Author Topic: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd  (Read 1570 times)

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Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« on: November 01, 2015, 01:40:37 pm »
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/01/opinion/sunday/fall-of-the-house-of-bush.html?ref=opinion&_r=0

Fall of the House of Bush

OCT. 31, 2015

WASHINGTON — JEB, dragging his wilted exclamation point around, is so boring that it’s hard to focus on the epic nature of his battle.

Not the battle against Donald Trump, although his beat-down by Trump is garishly entertaining. I’m talking about the Brooks Brothers “Game of Thrones” family tangle.

As much as Poppy Bush scoffs at “the D-word,” as he calls any reference to dynasty, the Bushes do consider themselves an American royal family. They have always pretty much divided the world into Bushes and the help. The patriarch once sent me a funny satire referring to himself and Barbara as the Old King and Queen, W. as King George of Crawford and Jeb as the Earl of Tallahassee.

At 91, 41 is living to see Jebbie become president. He is mystified by a world in which Trump, whom he considers a clown, could dethrone the crown prince.

continued
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Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2015, 02:09:14 pm »
Quote
the Bushes do consider themselves an American royal family. They have always pretty much divided the world into Bushes and the help.

Poor Maureen.......... she has to make things up to make her point.   BDS, even after all these years, is just sad.......
Character still matters.  It always matters.

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2015, 03:04:07 pm »
Poor Maureen.......... she has to make things up to make her point.   BDS, even after all these years, is just sad.......

The Bushes DO believe they're political royalty.  How else would one explain the chutzpah it takes to think the only Republican to sit in the Oval Office since Reagan's departure in 1989 should be a Bush?

Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2015, 03:58:11 pm »
The Bushes DO believe they're political royalty.  How else would one explain the chutzpah it takes to think the only Republican to sit in the Oval Office since Reagan's departure in 1989 should be a Bush?

You're making a whale of a lot of assumptions in those two sentences, RiV.

Just like Mo.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2015, 04:07:59 pm »
You're making a whale of a lot of assumptions in those two sentences, RiV.


Actually, ML, I stand by my two sentences as truth.  And if you take a peek at the polls, it would appear the vast majority of Americans polled agree with me.

BDS may be the appropriate reaction to Bush III. 

Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2015, 04:14:32 pm »


Actually, ML, I stand by my two sentences as truth.  And if you take a peek at the polls, it would appear the vast majority of Americans polled agree with me.

BDS may be the appropriate reaction to Bush III.

Let me make it clear that Jeb is way down on my list (only slightly above Trump).  I didn't want him to run, and I don't want him to win the nomination.  If he does, I will vote for him rather than stay home and vote for Hillary, but I don't support him at all.

That said, the assumptions about what the Bush's think about themselves is speculation, and the idea that they look at everyone else as 'the help' has absolutely no basis in reality.  Mo made that up.

As for BDS, I don't believe that mental derangement and hysteria are ever appropriate reactions for rational people.

I obviously may be in the minority here when it comes to anyone named Bush, but insanity just doesn't seem an appropriation response.    :shrug:
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2015, 04:23:40 pm »
I obviously may be in the minority here when it comes to anyone named Bush, but insanity just doesn't seem an appropriation response.    :shrug: 

It's not insanity.  It's reasonable and rational to be insulted by and rise against the proposition that the only Republican to sit in the oval office since 1989 should be yet another Bush.

It is hubris bordering on a royalty complex for the Bush family to think they have the right to it.

« Last Edit: November 01, 2015, 04:24:20 pm by Right_in_Virginia »

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2015, 04:28:33 pm »
It's not insanity.  It's reasonable and rational to be insulted by and rise against the proposition that the only Republican to sit in the oval office since 1989 should be yet another Bush.

It is hubris bordering on a royalty complex for the Bush family to think they have the right to it.

I don't think they think they have a right to it, no matter what nag Dowd says.

It's sad to see so many in the Republican party trashing the Bushes.  GHW and GW had administrations free of scandal and did their best. 

Is it their fault the GOP nominated tired old dogs like Bob Dole, John McCain, and a patrician like Mitt Romney?
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2015, 04:36:39 pm »
It's not insanity.  It's reasonable and rational to be insulted by and rise against the proposition that the only Republican to sit in the oval office since 1989 should be yet another Bush.

It is hubris bordering on a royalty complex for the Bush family to think they have the right to it.

I confess to having paid a lot of attention to George W. Bush while he was in office.  And one of the most remarkable things I saw (in his behavior, in the words of those who had contact with him, in his own words) was his humility and graciousness.  I ended up disagreeing with many of the things he did, but in all the years of his presidency, and in the years since, there has been nothing to change my mind about what kind of person he is.  And that kind of person is not one who thinks of himself as 'royalty.'

The same characteristic is true of his father.  GHW Bush, regardless of what you think of his Presidency, is a gracious, giving man.

I maintain that to make the comments you and Mo have made, one has to make a number of assumptions that are based on your feelings and not on the facts about who they are as people.

As I said, I do NOT want Jeb to be President.  I didn't want him to run.  But I believe he is a decent man who wants to serve, just like his Dad and brother.

This BDS madness will fade.  The derangement that you support (i.e. insanity) will go away in time, and the perspective of a patriotic family will return as emotions die away.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2015, 04:37:56 pm »
I don't think they think they have a right to it, no matter what nag Dowd says.

It's sad to see so many in the Republican party trashing the Bushes.  GHW and GW had administrations free of scandal and did their best. 

Is it their fault the GOP nominated tired old dogs like Bob Dole, John McCain, and a patrician like Mitt Romney?

It's the PC thing to do, sinkspur.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Online Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2015, 04:42:35 pm »
It's sad to see so many in the Republican party trashing the Bushes.  GHW and GW had administrations free of scandal and did their best.

Yes, both administrations were free of scandal--and that's a good thing.  But their "best" wasn't good enough.  If it had been, the Republican "brand" would have strengthened; not diluted.  If it had been, we would not have seen a President Clinton or President Obama. 

Quote
Is it their fault the GOP nominated tired old dogs like Bob Dole, John McCain, and a patrician like Mitt Romney?

Of course not.  But that doesn't exonerate even the idea of a third Bush presidency in 26 years, never mind an actual campaign.  It is enough. 

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2015, 05:04:54 pm »
I used to really like Jeb..I don't know what has happened to him...he isn't the same...always has the *deer in the headlights* look...maybe his diet..he may want to introduce some carbs back into his meals...
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Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2015, 05:05:58 pm »
I used to really like Jeb..I don't know what has happened to him...he isn't the same...always has the *deer in the headlights* look...maybe his diet..he may want to introduce some carbs back into his meals...

I get the feeling he really, really doesn't want to run.  He's been pathetic lately, hasn't he??
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2015, 05:13:58 pm »
I agree with those who view GHWB, GWB, and Jeb as gracious and humble human beings. They do not have a Monarch-mentality or a sense of entitlement, in my view. Jeb is done and he knows it, however. It will not be a good way to go out if he tries to take Rubio with him.
There are some among us who live in rooms of experience we can never enter.
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Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2015, 05:46:27 pm »
I agree with those who view GHWB, GWB, and Jeb as gracious and humble human beings. They do not have a Monarch-mentality or a sense of entitlement, in my view. Jeb is done and he knows it, however. It will not be a good way to go out if he tries to take Rubio with him.

I think because it was so out of character for a Bush, Jeb's jabs at Rubio looked even worse.

The best thing for him to do right now, IMO, is just back away.  He IS toast.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #15 on: November 01, 2015, 06:59:14 pm »
Yes, both administrations were free of scandal--and that's a good thing.  But their "best" wasn't good enough.  If it had been, the Republican "brand" would have strengthened; not diluted.  If it had been, we would not have seen a President Clinton or President Obama. 

Of course not.  But that doesn't exonerate even the idea of a third Bush presidency in 26 years, never mind an actual campaign.  It is enough.

I don't believe anyone on this forum is supporting Jeb Bush; if they are, I haven't seen it.  So you're kind of arguing against a straw man. 

