Comments below in bold teal.
@QuixQuix, when you post a thread, you are inviting people to respond and they, including me, may not agree with some of your positions. If you don’t want to support your conclusions, as you say, “I have spent probably 30-40 years of the 55 years I've studied such topics trying to offer the best reasons and arguments for my perspectives as I could. In recent years, I've come to the conviction that I not only need to move on, I have moved on from needing to do that for much of any reason. It's become too tedious and too boring and too much a waste of time compared to other prioritiesâ€, t
hen don’t post a thread.
THANKS for your kind reply. I understand your reasoning. It's just not my perspective.
I'm mostly done with, weary of, tired of tediously trying to support a lot of historical stuff--particularly when it has little chance of influencing the questioner anyway. It makes more sense to me to put my energy toward the parts that I don't yet know enough about. It makes more sense to me to try and sort out with bright, thoughtful, articulate folks the things I still have curiosities, questions about. I want a co-speculator sounding board, I guess.
Since you are the master of your posting, I suppose you could remove any disagreement someone posted, thus leaving your original post as the only writing on the thread unless a person agreed with all you post.
I think you know me well enough to know that's not my style or preference. Besides, that wouldn't be very meaningful; wouldn't achieve a lot very useful; wouldn't be iron-sharpening-iron etc.
You want responses, but only responses that agree with you so you “move on...†as “it has become too tedious and too boring and too much a waste of time…�
I think you know me better than that. I learn most from folks who disagree with me.
It is no longer useful or interesting to me to rehash for the 3,000th time historic stuff that I'm confident of my conclusions on to such a degree--that I'm very skeptical that almost anyone I'm discussing those things with would be likely to add anything new and meaningful.
I want to move on and discuss things that I'm still quite tentative and speculative about.
You said, “So far, we seem to have spent a fair amount of time with me trying somewhat to document why I believe as I do. I can understand that. It would be easier if we could pretend that a given set of assumptions were true and go from there.â€
If I cannot agree to your set of assumptions, and tell you why, if would be folly for me to falsely agree with you so we can “go from thereâ€.
I understand your stance, I think. That's disappointing but understandable.
My stance is somewhat like . . .
Dear Precious Colleague, here we have this extremely complex machine that was found deep in a salt mine in the midwest. We know a fair amount about what the machine can do. We know it can do these 12 things. But what I want to spend our time about is not where the machine comes from; not who made the machine; and not a great deal even about proving its capabilities.
I'd rather start with this list of proven capabilities--which I'd ask you to temporarily accept on faith for now--and let's move on and talk about the IMPLICATIONS of this machine's THEREFORE THEN, LIKELY impacts on our society.
We both agree the end times are coming, as said in the Bible. That is the bed rock of what I believe. I think it is near, as upon us at this time. I used natural occurrences being worse than ever before, to reach this conclusion, plus human wickedness worse than ever before. It does not take aliens from outer space, reptile people, and an alien city or alien air base under the south pole to bring this about. Human nature without God is bringing this about.
That's probably a reasonable assertion. Though I think we can say that God set the whole object lesson of earth, Adam and Eve, etc. etc. demonstrating to all Creation that even the best culture and form of government in all of history--apart from God--would still descend into evil, manipulated by the Dark Lord. That the only LIFE and source of life MUST occur in an eternal dance with God our Father, Yehovah.
I
see this as simple as the Bible/Jesus says, you seem to need outer space aliens and reptile people, New World Order people, cities under the ice, to bring this about. I will stay with simple rather than concoct illusions.
I'm surprised you seem to misunderstand me on that score.
I don't NEED any such set of things. I 'need' to discuss the plausible possibilities, the probabilities and the highly likely truth.
The critters etc. all AROSE, FOR ME, STRICTLY OUT OF THE DATA. So, I feel compelled to deal with the data--the facts as they appear at this point in time--FROM THE DATA.
I understand that your inclinations, preferences, stance is MUCH MORE grounded strictly in tangible super proven 'realities.'
With this said, I don’t doubt there are unidentified flying objects (UFOs). My position is they are real, but they don’t direct the end days – it is human behavior against God that brings this about.
Yes, the government allowed this latest UFO film to be released and there may be more coming as some believe.
I can go much of that distance with you--to the point that I agree that sinful deeds and nature of mankind results in consequences from God.
Nevertheless, the script of the end times was written by God millennia ago.
UFO little people are not going to take over the world. It is imagination that is running wild about who is in these UFOs and imagination that says their plan is to destroy the world.
I think that's a bit of a big set of assumptions.
1. God declares in Scripture that the oligarchy including with satan incarnate with his fallen angels WILL BE in overt control of all nations for 3.5-7 years. That's a Biblical fact.
2. No, it is NOT sourced merely in such folks' imaginations. It is sourced in EXTENSIVE reviews of a huge amount of data, puzzle pieces, written and other records from many centuries ago to and through the present.
3. The globalists stated at least 100-200 years ago exactly what their goals were and what they would do to get there. I've often posted links to such quotes in their own words. Their plans are exactly consistent with what the Bible says will be true of the evil global government of the end times.
4. THOSE GOALS AND STRATEGIES are emphatically consistent with tons of puzzle pieces from and about the critters--their doings (such that Dr Jacques Vallee asserts they are serving as a CONTROL FUNCTION over our culture and planet. His PhD and related experiences entitle him to speak of that as one of the world's top experts on CONTROL functions.) Actually a significant amount of evidence suggests that the critters have BEEN in control of the oligarchy for quite some time, already.
5. Their goals regarding trashing humanity are also consistent with the Biblical record AS WELL AS extensive puzzle pieces derived from the data from a large number of diverse sources. This aspect is a heavily conflicted topic whereon UFO experts differ widely. I'm comfortable with my conclusions, however--very confident about them.
6. I do not know anyone asserting that they are going to 'destroy the world.' The Biblical record is clear that's not going to be allowed. They may well try--that would be consistent with their boss's values and vengeance--but God won't let them succeed.
When I have a bit of time, I will post Jesus’ words explaining/describing the coming of the end. He is not on YouTube.
THAT, essentially, has to come from Matthew 24.
Matthew 24New Living Translation (NLT) Jesus Speaks about the Future24 As Jesus was leaving the Temple grounds, his disciples pointed out to him the various Temple buildings.
2 But he responded, “Do you see all these buildings? I tell you the truth, they will be completely demolished. Not one stone will be left on top of another!â€
3 Later, Jesus sat on the Mount of Olives. His disciples came to him privately and said, “Tell us, when will all this happen? What sign will
signal your return and the end of the world {
as we have known it}?
a]">[a]â€
4 Jesus told them, “Don’t let anyone mislead you,
5 for many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah.’ They will deceive many.
6 And you will hear of wars and threats of wars, but don’t panic. Yes, these things must take place, but the end won’t follow immediately.
7 Nation will go to war against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in many parts of the world.
8 But all this is
only the first of the birth pains, with more to come.9 “Then you will be arrested, persecuted, and killed. You will be hated all over the world because you are my followers.
b]">[b] 10 And many will turn away from me and betray and hate each other.
11 And many false prophets will appear and will deceive many people.
12 Sin will be rampant everywhere, and the love of many will grow cold. 13 But the one who endures to the end will be saved. 14 And the Good News about the Kingdom will be preached throughout the whole world, so that all nationsc]">[c] {some experts say language groups; tribal groups; people groups} will hear it; and then the end will come.15 “The day is coming when you will see what Daniel the prophet spoke about—
the sacrilegious object that causes desecrationd]">[d] standing in the Holy Place.†(Reader, pay attention!) 16 “Then those in Judea must flee to the hills. 17 A person out on the deck of a roof must not go down into the house to pack. 18 A person out in the field must not return even to get a coat. 19 How terrible it will be for pregnant women and for nursing mothers in those days. 20 And pray that your flight will not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For there will be greater anguish than at any time since the world began. And it will never be so great again. 22 In fact,
unless that time of calamity is shortened, not a single person will survive. But it will be shortened for the sake of God’s chosen ones.23 “Then if anyone tells you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah,’ or ‘There he is,’ don’t believe it.
24 For false messiahs and false prophets will rise up and perform great signs and wonders so as to deceive, if possible, even God’s chosen ones.
25 See, I have warned you about this ahead of time.
26 “So if someone tells you, ‘Look, the Messiah is out in the desert,’ don’t bother to go and look. Or, ‘Look, he is hiding here,’ don’t believe it!
27 For as the lightning flashes in the east and shines to the west, so it will be when the Son of Man
e]">[e] comes.
28 Just as the gathering of vultures shows there is a carcass nearby, so these signs indicate that the end is near.
f]">[f]29 “Immediately
after the anguish of those days,
the sun will be darkened,
the moon will give no light,
the stars will fall from the sky,
and the powers in the heavens will be shaken.g]">[g] 30 And then at last, the
sign that the Son of Man is coming will appear in the heavens, and there will be deep mourning among all the peoples of the earth. And they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.h]">[h] 31 {Most of the scholars I respect consider that to be the 2nd coming of Christ coming to rule from Jerusalem after Armageddon--NOT the coming as a thief in the night coming at The Rapture.And he will send out his angels with the mighty blast of a trumpet, and they will gather his chosen ones from all over the world
i]">[i]—from the farthest ends of the earth and heaven.
32 “Now learn a lesson from the fig tree. When its branches bud and its leaves begin to sprout, you know that summer is near.
33 In the same way, when you {who see these events begin will as a group, cohort, will still be alive--at least some representives of the group--when the final events occur} see all these things, you can know his return is very near, right at the door. 34 I tell you the truth, this generationj]">[j] {which sees such things begin} will not pass from the scene until all these things take place. 35 Heaven and earth will disappear, but my words will never disappear.36 “However, no one knows
the day or hour when these things will happen, not even the angels in heaven or the Son himself.k]">[k] Only the Father knows. {That does NOT say we won't know the season or year or even month or week.}
37 “When the Son of Man returns, it will be like it was in Noah’s day.
38 In those days before the flood, the people were enjoying banquets and parties and weddings right up to the time Noah entered his boat.
39 People didn’t realize what was going to happen until the flood came and swept them all away. That is the way it will be when the Son of Man comes.40 “Two men will be working together in the field; one will be taken, the other left.
41 Two women will be grinding flour at the mill; one will be taken, the other left.
42 “So you, too, must keep watch! For you don’t know what day your Lord is coming.
43 Understand this: If a homeowner knew exactly when a burglar was coming, he would keep watch and not permit his house to be broken into.
44 You also must be ready all the time, for the Son of Man will come when least expected.45 “A faithful, sensible servant is one to whom the master can give the responsibility of managing his other household servants and feeding them.
46 If the master returns and finds that the servant has done a good job, there will be a reward.
47 I tell you the truth, the master will put that servant in charge of all he owns.
48 But what if the servant is evil and thinks, ‘My master won’t be back for a while,’
49 and he begins beating the other servants, partying, and getting drunk?
50 The master will return unannounced and unexpected, 51 and he will cut the servant to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Footnotes:
New Living Translation (NLT) Holy Bible, New Living Translation, copyright © 1996, 2004, 2007, 2013, 2015 by Tyndale House Foundation. Used by permission of
Tyndale House Publishers Inc., Carol Stream, Illinois 60188. All rights reserved.
= = = = =
You said, “I have wondered HOW different God's timeline on the beginning of the horrific period was compared to satan's. I have always assumed satan wanted to rush such things but that God would hold him back to whatever unknown degree.â€
The Bible says the end times will come ONLY after the Word is known to all. I can look up that scripture. With missionaries and travel possible to all parts of the world, plus TV, the internet allowing information across the world, we are likely at this point. The Word is available to all now.
Uhhhh. Evidently not. Else the Rapture would likely have already taken place. ALL language groups do not quite yet have the Scripture in their language. There is a group in Albuquerque who is working to complete that task ASAP. They are translating the Bible into each remaining people group's language and putting the oral Scriptures on an MP3 player that is both solar and wind-up and designed to last many years.
They seek out "THE MAN OF PEACE" in the tribe and make an agreement with him to play 30 minutes of the Scriptures and then have 30 minutes of discussion per week. That's all. That's it. Many Acts 2 type churches have spontaneously sprung up from their efforts. I think the keywords to search is PROCLAIMER and Albuquerque translation outreach.
“Mark Taylor agrees that our prayers make lots of differences in events and in enlisting God's aid etc. He also asserts that while WW3 may well be likely--he doesn't think it will be any time soon.â€
I believe, with Trump in office, WWIII will happen and not in the distant future.
I still think you are wrong about Trump. Shrillery in office would likely have already had us in war as she openly asserted she WOULD ATTACK IRAN. Her rage-aholic nature is far scarier than any of Trump's flaws by several orders of magnitude, imho.
In any case, we will find out in due course how soon WW3 begins. North Korea is not a comforting anything.
“So, I'm in the process of trying to integrate, accommodate the information he offers with my prior perspectives, conclusions, assumptions, conjectures and expectations re the end times. That's necessitating some significant changes. I think they will be good changes--though surprising-to-me changes.â€
See, you cannot be concrete in your thinking – you have to adjust; therefore, your writing will adjust.
I disagree. I can be quite concrete in my thinking. Perhaps not to your criteria in all respects. However, most folks who know me think I'm a very concrete thinker.
Adjusting gets back to George Kelly's role construct theory:
ONE PROGRAM on the net where one can fill out one's own grid and get the resulting cluster chart/map
https://www.psyctc.org/grids/ingrid1.html
http://www.lis.ntu.edu.tw/cisap2010/Abstracts_files/ds08.pdf
https://www.uxmatters.com/mt/archives/2007/12/the-repertory-grid-eliciting-user-experience-comparisons-in-the-customers-voice.php
http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/showciting?cid=575866
I can't find the best such online program but the top link is likely close to it.
You asserted that I have to adjust . . .
Actually, we all do. If we don't our construct system is tooooo rigid, narrow, brittle to have optimum predicitve usefulness. Our construct grids do best at the mind-point between adjusting too often, too easily on the basis of too little information vs rarely to never regardless of any evidence.
The grid is the MOST valid and the MOST reliable instrument available per a massive research study of my Dissertation chairman's. It out performed all others including the MMPI and all other well known instruments.
It is very sensitive to SIGNIFICANT events in the person's life--which might be 'merely' mental events. Yet, it is reliable, consistent over time with the individual's true construct system with which they perceive, interpret and predict events in their daily life.
You are adjusting according to what a human says.
Yes & no--TO THE DEGREE that The Lord, events, puzzle pieces more or less clearly affirm sufficient reason to make such an adjustment, yes. Then adjust. But not for shallow reasons or based on poor evidence.
Any human writing must be compared to the Bible in these matters. Jesus says others will come pretending to be Him and not to believe these people. There will be false information people will believe. If it is not Biblical, I’m not believing it.
CERTAINLY THE BIBLE IS THE STANDARD OF TRUTH AND IF THINGS DON'T LINE UP WITH SCRIPTURE, SOMETHING IS DREADFULLY WRONG.
Nevertheless, there's tons of stuff the Bible does not clearly speak to much at all, if at all.
= = = = different topic = = = thought experiment about forming a different social, governmental structure.
“And I'd set up a secret panel to research and select leaders--either directly for the positions or to run as candidates before the people--based primarily on the above factors plus skills needed for their particular slated leadership roles.â€
Here is a truism – two people can agree; three people will divide into two against the other one – the more people the more disagreement Your secret panel will choose people according to their wants for themselves – that is human nature. Your secret panel will be corrupt.
Your friend to the end.
I think the design of my suggestions took human flaws greatly into account and sought to minimize their impacts. I'm surprised you didn't note that.
Thanks for your meaty and kind responses.