Help?

[Suppressed]

@Suppressed
Then it is definitely within the OS, all else is eliminated.
It is not in the networking, as there is nowhere to blacklist sites other than the firewall and the HOSTS - Both already confirmed to be ok

Something just hit me... I'm a bit confused about my HOSTS file.  I'm wondering whether I was looking at the right thing. 

It used to be HOSTS.txt was on a main path, but I think my antivirus has it in some protected space, as I'm trying to find where it is, and when I search for Hosts, it shows Hosts.txt and when I right-click/Properties, it says the target is "C:\Users\<userid>\AppData\Local\AVAST Software\Browser\User Data\Default\Extensions\kmediagceboldddnnajkcochbkfkedel\1.14.20.170_0\assets\thirdparties\www.malwaredomainlist.com\hostslist\hosts.txt"

I'm not seeing any other HOSTS file.  Could there be one hidden or something?  I'm trying to remember where to find a "PATH=" to see where it's looking.

Brings me back around to AV, script blockers, adblockers, or some sort of hijacker. Whatever that could be must be over all browsers, or was imported into each.

Yeah.

Here is another thing to try - make another (temporary) user, and try to log in through that... If you can log in though that, then all you have to do is back your data, kill off your real user (deleting files), reboot, and rebuild the user... Probably quicker and better than an overlay install...

I just created another user and it couldn't log in.

If you cannot login through that, then it would seem to me you have a critter, or it has to be AV, or some other overreaching thing.

So...since I've done all kinds of antivirus steps, is the best step now to try to back up or get a new SSD and try to reinstall? 

[Suppressed]

@DB

I've not been following this so forgive me if I ask/say something redundant... Did you backup your computer at all? Do you have any backups you can restore from prior to it going bad? Unless you can identify what caused your problem so you can remove it you won't know for certain if you got rid of it and your computer is really secure. You can copy all your pictures, documents, music, etc off your computer and then scan it all with something reliable to make sure it is clean. Drives are cheap, you can buy a new one and start over while keeping your original drive intact (but not connected to the computer). Yes it really sucks... But if your computer is compromised and you don't know by what your options are pretty limited if you want any certainty it is secure again.

If I'd thought of it, I could probably have done a System Restore, but all the restore points are too young.

I have Carbonite backing up individual files, but nothing for the system...I've been unable to get a good backup system working for me.

You make a good point about drives being cheap.  I'm thinking I might just need to swap out the SSD, and hope the HDD is not relevant.  My big problem is that I'm so disorganized, it's finding all the install stuff.   But you're right, that's probably what I'll have to do...

[DB]

@DB

If I'd thought of it, I could probably have done a System Restore, but all the restore points are too young.

I have Carbonite backing up individual files, but nothing for the system...I've been unable to get a good backup system working for me.

You make a good point about drives being cheap.  I'm thinking I might just need to swap out the SSD, and hope the HDD is not relevant.  My big problem is that I'm so disorganized, it's finding all the install stuff.   But you're right, that's probably what I'll have to do...

If you are certain everything of importance is copied off the drive you can wipe it and start over without buying a new drive. Generally I buy a new drive just be sure that if something was skipped I can still recover it. Or if it all goes wrong I can go back to it. The drive may have another partition setup with a recovery installation. If that's the case it already has all the drivers backed up making re-installation much easier. It still remains possible that the backup installation as been corrupted but that isn't real likely.

You can also buy genuine Win7 installation discs off of Amazon and eBay. I bought 3 copies of Win7 Professional earlier this year...

[roamer_1]

Something just hit me... I'm a bit confused about my HOSTS file.  I'm wondering whether I was looking at the right thing. 

@Suppressed
Sorry so late replying... got on the phne with my kid, and then went to finally make some dinner....

HOSTS is in %windir%\sytem32\drivers\etc\  And it is named HOSTS with no .ext. It is hidden/protected/system, so you have to turn off hidden/protected files  to even see it.

see here:
https://www.petri.com/edit-hosts-file-windows-7
And your AV may be protecting it too - you may need to go into it's options and turn off hosts file protection.

Or use this dohickey:
http://www.abelhadigital.com/hostsman/

Get the portable one (no installer) Unpack to a temp directory on your desktop (or whatever) and run it... no install, delete when you want.
RTFM

I just created another user and it couldn't log in.

So...since I've done all kinds of antivirus steps, is the best step now to try to back up or get a new SSD and try to reinstall?

You might try disabling AV, disabling firewall and see...
You might go back and run EEK as I first recommended.
and if there is in fact a redirect in hosts...

But I can understand that this is becoming laborious. May be time to nuke and pave. That would be your decision.

If you are there, I would recommend the new SSD system drive  - They are quite cheap anymore, and if you are like most of us, a 256g will suit you fine for a system drive...

If your machine is new enough to matter, the performance difference makes it a no-brainer.

And that way, when you are comfortable with the idea that all your data is moved over alright, rub the old drive off and use it for backup and storage.

ALL my system drives are SSD, and the only other thing I would recommend in that case is to redirect your pics and movies into something like /Media/pictures and /Media/Movies on the rearward drive to keep all that fat stuff off your system drive... Likewise your torrent base directory and etc... you know the drill.

[roamer_1]

@Suppressed
Make SURE you have your keys (Windows/Office/etc) before you scrub it.
If you can't find your keys, let me know and I will provide a sniffer to get them out of your system...

[roamer_1]

I have Carbonite backing up individual files, but nothing for the system...I've been unable to get a good backup system working for me.

WAT?

Cobian

But if you're scripty,
FreeFileSync
FreeFileSync is incredible awesomeness. Scriptable batchiness. Beauty day. But not for the faint of heart.

Cobian runs all my big backup stuff, and freesync is for USB backup on my laptop and goofy stuff like special handling for music and picture backups...

[Suppressed]

@Suppressed
Make SURE you have your keys (Windows/Office/etc) before you scrub it.
If you can't find your keys, let me know and I will provide a sniffer to get them out of your system...

Thanks!

I found a text file where I had precisely two keys saved, sniffed from my old installation.  Definitely not what I need!
I've ordered the SSD, and probably won't have time to work on this until Sunday, but will take the scraps of time over the next few days to gather such things.

[Suppressed]

WAT?

Cobian

But if you're scripty,
FreeFileSync
FreeFileSync is incredible awesomeness. Scriptable batchiness. Beauty day. But not for the faint of heart.

Cobian runs all my big backup stuff, and freesync is for USB backup on my laptop and goofy stuff like special handling for music and picture backups...

I had tried Macrium, but not Cobian.  I'll look into it.

[Suppressed]

@Suppressed
Sorry so late replying... got on the phne with my kid, and then went to finally make some dinner....

No problem!  I appreciate all the time you've given me! 

HOSTS is in %windir%\sytem32\drivers\etc\  And it is named HOSTS with no .ext. It is hidden/protected/system, so you have to turn off hidden/protected files  to even see it.

That was what I recalled, and I hate to admit it, but I usually keep all files unhidden (and extensions visible), but I'll have to confirm tonight.

[DB]

No problem!  I appreciate all the time you've given me! 

That was what I recalled, and I hate to admit it, but I usually keep all files unhidden (and extensions visible), but I'll have to confirm tonight.

There are two levels of "hidden" I believe. There are hidden files and hidden system files.

[roamer_1]

Thanks!

I found a text file where I had precisely two keys saved, sniffed from my old installation.  Definitely not what I need!
I've ordered the SSD, and probably won't have time to work on this until Sunday, but will take the scraps of time over the next few days to gather such things.

@Suppressed
Try Enchanted Keyfinder
Portable. Unpack to a temp folder and run it.
If you need it to, it can be directed to an offline system for extraction too, but if you are running within the OS you are sniffing, it is pretty direct. Just run it. Delete (or file away) when done.

For sure does Windows and Office, and some others. It is an Open Source fork off of the ol Magic Jellybean

[roamer_1]

No problem!  I appreciate all the time you've given me! 

That was what I recalled, and I hate to admit it, but I usually keep all files unhidden (and extensions visible), but I'll have to confirm tonight.

LOL! I always have extensions visible... That's how I identify files... I still couldn't tell you what the little icons are... Every client machine goes out of here with extensions visible.

But I don't mess with hidden and system files... I keep a separate file manager set to see all files, and leave the Windows file manager with all that hidden...

[Suppressed]

There are two levels of "hidden" I believe. There are hidden files and hidden system files.

Thanks!


In any case, yeah, I had checked the right HOSTS, and it has nothing added.

[Suppressed]

@Suppressed
Try Enchanted Keyfinder
Portable. Unpack to a temp folder and run it.
If you need it to, it can be directed to an offline system for extraction too, but if you are running within the OS you are sniffing, it is pretty direct. Just run it. Delete (or file away) when done.

For sure does Windows and Office, and some others. It is an Open Source fork off of the ol Magic Jellybean

Thanks, @roamer_1  Will do!

[roamer_1]

Thanks, @roamer_1  Will do!

btw @Suppressed , realize that all keyfinders are gonna show up in AV as a bug... They don't want you sniffing your keys... So disable AV or exclude a folder in your AV and run it from there.

FYI

[Suppressed]

Update:
The wireless connection did nothing for me.  I spent time over the weekend trying to get stuff backed up.  I found that several keys weren't ripped by Enchanted, so I was going around trying to be sure I could find them or the license files.

Bottom line, I still haven't done my reinstall.

The curious side of me wonders whether I could install an e-mail client and access my mail that way.  You know, like the old Outlook, Pegasus, or whatever.  Anyone got any recommendations for one of those?

[dfwgator]

[roamer_1]

Update:
The wireless connection did nothing for me.  I spent time over the weekend trying to get stuff backed up.  I found that several keys weren't ripped by Enchanted, so I was going around trying to be sure I could find them or the license files.

Bottom line, I still haven't done my reinstall.

The curious side of me wonders whether I could install an e-mail client and access my mail that way.  You know, like the old Outlook, Pegasus, or whatever.  Anyone got any recommendations for one of those?

Yes. I use thunderbird.
Mozilla mo'bedda.

https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/

Should hook right up to MS
Needs an addon to get to Google.

Get the lightning addon if it doesn't come preinstalled - That gives you PIM capabilities, though accessing calendars for google and MS require more addons.

[Suppressed]

Yes. I use thunderbird.
Mozilla mo'bedda.

https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/

Should hook right up to MS
Needs an addon to get to Google.

Get the lightning addon if it doesn't come preinstalled - That gives you PIM capabilities, though accessing calendars for google and MS require more addons.

@roamer_1

Wow...what service!    
Can't tell you how much I appreciate your help, and that of everyone here!

[roamer_1]

@roamer_1

Wow...what service!    
Can't tell you how much I appreciate your help, and that of everyone here!

@Suppressed
No problemo. Holler if you need a hand setting it up... But it should go pretty automagically.

[Cyber Liberty]

Yes. I use thunderbird.
Mozilla mo'bedda.

https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/

Should hook right up to MS
Needs an addon to get to Google.

Get the lightning addon if it doesn't come preinstalled - That gives you PIM capabilities, though accessing calendars for google and MS require more addons.

I like T'bird.  I just installed that app, none of the other stuff like Lightning.  Works great!

[roamer_1]

I like T'bird.  I just installed that app, none of the other stuff like Lightning.  Works great!

Here's a tip:
If you are stuck w/ POP3 service for your mail, move the TBird data from where it is kept to somewhere in your backup chain. Both Firefox and Thunderbird's data reside in subfolders of %user%\Archives\ on my machines, and that is always backed up with my user profile. And it makes t far easier to sync between machines.

If you hook up MAPI (which most are anymore) then it is not necessary, as MAPI data is physically kept on the server... Even so, moving the data file where you can get at it is a good idea... Same can be done for outlook, too.

The really beauty part of that, and why I like Mozilla so much, is fresh installs. Push your crap onboard, fire up Moz products in profilemanager mode, point em at their data, and DONE. All your settings are in, all your history, preferences, addons... all of it is right the way you left it.

[Suppressed]

Sounds good!

[Elderberry]

@roamer_1 has it right! I stepped up to Thunderbird from Pegasus so long ago I can't even remember. And I don't keep messages on the server.

[Cyber Liberty]

Here's a tip:
If you are stuck w/ POP3 service for your mail, move the TBird data from where it is kept to somewhere in your backup chain. Both Firefox and Thunderbird's data reside in subfolders of %user%\Archives\ on my machines, and that is always backed up with my user profile. And it makes t far easier to sync between machines.

If you hook up MAPI (which most are anymore) then it is not necessary, as MAPI data is physically kept on the server... Even so, moving the data file where you can get at it is a good idea... Same can be done for outlook, too.

The really beauty part of that, and why I like Mozilla so much, is fresh installs. Push your crap onboard, fire up Moz products in profilemanager mode, point em at their data, and DONE. All your settings are in, all your history, preferences, addons... all of it is right the way you left it.

I'll have to look at my Thunderbird setup when I get home.  I know my provider has help pages that will tell me what I have...

Is it worth it for me to get Lightning working?  When I first got the T-bird, I didn't find the help pages about setting it up very helpful.

[roamer_1]

I'll have to look at my Thunderbird setup when I get home.  I know my provider has help pages that will tell me what I have...

Is it worth it for me to get Lightning working?  When I first got the T-bird, I didn't find the help pages about setting it up very helpful.

Yeah... Lightning is alright... I run my cal out of google these days, and the google addon handles that great... But I am a ToDo guy - useless w/o lists, and a lot of the tasking gets broke going to google tasks. Currently working all that through my phone anymore, using reminders and lists... which sucks, pretty much. I need a better way. 

[Suppressed]

So much for my bright idea.  Whatever is blocking browsers from contacting the login server is evidently blocking Thunderbird, too.  It's just sitting and spinning as it's "Checking password" when I try to set up the (IMAP) account.

Grrrr...  Guess I have to swap out the SDD.

So... can these SATA drives be daisy-chained or something, or am I limited to just 4 drives?  (Sorry for such a basic question...)   

[roamer_1]

So much for my bright idea.  Whatever is blocking browsers from contacting the login server is evidently blocking Thunderbird, too.  It's just sitting and spinning as it's "Checking password" when I try to set up the (IMAP) account.

Grrrr...  Guess I have to swap out the SDD.

So... can these SATA drives be daisy-chained or something, or am I limited to just 4 drives?  (Sorry for such a basic question...)

@Suppressed
SATA is one per cable. No daisy-chaining.
But you could go get a controller card... My server here has 6 on the board and four more on a promise card.

Did you ever try killing the firewall and AV to see if there's joy?
What about recently added security programs that may be blocking the access?

And I will mention EEK again... 

[Suppressed]

@Suppressed
SATA is one per cable. No daisy-chaining.
But you could go get a controller card... My server here has 6 on the board and four more on a promise card.

Cool.  I'm thinking that I might want to set up a card, then, with a large internal drive for automated backups.  When I get there . . . 

Did you ever try killing the firewall and AV to see if there's joy?

I had tried killing Avast's shields and no luck.  But I just realized I hadn't checked Windows Firewall. 

I went into the Control Panel to that listing, and it's not letting me select "Turn the Firewall on or off".  Gonna reboot to see.

What about recently added security programs that may be blocking the access?

 

I think I killed all and tried.  No luck.

And I will mention EEK again... 

No joy with EEK.  It found nothing.

[Suppressed]

iPhone 6 s plus. Pink

Did you get it all worked out so you don't have an exploding phone, @Freya?

[Suppressed]

I had tried killing Avast's shields and no luck.  But I just realized I hadn't checked Windows Firewall. 

I went into the Control Panel to that listing, and it's not letting me select "Turn the Firewall on or off".  Gonna reboot to see.

Okay, now the firewall is off and it says it's being managed by Avast.  When I turned off Avast, it stayed down, but still no luck.

[Cyber Liberty]

Okay, now the firewall is off and it says it's being managed by Avast.  When I turned off Avast, it stayed down, but still no luck.

Avast may have buried itself in your boot sector.  I'm not sure, but rebuilding from a recovery drive might get rid of that.  I have shit like that buried in mine, but I'm afraid to try it.

[Snarknado]

I switched to TBird when WLM bit the dust, and I'm reasonably happy with it. It manages 8 accounts, all Live or Outlook, so not sure how good it is with non-MS accounts. The filter rules could be improved, like optionally applying on a delayed basis instead of immediately on receipt...

[Suppressed]

Avast may have buried itself in your boot sector.  I'm not sure, but rebuilding from a recovery drive might get rid of that.  I have shit like that buried in mine, but I'm afraid to try it.

Looks like I'd better just follow @DB 's suggestion and do a fresh install.

Wow, I've put a lot of things on this machine.  I'm realizing now how many stupid disks (Bluetooth adapter, etc.) I hope I have! 

[roamer_1]

Okay, now the firewall is off and it says it's being managed by Avast.  When I turned off Avast, it stayed down, but still no luck.

I am running out of bullets @Suppressed . Try uninstalling Avast for the moment, and let the thing come back up with only Windows Firewall, and if still no joy, try disabling Windows firewall.. If that ain't it, I am hanging up my guns. 

[DB]

Looks like I'd better just follow @DB 's suggestion and do a fresh install.

Wow, I've put a lot of things on this machine.  I'm realizing now how many stupid disks (Bluetooth adapter, etc.) I hope I have! 

The real problem is, you can't trust that your machine is secure if you can't definitively find and resolve the problem. You probably shouldn't go get new drivers with the same compromised machine. If you have another computer that is clean, use it to go online to download drivers for the compromised machine. Anything executable is suspect coming from the old machine.

Good luck!

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

The real problem is, you can't trust that your machine is secure if you can't definitively find and resolve the problem. You probably shouldn't go get new drivers with the same compromised machine. If you have another computer that is clean, use it to go online to download drivers for the compromised machine. Anything executable is suspect coming from the old machine.

Good luck!

And if you can't trust the (potentially) compromised machine, you can't trust it to properly install drivers downloaded from another machine.  Nuke from orbit.

[LegalAmerican]

Google is the culprit.  Support TRUMP, and he will fix this next.  BIG CORPS. BEING BIG BROTHER.  OR  you could keep shooting yourselves in the foot.  Ego is tough to over come, for good of the country.

[DB]

And if you can't trust the (potentially) compromised machine, you can't trust it to properly install drivers downloaded from another machine.  Nuke from orbit.

He's starting over with a clean drive. The point was to not use drivers download on the same machine prior to doing the new, clean installation.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

He's starting over with a clean drive. The point was to not use drivers download on the same machine prior to doing the new, clean installation.

Okay, great point.

[Suppressed]

Spent last night starting a fresh install with brand new SSD (thank goodness prices have come way down).
 
I almost choked when it had trouble connecting to hotmail even on the fresh install, but it seems that was just a momentary glitch.   

With zillions of reboots necessary, gotta love SSD!

But it's not acting very smooth... hanging on log off, etc.  So I think I might just start it from scratch again. 

I haven't used any drivers from compromised machine...just license key information.  It's a fresh Windows 7 Professional install.

When I was going through the Windows Updates, I didn't do any of the optional Windows ones -- no, I DON'T want Windows 10!


Thank you all for being there while I go through this.  I used to do installs in my sleep, but this brain is old and leaky!

[roamer_1]

Spent last night starting a fresh install with brand new SSD (thank goodness prices have come way down).
 
I almost choked when it had trouble connecting to hotmail even on the fresh install, but it seems that was just a momentary glitch.   

But it's not acting very smooth... hanging on log off, etc.  So I think I might just start it from scratch again. 

@Suppressed
To be expected... Especially if you are installing from a Win7 Pro gold iso instead of a Win7 SP1...

Don't judge it until the updates are done.

If you do rub it off and start over, try this:
https://softlay.net/operating-system/windows-7-all-in-one-iso-free-download-32-64-bit.html

Not a hack. You will have an extra little bit to go through... Be sure to select for both type (home, pro, etc) AND 32/64bit, as it will do any of them. This IS for sure, an SP1 disk, and may contain quite a few of the updates since.

If you know how to put it on a bootable thumb, it stores much better, and goes much faster.

after install, have chipset, vid, and nic drivers ready, and put them in first. MS Essentials as AV till you are all the way in... It suffices, and you won't be dealing with any errant takeovers of firewall and such

Then let it update fully... you can install other drivers along the way, but most will probably come in on the update stream. Then deal with whatever other drivers are left.

It WILL be hinky until all the way updated.
And optional updates are fine - necessary if drivers. I would encourage driver installation that way, because the driver is pinned to certain updates being present before the driver update is presented to you.

Addendum: Upgrades are vastly decreased AFTER SP1 if you have the distributable Internet Explorer 11 (I think 11 was the last one that works on 7) and latest WiMP (Windows Media Player) distributable on hand.

[Suppressed]

@Suppressed
To be expected... Especially if you are installing from a Win7 Pro gold iso instead of a Win7 SP1...

Don't judge it until the updates are done.

If you do rub it off and start over, try this:
https://softlay.net/operating-system/windows-7-all-in-one-iso-free-download-32-64-bit.html

Not a hack. You will have an extra little bit to go through... Be sure to select for both type (home, pro, etc) AND 32/64bit, as it will do any of them. This IS for sure, an SP1 disk, and may contain quite a few of the updates since.

If you know how to put it on a bootable thumb, it stores much better, and goes much faster.

after install, have chipset, vid, and nic drivers ready, and put them in first. MS Essentials as AV till you are all the way in... It suffices, and you won't be dealing with any errant takeovers of firewall and such

Then let it update fully... you can install other drivers along the way, but most will probably come in on the update stream. Then deal with whatever other drivers are left.

It WILL be hinky until all the way updated.
And optional updates are fine - necessary if drivers. I would encourage driver installation that way, because the driver is pinned to certain updates being present before the driver update is presented to you.

Addendum: Upgrades are vastly decreased AFTER SP1 if you have the distributable Internet Explorer 11 (I think 11 was the last one that works on 7) and latest WiMP (Windows Media Player) distributable on hand.

I'm using a GEN-U-INE Micro$oft Win 7 Pro 64-bit with SP1 (for OEM) DVD.  I didn't even let it install IE11 yet...I'm still waiting for it to finish the Important Upgrades.  It evidently hung trying to install the upgrades, as I let it continue overnight and it still hadn't finished.   



I'm thinking that I should gather up all those drivers like you suggest and redo the install if it keeps up, but I'll see if it calms down before giving up and doing that yet.  I goofed and did AV first, so maybe that was one of my problems.

But that's interesting what you said about some drivers being pinned to the updates.  The optionals I did do were Intel ones, monitor...anything but MS.

Okay, you've calmed me down.

[roamer_1]

I'm using a GEN-U-INE Micro$oft Win 7 Pro 64-bit with SP1 (for OEM) DVD.  I didn't even let it install IE11 yet...I'm still waiting for it to finish the Important Upgrades.  It evidently hung trying to install the upgrades, as I let it continue overnight and it still hadn't finished. 

@Suppressed
Likely update busted itself. That is a frequent or at least common occurrence. Win7 is getting pretty long in the tooth, and MS is not dedicating very much resource into maintaining its gigantic database. I think that is purposeful - By now, they easily could have released an SP-2 with all of these updates already knitted in, but I think they purposefully make it a PIA.

A LOT of the important updates are contained in the IE and Media Player subsystems, so even if you have to go get the full feature distributables, Getting them shoehorned in there solves a bunch of problems. One thing that comes with them is DotNet, which is a butt-ton of the update train. Since DotNet is specific to IE versions, shoving in the newest avoids not only all the IE upgrades, but all the multiple DotNet upgrades per version that inherently go with it.

You may find it easier to just upgrade to Win10... I bailed on Seven a long time ago, just because the install is so unmanageable (see associated PM).

I'm thinking that I should gather up all those drivers like you suggest and redo the install if it keeps up, but I'll see if it calms down before giving up and doing that yet.  I goofed and did AV first, so maybe that was one of my problems.

But that's interesting what you said about some drivers being pinned to the updates.  The optionals I did do were Intel ones, monitor...anything but MS.

Okay, you've calmed me down.

Yeah... AV products are super integrated anymore - especially AV suites that invade firewall and browser, and every other little thing. MSEssentials, while not as effective, plays nice with MS stuff and so, stays out of the way.

As far as optionals are concerned, I do em all - There are some that are specific to particular hardware, and without some serious study, you may be foregoing a fix that your specific machine needs to install and function properly. 

[DB]

I'm using a GEN-U-INE Micro$oft Win 7 Pro 64-bit with SP1 (for OEM) DVD.  I didn't even let it install IE11 yet...I'm still waiting for it to finish the Important Upgrades.  It evidently hung trying to install the upgrades, as I let it continue overnight and it still hadn't finished.   



I'm thinking that I should gather up all those drivers like you suggest and redo the install if it keeps up, but I'll see if it calms down before giving up and doing that yet.  I goofed and did AV first, so maybe that was one of my problems.

But that's interesting what you said about some drivers being pinned to the updates.  The optionals I did do were Intel ones, monitor...anything but MS.

Okay, you've calmed me down.

There's a bug in the original Win7 with updates. I think the patch was included with SP1 but you have to have it on disc with the installation before doing online updates. When the backlog of updates exceeds some threshold it breaks the update process and it will never complete them. There's a couple of MS patches to fix it. I'm trying to find my notes...

[Suppressed]

Well, I've got Win 10 running.  Thanks to everyone, and some additional applause to @roamer_1  for helping me via PM, too.

Still am puzzled why I can't just hook up my old SSD and get it to boot anymore, but I'm looking forward and didn't lose too much.  My next step is to figure out how to set up a nice backup system!

[roamer_1]

Well, I've got Win 10 running.  Thanks to everyone, and some additional applause to @roamer_1  for helping me via PM, too.

Still am puzzled why I can't just hook up my old SSD and get it to boot anymore, but I'm looking forward and didn't lose too much.  My next step is to figure out how to set up a nice backup system!

Happy to help - Glad you are sorted out.

[Wingnut]

FWIW.  My problem with Vista running Chrome has been corrected.  I started using the Avast Browser.

[Elderberry]

I'm glad to hear you're machine is back up and running. I know how extremely frustrating computer problems can be.

For backups I've been using Macrium Reflect, though it can be confusing to set up and use.

https://www.business.com/reviews/macrium-reflect/

Macrium Reflect received a C for ease of use during the backup process. It’s easy to see from the interface's design that the app isn’t made for someone who has never backed up a computer before. The homepage displays the various disks, volumes and partitions under the Create a Backup tab, rather than focusing on backing up specific folders and files. This poses a significant learning curve for novices, as they’re unlikely to know what these terms mean, much less want to back up entire disks, volumes or partitions. That said, creating a backup set is relatively easy, though it takes about 11 steps. Users with advanced technical knowledge will likely prefer this design.

In contrast, the restore process received a B+ for ease of use. While the backup process has many steps, the restore process has just four. There are some minor learning curves – additional options in the steps and an interface designed for an advanced user – but a novice can restore their files without much trouble.

Macrium Reflect’s best feature is its backup and restore performance. Both phases received an A- for speed. While the software wasn't the fastest at processing data, it was close. In addition, it didn't hog resources, receiving an above-average grade for CPU usage in both phases.

[roamer_1]

If we are going to get into Backup, I think it deserves its own thread....

But I will say this...
Storage is cheap.

Never rely on a single set - multiple means, multiple chains, especially when dealing with automated systems.

Image-style backups are less robust than raw copied files. an Imaged set is very convenient, restoring with ease... But it is in the end, a single file - and if a single file becomes corrupted, for all intents and purposes, all my be lost. Raw copied files must be restored more laboriously, but if a file becomes corrupt, that file is lost, and the rest are still there.

Not that an imaged set is not to be used - It can be one means, one chain... But it is not as reliable as raw copy.

Off Machine, Off Network and Off Site should all be goals, in that order of importance.