Author Topic: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages  (Read 8804 times)

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Offline TomSea

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Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« on: December 03, 2019, 06:55:00 pm »
Quote
Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
By Morgan Phillips | Fox News

A Texas judge received a public warning Monday from the state's Commission on Judicial Conduct for refusing to perform same-sex marriages.

McLennan County Justice of the Peace Dianne Hensley has said her “Bible-believing” Christian conscience did not allow her to perform same-sex weddings and believes she’s entitled to a “religious exemption.” Hensley continues to perform weddings for heterosexual couples.

The order made public Monday said Hensley was violating Texas Code of Judicial Conduct which states, “A judge shall conduct all of the judge’s extra-judicial activities so that they do not cast reasonable doubt on the judge’s capacity to act impartially as a judge,” according to the Waco Tribune-Herald.

Read more at: https://www.foxnews.com/us/texas-judge-warned-over-refusal-to-perform-same-sex-marriages

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2019, 07:55:36 pm »
It is a civil ceremony,  with no religious connotations.   There are no grounds for a "religious exemption".
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2019, 08:50:58 pm »
It is a civil ceremony,  with no religious connotations.   There are no grounds for a "religious exemption".

When it comes down to the obligations between a man and his God, nothing in life is merely "civil", it all bears witness to the moral fiber of the man and that relationship.

To compel what is morally reprehensible to a man, what goes against the relationship between that man and his Deity, is morally reprehensible in itself, no matter what cloak of civility it is wrapped in.

Find another judge.

How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2019, 09:11:21 pm »
It is a civil ceremony,  with no religious connotations.   There are no grounds for a "religious exemption".

It is also a violation of Texas law for any marriage other than one man - one woman.  But then who gives a damn about what the law says.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2019, 10:25:30 pm »
from article:
The Texas Justice Court Training Center, which educates justices of the peace, said following the 2015 Supreme Court decision it could not find “any current legal authority which would permit a justice of the peace” to only perform marriages between heterosexual couples.

The center’s executive director Thea Walen said their position has not changed. “If you’re going to perform marriages, you must perform marriages for everyone.”


And the problem has been stated succinctly by this Thea Walen:  there are no limits whatsoever on what constitutes a marriage as everyone must be served, even if a father-daughter, threesomes, monkey and man or whatever the deviants can dream up.
“You will never understand bureaucracies until you understand that for bureaucrats procedure is everything and outcomes are nothing.” Thomas Sowell

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2019, 10:47:13 pm »
Texas Constitution

Article 1, Sec 32

Sec. 32.  MARRIAGE.  (a)  Marriage in this state shall consist only of the union of one man and one woman.

(b)  This state or a political subdivision of this state may not create or recognize any legal status identical or similar to marriage. 


https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/CN/htm/CN.1.htm


Looks like this judge is following the law.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2019, 12:22:42 am »
When it comes down to the obligations between a man and his God, nothing in life is merely "civil", it all bears witness to the moral fiber of the man and that relationship.

To compel what is morally reprehensible to a man, what goes against the relationship between that man and his Deity, is morally reprehensible in itself, no matter what cloak of civility it is wrapped in.

Find another judge.

@Smokin Joe

I agree. If this judge can't follow the law,Texas needs to kick her ass off the bench,and to even fine her for refusing to obey the law.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2019, 12:27:08 am »
@Smokin Joe

I agree. If this judge can't follow the law,Texas needs to kick her ass off the bench,and to even fine her for refusing to obey the law.
Maybe we should revisit a law that places the State on the pedestal God should occupy. Just my #0.02

I get that we need a rule of law, but like the bakers, I's bet those hiding behind their protected status shopped for a judge who would say "no". There are plenty of judges in the world, so why that one?
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2019, 12:53:31 am »
Maybe we should revisit a law that places the State on the pedestal God should occupy. Just my #0.02

 

@Smokin Joe

Which God,and is he/she/it an American citizen? Old Testament,New Testament,or Saturday Night Fever Testament?

Trot him out and let's have a look and listen.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2019, 06:53:27 am »
@Smokin Joe

Which God,and is he/she/it an American citizen? Old Testament,New Testament,or Saturday Night Fever Testament?

Trot him out and let's have a look and listen.
The one who wasted Sodom and Gomorrah will do just fine.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Idiot

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2019, 09:58:02 am »
The one who wasted Sodom and Gomorrah will do just fine.
You are good @Smokin Joe !  I love reading your posts.....

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2019, 11:12:46 am »
When it comes down to the obligations between a man and his God, nothing in life is merely "civil", it all bears witness to the moral fiber of the man and that relationship.

