Author Topic: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report  (Read 10156 times)

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Offline Sanguine

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #100 on: November 29, 2017, 09:56:04 pm »

I researched the issue for many years after 2008.   I and others found information of which I don't believe a lot of people have been made aware.   


I also found an explanation as to how the current belief system (Jus Soli)  became so popular,  even though it is incorrect.

I would be very interested in seeing what you found. 

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #101 on: November 29, 2017, 10:37:13 pm »
I would be very interested in seeing what you found.


I think we had a thread about this in the last year,   but at the time,  people didn't seem very interested in it.   


The most interesting thing that was found (by freeper rxsid)  was this.   





This is from a Pennsylvania Law book that was widely circulated (1817) and was written by a member of the Pennsylvania legislature (William Lewis) that ratified the Constitution.    In 1787,  the Capital of the United States was Philadelphia,  which is exactly where William Lewis practiced law.   




The US Constitution was written in Independence Hall,  which was otherwise known as the "Pennsylvania State House"  which is where the Pennsylvania legislature sat.   




As a member of the Pennsylvania legislature which ratified the Constitution,  William Lewis should have known exactly what was meant by "natural born citizen."

This book was republished again in 1840,  and with no changes made to the sections on Aliens born in the US.   


I will further point out that the book is not merely the "opinion"  of William Lewis,  it is the consequence of a report issued by the Pennsylvania Supreme court regarding what English laws should  be included in the common law.

This report was issued at the request of the Pennsylvania state legislature in 1808. 





William Lewis simply compiled this report into book form and published it.   
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 10:42:23 pm by DiogenesLamp »
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Offline the_doc

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #102 on: November 29, 2017, 10:41:52 pm »
@Sanguine

He likely no longer has it,  (even though he mentioned seeing it in his book)  or if he still has it,  it doesn't doesn't support the narrative that he was born in Hawaii. 


The book was ghosted by Bill Ayers.  This is pretty easy to demonstrate.  Considering that fact, it is obvious that the book was intended as propaganda in a genuine Communist conspiracy. 

We should therefore notice which chapter was the centerpiece of this conspiratorial book.  I say it was the chapter about finding the COLB in the grandparents' attic.  Hmmnm...

I submit that the whole sentimental episode is false.  I submit that Ayers wrote the chapter as a pre-emptive strike against the Birthers whom Ayers knew would eventually arise to challenge Obama's citizenship.  Ayers was trying to lull America into a literary stupor about the whole thing.

I submit that the only reason why the story is in the book is because Obama is not a U.S. citizen.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 10:47:10 pm by the_doc »

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #103 on: November 29, 2017, 10:44:23 pm »
@DiogenesLamp, @the_doc and I would have been interested had we seen it.  I don't remember it, but may have responded to your post.

Interesting reading.  I will read it in detail as soon as possible. 

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #104 on: November 29, 2017, 10:45:01 pm »

I researched the issue for many years after 2008.   I and others found information of which I don't believe a lot of people have been made aware.   


I also found an explanation as to how the current belief system (Jus Soli)  became so popular,  even though it is incorrect.

@DiogenesLamp

I went and found the thread on which the aforementioned discussion of what "natural born" actually means took place.  It's a long read but I'm sure you will find it worthwhile should you take the ime to read through it.

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,190577.0.html

Unfortunately and to my GREAT sorrow, one of it's chief participants (Katzenjammer) went and got himself banned so he no longer posts here.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 10:48:10 pm by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #105 on: November 29, 2017, 10:49:02 pm »
@Sanguine
The book was ghosted by Bill Ayers.  This is pretty easy to demonstrate.  Considering that fact, it is obvious that the book was intended as propaganda in a genuine Communist conspiracy. 

We should therefore notice which chapter was the centerpiece of this conspiratorial book.  I say it was the chapter about finding the COLB in the grandparents' attic.  Hmmnm...

I submit that the whole sentimental episode is false.  I submit that Ayers wrote the chapter as a pre-emptive strike against the Birthers whom Ayers knew would eventually arise to challenge Obama's citizenship.  Ayers was trying to lull America into a literary stupor about the whole thing.


I think Jack Cashill pretty much proved beyond a reasonable doubt that Bill Ayers wrote Obama's book.   (Obama was certainly incapable of writing it.) 

However you are giving Bill Ayers such prescience as to verge on the divine.   You could be right about this,   but it feels like a stretch to believe Ayers thought that far ahead.   

This book was published in 1995,  and at that point there was no reason to believe that the media would make that fool into a President.   


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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #106 on: November 29, 2017, 10:55:54 pm »

I think we had a thread about this in the last year,   but at the time,  people didn't seem very interested in it.   


The most interesting thing that was found (by freeper rxsid)  was this.   





This is from a Pennsylvania Law book that was widely circulated (1817) and was written by a member of the Pennsylvania legislature (William Lewis) that ratified the Constitution.    In 1787,  the Capital of the United States was Philadelphia,  which is exactly where William Lewis practiced law.   




The US Constitution was written in Independence Hall,  which was otherwise known as the "Pennsylvania State House"  which is where the Pennsylvania legislature sat.   




