BREAKING......US has launched dozens of tomahawks on Syria

[Chosen Daughter]

Rep. Tulsi Gabbard

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/leahbarkoukis/2017/04/07/dem-rep-who-met-with-assad-he-should-be-executed-if-hes-behind-chemical-attack-n2310288

I think she is right.  Trump jumped the gun. 

I saw that McCain was all in on these strikes.  So was Hillary.  Tulsi makes the obvious point that we didn't get evidence first.  What if it was ISIS, or another Terrorist faction?  Or worse fabricated.

[Cripplecreek]

Rep. Tulsi Gabbard

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/leahbarkoukis/2017/04/07/dem-rep-who-met-with-assad-he-should-be-executed-if-hes-behind-chemical-attack-n2310288

I think she is right.  Trump jumped the gun. 

I saw that McCain was all in on these strikes.  So was Hillary.  Tulsi makes the obvious point that we didn't get evidence first.  What if it was ISIS, or another Terrorist faction?  Or worse fabricated.

The problem is that if he is behind the chemical attack, we know others in Syria have also used chemicals.

It doesn't help that a lot of the pics of victims aren't from this attack.

[LonestarDream]

S400 as in 400KM

Thank you, Sir. I appreciate the follow-up on this.

It makes sense - was leery of the stand off range anyways (I do know the effective range of the S-400 defence system: it's pretty impressive, assuming everything works.) Didn't realize the US was so short on B-2s though. Tend not to worry too much about allied stuff unless some's been jacked by the scum.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S-400_missile_system


The S-400 Triumf (Russian: C-400 Триумф, Triumph; NATO reporting name: SA-21 Growler), previously known as the S-300PMU-3, is an anti-aircraft weapon system developed in the 1990s by Russia's Almaz Central Design Bureau as an upgrade of the S-300 family. It has been in service with the Russian Armed Forces since 2007. The S-400 uses four missiles to fill its performance envelope: the very-long-range 40N6 (400 km), the long-range 48N6 (250 km), the medium-range 9M96E2 (120 km) and the short-range 9M96E

[libertybele]

Trump was briefed by Defense Secretary Mattis and National Security Advisor McMasters and given options as to how to respond to the attack in Syria. Secretary of State, Tillerson stated that he had no doubt that it was Asaad who ordered the chemical attack.  President Trump is depending on the information given from the people whom he appointed to these positions.  So ... based on some of the posts in here ... Mattis, McMasters and Tillerson are all wrong?

[LonestarDream]

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php?topic=257576.new#new

BTW: There was plenty of WMD in Iraq.  Soldiers and civilians got sick from it...

[LonestarDream]

Trump was briefed by Defense Secretary Mattis and National Security Advisor McMasters and given options as to how to respond to the attack in Syria. Secretary of State, Tillerson stated that he had no doubt that it was Asaad who ordered the chemical attack.  President Trump is depending on the information given from the people whom he appointed to these positions.  So ... based on some of the posts in here ... Mattis, McMasters and Tillerson are all wrong?

It is not that they were 'wrong' per se.  We just want to see the chain of possession of the WMD.

People did show up sick in Turkey.  Question is whodunit. 

And Qui Bono-- Who benefits.  Clearly, ISIS benefits.

[Chosen Daughter]

The problem is that if he is behind the chemical attack, we know others in Syria have also used chemicals.

It doesn't help that a lot of the pics of victims aren't from this attack.

I am really sour on regime change.  We saw what happened in Egypt and Libya.  There are a number of different terrorist groups who could fill the gap.  What is horrifying in the ME is that they are majority Islam.  They are continuously on a self destruction path.  One faction bombs another faction at a wedding or a mosque.  Common.  And as horrible as it is,.. chemical bombs so is genocide by ISIS , Al Qaeda, Hamas ......

I don't know what the answer is.  But I have read that ISIS has used chemical weapons also.  Mustard gas.  They chop off heads and burn people live in cages.

Islam is barbaric, but who would rule Syria if Assad is gone?

[INVAR]

Trump was briefed by Defense Secretary Mattis and National Security Advisor McMasters and given options as to how to respond to the attack in Syria. Secretary of State, Tillerson stated that he had no doubt that it was Asaad who ordered the chemical attack.  President Trump is depending on the information given from the people whom he appointed to these positions.  So ... based on some of the posts in here ... Mattis, McMasters and Tillerson are all wrong?

Who fed them the intel from the site of the attack?  How trustworthy are those assets?  Are they leftovers from Obama's reign?   I doubt those three were in theater to assess the actual situation, and I have doubts as to whether whatever assets we had for intel from he region were reliable given Obama was buddy-buddy with the Muslim Brotherhood and other Islamists seeking to overthrow Assad.

How easy would it be to masquerade such an attack knowing how gullible we are and then parade victims before the cameras?

Assad gets nothing from using chemical weapons, and only loses whatever indifference or support he would have from the international community.

It just smells bad, and not clean and neat as they are making it out to be.

If Assad was truly that stupid - he just slit his own throat and let the rebels win.

[EC]

Islam is barbaric, but who would rule Syria if Assad is gone?

There's the rub. Assad, being a rather efficient sort, has (permanently) removed anyone who could easily and credibly replace him.

[bigheadfred]

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php?topic=257576.new#new

BTW: There was plenty of WMD in Iraq.  Soldiers and civilians got sick from it...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZkQmGfxPKA

[libertybele]

Who fed them the intel from the site of the attack?  How trustworthy are those assets?  Are they leftovers from Obama's reign?   I doubt those three were in theater to assess the actual situation, and I have doubts as to whether whatever assets we had for intel from he region were reliable given Obama was buddy-buddy with the Muslim Brotherhood and other Islamists seeking to overthrow Assad.

How easy would it be to masquerade such an attack knowing how gullible we are and then parade victims before the cameras?

Assad gets nothing from using chemical weapons, and only loses whatever indifference or support he would have from the international community.

It just smells bad, and not clean and neat as they are making it out to be.

If Assad was truly that stupid - he just slit his own throat and let the rebels win.

I'm not sure I'd go along with the theory that this was staged ... for what purpose?  Perhaps I'm wrong, but I would certainly hope and expect that we had decent and reliable "intelligence" coming out of the area.  I do agree that team Trump's response seemed extremely quick...and I would have to assume that the ships used were already in place.

[Chosen Daughter]

There's the rub. Assad, being a rather efficient sort, has (permanently) removed anyone who could easily and credibly replace him.

I was just reading this story about Assad and his family.  Crazy.

http://gawker.com/asma-al-assad-a-rose-in-the-desert-1265002284

http://www.globalresearch.ca/syria-bashar-al-assads-secular-governments-battle-against-isis-protects-pluralism-catholic-world-report/5422820

[INVAR]

If the Russian drone and on site footage is to be believed, we spent a whole lot of millions to administer a minor scratch, if even that.

One wonders how badly our military has been depleted in terms of readiness over the last 8 years under Obama.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBh06hs8MlY

[TomSea]

There is such a focus on the Middle East, I care what goes on there but people are suffering in Africa and other places as well. ME gets all of the attention really.

[bigheadfred]

If the Russian drone and on site footage is to be believed, we spent a whole lot of millions to administer a minor scratch, if even that.

One wonders how badly our military has been depleted in terms of readiness over the last 8 years under Obama.

They accomplished what they wanted. The mission was a complete success. Trump gets another horsefeather in his cap.

[LonestarDream]

They accomplished what they wanted. The mission was a complete success. Trump gets another horsefeather in his cap.

@INVAR

Your points are taken.  The raid was really about a message to Russia, Syria, turkey, China and NK

[bigheadfred]

@INVAR

Your points are taken.  The raid was really about a message to Russia, Syria, turkey, China and NK

I'm am really glad they didn't drag someone up before the UN to give a speech. That is all I know.

[Chosen Daughter]

They accomplished what they wanted. The mission was a complete success. Trump gets another horsefeather in his cap.

My first reaction was yes it was right.  But not really feeling it now.  Syria has been a secular state.  It is now under attack from several extremist groups.  Trump should have verified first.  If this is a strike against Syria to relieve the pressure on himself about his ties to Russia.  God forgive him.

I never agreed with Arab Spring.  ISIS is ready to move in if we get rid of a secular state.

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2017-04-06/syria-narrative-that-assad-behind-chemical-attack-questioned

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/04/president-trumps-syria-strike-was-unconstitutional-and-unwise/522228/

Read link above to see Trumps reaction to the 2013 chemical attack.  Doesn't make sense.

http://hotair.com/archives/2017/04/07/then-and-now-mitch-mcconnells-epic-reversal-on-bombing-syria/

[LonestarDream]

I'm am really glad they didn't drag someone up before the UN to give a speech. That is all I know.

Yes . Point.

[Smokin Joe]

Quote from: TomSea on April 07, 2017, 11:06:57 AM

    Here’s The Pentagon’s Evidence Assad Used Chemical Weapons

    Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2017/04/07/heres-the-pentagons-evidence-assad-used-chemical-weapons/#ixzz4dZnycM43

Not much there.  I still see conflicting stories whether the 2013 incident was a false flag operation or Assad.

All I saw was a flight track. That still doesn't tell me the nerve agent came from the planes, as opposed to already being in chemical munitions on the ground and released by conventional ordnance dropped in those air strikes.
That remains the seminal question in my mind, and one which is not yet sufficiently answered.

 

[Smokin Joe]

@EC

See my reply t@Cyber Liberty.  I'm not a fan of missiles because I don't know enough about different types of ammunition to be one.

Here's a quick rundown of most common US missiles, with the very basics and links to learn more. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_missiles_of_the_United_States_military

 I find it interesting, YMMV.

[Smokin Joe]

This was my first thought.   I've seen stories claiming that Hillary allowed the "rebels"  (meaning ISIS)  to have Sarin gas,   and i've seen stories arguing that the people on the ground claiming it is Sarin gas are not acting as though it were really Sarin gas.    (No NBC suits,  etc.)   


From what I had read it seemed to me that any move on Syria should be very cautious because there is a serious potential of a false flag operation going on here. 


I could only reassure myself with the presumption that the President has better intelligence than do I.   Of course there have been quite a few times in which blogs on the internet got it right,  while our "brilliant"  Ivy League "intelligence"  agencies got it wrong.   
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarin

There are other nerve agents, as well. And while this one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VX_(nerve_agent) causes similar symptoms, it seems to be an even more likely possibility given it's low volatility and persistence in the environment coupled with incredible toxicity as an aerosol, gas, liquid, or even as a thickened agent mixed with clay or talc. It could conceivably be lethal in very small quantities mixed in soil if it got on the skin.

I agree, I hope the intel is better than the press accounts, and I can see reasons why specifics might compromise sources so those specifics would not be disclosed in order to cover the source. I would hope this administration is better at keeping a lid on HUMINT source info than the Democrats have been in the past.

[Suppressed]

If the Russian drone and on site footage is to be believed, we spent a whole lot of millions to administer a minor scratch, if even that.

One wonders how badly our military has been depleted in terms of readiness over the last 8 years under Obama.

Runways weren't the target. Tomahawks are not the ideal weapon for attacking military runways.

I'm surprised they tried to punch the hardened hangars with only TLAMs, but I think some of this is providing good information.

[Chosen Daughter]

All I saw was a flight track. That still doesn't tell me the nerve agent came from the planes, as opposed to already being in chemical munitions on the ground and released by conventional ordnance dropped in those air strikes.
That remains the seminal question in my mind, and one which is not yet sufficiently answered.

I have seen that has been questioned.  Needs investigation as to what actually happened.

Another observation that I have is how liberals are embracing Trumps actions.  Hillary is spouting same stuff.  McLame is heaping praise.  Brian Williams.................Regime change was part of the Arab Spring.

[bigheadfred]

All they were doing was sending this message: "If you people want to start playing the chemical weapons game we will pound you with enough ordinance in a specific spot to either obliterate you or convince you to stop. With our guided missiles, we could have punched holes in the runway the entire length at even spacing. Or put 30 on one spot. And we are willing to do it."

 End message.