To compel what is morally reprehensible to a man, what goes against the relationship between that man and his Deity, is morally reprehensible in itself, no matter what cloak of civility it is wrapped in.

Find another judge.

Or, resign as a judge if one cannot in good conscience follow the law.   I don't fault the judge for her moral viewpoints,  but she should not victimize those citizens of Texas who seek to be married in accordance with the law as it stands.   If she wants to ascend her moral high-horse, then fine,  but her stand on principle should consist of her resignation.     
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2019, 12:27:12 pm »
Or, resign as a judge if one cannot in good conscience follow the law.   I don't fault the judge for her moral viewpoints,  but she should not victimize those citizens of Texas who seek to be married in accordance with the law as it stands.   If she wants to ascend her moral high-horse, then fine,  but her stand on principle should consist of her resignation.   
Or how about whatever the entity that wished to marry find another judge?

Why is that not a suitable option?
“You will never understand bureaucracies until you understand that for bureaucrats procedure is everything and outcomes are nothing.” Thomas Sowell

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2019, 12:28:56 pm »
Or how about whatever the entity that wished to marry find another judge?

Why is that not a suitable option?

Why should a citizen be forced to shop for a judge who will follow the law?   This isn't, say, Mexico is it?   
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2019, 12:38:40 pm »
Why should a citizen be forced to shop for a judge who will follow the law?   This isn't, say, Mexico is it?
That certainly does not answer the question.

Do you have a real answer on why that is not a real solution for the entity?

BTW, if you knew about the justice system, shopping for judges is done all the time.
“You will never understand bureaucracies until you understand that for bureaucrats procedure is everything and outcomes are nothing.” Thomas Sowell

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2019, 12:40:27 pm »
The one who wasted Sodom and Gomorrah will do just fine.

@Smokin Joe

That one seems to  have retired hundreds of years ago.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2019, 12:43:43 pm »
Quote
Or, resign as a judge if one cannot in good conscience follow the law. 

@Jazzhead

Simple,ain't it? Seems like everybody wants to be a drama queen these days. If you can't in good conscience do the job you were hired to do,QUIT!

Quote
I don't fault the judge for her moral viewpoints,  but she should not victimize those citizens of Texas who seek to be married in accordance with the law as it stands.   If she wants to ascend her moral high-horse, then fine,  but her stand on principle should consist of her resignation.
 

She HAS no principle as valuable to her as her paycheck and position,so fire her ass and replace her with someone that doesn't lie when they take the oath of office.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #17 on: December 04, 2019, 12:45:05 pm »
Or how about whatever the entity that wished to marry find another judge?

Why is that not a suitable option?

@IsailedawayfromFR

What oath did THEY take that they are violating? Do citizens work for the government,or does government work for the citizens and the rule of law?
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #18 on: December 04, 2019, 12:47:18 pm »
That certainly does not answer the question.

Do you have a real answer on why that is not a real solution for the entity?

BTW, if you knew about the justice system, shopping for judges is done all the time.

@IsailedawayfromFR

That is done by lawyers representing guilty clients who hope to find a biased judge that doesn't follow the law him/herself. These people want to get married,and that is legal for them to do so where they live.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #19 on: December 04, 2019, 12:51:40 pm »
@IsailedawayfromFR

That is done by lawyers representing guilty clients who hope to find a biased judge that doesn't follow the law him/herself. These people want to get married,and that is legal for them to do so where they live.
Be consistent at least.  This board you are hardlining the law be followed.  On another you excuse someone ignorant of the law.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #20 on: December 04, 2019, 12:52:40 pm »
Why should a citizen be forced to shop for a judge who will follow the law?

This judge is following the law.  See Article 1, Sec 32 of the Texas State Constitution:

https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/CN/htm/CN.1.htm
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #21 on: December 04, 2019, 12:53:55 pm »
Texas Constitution

Article 1, Sec 32

Sec. 32.  MARRIAGE.  (a)  Marriage in this state shall consist only of the union of one man and one woman.

(b)  This state or a political subdivision of this state may not create or recognize any legal status identical or similar to marriage. 


https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/CN/htm/CN.1.htm
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #22 on: December 04, 2019, 01:05:41 pm »
Be consistent at least.  This board you are hardlining the law be followed.  On another you excuse someone ignorant of the law.