Are you kidding about GW Bush?  The bottom fell out of the economy in the two months before the election; no Republican was going to win the presidency after that.   And I'm still not convinced that that cipher Perot didn't cost GHW Bush the 1992 election.
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Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #16 on: November 01, 2015, 07:15:35 pm »
I don't believe anyone on this forum is supporting Jeb Bush; if they are, I haven't seen it.  So you're kind of arguing against a straw man. 

Are you kidding about GW Bush?  The bottom fell out of the economy in the two months before the election; no Republican was going to win the presidency after that.   And I'm still not convinced that that cipher Perot didn't cost GHW Bush the 1992 election.

I absolutely believe that Perot gave the Presidency to Clinton.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2015, 07:21:45 pm »
I confess to having paid a lot of attention to George W. Bush while he was in office.  And one of the most remarkable things I saw (in his behavior, in the words of those who had contact with him, in his own words) was his humility and graciousness.  I ended up disagreeing with many of the things he did, but in all the years of his presidency, and in the years since, there has been nothing to change my mind about what kind of person he is.  And that kind of person is not one who thinks of himself as 'royalty.'

The same characteristic is true of his father.  GHW Bush, regardless of what you think of his Presidency, is a gracious, giving man.

I maintain that to make the comments you and Mo have made, one has to make a number of assumptions that are based on your feelings and not on the facts about who they are as people.

...

Asking a difficult question here:  aren't you making the same feelings based assumption about Jeb?  Because his dad and brother appear to be good people, therefore Jeb is too?

Full disclosure: I don't have strong feelings for Jeb one way for the other.  Well, other than that I strongly feel that he should get out of the race.  But, I don't think he is cut of quite the same cloth as his father and brother.

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2015, 07:25:48 pm »
Lord have mercy but it's bizarre - and disgusting - to see some arguing in favor of Dowd and as against a Bush.

Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #19 on: November 01, 2015, 07:28:33 pm »
Asking a difficult question here:  aren't you making the same feelings based assumption about Jeb?  Because his dad and brother appear to be good people, therefore Jeb is too?

Full disclosure: I don't have strong feelings for Jeb one way for the other.  Well, other than that I strongly feel that he should get out of the race.  But, I don't think he is cut of quite the same cloth as his father and brother.

I don't think it's a feelings based assumption because I've seen quite a bit about Jeb previously, and believe he is a man of character with a desire to serve.

It's quite clear, however, that he doesn't have the same mettle as his Dad and brother since he is wilting before our very eyes.  But that's not the same thing as believing he's dishonorable.  Just weaker.

I never wanted him to run, and I strongly feel he should get out.  It will be best for everyone, and for the process, if he does.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #20 on: November 01, 2015, 07:29:07 pm »
Lord have mercy but it's bizarre - and disgusting - to see some arguing in favor of Dowd and as against a Bush.

Amen!

We have entered the Twilight Zone.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #21 on: November 01, 2015, 07:36:09 pm »
You are known by your enemies.

I think Jeb can sleep pretty soundly at night if Maureen Dowd and Trump get their panties in a bunch over him.
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #22 on: November 01, 2015, 07:38:02 pm »
You are known by your enemies.

I think Jeb can sleep pretty soundly at night if Maureen Dowd and Trump get their panties in a bunch over him.

Do you think they have pantie parties together?  :silly:

Offline musiclady

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #23 on: November 01, 2015, 07:39:49 pm »
Lord have mercy but it's bizarre - and disgusting - to see some arguing in favor of Dowd and as against a Bush.

btw, there is a possibility that the poster was not so much arguing in agreement with Dowd as she was being disagreeable with me.   I'm beginning to see a pattern here.....   :shrug:
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

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Re: Fall of the House of Bush...Maureen Dowd
« Reply #24 on: November 01, 2015, 08:50:19 pm »
I don't believe anyone on this forum is supporting Jeb Bush; if they are, I haven't seen it.  .

Thanks for the encouraging words--they're a great way to start a week!   :laugh: