Author Topic: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.  (Read 4541 times)

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Offline Bigun

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #50 on: February 01, 2021, 04:03:40 pm »
“No method of procedure has ever been devised by which liberty could be divorced from local self-government. No plan of centralization has ever been adopted which did not result in bureaucracy, tyranny, inflexibility, reaction, and decline. Of all forms of government, those administered by bureaus are about the least satisfactory to an enlightened and progressive people. Being irresponsible they become autocratic, and being autocratic they resist all development. Unless bureaucracy is constantly resisted it breaks down representative government and overwhelms democracy. It is the one element in our institutions that sets up the pretense of having authority over everybody and being responsible to nobody.”

President Calvin Coolidge, Address at the College of William and Mary, Williamsburg, Va., May 15, 1926

Pournelle's Iron Law of Bureaucracy

"In any bureaucracy, the people devoted to the benefit of the bureaucracy itself always get in control and those dedicated to the goals the bureaucracy is supposed to accomplish have less and less influence, and sometimes are eliminated entirely."

"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #51 on: February 01, 2021, 07:57:30 pm »
“I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution, or that have failed in their purpose, or that impose on the people an unwarranted financial burden. I will not attempt to discover whether legislation is "needed" before I have first determined whether it is constitutionally permissible.”

-- Barry Goldwater

Did Goldwater define how he proposed to extend freedom, what laws he was eyeing to repeal, what programs he wanted to cancel and what his criteria for "needed" legislation was?  @Hoodat

Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #52 on: February 01, 2021, 08:30:14 pm »
We cannot fracture on the right. We cannot give up hope and quit voting on the right.

I think you're too late @Mesaclone  --- we already have.  The debate now is what will we look like going forward.  And, I might add, we've not a whole lot of time to noodle this around.

We cannot let the perfect be the enemy of the good. And we must NEVER be disloyal to conservatism by siding with the Socio-fasts...particularly on issues like impeachment. We can and must have our internal debates...but we gall damn better unite once we have a candidate. That candidate cannot and will not be a squish...nor an establishment figure...nor any of the current Quislings kissing Dem a$$ in DC right now.


I'll rephrase your post into two questions:  "How do we hold onto the 75+ million voters who have redefined conservatism to its most basic component: common sense?"  "How do we assure these voters the political apparatus supports their political worldview?"


If it can't be President Trump, and it may yet be, I still think Cruz can be the guy to unite this thing...maybe he takes on Donald Jr as a VP running mate.  We have to get this elements of the party working in concert. That is the one and only chance we have...and we must win back the House in 22 (and the Senate if possible) if we are to have any chance in 24.

Trying to pinpoint anyone for 2022 and 2024 is putting the cart before the horse.  We've got to define who we are so we can identify the candidates who do not fulfill our vision as well as those who do.

We need the vision.  THIS is the unifier.




Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #53 on: February 01, 2021, 08:48:41 pm »
I think you're too late @Mesaclone  --- we already have. 

Well then, when the history of the collapse of the USA is written you will be on the list of those wielding the hammer that drove the final nails in the coffin.

Thanks.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #54 on: February 01, 2021, 08:58:41 pm »
Well then, when the history of the collapse of the USA is written you will be on the list of those wielding the hammer that drove the final nails in the coffin.

Thanks.

Oh, drop the pearl clutching @Cyber Liberty and read the rest of my post.

We' can still choose the road to something better ... quicker, smarter, more in touch with Americans ... ready and willing to fight, ready to win.  Man up, man!

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #55 on: February 01, 2021, 09:11:06 pm »
Oh, drop the pearl clutching @Cyber Liberty and read the rest of my post.

We' can still choose the road to something better ... quicker, smarter, more in touch with Americans ... ready and willing to fight, ready to win.  Man up, man!

I hoped you didn't mean, "I'll never vote GOP again!"  As for "manning up," I think we're seeng that start to happen in the hustings, where I'd expect it.  It's why I'm located in the hustings.

Be nice to folks getting off the sidelines to get into the battle. I'd like to see more of us.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #56 on: February 01, 2021, 09:43:14 pm »
I hoped you didn't mean, "I'll never vote GOP again!"  As for "manning up," I think we're seeng that start to happen in the hustings, where I'd expect it.  It's why I'm located in the hustings.

Be nice to folks getting off the sidelines to get into the battle. I'd like to see more of us.

Once again I invite you to read past the first 10 words of my post.  As a member of the elected class it behooves you to do so.

BTW, I've already congratulated you on your recent victory @Cyber Liberty   ... but I'll cut you no slack.  In fact, I'm going to hold you to a higher standard so you'd best be ready for the "getting into the battle" you're so proud of.



« Last Edit: February 01, 2021, 09:46:07 pm by Right_in_Virginia »

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #57 on: February 01, 2021, 10:01:39 pm »
Once again I invite you to read past the first 10 words of my post.  As a member of the elected class it behooves you to do so.

BTW, I've already congratulated you on your recent victory @Cyber Liberty   ... but I'll cut you no slack.  In fact, I'm going to hold you to a higher standard so you'd best be ready for the "getting into the battle" you're so proud of.

All I asked is to stop belittling people who are trying and you accused me of clutching pearls. While I will be doing as you suggest, I'd appreciate it if y'all would stop catching me up with the broad brush you use on the GOP.  You are making it less likely I'll be keeping you up to date on my efforts.

You are starting to sound like the people who just throw brickbats at the players on the field. One of your main detractors on this Forum, for example.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed:

Online Hoodat

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #58 on: February 01, 2021, 10:19:06 pm »
Did Goldwater define how he proposed to extend freedom

By getting the federal government the hell out of the way.


what laws he was eyeing to repeal

The ones that infringe upon our right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.


what programs he wanted to cancel

Ones that failed in their intended purpose, cause violence to the Constitution, or impose an unwarranted financial burden upon the people.


and what his criteria for "needed" legislation was?  @Hoodat

He didn't get that far.  Assessing need is secondary. @Right_in_Virginia
« Last Edit: February 01, 2021, 10:19:57 pm by Hoodat »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #59 on: February 01, 2021, 10:50:00 pm »
By getting the federal government the hell out of the way.
The ones that infringe upon our right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
Ones that failed in their intended purpose, cause violence to the Constitution, or impose an unwarranted financial burden upon the people.

He didn't get that far.  Assessing need is secondary. @Right_in_Virginia


Thanks @Hoodat  I asked because I know about Goldwater only what I learned in a couple of PoliSci undergrad courses.

I was hoping to find verbiage from our conservative elders that included specifics.  I'll do a little research and if I find anything worthwhile I circle back (thanks Ms. Psaki) and post.

Online libertybele

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #60 on: February 01, 2021, 10:56:45 pm »
I think you're too late @Mesaclone  --- we already have.  The debate now is what will we look like going forward. And, I might add, we've not a whole lot of time to noodle this around.
 

I'll rephrase your post into two questions:  "How do we hold onto the 75+ million voters who have redefined conservatism to its most basic component: common sense?"  "How do we assure these voters the political apparatus supports their political worldview?"




Exactly!!
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Offline Mesaclone

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #61 on: February 01, 2021, 11:05:38 pm »
Once again I invite you to read past the first 10 words of my post.  As a member of the elected class it behooves you to do so.

BTW, I've already congratulated you on your recent victory @Cyber Liberty   ... but I'll cut you no slack.  In fact, I'm going to hold you to a higher standard so you'd best be ready for the "getting into the battle" you're so proud of.

While I'm all for defining a path forward, I'm still somewhat in a stage where "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". We're going to need men and women from multiple conservative factions....Trump, Cruz, even folks like Nikki Haley and Marco Rubio who "lean" establishment but are still salvageable...to find a way past ego and feelings and come together. My first preference is these folks broadly coalesce around President Trump and we wage a campaign to put his supporters in all the key positions within the party...the old establishment has to step down. In the end, the President may have to yield his support to a man like Cruz who can...perhaps...pull the disparate factions more tightly together.

Whoever leads the Right...must be a street brawler. Trump is a natural at this, but Cruz has come to have pretty sharp elbows himself. There can be no more Nevertrumper presence at any level within the party...this does not mean folks cannot criticize the President, on the contrary that's a healthy and necessary part of party politics. But everyone must do so in a way that is respectful of his place as leader of the party...and in a way that does NOT give aid and comfort to the Socio-Fascists.

I strongly believe that Cruz and Trump working in unison IS the answer. Perhaps a very close alliance of these two men can bring conservatives together and aim everyone's fire where it should be aimed. But there can be no "waffling"...no appeasing media by watering down the message or criticizing the President and/or other fellow conservatives. We have to all be loyal to the message and the messengers
We have the best government that money can buy. Mark Twain

Online libertybele

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #62 on: February 01, 2021, 11:57:27 pm »
While I'm all for defining a path forward, I'm still somewhat in a stage where "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". We're going to need men and women from multiple conservative factions....Trump, Cruz, even folks like Nikki Haley and Marco Rubio who "lean" establishment but are still salvageable...to find a way past ego and feelings and come together. My first preference is these folks broadly coalesce around President Trump and we wage a campaign to put his supporters in all the key positions within the party...the old establishment has to step down. In the end, the President may have to yield his support to a man like Cruz who can...perhaps...pull the disparate factions more tightly together.

Whoever leads the Right...must be a street brawler. Trump is a natural at this, but Cruz has come to have pretty sharp elbows himself. There can be no more Nevertrumper presence at any level within the party...this does not mean folks cannot criticize the President, on the contrary that's a healthy and necessary part of party politics. But everyone must do so in a way that is respectful of his place as leader of the party...and in a way that does NOT give aid and comfort to the Socio-Fascists.

I strongly believe that Cruz and Trump working in unison IS the answer. Perhaps a very close alliance of these two men can bring conservatives together and aim everyone's fire where it should be aimed. But there can be no "waffling"...no appeasing media by watering down the message or criticizing the President and/or other fellow conservatives. We have to all be loyal to the message and the messengers

A year ago I would have agreed with you.  Keep in mind that Trump just had an election stolen from under him.  Again, there is NO path forward unless there is a way to ensure a fair election.  Keeping RONNA (Romney's niece) as head of the RNC already tells me, we'll get more of the same that we just saw.  So, how do you keep doing the same thing; allowing the GOPe to continue to do nothing but break promises and side with the leftists and expect a different outcome and also expect Trump and Cruz to pull rabbits out of hats?

IMHO right now Trump needs to focus on keeping from being impeached and building a legal team to keep them from putting him behind bars. 

Cruz has a target on his back as well. I don't see him keeping his seat; the left will find a way to get rid of him; after all they have the ability to fully control the outcome of elections.
Romans 12:16-21

Live in harmony with one another; do not be haughty, but associate with the lowly, do not claim to be wiser than you are.  Do not repay anyone evil for evil, but take thought for what is noble in the sight of all.  If it is possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all…do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Online roamer_1

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #63 on: February 02, 2021, 12:29:07 am »

We need the vision.  THIS is the unifier.

THAT"S WHAT I"VE BEEN SAYING ALL THE WAY ALONG!  9999hair out0000

And Conservatism winnowed down to its basic elements is NOT mere common sense.

It is a discipline. Not a book club.

Online Hoodat

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #64 on: February 02, 2021, 12:46:11 am »
While I'm all for defining a path forward, I'm still somewhat in a stage where "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". We're going to need men and women from multiple conservative factions....Trump, Cruz, even folks like Nikki Haley and Marco Rubio who "lean" establishment but are still salvageable...to find a way past ego and feelings and come together. My first preference is these folks broadly coalesce around President Trump and we wage a campaign to put his supporters in all the key positions within the party...the old establishment has to step down.

The problem here is that in 2016, the Establishment was given free reign to entrench itself at the state level, thanks to some very favorable rules changes enacted at the 2016 Republican National Convention.  The thing that made this possible was Trump's decision to allow the Establishment to select his delegates instead of connecting with supporters at the local level and choosing them to represent him at the Convention.


In the end, the President may have to yield his support to a man like Cruz who can...perhaps...pull the disparate factions more tightly together.

Cruz was the one on the front line who recognized the GOP Establishment's efforts to wrest control away from grass roots Conservatives.  Ted Cruz dove directly into the trenches in state after state battling for the heart of the GOP.  And Trump and his Establishment delegates demonized him for it.

Flash forward to 2020 when Trump desperately needed that GOP support at the State level to rise up and fight for election integrity.  Instead, he discovered too late that the GOP Establishment was firmly in control and unwilling to lift a finger to help.  (See:  Georgia, Pennsylvania, Nevada, Arizona, Wisconsin, Michigan, Virginia, Minnesota, etc.)

And here we are again with the Conservative grass roots shut out of the political process, except now it will be even more difficult to bring about change thanks to that 2016 Convention.  At least people like Ted Cruz (and Rick Santorum before him) understand that and are willing to fight.  Maybe this time, Trump zealots will recognize it instead of vilifying him.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #65 on: February 02, 2021, 01:33:23 am »
The problem here is that in 2016, the Establishment was given free reign to entrench itself at the state level, thanks to some very favorable rules changes enacted at the 2016 Republican National Convention.  The thing that made this possible was Trump's decision to allow the Establishment to select his delegates instead of connecting with supporters at the local level and choosing them to represent him at the Convention.


Cruz was the one on the front line who recognized the GOP Establishment's efforts to wrest control away from grass roots Conservatives.  Ted Cruz dove directly into the trenches in state after state battling for the heart of the GOP.  And Trump and his Establishment delegates demonized him for it.

Flash forward to 2020 when Trump desperately needed that GOP support at the State level to rise up and fight for election integrity.  Instead, he discovered too late that the GOP Establishment was firmly in control and unwilling to lift a finger to help.  (See:  Georgia, Pennsylvania, Nevada, Arizona, Wisconsin, Michigan, Virginia, Minnesota, etc.)

And here we are again with the Conservative grass roots shut out of the political process, except now it will be even more difficult to bring about change thanks to that 2016 Convention.  At least people like Ted Cruz (and Rick Santorum before him) understand that and are willing to fight.  Maybe this time, Trump zealots will recognize it instead of vilifying him.

FACTS. Tumpy was no friend to Conservatives.

Offline christian

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #66 on: February 02, 2021, 03:09:43 am »
Trump halted the Obama decline, reversed the nations decline and invigorated the nation and its economy.  How disgusting AND HORRIFIC,so now Biden took over and is turning the nation around to the way Obama had it and accelerating the effects Obama had.  Is that whatcha call Conservative and what you and yours saved us from?  The nation sees your Bidens handiwork and wants no more of it.  You assisted Biden, despite denials to the contrary, he's your HANDIWORK.
Card carrying member of the national F-Joe Biden movement, and his minions

Online Hoodat

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #67 on: February 02, 2021, 03:12:21 am »
Is that whatcha call Conservative and what you and yours saved us from?  The nation sees your Bidens handiwork and wants no more of it.  You assisted Biden, despite denials to the contrary, he's your HANDIWORK.

Please put down the lighter and slowly step away from the bong.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline DCPatriot

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #68 on: February 02, 2021, 03:16:06 am »
DUH??  Gasoline has gone up 80 cents @ gallon since the election.  It's now $2.499 per gallon for 87 octane.

How much power and/or influence does that lobby/association have where it can affect a 33% rise in the price of gas over the past six months?

...let alone the loss of jobs and security/investment $$$ in many States and their respective towns across the land.

"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

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Offline Sled Dog

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #69 on: February 02, 2021, 03:25:45 am »
How to Unite The Right:

Tell the squishes "My way or the highway".

Take no prisoners, allow no compromise.

Get those who are not on the right, who want the right to compromise with them and mooooove left, to go where they belong if they don't want to grow up and become real Americans.

Some squishes want to continue hiding their closeted fascism by pretending that Trump's Mean Tweets offended them, because they are too stupid to understand what Trump was tweeting ABOUT.   These people are pretending to be adults, so start treating them like adults.  Tell them to shape up or ship out.   

Sure, we need their votes, but we don't need them undercutting the message of unity by belching out Rodent propaganda all over the internet.  They do more harm than good, and if they're too soaked in fascist propaganda and self-serving arrogance to see the harm their FEELZ are doing to the country, they need to be shunned.

Treat them like tiny, bankrupt, probably unwashed Romneys. 

The first step in party unity is rejection of the purveyors of Rodent propaganda.  Teach them the propaganda they spew is false, show them how it's harmful, and then give up on them.  They aren't human beings and certainly not Americans.  They are vile and disgusting.   

And embarrassing, too.  It's sad to see how anyone can repeat Rodent lies or allow their emotions to be manipulated by Rodent lies.
The GOP is not the party leadership.  The GOP is the party MEMBERSHIP.   The members need to kick the leaders out if they leaders are going the wrong way.  No coddling allowed.

Offline Sled Dog

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #70 on: February 02, 2021, 03:30:40 am »
FACTS. Tumpy was no friend to Conservatives.

In many ways he was.

Filled the Courts with non-Rodents, even replaced the Ruth Buzzy corpse.

Hundreds of miles of border wall built.

Real economic growth.

Real tax reform, tax reform that was incredibly painful to the Rodent states, like the $10,000 cap on deductions for state tax on the federal forms.   The Rodents screamed at that one.  Suddenly Rodent states aren't having American states bankroll their spendthrift policies.

Jobs, and more jobs, and then jobs on top of those.  Manufacturing started to return.   

NO NEW WARS.   

Lots of things Trump did, often with zero help from the GOP squishes in House and Senate.   Trump was the most effectively conservative president since Reagan.
The GOP is not the party leadership.  The GOP is the party MEMBERSHIP.   The members need to kick the leaders out if they leaders are going the wrong way.  No coddling allowed.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #71 on: February 02, 2021, 04:43:36 am »
“I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them. It is not to inaugurate new programs, but to cancel old ones that do violence to the Constitution, or that have failed in their purpose, or that impose on the people an unwarranted financial burden. I will not attempt to discover whether legislation is "needed" before I have first determined whether it is constitutionally permissible.”

-- Barry Goldwater
I see nothing there to take issue with, ever. THAT is how it should be.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Online roamer_1

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #72 on: February 02, 2021, 05:22:50 am »
In many ways he was.


No he was not.

Quote
Filled the Courts with non-Rodents, even replaced the Ruth Buzzy corpse.

You must not be paying attention. That is not a Conservative court.

Quote
Hundreds of miles of border wall built.

He didn't even get past what was already slated to be rebuilt. And take it from me: as a redneck, I know a fence ain't anything till it's done, because the critters just go around.

Quote
Real economic growth.

Riiiight. on printing money worse than anywon in history. My grandchildren will be in debt due to his spending. And you must not have paid attention to the last YEAR. NO economic growth.

Quote
Real tax reform, tax reform that was incredibly painful to the Rodent states, like the $10,000 cap on deductions for state tax on the federal forms.   The Rodents screamed at that one.  Suddenly Rodent states aren't having American states bankroll their spendthrift policies.

Tax reform without spending reform is no reform at all.

Quote
Jobs, and more jobs, and then jobs on top of those.  Manufacturing started to return.   

Riiight, again the last year seems to have slipped your mind.

Quote
NO NEW WARS.   

I will give you that one. though getting out unresolved ain't right. Proper if you are gonna put our boys in harms way, you let em win it.

Quote
Lots of things Trump did, often with zero help from the GOP squishes in House and Senate.   Trump was the most effectively conservative president since Reagan.

LOL! ALL **GONE** in the stroke of a pen. Meanwhile what he passed as law, which we get to keep, is all liberal. Just like Boosh before him. And YES, we still get the bill for it - Trillions upon trillions.

That don't impress me much.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2021, 05:24:23 am by roamer_1 »

Offline christian

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #73 on: February 02, 2021, 06:10:49 am »
You see?  With the evil Trump defeated, non-stop orgasms, we're livin in the promised land, paradise peace and harmony.  With Trump defeated, Biden is running wild with the blank check provided him!  Some 'Conservative' should be getting a cushy government job for making his election win so easy.  Helping Biden defeat Trump, of course.  And continues to help Biden defeat Trump until even now!  Hero of the revolution! 5 Star Stalin
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Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: This is no longer about Trumpers vs NT's or traditional conservatives.
« Reply #74 on: February 02, 2021, 06:21:59 am »
Here's the lead Senate Republican negotiating with Biden on the Covid relief package speaking with the press after meeting with Biden.  She's surrounded by her team.  She said the meeting went very well.