@IsailedawayfromFR

No,you dummy,I did not. On this board I am defending someone operating under the laws,and it is the JUDGE that is breaking the law,and on the other board I am defending someone who had no idea he had been breaking the law for 30+ plus years,and had been living and working in good faith as an American citizen. Even our government thought he was a citizen because he was allowed to enlist in the US Navy,and after that was hired by the Federal Government to be a Customs Agent. If the US Government considered him to be a citizen,WHAT is the justification for prosecuting HIM for thinking he was a citizen?
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2019, 01:21:59 pm »
@IsailedawayfromFR

No,you dummy,I did not. On this board I am defending someone operating under the laws,and it is the JUDGE that is breaking the law,and on the other board I am defending someone who had no idea he had been breaking the law for 30+ plus years,and had been living and working in good faith as an American citizen. Even our government thought he was a citizen because he was allowed to enlist in the US Navy,and after that was hired by the Federal Government to be a Customs Agent. If the US Government considered him to be a citizen,WHAT is the justification for prosecuting HIM for thinking he was a citizen?
You do realize don't you that one does not have to be an American citizen to serve in the military?  Calling someone a dummy when you do not even know what is permitted?
« Last Edit: December 04, 2019, 01:23:02 pm by IsailedawayfromFR »
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #24 on: December 04, 2019, 01:51:52 pm »
@IsailedawayfromFR

No,you dummy,I did not. On this board I am defending someone operating under the laws,and it is the JUDGE that is breaking the law

@sneakypete

Can you please cite this "law" that the judge is breaking?  Thanks.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Bigun

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #25 on: December 04, 2019, 02:07:37 pm »
Texas Constitution

Article 1, Sec 32

Sec. 32.  MARRIAGE.  (a)  Marriage in this state shall consist only of the union of one man and one woman.

(b)  This state or a political subdivision of this state may not create or recognize any legal status identical or similar to marriage. 


@Hoodat given that, how does a couple outside of that very clear definition even get a marriage license in Texas?  Seems to me that should be impossible.


https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/CN/htm/CN.1.htm
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #26 on: December 04, 2019, 02:17:19 pm »
Are you referring to Part (b)?  It is drawing a line between 'marriage' and 'anything other than marriage as defined in Part (a)'.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Bigun

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #27 on: December 04, 2019, 02:22:41 pm »
Are you referring to Part (b)?  It is drawing a line between 'marriage' and 'anything other than marriage as defined in Part (a)'.

Both Parts would seem to preclude the state from issuing a Marriage License to those who do not conform to the very clear definition in part (a).
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #28 on: December 04, 2019, 02:36:41 pm »
@sneakypete

Can you please cite this "law" that the judge is breaking?  Thanks.

@Hoodat

I could if I were willing to go back and look at it all,but my memory sucks now,and I have better things to do with my time than argue with some fool about how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #29 on: December 04, 2019, 02:39:54 pm »
@Hoodat

I could if I were willing to go back and look at it all,

In order to save precious time, let me help you out with that one.  You can't because no such law exists.  Sure, you may 'feel' such a law exists.  But it would definitely be a waste of your time to prove that which cannot be proved.  (But hey, why let facts get in the way of feelings.)
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #30 on: December 04, 2019, 02:45:52 pm »
In order to save precious time, let me help you out with that one.  You can't because no such law exists.  Sure, you may 'feel' such a law exists.  But it would definitely be a waste of your time to prove that which cannot be proved.  (But hey, why let facts get in the way of feelings.)

@Hoodat

Admit it,you don't give a shit about morality. All you care about is scoring points to justify your superstition.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #31 on: December 04, 2019, 02:47:00 pm »
@Hoodat

Admit it,you don't give a shit about morality. All you care about is scoring points to justify your superstition.

What does morality have to do with the Texas Constitution?

Let's review, shall we?  My position is one based purely on written law.  It is this written law that is the sole premise upon which my argument is founded.  Compare that with yours.  Your argument has zero factual basis, but is instead based solely on what you believe to be true - in other words, based on your personal morality.  So it is YOU that is trying to impose your foundationless morality on me, not the other way around.

So if you want to engage in this discussion without morality involved, then you will come up with the law that this judge allegedly violated.  Because without that, you have nothing.  And your denial of that illustrates that you are stuck waging some sort of morality contest with zero factual basis.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2019, 02:51:52 pm by Hoodat »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #32 on: December 04, 2019, 02:48:04 pm »
What does morality have to do with the Texas Constitution?

@Hoodat


What do you care about the Texas Constitution,unless it happens to back your religious superstitions?
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #33 on: December 04, 2019, 02:56:50 pm »
What do you care about the Texas Constitution,unless it happens to back your religious superstitions?

You lost me.  What does religion have to do with this?  Texas law is quite clear.  This judge is being wrongly accused of breaking the law.  If this case were in Vermont instead, I would be agreeing that the judge is violating the law, primarily because there is an actual Vermont law that can be produced detailing said violation.

In both instances, I side with the law.  Contrast that with you who chooses sides based solely on moral judgment with zero regard to the existence of written law.  So how about focusing on the facts here instead of pushing your moral judgments onto others.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #34 on: December 04, 2019, 03:41:57 pm »
The Texas law is trumped by the Federal Constitution.   A state's civil marriage requirements must conform to the Federal Constitution's guarantee of the law's equal protection.

 

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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #35 on: December 04, 2019, 03:47:15 pm »
The Texas law is trumped by the Federal Constitution.

Here's what the US Constitution says:


The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.


Can you please pinpoint the part of the Constitution that trumps the Texas Constitution regarding that State's right to define marriage?  Thanks.

A state's civil marriage requirements must conform to the Federal Constitution's guarantee of the law's equal protection.

The Texas requirement applies equally to everyone.  It does conform to equal protection.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #36 on: December 04, 2019, 03:50:10 pm »
I gave you the answer.  If you don't want to accept it, fine,  but I am not going to waste time indulging your silliness.   
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #37 on: December 04, 2019, 03:52:06 pm »
Or, resign as a judge if one cannot in good conscience follow the law.   I don't fault the judge for her moral viewpoints,  but she should not victimize those citizens of Texas who seek to be married in accordance with the law as it stands.   If she wants to ascend her moral high-horse, then fine,  but her stand on principle should consist of her resignation.   
I'd bet dimes to dollars this isn't the only judge.

This reeks of the targeting formerly reserved for bakers and wedding photographers.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #38 on: December 04, 2019, 03:57:58 pm »
I gave you the answer.

No you did not.  You simply tossed out the term "Federal Constitution" as if the sheer utterance of it proved your case.  It doesn't.  If there is something in the Constitution itself that this judge violated, then cite it.  Make your case.  Provide the evidence.  Because without it, it is just your opinion against the Bill of Rights and the Texas Constitution.


If you don't want to accept it, fine

There is nothing to accept other than you tossing out the term "Federal Constitution".


but I am not going to waste time indulging your silliness.

The silly one would be the person here making baseless statements about this case.  But then we've been here before.   Again and again.  And each and every time, you bring nothing to the table other than your empty insistence that you are right, while denying the very wording of the Constitution of the United States of America.  To hell with your tyranny.

If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #39 on: December 04, 2019, 07:17:38 pm »
No you did not.  You simply tossed out the term "Federal Constitution" as if the sheer utterance of it proved your case.  It doesn't.  If there is something in the Constitution itself that this judge violated, then cite it.  Make your case.  Provide the evidence.  Because without it, it is just your opinion against the Bill of Rights and the Texas Constitution.


There is nothing to accept other than you tossing out the term "Federal Constitution".


The silly one would be the person here making baseless statements about this case.  But then we've been here before.   Again and again.  And each and every time, you bring nothing to the table other than your empty insistence that you are right, while denying the very wording of the Constitution of the United States of America.  To hell with your tyranny.
Some do not believe the freedoms cited in the US Constitution apply equally to both sides. 

And that will be the ultimate downfall of those who choose to selectively use the Constitution for their own purposes.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #40 on: December 04, 2019, 07:24:03 pm »
Some do not believe the freedoms cited in the US Constitution apply equally to both sides. 

And that will be the ultimate downfall of those who choose to selectively use the Constitution for their own purposes.

The only part of the Constitution that they are using is the word "constitution".
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #41 on: December 05, 2019, 07:53:28 am »
@Smokin Joe

That one seems to  have retired hundreds of years ago.
Nah. He's still around.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #42 on: December 05, 2019, 08:27:01 am »
Some do not believe the freedoms cited in the US Constitution apply equally to both sides. 

And that will be the ultimate downfall of those who choose to selectively use the Constitution for their own purposes.

Baloney.   A judge doesn't have the "freedom" to ignore the law.   She made an oath to uphold and follow the law.   If she cannot square that oath with her conscience then she is obliged to resign.   The citizens of Texas are the aggrieved ones here, not this virtue-signaling "judge".   Those citizens have the right to the equal and fair administration of the law, including to marry who they love consistent with the Federal Constitution's guarantee of equal protection.   

Same sex marriage is the law.   Get over it.   
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Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #43 on: December 05, 2019, 08:30:04 am »
  But then we've been here before.   Again and again.  And each and every time, you bring nothing to the table other than your empty insistence that you are right, while denying the very wording of the Constitution of the United States of America.  To hell with your tyranny.

