital.

Businesses are taxed, but they get to account for the expenses to only pay tax on the net; whereas an individual gets screwed because I cannot take advantage of GAAP used for business assets and capital.

Worse, I sell my house, I overpay the capital gains tax, and it is from the remainder that I obtain the capital I'll use to pay the replacement cost from monies that have been taxed as personal income and gross capital gains.

If households could use the same accounting gimmicks businesses use, taxable disposable personal household income would be significantly less.

Businesses get to deduct and carry-over the expenses of doing business, but individuals and families do not get to deduct the full cost of living from payroll taxation.

This is why celebrities, scumbags (Mitt Romney), and douchebags (John F'ing Kerry) funnel their income through S corps, LLC's, trusts, and other legal tax sheters - to reduce their tax exposure.

If American households could incorporate, they could decuct their living, education, childcare, healthcare, yadda yadda yadda expenses to reduce their tax liabilities, just as corporations and pass-through LLC's do.

Don't tell me that I am not being screwed over compared to the likes of Mitt Romney and John F'ing Kerry.  John Kerry doesn't pay for his private jet flights with his own money ... he launders it through trusts and LLC's to deduct as a business expense or for a legal tax shelter entity to write off depreciation expense on the Gulfstream 5 owned by the Heinz Trust or LLC.

So, John F'ing Kerry tells the world he does not personally own private jets - his trusts and LLC's do.

Businesses pay income tax on post-expense net income whereas the deplorables pay personal taxes on pre-expense gross income.



The money that purchased that capital investment was already taxed. Buy a house and live in it for 20 years and then sell it. You are taxed capital gains on the difference you bought it for and sold it for in terms of dollars. You equate that with earnings from working? In that twenty years if your house doubled in price and the value of the dollar has halved your house (takes twice as many devalued dollars to purchase it) it hasn't actually gained in real value. But you'll still pay the difference anyway in taxes...

The whole system is corrupt.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2024, 02:50:39 pm by DefiantMassRINO »
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Offline DB

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Do I get to deduct or credit what I have paid in property taxes, mortgage interest, insurance, utilities, maintenance, depreciation expense, and replacement costs against the gross capital gains to only pay capital gains tax on the net capital gain?

I paid payroll taxes on my gross adjusted earned income.  I have to pay for recurring monthly house expenses (property taxes, mortgage interest, insurance, utilities, maintenance) using my net income, which has been taxed for Social Security, Medicare, Federal Income Tax, and State Income Tax.

I only take home 60% of my gross, from which 50%  of the remainder (30% gross income) pays for household expenses.  I don't get to write off depreciation expense like a business does.

If I sell the house, I pay capital gains tax on the gross capital gain, not the net.  My captial gains tax, based upon the gross, is too high when it should be based upon the net capital gain.

So, it is my after-tax income that I use for capital.

Businesses are taxed, but they get to account for the expenses to only pay tax on the net; whereas an individual gets screwed because I cannot take advantage of GAAP used for business assets and capital.

Worse, I sell my house, I overpay the capital gains tax, and it is from the remainder that I obtain the capital I'll use to pay the replacement cost from monies that have been taxed as personal income and gross capital gains.

If households could use the same accounting gimmicks businesses use, taxable disposable personal household income would be significantly less.

Businesses get to deduct and carry-over the expenses of doing business, but individuals and families do not get to deduct the full cost of living from payroll taxation.

This is why celebrities, scumbags (Mitt Romney), and douchebags (John F'ing Kerry) funnel their income through S corps, LLC's, trusts, and other legal tax sheters - to reduce their tax exposure.

If American households could incorporate, they could decuct their living, education, childcare, healthcare, yadda yadda yadda expenses to reduce their tax liabilities, just as corporations and pass-through LLC's do.

Don't tell me that I am not being screwed over compared to the likes of Mitt Romney and John F'ing Kerry.  John Kerry doesn't pay for his private jet flights with his own money ... he launders it through trusts and LLC's to deduct as a business expense or for a legal tax shelter entity to write off depreciation expense on the Gulfstream 5 owned by the Heinz Trust or LLC.

So, John F'ing Kerry tells the world he does not personally own private jets - his trusts and LLC's do.

Businesses pay income tax on post-expense net income whereas the deplorables pay personal taxes on pre-expense gross income.



Not entirely correct. If you sell your house, roughly the difference of what you sold it for and bought it for are the capital gains. As mentioned above there's a threshold you have to cross to pay capital gains on the sale of your house, but it isn't that much.

Businesses that do R&D (create new products) have to pay income taxes on the engineering/programmer payroll costs because it has to be depreciated over 5 years. Very expensive.

Businesses that purchase tools/computers etc. have to depreciate the costs of those things over many years (different categories have different depreciation schedules). So these expenses do not come directly off the top of the business' income for tax purposes.

An S Corp does not shield income. It simply counts business income directly as personal income - because they are the business owners. C Corp businesses pay corporate taxes and then the distributed profits are taxed again as individual income.
« Last Edit: December 25, 2024, 06:47:58 pm by DB »