Author Topic: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump  (Read 4475 times)

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Offline Paladin

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John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« on: February 05, 2016, 03:57:23 am »
and it ain't racism.

"OK, squirmish of the week: National Review against Donald Trump. The venerable conservative magazine has published a special issue
My former colleagues (memorably described by my heroine Ann Coulter as “girly-boys”) have a point. But at the same time they’re missing a more important point.

The point they have is that Trump has (almost) no track record as a movement conservative. Trump shows no acquaintance with the ideas that have shaped the post-WW2 conservative movement. I’m just flipping through George Nash’s book The Conservative Intellectual Movement in America Since 1945. Eric Voegelin, Whittaker Chambers, Ludwig von Mises, Russell Kirk, Willmoore Kendall, … Do any of these names mean anything to Trump? I doubt it.urging conservatives to not support Trump, on the grounds that he’s not a conservative.


The point they’re missing is that, first—all right, I’m going to make two points out of it—first, there is such a thing as gut conservatism, as distinct from head conservatism. A great many Americans—tens of millions—are conservatives without ever having heard of Willmoore Kendall.

And second, even among the lesser number of us who do know the difference between Straussians and Fusionists, the conviction has settled in that intellectual “conservatism” is a political dead end, with no consequences in the present age.

That wasn’t true in the previous age, the age of the Cold War. Conservative ideas were important and had consequences: most notably, the election of Ronald Reagan. That was terrifically impressive to those of us who grew up during the Cold War, and it made the conservative intellectual enterprise seem worthwhile.

It seems worthwhile no longer. It has no consequences, none that seem good to a conservative temperament, to a conservative gut. The Tea Party election of 2010 has had no good consequences. Nothing happened for us, nothing changed. The George W. Bush Presidency had none, less than none. The 1994 Gingrich Revolution had none. Even the Reagan Presidency had rather few in the domestic sphere, arguably none. I refer you to Chapter 3 of David Frum’s 1994 book Dead Right, chapter title: “The Failure of the Reagan Gambit.”

Gut conservatives are left clutching at straws. They—we—are ready to rally to anyone who shows, in how unsatisfactory-soever a way, some glimmer of understanding about what concerns us.

We don’t want millions of unassimilable foreigners pouring into our country. We don’t want our young people sent off to fight half-hearted wars our leaders have no real desire to win. We don’t much care if Russia or China throw their weight around in their own spheres of influence. We don’t want to see our nation’s leaders apologize to anyone, for anything.

We have no confidence in the Republican Party as a vehicle for our concerns.

Who then are we to vote for? In 2012 a great many of us didn’t bother to vote at all. That’s how Barack Obama got his second term. We didn’t think Romney would have made much difference.

We think Donald Trump will make a difference. That’s the difference.

If you still don’t get it, go read the comment thread on the National Review website. Random sample, quote:

   Been lied to too many times. If the nominee isn’t Trump or Cruz I’ll vote for the Democrat. Trump might screw us over but the establishment candidate will for sure. I’ve come to realize that the establishment Republicans are a greater enemy to me than any communist democrat. I’ll cut off my arm before I ever vote for you c***-*****rs again.

If you still don’t get it, I can’t help. I’ve done my best here.

http://www.vdare.com/articles/weird-american-alpha-male-meets-weird-american-fertility-goddess-and-national-reviews-squirmishing-girly-boys

If you do not know who John Derbyshire is: "John Derbyshire [email him] writes an incredible amount on all sorts of subjects for all kinds of outlets. (This no longer includes National Review, whose editors had some kind of tantrum and fired him. ) He is the author of We Are Doomed: Reclaiming Conservative Pessimism and several other books. He’s had two books published by VDARE.com: FROM THE DISSIDENT RIGHT (also available in Kindle) and From the Dissident Right II: Essays 2013. His writings are archived at JohnDerbyshire.com."

He's an excellent writer.
Members of the anti-Trump cabal: Now that Mr Trump has sewn up the nomination, I want you to know I feel your pain.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2016, 11:59:36 pm »
Quote
We think Donald Trump will make a difference. That’s the difference.

Truth in a nutshell.

Offline sinkspur

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2016, 12:12:18 am »
« Last Edit: February 06, 2016, 12:13:48 am by sinkspur »
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline aligncare

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2016, 12:43:39 am »

"He's an excellent writer."

Yes, in both style and substance.

I like a writer that can, in a wholistic, plausible way, explain and reinforce thoughts and feelings I was having but had no words for. This one seems to have captured for me what is happening in the Republican Party and among conservatives in this crazy 2016 presidential election that's breaking all the rules of how elections are supposed to be.

Interesting read.



Offline Paladin

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2016, 01:25:52 am »
No surprise that a white nationalist racist would support Donald Trump. He's just following the crowd:

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/295514/parting-ways-rich-lowry

http://www.forbes.com/sites/joshbarro/2012/04/06/why-national-review-must-fire-john-derbyshire/#2715e4857a0b193c32ee3353

Ah, sweet. Once again we return to the cesspool of personal attack, "white nationalist racist". So now we can dismiss any thing this fellow has to say. Of course, such a tactic reeks of Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and every other race hustler known to mankind; but, hey, whatever helps you get through the night.

The more perceptive among you will probably note the piece I posted said nothing about race, about nationalism, about whites; in fact, it was just Derbyshire's assessment of why Trump is so popular among Conservatives though he doesn't appear to have any of the intellectual connections to Conservativism shown in the past. That was it. Would that his self-appointed critic had dealt with that instead of trotting out the race card. It might have led to an interesting discussion.

Btw, as Aligncare notes, he is an exceptional polemist. Do not take the biased opinions of the articles cited, especially from NR (who pays any attention to NR on anything?), but read Mr Derbyshire's own words and opinions. http://johnderbyshire.com/. You might find it quite enlightening.

"John Derbyshire

Writer

John Derbyshire is a British-born naturalized American writer, journalist and commentator. He formerly wrote a column in National Review. He has also written for the New English Review. These columns cover a broad range of political-cultural topics, including immigration, China, history, mathematics, and race. Derbyshire's 1996 novel, Seeing Calvin Coolidge in a Dream, was a New York Times "Notable Book of the Year". His 2004 non-fiction book, Prime Obsession, won the Mathematical Association of America's inaugural Euler Book Prize. A new political book, We Are Doomed: Reclaiming Conservative Pessimism, was released in September 2009 through Crown Forum. Derbyshire attended the Northampton School for Boys and graduated from University College London, of the University of London, where he studied mathematics. Before turning to writing full-time, he worked on Wall Street as a computer programmer."
Members of the anti-Trump cabal: Now that Mr Trump has sewn up the nomination, I want you to know I feel your pain.

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2016, 01:33:40 am »
Quote
and it ain't racism.

Ah but it is -

Quote
We don’t want millions of unassimilable foreigners pouring into our country.

Note that Mr. Derbyshire didn't speak of not wanting dangerous terrorists in our country.  Or even illegal alien workers.   He doesn't want "unassimilable foreigners" - he doesn't want brown people and non-Christian people,  and he makes the wholly unsupportable objection that such folks won't assimilate.   History has proven that America is a melting pot that assimilates folks from all cultures.   It's the consequence of our Constitution and our attitude toward the God-given nature of our liberties.   

If you want the borders secured,  if you want terrorism confronted and defeated, then you're voicing a legitimate concern that just about all the GOP candidates share.   But if you want to keep the "unassimilable foreigners" out,  then sorry, Mr. Derbyshire,  that's racism, and I understand full well why Trump's your man.   
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Offline sinkspur

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2016, 01:41:50 am »
So now we can dismiss any thing this fellow has to say

Yes. I ignore the rantings of racists.

Do you value anything Al Sharpton says?

Derbyshire is a racist. Read his column on how he keeps his white children away from black children.
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline Paladin

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2016, 01:48:06 am »
How does the phrase "unassimilable foreigners" imply anything about race, brown people and non-Christian people? The word means unable "to bring into conformity with the customs, attitudes, etc., of a group, nation, or the like; adapt or adjust." There is no criterion beyond that, unless, of course, one is injecting one's own thoughts into the discussion, or is playing the race card.

Btw, what is wrong with keeping unassimilable foreigners out of our country, no matter who they are, what their race is, their religion, and their point of origin?

Members of the anti-Trump cabal: Now that Mr Trump has sewn up the nomination, I want you to know I feel your pain.

Offline Paladin

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2016, 01:49:22 am »
I ignore the rantings of racists.

Precisely why I don't take anything you have to say seriously.
Members of the anti-Trump cabal: Now that Mr Trump has sewn up the nomination, I want you to know I feel your pain.

Offline sinkspur

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2016, 01:51:04 am »
Precisely why I don't take anything you have to say seriously.

You don't ignore the rantings of racists?
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline EdinVA

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2016, 01:57:37 am »
He's an excellent writer.

Never heard of him till you posted... got my attention.
Thanks Paladin..

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2016, 01:58:23 am »
You don't ignore the rantings of racists?

I am sure he does sink
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Offline sinkspur

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2016, 02:00:04 am »
I am sure he does sink

You are very tolerant.
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline Paladin

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2016, 02:21:52 am »
Quote from: sinkspur on Today at 05:51:04 PM
You don't ignore the rantings of racists?

I am sure he does sink

Subtlety apparently is not exactly this lad's strong point.
Members of the anti-Trump cabal: Now that Mr Trump has sewn up the nomination, I want you to know I feel your pain.

Offline aligncare

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2016, 02:40:14 am »
Ah but it is -

Note that Mr. Derbyshire didn't speak of not wanting dangerous terrorists in our country.  Or even illegal alien workers.   He doesn't want "unassimilable foreigners" - he doesn't want brown people and non-Christian people,  and he makes the wholly unsupportable objection that such folks won't assimilate.   History has proven that America is a melting pot that assimilates folks from all cultures.   It's the consequence of our Constitution and our attitude toward the God-given nature of our liberties.   

If you want the borders secured,  if you want terrorism confronted and defeated, then you're voicing a legitimate concern that just about all the GOP candidates share.   But if you want to keep the "unassimilable foreigners" out,  then sorry, Mr. Derbyshire,  that's racism, and I understand full well why Trump's your man.

I'm an immigrant to America and I don't want millions of unassimilable foreigners coming here, either.

My family came here to become Americans. Unassimilable, connotes an unwillingness to embrace America, unlike my family had done.

Who wants millions of people coming here who don't love America but just want to take what they can from her? What principle are we upholding when we support that? ...The principle of liberal stupidity?

"Come one come all" sounds nice on paper. But, keep it up, and pretty soon we lose our country to foreigners who don't understand our political traditions or share or embrace American culture or values...and to a person vote for socialists. That's how we lose the America we love.

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2016, 03:10:28 am »
I'm an immigrant to America and I don't want millions of unassimilable foreigners coming here, either.

My family came here to become Americans. Unassimilable, connotes an unwillingness to embrace America, unlike my family had done.

Who wants millions of people coming here who don't love America but just want to take what they can from her? What principle are we upholding when we support that? ...The principle of liberal stupidity?

"Come one come all" sounds nice on paper. But, keep it up, and pretty soon we lose our country to foreigners who don't understand our political traditions or share or embrace American culture or values...and to a person vote for socialists. That's how we lose the America we love.

But who are you - or Donald Trump or Mr. Derbeyshire - to judge who is and who is not "unassimilable"?   That canard was leveled against the Italians, and the Jews, and other immigrant groups that have managed to assimilate just fine.   Why is it still being trotted out today?   

This has nothing to do with illegal immigration, btw.   Cruz is tough as nails when it comes to illegal immigration, but I wouldn't accuse him of racism.  Derbeyshire?   Accusing "millions" of immigrants of being  -  not illegal -  but "unassimilable"?   What millions?  There aren't a million terrorists.   And the illegals who come here to work, truth be told, assimilate just find.  He's painting with a broad brush - a brush, it ought to be reasonably clear, that is arbitrary and prejudicial. 

But yeah,  Derbeyshire's a "good writer".  He has, indeed, been prescient in pinpointing a key component of Trump's appeal.   
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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2016, 03:28:23 am »
No surprise that a white nationalist racist would support Donald Trump. He's just following the crowd:

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/295514/parting-ways-rich-lowry

http://www.forbes.com/sites/joshbarro/2012/04/06/why-national-review-must-fire-john-derbyshire/#2715e4857a0b193c32ee3353

Thank you for posting this. 

The site he posts at (VDARE) tends to attract white nationalist writers.  Heck, one of their writers, Peter Brimelow, is considered to be 'too extreme' for even the WND.

They also write in support of the Golden Dawn party in Greece.

BTW, here's another of Derbyshire's articles (http://www.vdare.com/articles/john-derbyshire-on-our-unwanted-but-uncriticizable-underclasses)
« Last Edit: February 06, 2016, 03:31:13 am by HonestJohn »

Offline Paladin

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2016, 04:24:21 am »
Who woulda thought politically correct standards of expression and applications of the race card would ever infest GOPbr? And yet here we are.
Members of the anti-Trump cabal: Now that Mr Trump has sewn up the nomination, I want you to know I feel your pain.

Offline sinkspur

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2016, 04:31:05 am »
VDARE was home to the execrable Sam Francis who wrote this:

"At a time when anti-white racial and ethnic groups define themselves in explicitly racial terms, only our own unity and identity as a race will be able to meet their challenge. If and when that challenge should triumph and those enemies come to kill us as Robert Mugabe has threatened to do to whites in Zimbabwe, they will do so not because we are 'Americans' or 'Christians' or 'conservatives' or 'liberals,' but because we are white."
— "Race and the American Prospect: An Introduction," VDARE.com, 2006 (published posthumously)

Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline truth_seeker

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2016, 04:54:44 am »
So here, we cannot discuss immigrant assimilation, because it is not politically correct ??

Seems like Europe, where people are upset with rampant rape and crime committed by immigrants, but they are supposed to shut up !!

Muslims that rape non-muslim women are clearly NOT assimilated, period !!  Muslims that shoot up Ft. Hood are NOT assimilated !!

We should NOT take unnecessary chances, for the sake of political correctness.

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Offline aligncare

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Re: John Derbyshire on the appeal of Trump
« Reply #20 on: February 06, 2016, 01:48:45 pm »

Three cheers for President Obama, America's first black president who singlehandedly created such harmony between the races and who helped usher in "hands up don't shoot," "#BlackLivesMatter (or else!)," "I was robbed by the racist academy awards," and a revival of segregated college campuses.

Now, all we need to do to complete this picture of a reverting and dying society is to import millions more culturally unassimilable foreigners with third-world resentments. Oh, joy.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2016, 02:05:48 pm by aligncare »