The Conservatives Made a Mistake

[Right_in_Virginia]

The Conservatives Made a Mistake
PJ Media, Mar 24, 2017, Andrew Klavan

I fear the conservatives may have erred.

Let's accept that Paul Ryan's healthcare bill wasn't optimal. If the Congressional Budget Office was anywhere close to correct in its original estimations, the bill would have cut government spending by $12.5 trillion, cut taxes by $900 million, repealed Obamacare's tax increases, and instituted the largest entitlement reform in the last thirty years.

But yes, it's true, it wasn't full repeal. Indeed, as long as insurance companies are required to cover pre-existing conditions, government healthcare is with us, and the bill would not have changed that. And it is certainly fair to doubt whether the third phase of Ryan's three-phase plan — the phase that would have returned the free market to insurance — would ever have gotten past the Democrats.

Let's also forget about any four-dimensional chess conspiracy theories. I do not believe even for a second this whole thing was a Steve Bannon plot to destroy Paul Ryan or a Paul Ryan plot to destroy Donald Trump. I think Ryan felt this was the best bill he could get past the moderates in the house who do not want to go home and explain to their constituents why they lost their Obamacare benefits, and the conservatives, who do not want to go home and explain why they didn't get full repeal. It's easy to pick on the speaker, but he doesn't live on talk radio where pure principle rules. He lives in reality where building a consensus through compromise is both necessary and difficult.

All this said, I simply feel that letting the bill die was such a huge mistake politically that it would have been worth eating the bill's flaws — trying to fix them in the Senate — and living to fight another day.


https://pjmedia.com/andrewklavan/2017/03/24/the-conservatives-made-a-mistake/

[Right_in_Virginia]

Freedom Caucus drives dagger into heart of young Trump presidency
Fox News, Mar 24, 2017, Liz Peek

It is hard to overestimate the damage the Freedom Caucus has done to the fledgling presidency of Donald Trump, and to the country. By blocking the American Health Care Act of 2017, the conservative group has guaranteed that Americans will struggle forward under the burden of Obamacare.

In the next few months insurers will announce their premium hikes for the coming year; chances are, given the continuing withdrawal of major companies from the marketplaces and the ongoing failure of the bill to attract enough young and healthy participants, the new rates will not be pretty. Last year premiums went up 25%; it’s likely the increases will be higher this year.

Republicans will own those higher rates. Their failure to repeal the financial underpinnings of Obamacare and start replacing that failing program with an approach that encourages competition and that embodies numerous other common sense reforms will mean that families hit by ever-higher costs will blame the GOP. Voters elected Donald Trump and a GOP Congress to get this job done – the number one promise of every Republican campaign since 2010.

***
Outraged Republicans should save most of their ire for the Freedom Caucus. The group of 30-odd conservatives are patting themselves on the backs this evening; joining their celebration are Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer. Hillary Clinton declared the failure a victory, while disgusted Republicans across the country wonder how it went so wrong.

More:  http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/03/24/freedom-caucus-drives-dagger-into-heart-young-trump-presidency.html

[Right_in_Virginia]

The House Freedom Caucus ... the last bastion of principle in a corrupt world   

[Maj. Bill Martin]

The Conservatives Made a Mistake
PJ Media, Mar 24, 2017, Andrew Klavan

I fear the conservatives may have erred.

Let's accept that Paul Ryan's healthcare bill wasn't optimal. If the Congressional Budget Office was anywhere close to correct in its original estimations, the bill would have cut government spending by $12.5 trillion, cut taxes by $900 million, repealed Obamacare's tax increases, and instituted the largest entitlement reform in the last thirty years.

But yes, it's true, it wasn't full repeal. Indeed, as long as insurance companies are required to cover pre-existing conditions, government healthcare is with us, and the bill would not have changed that. And it is certainly fair to doubt whether the third phase of Ryan's three-phase plan — the phase that would have returned the free market to insurance — would ever have gotten past the Democrats.

Let's also forget about any four-dimensional chess conspiracy theories. I do not believe even for a second this whole thing was a Steve Bannon plot to destroy Paul Ryan or a Paul Ryan plot to destroy Donald Trump. I think Ryan felt this was the best bill he could get past the moderates in the house who do not want to go home and explain to their constituents why they lost their Obamacare benefits, and the conservatives, who do not want to go home and explain why they didn't get full repeal. It's easy to pick on the speaker, but he doesn't live on talk radio where pure principle rules. He lives in reality where building a consensus through compromise is both necessary and difficult.

All this said, I simply feel that letting the bill die was such a huge mistake politically that it would have been worth eating the bill's flaws — trying to fix them in the Senate — and living to fight another day.


https://pjmedia.com/andrewklavan/2017/03/24/the-conservatives-made-a-mistake/

Can't argue with a word of that.

The conservatives just proved they won't vote for any bill that can actually garner a majority, which means anyone looking to put together a coalition to do something with Obamacare is going to do it without them.

[Sanguine]

It appears that almost NO ONE on the R side wanted to go home and tell their constituents that they voted either for or against.

Well, except for the very, very few conservatives in the House.  They were at least true to their principles.  And, there's just not enough of them to have made the difference, numbers-wise.

[Fishrrman]

Take the failed bill back to the drawing board.

Rip out the parts that were most objectionable.

Retain those parts in which there was general agreement.

Resubmit the slimmed-down bill for a vote.

Get it done in the next 4-6 weeks.

The only way to take down a large building "all at once" is to nuke it (well, use explosives).
Told ya that to tell ya this:
The only way to "repeal" ObamaCare would be by use of the nuclear option in the Senate.

That's probably not possible (although I wish that it was).

So... if you can't take the building down at once, take it down in pieces.
If you can't take out an entire floor at once, take it down a block at a time.

If it can't be done with one bill, or even three...

Pass a small bill each month, each one dismantling another part of obamacare.

Keep doing this, and eventually much of it will be gone...

[Smokin Joe]

In the meantime, put the 2015 bill up for a vote.

[skeeter]

How about just giving your voters what you promised?

Too far fetched?

[INVAR]

How about just giving your voters what you promised?

Too far fetched?

Yes.

We're all Socialists now, and we're supposed to take and accept what piecemeal crumbs of liberty the Beast at Mordor on the Potomac permit us to have and chastise and bash those with principles for being the bane of "progress".

Simple as that.

Principles are becoming as hated as Jesus Christ and the bible are in this country.

[jmyrlefuller]

Yes.

We're all Socialists now, and we're supposed to take and accept what piecemeal crumbs of liberty the Beast at Mordor on the Potomac permit us to have and chastise and bash those with principles for being the bane of "progress".

Simple as that.

Principles are becoming as hated as Jesus Christ and the bible are in this country.

This is why certain people, even conservatives, love dictatorships.

When one is outnumbered in a democratic (or even a republican) system, only a benevolent dictator can overrun the will of the ignorant, corrupt masses.

Many on the right placed their hope in Trump being a benevolent dictator. He apparently is neither.

[XenaLee]

Can't argue with a word of that.

The conservatives just proved they won't vote for any bill that can actually garner a majority, which means anyone looking to put together a coalition to do something with Obamacare is going to do it without them.

In other words.... they are standing by their promises, their words and their values.  No wonder they're being demonized by the idiots on the left and some idiots (supposedly) on the right.  How DARE they!

[INVAR]

Many on the right placed their hope in Trump being a benevolent dictator. He apparently is neither.

It's still early.  If his narcissism is as deep as I suspect it is based on his thumbs and his big mouth - when 'winning' is all he cares about - he will be happy to act as a dictator to ensure he is seen as a 'winner'.

Even when it means he is acting as a dictator for the Left by destroying Conservatives who oppose him.

Which will be met with grand applause, even by several right here on this board.

[Taxcontrol]

Putting lipstick on a pig is a waste of time and it pisses off the pig.

The duplicate of the 2015 repeal is in committee.  Pass it out of committee and vote for it on the floor.

[DB]

And the leftward march continues...

Has any country in history recovered from going socialist without a hard/deadly reset?

We won't be the exception. The takers are now a majority with a vote and its a positive feedback system until there's nothing left to plunder. That usually takes awhile but can also happen suddenly, no one really knows.

I'm not advocating violence. I'm just saying we can't stop what's coming. The time to stop it has passed. The only thing that can be done now is prepare to survive it.

[INVAR]

And the leftward march continues...

Has any country in history recovered from going socialist without a hard/deadly reset?

We won't be the exception. The takers are now a majority with a vote and its a positive feedback system until there's nothing left to plunder. That usually takes awhile but can also happen suddenly, no one really knows.

I'm not advocating violence. I'm just saying we can't stop what's coming. The time to stop it has passed. The only thing that can be done now is prepare to survive it.

The most important and correct thing I have ever read posted on this board.

Bravo sir.

[Victoria33]

Yes.

We're all Socialists now, and we're supposed to take and accept what piecemeal crumbs of liberty the Beast at Mordor on the Potomac permit us to have and chastise and bash those with principles for being the bane of "progress".
Simple as that.  Principles are becoming as hated as Jesus Christ and the bible are in this country.

@INVAR
@mystery-ak 

You are wise to say that.  One of the founding fathers said our government would last until the citizens received so much from government, making them dependent on government for their life,  that there would be no more to give, then it would collapse.  When a government collapses, history shows a dictator will rise and the people, looking for a savior, will accept him.  We are on our way to collapse.  It appears healthcare may be the last flutter of the butterfly wings that brings chaos and collapse as there is not enough money to give everyone healthcare paid by the government.  Medicaid, free healthcare, will be the last flap of the butterfly wings.

[Sanguine]

So, 15 Freedom Caucus members planned to vote "no"; 18 regular republicans  planned to vote no.

[bolobaby]

Wah wah wah. Trump didn't get a BS bill that was ultimately a joke on conservatives everywhere. No there's NO POSSIBLE way for the GOP to figure out new legislation that might actually return health care to the free market.

No way whatsoever.

Nope.

None.

Because Trump and Ryan say so.

Welcome to Right_In_Virginia's Trumpian fantasy land.

[bolobaby]

For the record, this whole episode proves once and for all that all the Trumpists were PLAYED during the election.

Conservatives said, "He's not really a conservative. He won't try and govern like one. Vote for someone with principles, at least."

No, no. The Trumpists had to have their man.

Bear this in mind: The House voted to repeal Obamacare more than 50 times prior to this. FIFTY times. Obviously, none of those bills became law. Here, we have ONE bill that WASN'T EVEN SUBMITTED FOR A VOTE.

Now we're told, "It's over. Political suicide. We'll never get a repeal now."

Balderdash.

Trump, Ryan, and the Trumpettes are full of it. It should now be abundantly clear than NONE of them really wanted to repeal Obamacare in the first place. They LOVE the entitlement mindset and can't bear the thought of taking an entitlement away from Americans.

They tried fifty times previously - when failure was assured - then - when success was an actual possibility - they introduce a half-baked bill that doesn't attack the core problem, thus dooming the bill to failure.

If you need any more evidence of the uniparty mindset in Washington, and that Trump, Ryan, and the "moderate" GOP have completely sold out to the uniparty... well... just wait. Next up, will be a "compromise" bill that - SURPRISE - is developed by some "gang of eight (douches)" that Trump will laud as an "excellent deal" that is "good for the American people."

And, here, on the GOP Briefing Room, the Trumpettes will praise their orange god, his negotiating skills, and blame actual conservatives for not getting a more conservative bill passed.

Anyone else pissed off at the Trumpettes yet for NOT seeing this coming a mile away like we did during the primaries?

[Sanguine]

The guys on Fox Business were apoplectic this morning.  They come at it from a POV of "if it's good for the stock market, it's good".   

[INVAR]

Conservatives said, "He's not really a conservative. He won't try and govern like one. Vote for someone with principles, at least."

No, no. The Trumpists had to have their man.

Oh yes.  We were told that Trump 'will fight' and 'he's the Patton we need'; 'Only Trump can save us'; 'Only Trump will stop the Left'.

Blah, blah, blah.

Trump only fights those whom dis him.

Trump is going to war on Conservatives and coddle up with and push the Democrat Agenda in total - because THAT will be a sure - 'win', and there is nothing more important to Trump than 'winning'.

[XenaLee]

@INVAR
@mystery-ak 

You are wise to say that.  One of the founding fathers said our government would last until the citizens received so much from government, making them dependent on government for their life,  that there would be no more to give, then it would collapse.  When a government collapses, history shows a dictator will rise and the people, looking for a savior, will accept him.  We are on our way to collapse.  It appears healthcare may be the last flutter of the butterfly wings that brings chaos and collapse as there is not enough money to give everyone healthcare paid by the government.  Medicaid, free healthcare, will be the last flap of the butterfly wings.

I disagree, somewhat.  America is the wealthiest nation on the planet.  With the right leadership (no pun intended).... we would have plenty of money to fund anything we need to fund AND pay down the national debt.  Billions of dollars are wasted and diverted to "other" initiatives under the wrong leadership.  And sadly, I fear that Trump is going to end up being just more of the same "wrong-headed" leadership.   

With the exception of his immigration ban, 2nd amendment stance and tough stance on our national defense, I find myself wondering what's the diff between him and how Hillary would be governing on this "healthcare" fiasco.  It's looking like the "replacement" bill is just more dog and pony show for the brain-dead sheeple. 

True, without the immigration ban enforced, it's probably all going to be moot, since... given enough time our enemies without will manage to hit us and hit us hard.  When that happens, all of this grandstanding over Obamacare will amount to nothing re: priorities.  Mere survival will be the issue.

[Frank Cannon]

The House Freedom Caucus ... the last bastion of principle in a corrupt world   

Donald Trump....the last bastion of incompetence and ignorance in passing one of his signature bills. It's more than obvious now after hearing him try to talk about the bill he didn't even know or care what was in this turd and why people didn't like it.

[ABX]

The guys on Fox Business were apoplectic this morning.  They come at it from a POV of "if it's good for the stock market, it's good".

There is a YUGE! misbelief that what is good for the stock market is actually the best free market solution that is best for the people.

What is good for the stock market is certainty on an issue. Business will adapt to whatever the conditions are but they need to know what the conditions are. The market going up wouldn't be because the bill was good, nor is the market going down because the bill was bad. The market going down (and really not very much, it is almost flat at the time I am writing this), is because it is still uncertain which way it will go so businesses in the market can't plan or adapt.

This is why a lot of Wall Street likes Democrats and liberal bills. It is certain, even if it is certain based on centralized, highly regulated government management. It is easy to predict and adapt to. And if you weren't clear on this, that is not a good thing.

[Doug Loss]

Putting lipstick on a pig is a waste of time and it pisses off the pig.

The duplicate of the 2015 repeal is in committee.  Pass it out of committee and vote for it on the floor.

Yup, but just talking about doing it here won't get it done.  That duplicate is H.R. 1436; everyone, contact your congressmen and urge them to support a discharge petition to force the committee to bring the bill to the House floor for debate.  Otherwise, it'll just die in committee.