Yeah, right.  *****rollingeyes*****   My  "empty insistence" is only backed up by the Federal Constitution and the United States Supreme Court.

Same sex marriage is the law.  Get over it.   
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #44 on: December 05, 2019, 08:30:25 am »
Baloney.   A judge doesn't have the "freedom" to ignore the law.   She made an oath to uphold and follow the law.   If she cannot square that oath with her conscience then she is obliged to resign.   The citizens of Texas are the aggrieved ones here, not this virtue-signaling "judge".   Those citizens have the right to the equal and fair administration of the law, including to marry who they love consistent with the Federal Constitution's guarantee of equal protection.   

Same sex marriage is the law.   Get over it.
Which law, because it isn't Texas Law.

BTW, homosexuals are still free to marry, just not another person of the same sex. Which is the same rule Heterosexuals have.

Being free to own a car doesn't mean you automatically get a Rolls Royce.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #45 on: December 05, 2019, 08:34:30 am »
Which law, because it isn't Texas Law.

BTW, homosexuals are still free to marry, just not another person of the same sex. Which is the same rule Heterosexuals have.

The cited Texas law is unconstitutional.   You appear to take seriously the notion that your gun rights are defended against encroachment by the Federal Constitution.  If that's the case, then why not this couple's right to marry?   It's the same old story - rights for me but not for thee.   

Let me be clear -  I do not dispute the sincerity of this judge's religious beliefs.  She is entitled to them, same as you or me.  But as an officer of the court, she is obliged to uphold and administer the law,  or else resign if she cannot.   
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #46 on: December 05, 2019, 08:41:13 am »
The cited Texas law is unconstitutional.   You appear to take seriously the notion that your gun rights are defended against encroachment by the Federal Constitution.  If that's the case, then why not this couple's right to marry?   It's the same old story - rights for me but not for thee.   

Let me be clear -  I do not dispute the sincerity of this judge's religious beliefs.  She is entitled to them, same as you or me.  But as an officer of the court, she is obliged to uphold and administer the law,  or else resign if she cannot.   
First and foremost, my gun rights are defended by not just my gun, but the community of people who own guns who similarly will stand up for those rights with whatever means necessary.
Like I said before, this whole thing reeks of targeting a Christian Judge, like homosexuals have targeted Christian Bakers, Photographers, and others in an effort to coerce Christians to apostasy or unemployment.
It's wrong, an abuse of the Constitution, an effort to codify an anti-religion, and I expect you know that. There are plenty of judges in the country, why target this one?
Now if Congress can make no law (with respect to religion), kindly tell me where the courts, which are NOT empowered to make law, can.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #47 on: December 05, 2019, 08:49:24 am »

Like I said before, this whole thing reeks of targeting a Christian Judge, like homosexuals have targeted Christian Bakers, Photographers, and others in an effort to coerce Christians to apostasy or unemployment.

Different issue.  A judge has sworn an oath to uphold the law.   And the law is perfectly clear - same sex marriage is lawful in all states that recognize and afford valuable benefits and protections to the status of civil marriage.

The law is unsettled whether a business owner can discriminate against gays on the basis of religion.   Not so for this judge - her duty under the law is clear.   If that conflicts with her self-perceived duty to God, then she should gladly resign.   What she should not be able to do is victimize the citizens of Texas by administering the law on a selective basis.     
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Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #48 on: December 05, 2019, 08:52:00 am »
First and foremost, my gun rights are defended by not just my gun, but the community of people who own guns who similarly will stand up for those rights with whatever means necessary.

And those rights are also protected by the Federal Constitution, against a state that would otherwise encroach upon them.   I assume you support that.   Again -  why are your rights more deserving of the Constitution's protection than this couple's right to marry?   

It is the hypocrisy that I object to.   
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Texas judge warned over refusal to perform same-sex marriages
« Reply #49 on: December 05, 2019, 08:52:20 am »
Different issue.  A judge has sworn an oath to uphold the law.   And the law is perfectly clear - same sex marriage is lawful in all states that recognize and afford valuable benefits and protections to the status of civil marriage.

The law is unsettled whether a business owner can discriminate against gays on the basis of religion.   Not so for this judge - her duty under the law is clear.   If that conflicts with her self-perceived duty to God, then she should gladly resign.   What she should not be able to do is victimize the citizens of Texas by administering the law on a selective basis.     
Which law?

Texas Law, check!
Yet you say Texas can't make their own laws?
Why, because some judge elsewhere said so?

As I said, If Congress can make no law with respect to religion, why should the courts (which are not empowered to make law) be able to do so?
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis