Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion 2

[Hoodat]

That is how we get this behind us.

And this is what the Left is trying to block until after November.

[skeeter]

What is the debate? Plague or pandemic?

@bigheadfred A Chinese friend was gloating about the number of cases in the US. I needed to know whether the figures were infections, or infections AND those tested who had the virus but were over it.

[Hoodat]

@bigheadfred A Chinese friend was gloating about the number of cases in the US. I needed to know whether the figures were infections, or infections AND those tested who had the virus but were over it.

Too bad we can't get any figures on the number of Chinese infections.

Go here and scroll down to 'Total Coronavirus Deaths in China', and have your friend explain the mathematical impossibility of the official Chi-com propaganda account.

But if it is schadenfreude he is looking for, then wait until the Three Gorges Dam collapses.

[Hoodat]

Here's more propaganda from Democrats posing as journalists:


Claremont 13-Year-Old Dies After Experiencing COVID-19 Symptoms

Here's paragraph six:  On July 9, Maxx’s mother took him to get tested for COVID-19. That test came back negative.

So the boy was tested, and it turned out he did not have the virus.  Yet the story still implies that every parent in America should be in complete terror because Covid is now killing 13-year-olds.  Enough of this BS already.

[Hoodat]

And even more propaganda:

85 Babies Tested Positive For COVID-19 In One Texas County, Health Director Says

~We currently have 85 babies under the age of one year in Nueces County that have all tested positive for COVID-19,” said Annette Rodriguez, director of public health for Corpus Christi Nueces County.

“These babies have not even had their first birthday yet. Please help us stop the spread of this disease.”

She did not provide additional details on their conditions.

No additional details?  Are any of the babies sick?  Did any of the babies exhibit symptoms?  Why were the babies tested to begin with?

No pleas to help these babies.  Only a plea to stop the spread of the disease.  And how to do that?  Wearing masks, social distancing, and at the ballot box of course.

[mountaineer]

Unlikely.

[Smokin Joe]

Here's more propaganda from Democrats posing as journalists:


Claremont 13-Year-Old Dies After Experiencing COVID-19 Symptoms

Here's paragraph six:  On July 9, Maxx’s mother took him to get tested for COVID-19. That test came back negative.

So the boy was tested, and it turned out he did not have the virus.  Yet the story still implies that every parent in America should be in complete terror because Covid is now killing 13-year-olds.  Enough of this BS already.

My daughter was 58 days in hospital because of a combination of pneumonia and MRSA that had gone systemic. She was tested for SARS-CoV-2 numerous times (all negative). Thankfully, she survived and is well, but the incorporation of deaths from other causes into the COVID-19 death count is clouding the issues ofmortality and giving a false image of the disease.
This only serves Democrats looking for more mayhem to impose on the American People via lockdowns and rules.

As a scientist, such wanton pollution of data only makes a mess of any scientific inquiry, much like the muddying of the issue of hydroxychloroquine (and Azithromycin and zinc supplement) use as a remedy.

Those doing this should not only be ashamed of the death and destruction they have wrought, but should be stripped of any license or credentials they possess for having done so.

[Hoodat]

07-19-2020 | 0:00 GMT

REGION	Recov:Death	Cases:Recov
Global (excluding China & US)	14.785 ↑	1.555 ↓
United States	12.425 ↑	2.159 ↓

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Largest case rises occurred in FL, CA, TX, GA, & AZ.

Today's new US Deaths compared to new deaths seven days ago:  +81.

14-day Recovery Deficit - 1,017,674.

Estimated infection (immunity) as percentage of population:
AZ - 13.59 %
FL - 11.00 %
GA -  9.22 %
TX -  7.98 %
CA -  6.78 %

[mountaineer]

A member of our church is a family practice physician. Today,  someone asked when he thought the virus might run its course. He replied that it ran its course weeks ago, that what is happening now, the alleged new cases, etc., was all just politics - not likely to end until election day. He's had five patients test positive, so he's not denying the existence of the virus.

[Bigun]

A member of our church is a family practice physician. Today,  someone asked when he thought the virus might run its course. He replied that it ran its course weeks ago, that what is happening now, the alleged new cases, etc., was all just politics - not likely to end until election day. He's had five patients test positive, so he's not denying the existence of the virus.

He's right as rain @mountaineer

[aligncare]

I thought this was interesting from TOS.

[Smokin Joe]

I thought this was interesting from TOS.

Again with the cases, what are the fatalities (and I bet the flu hasn't been inflated like COVID)

[Hoodat]

07-20-2020 | 0:00 GMT

REGION	Recov:Death	Cases:Recov
Global (excluding China & US)	14.869 ↑	1.555 -
United States	12.578 ↑	2.163 ↑

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Largest case rises occurred in FL, TX, CA, GA, & LA.

Today's new US Deaths compared to new deaths seven days ago:  +33.

14-day Recovery Deficit - 1,036,671.

To date, 1.178 % of Americans have tested positive for this disease.  0.043 % have died.  Omitting NY, NY, MA, and CT, only 0.028 % have died. But on behalf of the Biden campaign, tomorrow's front page of the WaPo will blast that Coronavirus is "crushing" the US.  All lies.  All BS.

[Hoodat]

For all you Erik Erickson fans out there, count him in the mask Nazi camp.  He thinks Gov. Kemp should make mask-wearing mandatory, and that it should be enforced.  Reason #17 why Erickson isn't a Conservative.

Here's the drill people:

1)  Wash hands early and often
2)  Don't touch your face
3)  Keep six feet away from anyone wearing a mask
4)  Keep six feet away from anyone not wearing a mask
5)  Mind your own friggin' business about what somebody else is doing.  They aren't you.

Don't know why this is so difficult for the emotional crowd to understand.

[Smokin Joe]

For all you Erik Erickson fans out there, count him in the mask Nazi camp.  He thinks Gov. Kemp should make mask-wearing mandatory, and that it should be enforced.  Reason #17 why Erickson isn't a Conservative.

Here's the drill people:

1)  Wash hands early and often
2)  Don't touch your face
3)  Keep six feet away from anyone wearing a mask
4)  Keep six feet away from anyone not wearing a mask
5)  Mind your own friggin' business about what somebody else is doing.  They aren't you.

Don't know why this is so difficult for the emotional crowd to understand.

Sorry, they are in "Fight or Flight" mode, and the Limbic Brain doesn't respond to logic.

One more reason to keep your distance.

[jmyrlefuller]

For all you Erik Erickson fans out there, count him in the mask Nazi camp.  He thinks Gov. Kemp should make mask-wearing mandatory, and that it should be enforced.  Reason #17 why Erickson isn't a Conservative.

Here's the drill people:

1)  Wash hands early and often
2)  Don't touch your face
3)  Keep six feet away from anyone wearing a mask
4)  Keep six feet away from anyone not wearing a mask
5)  Mind your own friggin' business about what somebody else is doing.  They aren't you.

Don't know why this is so difficult for the emotional crowd to understand.

Because keeping six feet away from everyone for months on end is unsustainable, and you're seeing it everywhere. The mask is a shortcut.

It reduces the necessary social distancing to about three feet, close enough to shake a hand and a distance that most people rarely ever get closer unless they're in a crowded club or are hugging.

[jmyrlefuller]

Because keeping six feet away from everyone for months on end is unsustainable, and you're seeing it everywhere. The mask is a shortcut.

It reduces the necessary social distancing to about three feet, close enough to shake a hand and a distance that most people rarely ever get closer unless they're in a crowded club or are hugging.

(I will also note that the three-foot rule was successfully implemented in Europe along with the masks. A major problem with enforcement here in America is that they're still insisting on the six-foot rule even if you're wearing a mask, so that's part of what's driving the embitterment.)

[Hoodat]

Because keeping six feet away from everyone for months on end is unsustainable

No, keeping the economy shut down for months on end is unsustainable, as is printing up more new money to pay for it.

and you're seeing it everywhere.

It's a personal choice and a personal responsibility.  If people choose to close that distance, then they accept the consequences of their choice.

The mask is a shortcut.

Also a personal choice.  If a person chooses not to wear a mask, then they accept the consequences of his/her choice.  No different than the 6-ft rule.

It reduces the necessary social distancing to about three feet, close enough to shake a hand and a distance that most people rarely ever get closer unless they're in a crowded club or are hugging.

Shaking hands and hugging are also personal choices.  If a person chooses to shake another person's hand and then touches his/her own face while adjusting his/her own mask, then that person accepts the consequence of their action.  And no government directive issued by any governor/mayor/etc. without legislative approval is going to change that.

Personally, I happen to be an adult who is instilled with a sense of personal responsibility.  And I am not about to embrace some fascist reactionary impulsive mandate because someone else isn't being controlled like I want them to be controlled.  And if the Euro-solution is so effective, then why do countries like France, Belgium, and the UK have higher death rates than the US?

You want an American to wear a mask?  Then ask nicely.  You would be surprised what that will get you.  But order an American to wear one?  You may end up with a boatload of masks tossed into the harbor.

[bigheadfred]

"You want an American to wear a mask?  Then ask nicely.  You would be surprised what that will get you.  But order an American to wear one?  You may end up with a boatload of masks tossed into the harbor."

@Hoodat

Hopefully with those masks still attached to the people who gave the order(s).

[jmyrlefuller]

You want an American to wear a mask?  Then ask nicely.  You would be surprised what that will get you.  But order an American to wear one?  You may end up with a boatload of masks tossed into the harbor.

You'll get a bunch of Facebook memes swearing that masks don't work, are a conspiratorial plot, etc. If Americans are convinced of something, there is nothing that you can do to convince them otherwise.

[libertybele]

Mixed messages from Day One': Rising cases prove summer is no barrier to COVID-19

Any hopes that summer’s high temperatures might slow the spread of the coronavirus were smashed in June and July by skyrocketing cases across the country, especially in some of the warmest states.

Colin Carlson wasn’t a bit surprised that summer heat failed to curb the virus that causes COVID-19, which has claimed more than 138,000 lives in the U.S. That notion, no matter how many times it was repeated, was never supported by science, said Carlson, an assistant research professor at Georgetown University who studies the relationship between climate change and infectious disease.

The optimistic, though inaccurate forecast was among several persistent misconceptions about heat and light, and other issues related to the spread of the virus, that leave epidemiologists like Carlson increasingly frustrated. They see and hear mixed messages and miscommunications all the time, whether it’s in social media, their circle of friends and family, hastily assembled research papers or the White House.

“My hunch is that most Americans think sunlight and heat kill the virus and you can be outdoors without risk,”  Carlson said, but if you’re in a group, even outside, you can spread and contract the virus. "It's true that not being in a confined space is better but it's not protective."........

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2020/07/17/spiking-covid-19-cases-show-summers-heat-doesnt-stop-coronavirus/5447462002/

[bigheadfred]

We had two Mormon Missionaries stop by. I always talk with them. I offered my hand. They said we can only bump elbows.

I said what? One kid was from the area of the Marshall Islands. Spoke English well enough.

I told him he had travelled that far to spread the Gospel to me and he had so little Faith he couldn't shake my hand????

We talked for a few more minutes and when they left they both...shook my hand.

[Hoodat]

You'll get a bunch of Facebook memes swearing that masks don't work, are a conspiratorial plot, etc. If Americans are convinced of something, there is nothing that you can do to convince them otherwise.

Currently, you get a bunch of Facebook memes swearing that masks work, and that edicts issued by governors/mayors/etc. that bypass the legislative process - edicts that hand out prison sentences for non-compliance - are as American as the Declaration of Independence itself.  And there is nothing that you can do to convince them otherwise.

[roamer_1]

(I will also note that the three-foot rule was successfully implemented in Europe along with the masks. A major problem with enforcement here in America is that they're still insisting on the six-foot rule even if you're wearing a mask, so that's part of what's driving the embitterment.)

Well no, it's bullsh*t, which is driving the embitterment. Thankfully, I am finding out just how many think that way... The governor's mandated mask program here ain't doing so well.Everybody flat ignored it... To include the sheriff deputies and city cops who were told to enforce it.

[Hoodat]

07-21-2020 | 0:00 GMT

REGION	Recov:Death	Cases:Recov
Global (excluding China & US)	15.016 ↑	1.549 ↓
United States	12.862 ↑	2.141 ↓

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/


Global Recoveries-to-deaths ratio climbs above 15.


Largest case rises occurred in FL, CA, TX, LA, & GA.

Today's new US Deaths compared to new deaths seven days ago:  +80.

14-day Recovery Deficit - 1,047,010.

[roamer_1]

“My hunch is that most Americans think sunlight and heat kill the virus and you can be outdoors without risk,”  Carlson said, but if you’re in a group, even outside, you can spread and contract the virus. "It's true that not being in a confined space is better but it's not protective."........

BLATANT NONSENSE... It is not because ppl are going outside. It is because they aren't. If you don't want to get the virus, avoid people and stay outside... Or avoid people and stay inside. But when Southern states get hot, everybody just goes inside into the air conditioning. That is a closed circuit air system which PREVENTS what summer heat would tend to do.

[Hoodat]

BLATANT NONSENSE... It is not because ppl are going outside. It is because they aren't. If you don't want to get the virus, avoid people and stay outside... Or avoid people and stay inside. But when Southern states get hot, everybody just goes inside into the air conditioning. That is a closed circuit air system which PREVENTS what summer heat would tend to do.

Correctamundo.  The author is trying to push a false narrative here.

[bigheadfred]

Too bad we can't get any figures on the number of Chinese infections.

Go here and scroll down to 'Total Coronavirus Deaths in China', and have your friend explain the mathematical impossibility of the official Chi-com propaganda account.

But if it is schadenfreude he is looking for, then wait until the Three Gorges Dam collapses.

2019 picture. That deformation has to be worse now with all the flooding problems there now.

[Smokin Joe]

You'll get a bunch of Facebook memes swearing that masks don't work, are a conspiratorial plot, etc. If Americans are convinced of something, there is nothing that you can do to convince them otherwise.

Yeah,  those facebook memes. https://www.technocracy.news/censored-a-review-of-science-relevant-to-covid-19-social-policy-and-why-face-masks-dont-work/?fbclid=IwAR2Z4J3itgl2DfGCP0UhG3n3PfeQDW7Zw3BizMAH5cMZzob1xsmUhFyaJ3c

[DB]

2019 picture. That deformation has to be worse now with all the flooding problems there now.

That picture may be multiple pictures stitched together causing distortion. That darker section on the right is definitely a separate picture stitched to the lighter one on the left.

[sneakypete]

@Hoodat @roamer-1  @bigheadfred @libertybele @jmyrlefuller

My daughter is a MD with her own clinic in a semi-rural area with a lot of "summer residents" from New York and other foreign countries,and my ex is her receptionist. I went there to get my infected leg treated today by the PA that works there,and while talking with the ex asked her if they had treated any Corona virus cases,and she shook her head and said "Not a single one". i

I realize this will not be the case with every medical clinic in the nation,but I do think it is more representative of what is typical than it is an aberration.

[Bigun]

Flaw in Manufacturer’s Testing System For Coronavirus Used by Labs Across the US Causing False Positives

According to DPH scientists, the affected patients were tested between July 15 to July 17 and out of a total of 144 ‘positive’ tests, 90 were false positives!

[jmyrlefuller]

Yeah,  those facebook memes. https://www.technocracy.news/censored-a-review-of-science-relevant-to-covid-19-social-policy-and-why-face-masks-dont-work/?fbclid=IwAR2Z4J3itgl2DfGCP0UhG3n3PfeQDW7Zw3BizMAH5cMZzob1xsmUhFyaJ3c

The surest way for me to think something's bullcrap is if you claim it's "censored."

It's probably not censored; it's just bad science.

[Bigun]

The surest way for me to think something's bullcrap is if you claim it's "censored."

It's probably not censored; it's just bad science.

You would do well to click on a few of the links in that story @jmyrlefuller Bad science my @$$!

[Hoodat]

Speaking of bad science, where can I find the study that compares infection rates for those wearing masks outdoors in the sunshine and high humidity and those not wearing masks outdoors in the sunshine and high humidity.

[libertybele]

Flaw in Manufacturer’s Testing System For Coronavirus Used by Labs Across the US Causing False Positives

This isn't the first reports of "flawed" testing and inaccurate data collecting and reporting.

[libertybele]

Speaking of bad science, where can I find the study that compares infection rates for those wearing masks outdoors in the sunshine and high humidity and those not wearing masks outdoors in the sunshine and high humidity.

I doubt that you would find one, at least an accurate one.  I have trouble breathing through a darn mask in the air conditioning after I've had it on for awhile. I think trying to breathe with a mask on in the heat and humidity would be difficult.

When they first shut us down, I thought to myself, well at least we can still go enjoy the parks.  Then they shut those down too.  It absolutely made no sense.  I see some people wearing masks at the park, riding bicycles and even jogging. I'm trying to understand their logic.

[Cyber Liberty]

I doubt that you would find one, at least an accurate one.  I have trouble breathing through a darn mask in the air conditioning after I've had it on for awhile. I think trying to breathe with a mask on in the heat and humidity would be difficult.

When they first shut us down, I thought to myself, well at least we can still go enjoy the parks.  Then they shut those down too.  It absolutely made no sense.  I see some people wearing masks at the park, riding bicycles and even jogging. I'm trying to understand their logic.

Spit masks require a little getting used to.  I wore them daily for six years when I worked in the clean-rooms, before I went into R&D.  The vinyl gloves were worse.

[Hoodat]

I doubt that you would find one, at least an accurate one.  I have trouble breathing through a darn mask in the air conditioning after I've had it on for awhile. I think trying to breathe with a mask on in the heat and humidity would be difficult.

My point is that the pro-mask zealots operate under the haughty assumption that science is on their side, when that is really not the case.

When they first shut us down, I thought to myself, well at least we can still go enjoy the parks.  Then they shut those down too.  It absolutely made no sense.  I see some people wearing masks at the park, riding bicycles and even jogging. I'm trying to understand their logic.

This is no different than when they had the government shutdowns under Obama.  The first thing they did was to close the parks and monuments in order to inflict pain on the people for a political advantage.  They are following that same playbook here.

[jmyrlefuller]

All those mask mandates are causing skin problems.
https://www.wgrz.com/article/entertainment/television/programs/daybreak/dermatologists-say-maskne-is-real-and-its-on-the-rise/71-74fe3bd2-7ab8-4608-9870-7ff6b274a125

[Cyber Liberty]

All those mask mandates are causing skin problems.
https://www.wgrz.com/article/entertainment/television/programs/daybreak/dermatologists-say-maskne-is-real-and-its-on-the-rise/71-74fe3bd2-7ab8-4608-9870-7ff6b274a125

@jmyrlefuller

Color me confused.  Haven't you been condemning Briefers who refuse to wear masks for endangering your health? 

[jmyrlefuller]

@jmyrlefuller

Color me confused.  Haven't you been condemning Briefers who refuse to wear masks for endangering your health?

I believe there is a time and a place for masks, and that in certain situations they are effective.

I am against the "no masks, no never, they don't work" that pervades on this board and elsewhere.

[Cyber Liberty]

I believe there is a time and a place for masks, and that in certain situations they are effective.

I am against the "no masks, no never, they don't work" that pervades on this board and elsewhere.

The situation where cloth masks help stop COVID does not exist.  Spittle blows right though them.  The reason that pervades this board and elsewhere is that it's a fact borne out by research.  Cloth masks are nothing but a talisman to ward off evil spirits, and signal the wearer is a person who does what he/she's told.

I have one in the car, it's a cost of doing business I will pay after I walk into a store, and it comes off while I'm walking out the door.  I have to really need something, like bird seed from Tractor Supply, I'll put up with it, but for groceries I do curbside pickup.

Mrs. Liberty can't wear them, so as far as she's concerned they can all drop dead.

[jmyrlefuller]

The situation where cloth masks help stop COVID does not exist.  Spittle blows right though them.  The reason that pervades this board and elsewhere is that it's a fact borne out by research.  Cloth masks are nothing but a talisman to ward off evil spirits, and signal the wearer is a person who does what he/she's told.

I have one in the car, it's a cost of doing business I will pay after I walk into a store, and it comes off while I'm walking out the door.  I have to really need something, like bird seed from Tractor Supply, I'll put up with it, but for groceries I do curbside pickup.

Mrs. Liberty can't wear them, so as far as she's concerned they can all drop dead.

Time will tell over the next couple of weeks which one of us is right.

[Cyber Liberty]

Time will tell over the next couple of weeks which one of us is right.

That will depend on whom you believe at that time.  It's hard to discern, because the press has lied its ass off through this entire fiasco, even more than usual.  My experience is, I can't reason somebody out of something they didn't reason themselves into.

[Smokin Joe]

The surest way for me to think something's bullcrap is if you claim it's "censored."

It's probably not censored; it's just bad science.

Well, the Hydroxychloroquine/Azithromax/Zinc Sulfate regimen, as it turns out was Not bad science, instead, the articles in nejm and Lancet were retracted because those 'studies' claiming the regimen was harmful WERE bad science.
But YouTube and Facebook censored anything which did not agree with the CDC, which at the time was parroting the (obviously) flawed studies, including Dr Zeleno's original video detailing the pharmacology, how it worked, why it worked, and when it was most effective, all just as soon as Trump mentioned Hydoxychloroquine.

Sorry, but science has been polluted by politics since AlGore stepped up and started braying inconvenient lies.
As a scientist, I want to see the data, understand the processes and cause/effect relationships claimed, and see if the data support the conclusions (and whether the conclusions support the title). Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't.
So why don't you at least listen to what people have to say and make up your own mind?

[DB]

Time will tell over the next couple of weeks which one of us is right.

How's that?

There are no actual scientific studies that exist that confirm either cloth or paper masks do anything regarding a virus that is in the air. I'm sure the CDC is busy doing something to pass off as science to justify themselves. But this issue has been studied over many flu seasons and the data is what the data is.

Your eyes are wet and catch whatever is in the air providing direct entry into the body. A plastic eye shield that is open to the air around your face is also useless in that case.

Those are simple facts.

[sneakypete]

Speaking of bad science, where can I find the study that compares infection rates for those wearing masks outdoors in the sunshine and high humidity and those not wearing masks outdoors in the sunshine and high humidity.

@Hoodat

One of Jupiter's moons?

[sneakypete]

I doubt that you would find one, at least an accurate one.  I have trouble breathing through a darn mask in the air conditioning after I've had it on for awhile. I think trying to breathe with a mask on in the heat and humidity would be difficult.

@libertybele

I keep wondering why there are very few mentions of carbon dioxide poisoning from people inhaling their own spent breaths into those paper masks,and the breathing in more carbon dioxide than oxygen.

[DB]

Time will tell over the next couple of weeks which one of us is right.

Here's what the New England Journal of Medicine had to say about masks and Covid-19 before things went political:

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2006372?rfr_dat=cr_pub%3Dpubmed

"We know that wearing a mask outside health care facilities offers little, if any, protection from infection. Public health authorities define a significant exposure to Covid-19 as face-to-face contact within 6 feet with a patient with symptomatic Covid-19 that is sustained for at least a few minutes (and some say more than 10 minutes or even 30 minutes). The chance of catching Covid-19 from a passing interaction in a public space is therefore minimal. In many cases, the desire for widespread masking is a reflexive reaction to anxiety over the pandemic."

"What is clear, however, is that universal masking alone is not a panacea. A mask will not protect providers caring for a patient with active Covid-19 if it’s not accompanied by meticulous hand hygiene, eye protection, gloves, and a gown. A mask alone will not prevent health care workers with early Covid-19 from contaminating their hands and spreading the virus to patients and colleagues. Focusing on universal masking alone may, paradoxically, lead to more transmission of Covid-19 if it diverts attention from implementing more fundamental infection-control measures."