As a member of the Pennsylvania legislature which ratified the Constitution,  William Lewis should have known exactly what was meant by "natural born citizen."

This book was republished again in 1840,  and with no changes made to the sections on Aliens born in the US.   


I will further point out that the book is not merely the "opinion"  of William Lewis,  it is the consequence of a report issued by the Pennsylvania Supreme court regarding what English laws should  be included in the common law.

This report was issued at the request of the Pennsylvania state legislature in 1808. 





William Lewis simply compiled this report into book form and published it.

Very interesting indeed!  Thanks for posting! 

Much effort has been expended by some to erase such things from the web.  Happy to learn that this has been preserved!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #107 on: November 29, 2017, 10:57:48 pm »
@DiogenesLamp

I went and found the thread on which the aforementioned discussion of what "natural born" actually means took place.  It's a long read but I'm sure you will find it worthwhile should you take the ime to read through it.

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,190577.0.html

Unfortunately and to my GREAT sorrow, one of it's chief participants (Katzenjammer) went and got himself banned so he no longer posts here.



I'm reading through it now.  Coulter pissed me off on this issue.    She was as wrong as she could possibly be on this topic regarding Obama. 


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Offline Sanguine

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #108 on: November 29, 2017, 10:58:55 pm »


I'm reading through it now.  Coulter pissed me off on this issue.    She was as wrong as she could possibly be on this topic regarding Obama.

I don't remember - what was her opinion?

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #109 on: November 29, 2017, 10:59:30 pm »
Very interesting indeed!  Thanks for posting! 

Much effort has been expended by some to erase such things from the web.  Happy to learn that this has been preserved!


There is more.   If people are actually interested in this stuff,  i'm going to have to find all my old material that I used to have ready for such discussions.   


There is a lot of it.   I hope the links still work. 

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Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #110 on: November 29, 2017, 11:04:58 pm »
I don't remember - what was her opinion?


I am referring to a specific article she wrote on the subject,  but I no longer recall it's title and I no longer recall the exact particulars.    I do recall that it grossly contradicted another article she wrote,  regarding which I do so happen to recall the particulars.  This article.   


http://humanevents.com/2010/08/04/justice-brennans-footnote-gave-us-anchor-babies/ 



She gets the point on "Anchor Babies",   but she was completely oblivious to the exact same point about "natural born citizen."   


It is the same exact point,   but she takes one position on Obama,  and a different position on Anchor babies.   


I'll have to hunt up her comments on the topic,   because it's been a long time since I read them.   Basically she opines  "birthers"   are just crack pot loons who should be marginalized. 


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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #111 on: November 29, 2017, 11:07:56 pm »

There is more.   If people are actually interested in this stuff,  i'm going to have to find all my old material that I used to have ready for such discussions.   


There is a lot of it.   I hope the links still work.

Like you, I have LONG been interested in this subject and would truly appreciate whatever you may be willing to contribute to the further discussion of it.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #112 on: November 29, 2017, 11:19:39 pm »
So do millions of other Americans.  I'm among them.

Will Trump finally reveal the shocking evidence his private investigators dug up 10 years ago?  Will he direct the FBI to discover the truth about this mystery?  Or will he tweet out some barely intelligible gibberish he vomited out of his butt?

Stay tuned.

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #113 on: November 29, 2017, 11:20:11 pm »
Like you, I have LONG been interested in this subject and would truly appreciate whatever you may be willing to contribute to the further discussion of it.


Glad to oblige.   I will just have to work it into my other discussions. 


:)   
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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #114 on: November 29, 2017, 11:33:26 pm »

Glad to oblige.   I will just have to work it into my other discussions. 


:)

Please try to remember to call my attention to any such posts.  :beer:

"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #115 on: November 30, 2017, 12:04:45 am »

There is more.   If people are actually interested in this stuff,  i'm going to have to find all my old material that I used to have ready for such discussions.   


There is a lot of it.   I hope the links still work.

I wish I'd made copies of more of the great material that was posted back on those old threads. A while back I'd gone thru some of the old threads and many of the links were dead.

"The Long Thread" is still alive on TOS, just not as active as it was in its heyday. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/2306351/posts

Offline DiogenesLamp

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #116 on: November 30, 2017, 12:18:12 am »
I wish I'd made copies of more of the great material that was posted back on those old threads. A while back I'd gone thru some of the old threads and many of the links were dead.

"The Long Thread" is still alive on TOS, just not as active as it was in its heyday. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/2306351/posts



I see rxsid is still posting.   He posted a comment on that thread today!    He has done great work on this issue,   and I have conveyed my thanks to him for the work he has done. 


He found another very important piece to establish that jus sanguinus was the founder's intended basis for "natural citizen." 


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Offline the_doc

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #117 on: November 30, 2017, 12:55:53 am »
@Sanguine

However you are giving Bill Ayers such prescience as to verge on the divine.   You could be right about this,   but it feels like a stretch to believe Ayers thought that far ahead.   

This book was published in 1995,  and at that point there was no reason to believe that the media would make that fool into a President.

It's less of a stretch when you realize that Ayers has been patiently spending the past four decades working to overthrow the Republic.  (Ayers realized after his days of violence in the 1960s and early 1970s that his goal was realistic only if he was very patient and very secretive.  How patient was he?  Well, he became a prime mover in elementary education!    This strongly suggests that he believed that it would take decades to achieve his goal of destroying us.)

In the next place, Chicago is the epicenter of American Communism.  Communists are famous for their tedious patience in designing and implementing plots against target countries, and Chicago would have massive resources for a long-range conspiracy.  Ayers was probably the key player in Chicago, but he likely would have been connected with guys like Soros and with MSM Socialists at least as early as the 1990s. 

In the next place, Ayers knew Obama's background involving Frank Marshall Davis, whom the FBI had regarded as the most dangerous Communist subversive in the U.S.  Davis was apparently sent from Chicago to Hawaii to set up a Communist cell in Hawaii before Statehood. He evidently was extremely successful.  And since this top Communist was Obama's mentor for a matter of years, he was probably grooming Obama for an unspecified but potentially important role in the conspiracy against the Republic.  As it turns out, when Obama eventually landed in Chicago, there was already a significant Chicago network for him traceable back to Davis himself.

In summary, this was a very big, very opportunistic conspiracy.  Even if Ayers was a formidable Community Organizer in his earlier years, he was an opportunist visionary with national and even international connections.  And since Obama had confessed to be a Kenyan in his earlier political career, Ayers would have realized even in 1995 that he would have to change the birthplace narrative if Obama were to become useful at the highest levels of the conspiracy. 

The book was just a start.  Ayers had access to forgers (by his own admission), and he was expert in identity theft.  And Ayers surely knew that he would be able to count on the media to suppress the Birthers who would come along later.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2017, 12:59:10 am by the_doc »

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #118 on: November 30, 2017, 01:02:45 am »


I see rxsid is still posting.   He posted a comment on that thread today!    He has done great work on this issue,   and I have conveyed my thanks to him for the work he has done. 


He found another very important piece to establish that jus sanguinus was the founder's intended basis for "natural citizen."

Glad to learn that there are still a few serious people posting over there. 
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #119 on: November 30, 2017, 01:18:02 am »
@Sanguine
It's less of a stretch when you realize that Ayers has been patiently spending the past four decades working to overthrow the Republic.  (Ayers realized after his days of violence in the 1960s and early 1970s that his goal was realistic only if he was very patient and very secretive.  How patient was he?  Well, he became a prime mover in elementary education!    This strongly suggests that he believed that it would take decades to achieve his goal of destroying us.)

In the next place, Chicago is the epicenter of American Communism.  Communists are famous for their tedious patience in designing and implementing plots against target countries, and Chicago would have massive resources for a long-range conspiracy.  Ayers was probably the key player in Chicago, but he likely would have been connected with guys like Soros and with MSM Socialists at least as early as the 1990s. 

In the next place, Ayers knew Obama's background involving Frank Marshall Davis, whom the FBI had regarded as the most dangerous Communist subversive in the U.S.  Davis was apparently sent from Chicago to Hawaii to set up a Communist cell in Hawaii before Statehood. He evidently was extremely successful.  And since this top Communist was Obama's mentor for a matter of years, he was probably grooming Obama for an unspecified but potentially important role in the conspiracy against the Republic.  As it turns out, when Obama eventually landed in Chicago, there was already a significant Chicago network for him traceable back to Davis himself.

In summary, this was a very big, very opportunistic conspiracy.  Even if Ayers was a formidable Community Organizer in his earlier years, he was an opportunist visionary with national and even international connections.  And since Obama had confessed to be a Kenyan in his earlier political career, Ayers would have realized even in 1995 that he would have to change the birthplace narrative if Obama were to become useful at the highest levels of the conspiracy. 

The book was just a start.  Ayers had access to forgers (by his own admission), and he was expert in identity theft.  And Ayers surely knew that he would be able to count on the media to suppress the Birthers who would come along later.

@the_doc

Excellent post!  Every word true!   888high58888
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Emjay

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #120 on: November 30, 2017, 02:10:55 am »
I'm pleased to see so much interest in this subject.

It's almost unbelievable that this travesty happened to us and that we had 8 years of a traitorous president.

And also that we survived ... for now.

But communists are patient.
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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #121 on: November 30, 2017, 02:15:30 am »

Ah jeez not this s**t again.

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Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #122 on: November 30, 2017, 10:51:43 pm »
@kevindavis @Cripplecreek



While I don't like progressives, and this pushing of Christ into politics, I must admit having a similar reaction at times.


I left the TOS cause of this crap..
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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #123 on: November 30, 2017, 11:09:54 pm »
Liberals don't give a shit about "original intent."  Our resident liberal can't stand to hear about it, he'd rather kick back and quote court decisions that favor his point of view.  Those pesky Founders are a bunch of dead white farts to him.
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Offline Sanguine

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Re: Trump still privately questions Obama's birth certificate: report
« Reply #124 on: December 01, 2017, 12:12:23 am »
@the_doc

Excellent post!  Every word true!   888high58888

Doc's a pretty smart guy.