Author Topic: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative  (Read 22366 times)

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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #350 on: October 27, 2017, 07:49:03 pm »
So, I hope the Mods will step in and return the topic to Judge Roy Moore because this is getting ridicuous.

I think if they were going to do that, they'd have done that 20 pages ago.

But we can hope that Mod1 is getting bored again, right?
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Offline Sanguine

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #351 on: October 27, 2017, 07:49:14 pm »
I haven't read anything much about his religious beliefs.  Probably a good thing.

I think they're fairly standard Christian beliefs.  The difference is that he believes in acting upon those beliefs. 

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #352 on: October 27, 2017, 07:50:01 pm »
I haven't read anything much about his religious beliefs.  Probably a good thing.
In case you do wish to read up on him, you will find that we are exactly on topic regarding the way Christianity influences our current laws.
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Offline musiclady

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #353 on: October 27, 2017, 08:04:08 pm »
So, I hope the Mods will step in and return the topic to Judge Roy Moore because this is getting ridicuous.

This entire discussion is related to Roy Moore.

I'm a little curious here.......... you seem to want to be able to demand that people not discuss things you're not interested in.  Why don't you stay away from the (many) threads where moral and religious issues are the topic?

I think you're in a minority here who want to shut down religious and moral conversations entirely, but I'm in the minority on other subjects, and I don't jump onto a thread and tell people to stop talking about what interests them.

For instance...... I'm one of the few people on this forum who still has a great deal of respect for President Bush, but I know I'm in a small minority.  I know he did a bunch of things wrong, but I still respect him as a person.  So when I click on a thread about him where people are saying things like "Bush is garbage"  I may make a comment, but I leave it so others can vent.  And if it continues I just click on "Mark as read."  No big deal.  I just don't like Bush bashing threads, so I avoid them.

@Jazzhead insists on talking religion (his religious beliefs are strong and deeply held, albeit entirely secular), but he doesn't seem to mind being in the minority in religious and moral discussions.

Why not just let things go?  People haven't been behaving badly here, so why suggests the Mods shut it down?

If more comments come up on this thread, just don't come here.

It's easy @Emjay.   And you'll be a lot less frustrated with all of us than you are now.....
Character still matters.  It always matters.

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Offline truth_seeker

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #354 on: October 27, 2017, 08:25:31 pm »
I have a bit of a connection with the religious roots of the country.  My ancestors came over from Wales very, very early in the Republic.  They were 7th Day Baptists.  Most Baptists were 7th Day back then.  My great-great-great grandfather was converted to lst Day in an outdoor revival by a river that probably lasted many days.  I have newspaper clippings.

People have always argued about Religion which is stupid because everyone can't be right and I don't think God meant for us to hassle each other about it.
Those who bother to study and learn, will find MANY reasons that our Founders (1770-1790) sought to keep religious controversy out of the government.

Another  example would be puritans who despised Quakers. Early township plots, made provision for a church. It was controversial, to make provision for a second church. Quaker, or Baptist.

For a time the original puritans expected sole control. No other protestants, no Catholics, for example.
Rev. Hatevil Nutter, whipped young Quaker women.

http://thompsongenealogy.com/2011/04/hatevil-nutter-was-a-cruel-religious-hypocrite/

Likewise long after the founding, new denominations were vigorously opposed, like Mormons.

 
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Offline Jazzhead

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #355 on: October 27, 2017, 08:42:54 pm »
Those who bother to study and learn, will find MANY reasons that our Founders (1770-1790) sought to keep religious controversy out of the government.

Another  example would be puritans who despised Quakers. Early township plots, made provision for a church. It was controversial, to make provision for a second church. Quaker, or Baptist.

For a time the original puritans expected sole control. No other protestants, no Catholics, for example.
Rev. Hatevil Nutter, whipped young Quaker women.

http://thompsongenealogy.com/2011/04/hatevil-nutter-was-a-cruel-religious-hypocrite/

Likewise long after the founding, new denominations were vigorously opposed, like Mormons.

Excellent, on-topic post.   To secure religious freedom,  the Founders knew well that the government could not be entangled with religious tribalism.   
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Offline musiclady

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #356 on: October 27, 2017, 08:45:21 pm »
I think they're fairly standard Christian beliefs.  The difference is that he believes in acting upon those beliefs.

That's what the left wants us never to do.

The fact that their 'religion' is destroying the freedom of the rest of us doesn't make a bit of difference to them.

Rules for thee and not for me......
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

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Offline Bigun

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #357 on: October 27, 2017, 08:50:04 pm »
So, I hope the Mods will step in and return the topic to Judge Roy Moore because this is getting ridicuous.

I've noticed that it happens on nearly every thread certain people show up on!   

But who am I to notice such things?
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Offline Emjay

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #358 on: October 27, 2017, 09:39:49 pm »
This entire discussion is related to Roy Moore.

I'm a little curious here.......... you seem to want to be able to demand that people not discuss things you're not interested in.  Why don't you stay away from the (many) threads where moral and religious issues are the topic?

I think you're in a minority here who want to shut down religious and moral conversations entirely, but I'm in the minority on other subjects, and I don't jump onto a thread and tell people to stop talking about what interests them.

For instance...... I'm one of the few people on this forum who still has a great deal of respect for President Bush, but I know I'm in a small minority.  I know he did a bunch of things wrong, but I still respect him as a person.  So when I click on a thread about him where people are saying things like "Bush is garbage"  I may make a comment, but I leave it so others can vent.  And if it continues I just click on "Mark as read."  No big deal.  I just don't like Bush bashing threads, so I avoid them.

@Jazzhead insists on talking religion (his religious beliefs are strong and deeply held, albeit entirely secular), but he doesn't seem to mind being in the minority in religious and moral discussions.

Why not just let things go?  People haven't been behaving badly here, so why suggests the Mods shut it down?

If more comments come up on this thread, just don't come here.

It's easy @Emjay.   And you'll be a lot less frustrated with all of us than you are now.....

I get it.  I guess I'm something of an interloper.  I only joined this thread because I was curious as to how a thread about Moore could go that long.  I mean I hope Moore wins, but what is there to say for 17 pages.

You are not in a small majority about President Bush.  I always liked him very much and still do.

I don't understand the vitriol against him by some on this forum.

As far as why I hate religious discussions, it's because they make me and God sad because religion can generate so much hate.

I probably won't come here again unless I am pinged but that will be my choice.

Thanks for the advice though.
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Offline musiclady

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #359 on: October 27, 2017, 09:44:40 pm »
I get it.  I guess I'm something of an interloper.  I only joined this thread because I was curious as to how a thread about Moore could go that long.  I mean I hope Moore wins, but what is there to say for 17 pages.

You are not in a small majority about President Bush.  I always liked him very much and still do.

I don't understand the vitriol against him by some on this forum.

As far as why I hate religious discussions, it's because they make me and God sad because religion can generate so much hate.

I probably won't come here again unless I am pinged but that will be my choice.

Thanks for the advice though.

Can you imagine how God felt when the Catholics and Protestants were actually slaughtering each other?  Or the Lutherans and the Calvinists?  All in the "Name of Christ?"

This is pretty mild stuff relatively speaking.  ^-^

@Emjay

(As for the anti-Bush vitriol.......... I guess it's cool now.  Another 20 years or so, and beyond, people will be more objective, methinks....  :shrug:)
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline Emjay

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #360 on: October 27, 2017, 09:51:42 pm »
Can you imagine how God felt when the Catholics and Protestants were actually slaughtering each other?  Or the Lutherans and the Calvinists?  All in the "Name of Christ?"

This is pretty mild stuff relatively speaking.  ^-^

@Emjay

(As for the anti-Bush vitriol.......... I guess it's cool now.  Another 20 years or so, and beyond, people will be more objective, methinks....  :shrug:)

Well, yeah, apples and oranges.  A lot of lives have been lost because of religion, but I'm fairly sure God was not on either side.

So, if ya'll want to fight over it in a bloodless Internet way, then have fun.
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Offline Hoodat

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #361 on: October 27, 2017, 10:44:10 pm »
Finally, there is the Constitutional amendment power, by which two-thirds of the states can choose to uproot the Constitution's abortion right entirely.

Are you high?

Seriously.  Since you are currently ignoring the Constitution as it is written now, why wouldn't you simply ignore another amendment?
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #362 on: October 27, 2017, 11:00:05 pm »
Finally, there is the Constitutional amendment power, by which two-thirds of the states can choose to uproot the Constitution's abortion right entirely.

I missed this earlier.  It's 2/3 of the Houses of congress, and 3/4 of the states to ratify.  Or, alternatively, if you can persuade five people wearing black robes, then you're golden.  It's no wonder the left prefers the Courts.

Not bad for a classless lickspittle, eh?
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #363 on: October 28, 2017, 12:17:09 am »
Excellent, on-topic post.   To secure religious freedom,  the Founders knew well that the government could not be entangled with religious tribalism.
Yet those Ten Commandments on the monument are pretty much acknowledged by all of the hundreds of Protestant, Catholic and even Judaic groups --a point of commonality, not division.

Acknowledging those commandments as the basis of Western morals and legal systems (and the fundamentals for avoiding trouble in any culture) isn't far off base, either.

So the government was to uphold the God-given Right of people to worship as they chose, and was proscribed from interfering with that worship. Nor was the government allowed to use the religion of a person eligible otherwise for office to disqualify them from that office.

Unlike the secular humanists and those who decry the Bible, I don't see it as a bunch of restrictions, the "Thou Shalt Nots" people whine about. It is more like a user's manual for humans, with examples.

Now, while many might not see it that way, I don't reckon they check their oil in their car very often, either--but if they do, maybe they will begin to understand that not doing the things that Scripture cautions against, and doing the things it says to do often, even thousands of years later, produces desirable results, good health, even happiness.

Fight that all you want, use cheap oil, redline the engine frequently, and you just won't like the results in the long run.

When we say something is wrong, we say it because of experience or advice, we know that. We'd be remiss not to let people know, just like not letting them know they had a low tire. If you want to drive on that flat, it's your car, but I'm not going to let you recommend it to someone else, either, without piping up. Just as when I see people doing things I consider morally wrong, I can't approve, I will say something.
People are still free to choose to ignore that advice, but the results are on them.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #364 on: October 28, 2017, 12:19:53 am »
Well, yeah, apples and oranges.  A lot of lives have been lost because of religion, but I'm fairly sure God was not on either side.

So, if ya'll want to fight over it in a bloodless Internet way, then have fun.
I think if you took a fair accounting, you'd find at least as many had been lost to the absence of religion (placing the State first).
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #365 on: October 28, 2017, 12:30:15 am »
Finally, there is the Constitutional amendment power, by which two-thirds of the states can choose to uproot the Constitution's abortion right entirely.
Considering that Rights aren't granted by law, but by God, do you really think God wanted people to have a Right to kill their own get in the womb? If so, how come He didn't mention it in all those pages of scripture? No religion claims such a Right to be given by any God.
The Almighty did leave us the right to choose whether we would follow Him and His commandments. He rewards that after this life, and sometimes, during it. (Actually, it has been my experience that following them brings reward enough in this life.)
As for the Constitution, what part would we repeal to rid ourselves of this pesky "right" to abortion?

Oh, that's right, IT ISN'T IN THERE!!
« Last Edit: October 28, 2017, 12:30:40 am by Smokin Joe »
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline roamer_1

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #366 on: October 28, 2017, 12:44:08 am »
Considering that Rights aren't granted by law, but by God, do you really think God wanted people to have a Right to kill their own get in the womb? If so, how come He didn't mention it in all those pages of scripture?

In fact, the opposite is true - We are commanded 'not to cause our children to pass through the fire'.
That was the birth control in that day - The pagan worship services were sexual orgies and the 'fire' was under the hands of the bronze statue of Marduk, where those children were placed, to writhe and die... to the beat of drums as their parents got high and made more babies...

This is no different whatsoever.

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #367 on: October 28, 2017, 02:59:48 am »
As for the Constitution, what part would we repeal to rid ourselves of this pesky "right" to abortion?

Oh, that's right, IT ISN'T IN THERE!!
That is worth repeating.

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Offline Chosen Daughter

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #368 on: October 28, 2017, 04:47:55 am »
I have never clicked on nor entered this thread before.  I couldn't figure out how people could have that much to say about Moore.

OMG.  I see it has disintegrated into stupid religious controversy where NO ONE wins and everyone gets mean, just like Jesus told us to do.

Well, I like you @Jazzhead even if I don't always agree with you.

Sometimes you're a voice of sanity crying in the wilderness.

You always expose yourself for what you are....anti-christian.  Jesus never told us to get mean.  But you like to get mean over topics of faith.  I don't exactly know how to discuss Roy Moore without discussing the Ten Commandments at the courthouse.  I like how you drag yourself in here to put your self on the pedestal thinking you are above the Christians.
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Offline Sanguine

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #369 on: October 28, 2017, 04:52:30 am »
You always expose yourself for what you are....anti-christian.  Jesus never told us to get mean.  But you like to get mean over topics of faith.  I don't exactly know how to discuss Roy Moore without discussing the Ten Commandments at the courthouse.  I like how you drag yourself in here to put your self on the pedestal thinking you are above the Christians.

I think Emjay's response was much more Christian than yours.  Yours is just flat mean.

Offline Emjay

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #370 on: October 28, 2017, 05:02:40 am »
You always expose yourself for what you are....anti-christian.  Jesus never told us to get mean.  But you like to get mean over topics of faith.  I don't exactly know how to discuss Roy Moore without discussing the Ten Commandments at the courthouse.  I like how you drag yourself in here to put your self on the pedestal thinking you are above the Christians.

God knows that's a damn lie.  I've been a Christian all my life.
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Offline Emjay

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #371 on: October 28, 2017, 05:03:58 am »
I think Emjay's response was much more Christian than yours.  Yours is just flat mean.

Thank you @Sanguine.  This why I try to stay out of religious discussions.  I should have stayed out of this one.
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Offline Sanguine

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #372 on: October 28, 2017, 05:15:56 am »
Thank you @Sanguine.  This why I try to stay out of religious discussions.  I should have stayed out of this one.

Same here.  We know better.

Offline Sighlass

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #373 on: October 28, 2017, 06:55:31 am »
OMG.  I see it has disintegrated into stupid religious controversy where NO ONE wins and everyone gets mean, just like Jesus told us to do.

I know your comment was sarcasm.... but it fails pretty bad... Heritage....

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Re: CAMP: Roy Moore Is Not A Constitutional Conservative
« Reply #374 on: October 28, 2017, 10:39:23 am »
Thank you @Sanguine.  This why I try to stay out of religious discussions.  I should have stayed out of this one.

It's why I haven't joined in, too!

As crazy as 'political' discussions are, who needs THIS crap?    :laugh:

Figured the thread was another food fight about whose candidate has a 'Conservative' pedigree.
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