Author Topic: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?  (Read 5245 times)

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Offline Rapunzel

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Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« on: July 21, 2013, 11:22:33 pm »
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/history/world-war-two/10192280/Is-the-Mosquito-the-greatest-warplane-of-all.html


Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
The Spitfire is more famous but, discovers Jasper Copping, the de Havilland Mosquito can claim to be the plane that won the war
Jasper Copping

By Jasper Copping

7:00AM BST 21 Jul 2013

video at link with lots of video of the plane flying

While the Spitfire and Hurricane are remembered as the machines that saved Britain from Nazi invasion, the Lancaster and Halifax are lauded as the warhorses that took the fight to the Third Reich.

But there is an argument that the country’s greatest aircraft of the Second World War was none of these, but the less heralded de Havilland Mosquito.

This versatile, two-man machine, designed by the British aviator pioneer Geoffrey de Havilland, served with distinction as a fighter, bomber, U-boat hunter and night fighter, as well as in reconnaissance roles and as a pathfinder on large-scale bombing attacks.

It was behind some of the most stunning raids of the war – among them the precision operation to attack the Gestapo headquarters in Oslo, Norway; and another to breach the walls of a prison in Amiens to allow the escape of condemned resistance fighters.

Its greatest attribute, its speed, came from its unusual construction. To preserve metal reserves, it was made of wood, its parts crafted by carpenters and joiners in workshops turned over from furniture and cabinet-making. The components, from spruce, birch, balsa and plywood, were then put together with glue.



But at the end of the war, this unique characteristic became its biggest weakness. While metal-framed aircraft endured, most Mosquitos simply rotted away in their hangars.

For almost 20 years, there have been no airworthy Mosquitos since the last one crashed at an air show near Manchester in 1996, killing both crew members.

This lack of airborne Mosquitos and the higher profile enjoyed by the Spitfire and Lancaster, in particular, has led some to overlook the contribution made by the so-called “Wooden Wonder”.

But tonight, a Channel 4 documentary, The Plane that Saved Britain, seeks to correct that. And for the presenter, Arthur Williams, the show is also a more personal quest. The former Royal Marine has been fascinated with aviation – and, above all, the Mosquito – since childhood. But he took up flying only after a car crash in 2007 had left him in a wheelchair.

In the show he traces the history of the Mosquito: he speaks with a designer who overcame official doubts to create the revolutionary machine, as well as several of those who flew it. But he also travels to the US in an attempt to get aboard a newly restored one.

Overcoming last-minute health-and-safety concerns linked to his disability, he is able to fly the aircraft, which has been rebuilt by Jerry Yagen, an American aviation enthusiast, following an eight-year, £2.6m restoration. Back on land, after the flight, Williams says: “It seems kind of ironic that the whole journey that started me off on my flying career was the worst day of my life, which was the car crash that put me in my wheelchair. And now, six years down the line, we’re here, and I’m experiencing, by a long way, the best day of my life. It feels like two bookends.”

Williams, 27, had served in Sierra Leone before he broke his back and severed his spinal cord in the car accident near Pershore, Worcestershire, where he had been visiting family.

He trained as a Paralympian wheelchair racer and hand cyclist before switching to broadcasting and getting a job with Channel 4 during last summer’s Games. But he said it was flying that gave him a “crutch” and restored the confidence he had lost following the accident.

“I had struggled with how to reassert myself as a man after the crash. It might be my old Royal Marine mentality, but becoming a pilot has helped me do that,” he said last week. “People look at you in a wheelchair and perhaps assume you are spoon-fed. When you tell them you are a pilot, their jaw drops.

“Flying also gives you a freedom. Down here, I am restricted in what I can do physically, which can sometimes frustrate me. When you are flying, you are strapped in and become part of the aircraft.”

The title of tonight’s show makes a bold claim on behalf of the Mosquito, but Williams has marshalled strong support for the aircraft.

Eric “Winkle” Brown, a wartime test pilot, tells him: “I’m often asked, what type of aircraft saved Britain. My answer is that the Mosquito was particularly important because it wasn’t just a fighter or a bomber. It was a night fighter, a reconnaissance aircraft. A ground-attack aircraft. It was a multi-purpose aircraft.”

Sir Max Hastings, the historian, agrees: “The Mosquito helped transform the fortunes of the bomber offensive. It was obvious that this was a real gamechanger. In many ways, from the outset it became plain that the Mosquito was a much more remarkable aircraft than the Lancaster. Yes, the Lancaster is the aircraft that everybody identifies with Bomber Command, but in many ways the Mosquito, although it has received much less attention, was a much more remarkable aircraft.”

He adds: “You’ve got the range, the height, the speed. It can do anything and in that sense, I think some of us would argue this is a more remarkable design achievement than the Spitfire.”

The Germans had nothing equal to the Mosquito and it sapped their morale. Its fighter pilots were allowed to claim two “kills” for each one they were able to shoot down.

As well as enhancing the accuracy of heavy bombers by flying ahead and dropping “markers”, one of the Mosquito’s greatest contributions was in creating a new form of aerial warfare – surgical strikes, many of them for propaganda purposes.

As well as the Oslo and Amiens attacks, one of the most celebrated was a raid on the Berlin radio station on which Hermann Göring, head of the Luftwaffe, was about to deliver a speech. The British newsreel gleefully reported afterwards that the “fat Field Marshal” had been delayed by one hour.

Indeed, never mind the judgment of historians such as Hastings or the reminiscences of former pilots, the greatest tribute to the aircraft came from Göring himself, who said it made him “green and yellow with envy”.

He added: “The British, who can afford aluminium better than we can, knock together a beautiful wooden aircraft that every piano factory over there is building, and they give it a speed which they have now increased yet again. What do you make of that? There is nothing the British do not have. They have the geniuses, and we have the nincompoops.”

'The Plane that Saved Britain’ is on Channel 4 tonight at 8pm
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline EC

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2013, 11:28:41 pm »
Second.

The greatest warplane of all time is the Mil-24A. Fast, carries a ton and a half of munitions and is pretty much indestructible. It has the added bonus of being too ugly for even a mother to love.
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Offline EC

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2013, 11:45:52 pm »
Actually - gonna throw this out there. Back in WW2, planes were delivered by WACS. The Woman's Air Corps Auxiliary. Mosquitoes, Spitfires, Hurricanes, even Lancasters and Halifaxes were all flown to their airbases from the factories by women.

My Dad's eldest sister was one of them. They were given minimal fuel and a partial load out for the weapons for the trips, just in case.

My aunt has two confirmed kills to her name, both in a Spitfire. Not exactly an ace, but this tiny woman did stuff I can't even imagine doing. She's still alive now - she is over 100 - and still amazing. Just phoned her.  :laugh:
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Offline PzLdr

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2013, 04:36:41 am »
Greatest airplane off WW II? P-51 Mustang. Without it deep penetration raids into the Reich would have been chopped into dog meat. As for the Mosquito, its nearest equivalent the Ju-88 could do everything thr Mosquito could do. And it also served as a torpedo bomber.  :smokin:
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Offline flowers

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2013, 06:44:34 pm »
Greatest airplane off WW II? P-51 Mustang. Without it deep penetration raids into the Reich would have been chopped into dog meat. As for the Mosquito, its nearest equivalent the Ju-88 could do everything thr Mosquito could do. And it also served as a torpedo bomber.  :smokin:
P-51 one of my faves planes of  WWII!  I had a chance to fly in one once, turned it down. Should have done it.




Offline NavyCanDo

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2013, 01:01:09 am »
P-51 one of my faves planes of  WWII!  I had a chance to fly in one once, turned it down. Should have done it.

We had a Tuskegee Airman a member of my VFW post.   We always enjoyed his stories, and would often call on him to guest speak. As for the P51 being the best of WWII,  I would have to take Chuck Yeager's word for it.  He would most assuredly give it his vote.
The Spitfire and the Hurricane were the most beautiful airplanes in the sky without a doubt, and the sky was their element like a Mako shark in an turquoise ocean. But landing them was a B#@CH.   Many crashed upon landing. 
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Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2013, 01:33:59 am »
Harder to land than the Corsair???
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Offline NavyCanDo

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2013, 01:59:57 am »
If you have Netflix check out the documentary Battle of Britain (2011)   I gave it 5 stars.


To mark the Battle of Britain's 70th Anniversary, actor Ewan McGregor and his brother Colin, a former RAF pilot, lead viewers through key moments of the action when "The Few" of the RAF faced the mighty Nazi Luftwaffe. Together, the brothers take us on a journey to honor the heroes of 1940, bringing the amazing story of the Battle of Britain to a new generation. As Spitfires and Hurricanes once again fly over the White Cliffs of Dover, they reveal the inspiring personal stories of "The Few" who were there and those still with us today. Using great aerial footage mixed with impressive archival film, this is the definitive program on the Battle of Britain.

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Offline Ford289HiPo

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2013, 03:05:32 am »
What could be prettier than this:



or this:



The Mosquito was just a beautiful airplane.
I wonder when the lies will stop and truth begin, even as grim as the truth may be. And then I remember that for 70 years, the reign of terror in Russia called itself "the people's government." We have so far to fall, yet we are falling fast and Hell yawns to receive us.

Offline Ford289HiPo

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2013, 03:07:56 am »
Greatest airplane off WW II? P-51 Mustang.   :smokin:

I would say that the P47 was a better aircraft. It didn't have the complexity of a liquid cooling system, heavier armor and armament, and performance was comparable with the P51. The P51 was just prettier than the Jug.
I wonder when the lies will stop and truth begin, even as grim as the truth may be. And then I remember that for 70 years, the reign of terror in Russia called itself "the people's government." We have so far to fall, yet we are falling fast and Hell yawns to receive us.

Offline PzLdr

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2013, 03:36:54 am »
Harder to land than the Corsair???

Yeah. Problem was the closeness of the landing gear. Same problem with the Me 109. The Germns lost more pilots to crashes [especially on landing] than they did in combat.  :smokin:
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Offline PzLdr

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2013, 03:38:29 am »
I would say that the P47 was a better aircraft. It didn't have the complexity of a liquid cooling system, heavier armor and armament, and performance was comparable with the P51. The P51 was just prettier than the Jug.

The P-51 had MUCH greater range. The JUG never overcame that problem. Even with drop tanks.
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Offline PzLdr

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2013, 03:40:02 am »
If you have Netflix check out the documentary Battle of Britain (2011)   I gave it 5 stars.


To mark the Battle of Britain's 70th Anniversary, actor Ewan McGregor and his brother Colin, a former RAF pilot, lead viewers through key moments of the action when "The Few" of the RAF faced the mighty Nazi Luftwaffe. Together, the brothers take us on a journey to honor the heroes of 1940, bringing the amazing story of the Battle of Britain to a new generation. As Spitfires and Hurricanes once again fly over the White Cliffs of Dover, they reveal the inspiring personal stories of "The Few" who were there and those still with us today. Using great aerial footage mixed with impressive archival film, this is the definitive program on the Battle of Britain.

At the risk of being a maverick, to paraphrase Churchill, "Never have so many owed so much to the fuel capacity of the Me 109.
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Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2013, 03:42:13 am »
What could be prettier than this:



or this:



The Mosquito was just a beautiful airplane.

DeHavilland designed really beautiful planes. 
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2013, 04:11:06 am »
What about some consideration for the bombers of WWII?  It seems to me that some credit should be given to some of those aircraft, aircraft that could be shot through and through, with major sections missing, and still bring their crews back home.

This:



is, according to this webpage:  http://www.yellowairplane.com/models_bombers/images/Shackled_Crashed_B-17_Bomber_WW2_Okinawa.html (the actual story starts at the right side of the second photo on that page, not at the top),

a B-17 that took a direct hit from a German anti-aircraft gun, which killed one of the crew (the story says the round most likely landed in his lap, literally) and, as the image shows, blew the h*ll out of the entire nose section.  Nonetheless, the remaining crew were able to fly the bomber back to base - with some assistance from a pair of P-51s - land it, and walk away alive.

This:



is a photograph of the tail section of the B-17 "All American" after the bomber had been attacked by a pair of German fighters after making a bombing run in North Africa.  According to the story on this webpage:  http://www.warbirdsnews.com/warbird-articles/wwiis-b-17-all-american-separating-fact-fiction.html , one of the German fighters was hit while it was close to the "All American" and it struck the "All American" and "tore a significant hole in the rear of the fuselage and removed the left horizontal stabilizer."

Nonetheless, the crew were able to fly the "All American" back to base and land it safely.

I suppose it depends on your perspective, but I'd rank the B-17 up there pretty high considering its ability to take such awe-inspiring damage and still bring its crews home.


Offline PzLdr

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2013, 01:33:49 pm »
Altough it's not the greatest in terms of speed, bomb load, etc, I'd vote for the Ju 87B 'Stuka'. Its image is synonomous with World War II.   :smokin:
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Offline EC

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #16 on: July 23, 2013, 02:52:02 pm »
Altough it's not the greatest in terms of speed, bomb load, etc, I'd vote for the Ju 87B 'Stuka'. Its image is synonomous with World War II.   :smokin:

Might not have been the fastest or carried a huge load out, but it was perfectly designed for what it did - cause sheer terror. It had a decent enough range and was devastating to the convoys.

Agreed -  :smokin:

No love for the B25? North American took an HP Halifax and made it pretty.
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Offline Ford289HiPo

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #17 on: July 26, 2013, 03:02:20 am »
At the risk of being a maverick, to paraphrase Churchill, "Never have so many owed so much to the fuel capacity of the Me 109.

Yep. It was pathetic.
I wonder when the lies will stop and truth begin, even as grim as the truth may be. And then I remember that for 70 years, the reign of terror in Russia called itself "the people's government." We have so far to fall, yet we are falling fast and Hell yawns to receive us.

Offline Ford289HiPo

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #18 on: July 26, 2013, 03:05:11 am »
Altough it's not the greatest in terms of speed, bomb load, etc, I'd vote for the Ju 87B 'Stuka'. Its image is synonomous with World War II.   :smokin:

It was all but obsolete at the beginning of the war. Even so, it was an effective ground attack aircraft on the eastern front.
I wonder when the lies will stop and truth begin, even as grim as the truth may be. And then I remember that for 70 years, the reign of terror in Russia called itself "the people's government." We have so far to fall, yet we are falling fast and Hell yawns to receive us.

Offline PzLdr

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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #19 on: July 26, 2013, 03:29:12 am »
It was all but obsolete at the beginning of the war. Even so, it was an effective ground attack aircraft on the eastern front.

True. But to me, the Ju 87 was the coolest looking plane of the war. And despite the obsolescence, Rudel sank a battleship and busted a whole bunch of tanks with one. Hell, it soldiered on when dedicated ground attack aircraft  couldn't [Heinkel 129(?)].  :smokin:
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Re: Is the Mosquito the greatest warplane of all?
« Reply #20 on: July 26, 2013, 03:32:15 am »
True. But to me, the Ju 87 was the coolest looking plane of the war. And despite the obsolescence, Rudel sank a battleship and busted a whole bunch of tanks with one. Hell, it soldiered on when dedicated ground attack aircraft  couldn't [Heinkel 129(?)].  :smokin:

It was totally cool looking.  It sort of epitomizes the idea of a dive-bomber.