Poll: 76 percent of voters say 'Dreamers' should be allowed to stay

[RoosGirl]

False compassion will get you everywhere, apparently.  I have never, and will never, say that they should all just be "set free" and no harm, no foul; I think that legalization should come with some permanent disabilities, such as no right to naturalization. 

But it does no unfairness to anyone who went through the right process to enter legally if a person who was brought here as a young child is legalized without disability.  That is what compassion is about.

Well, I never said *you* said any such thing.  Second, the hell it isn't unfair for legals to have to compete with illegals for jobs.

[Smokin Joe]

Both are required, because humanity is imperfect and so there will never be perfect legislation or perfect enforcement, and a touch of compassion is the oil that keeps the system lubricated and working. 

I hope for your sake that you will never find yourself confronted with your own words on the day to come when you need a little compassion.

Been there, done that. Got shafted by a poorly written law and a drunken sot of a judge. I'd rather have well written laws.

[bigheadfred]

Both are required, because humanity is imperfect and so there will never be perfect legislation or perfect enforcement, and a touch of compassion is the oil that keeps the system lubricated and working. 

I hope for your sake that you will never find yourself confronted with your own words on the day to come when you need a little compassion.

I have gotten hammered my whole life for being truthful. I am a second class citizen now for it. Maybe lower. Marginalized for speaking the truth.

These people are dishonest. I will never have compassion for that.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Compassion has everything to do with it, and exercising due compassion does not make a country lawless.  Prosecutorial discretion is a very traditional component of what it means for a nation to be a nation of laws, and it includes an element of compassion. 

The heartless, mechanical enforcement of the law leads to lawless tyranny just as surely as does a corrupt refusal to enforce the law.

Ah, but the selective compassion being shown is for those illegally here, not for those who decided to come here legally.  Where is the compassion for those?

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Ahhh.  Just as forgiveness only lands on the side of those who don't need to be forgiven.  Just as tolerance is only for those whom you already tolerate. 

No, compassion lands on the side of the children brought here illegally by their parents.

So you tolerate people like this?

Mother of Teen Killed by ‘Dreamer’ on DACA: ‘I Can’t Call Another Country and Talk to Josh’
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/09/05/mother-of-son-killed-by-dreamer-speaks-out-on-end-for-daca/

Your toleration crap doesn't fly.

Open up your own home to the POS that did this, just don't let him outside of it.

Oh, and explain to the mother what type of compassion we should have for the guy that killed her son, too.

[jmyrlefuller]

What are you babbling on about?   

Don't play dumb. You just suggested that if a child found themselves on a moving train, that they should not hang on. They're literally hanging on for dear life, for crying out loud. I won't begrudge them for that.

I have no qualms kicking them out of this country but suggesting they fall off a train is too far.

[Gefn]

I think we should conduct our own poll here on this subject. 

[TomSea]

The poll may be a "push poll"

A push poll is an interactive marketing technique, most commonly employed during political campaigning, in which an individual or organization attempts to influence or alter the view of voters under the guise of conducting a poll.
Push poll - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Push_poll

One would have to look into how the questions are phrased but I heard this discussed.

Undocumented to dreamers to immigrants, all of these words could be used interchangeably in the questioning.

Also, just like the refugees in Europe, there's a good indication that the ages on the dreamers are way off. I think I heard these "children" actually have an average age of 25 years and x months.

The devil is in the details.

[Smokin Joe]

I wonder if the Romans had lengthy debates
About the cute little barbarians at the gates.

[DCPatriot]

Don't play dumb. You just suggested that if a child found themselves on a moving train, that they should not hang on. They're literally hanging on for dear life, for crying out loud. I won't begrudge them for that.

I have no qualms kicking them out of this country but suggesting they fall off a train is too far.

You completely misinterpreted what I said, then, @jmyrlefuller

Never said anything of the kind.

[Jazzhead]

Let's just assume for the sake of it that it is what you call a 'zero sum game', although it clearly is not.

I said that, so long as we emphasize economic growth,  the immigrant and the native-born can each find jobs.  That is, it is NOT a zero sum game. 

 Those who came here with their parents are the subject of this thread;  you seek to demonize then as "illegals",  but these folks are without moral fault.   The idea is to normalize their status so they don't have to compete unfairly with citizens in an underground economy.   They pay the same taxes and face the same obstacles to getting a legal job as anyone else -  that is, they must compete, and win, fair and square.   And many of them, it appears, are doing well,  because they have the drive and ambition that too many native-born lack.   Let's not forget that employers like immigrant labor, not because it's cheaper and easier to exploit, but because it shows up to work on time and is willing to go where the opportunity is.   

[Smokin Joe]

I said that, so long as we emphasize economic growth,  the immigrant and the native-born can each find jobs.  That is, it is NOT a zero sum game. 

 Those who came here with their parents are the subject of this thread;  you seek to demonize then as "illegals",  but these folks are without moral fault.   The idea is to normalize their status so they don't have to compete unfairly with citizens in an underground economy.   They pay the same taxes and face the same obstacles to getting a legal job as anyone else -  that is, they must compete, and win, fair and square.   And many of them, it appears, are doing well,  because they have the drive and ambition that too many native-born lack.   Let's not forget that employers like immigrant labor, not because it's cheaper and easier to exploit, but because it shows up to work on time and is willing to go where the opportunity is.

Which will last until they find out about sick leave, flex time, personal leave, overtime, double time, union scale, paid holidays, employer provided insurance, how to whine to HR and HSE, etc....

In the meantime, exploited labor that can barely speak the language is easily screwed.