Enhanced U.S. Combat Training Teams Readied for Ukraine Forces

[mystery-ak]

Enhanced U.S. Combat Training Teams Readied for Ukraine Forces

Simon Kent 16 Dec 2022

The Pentagon flagged Thursday it is in for the long haul delivering military assistance to Ukraine, announcing enhanced U.S. combat training for Kyiv’s forces via larger units delivering more complex battle skills.

The Defense Department and U.S. officials said the 7th Army Training Command headquartered in Grafenwoehr, Germany will carry out the initiative at U.S. ranges in that country.

The U.S. has already trained about 3,100 Ukrainian troops on how to use and maintain certain weapons and other equipment, including howitzers, armored vehicles and the High Mobility Artillery Rocket System, known as HIMARS.

As Breitbart News reported, that training goes back as far as May when the Biden administration entered an agreement with Germany to begin training programs for Ukrainian soldiers.

The UK also began a similar training operation the month before.

more
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2022/12/16/enhanced-u-s-combat-training-teams-readied-for-ukraine-forces/

[bilo]

Just don't send our guys into Ukraine!

[jafo2010]

It was announced in the news that with the delivery of Patriot missile systems in Ukraine, it would take USA military to man those weapon batteries.  That is boots on the ground.  Now imagine Russia striking them and killing 15, 50, 100 Americans.  Then what?  This escalates into Vietnam over night, only with nukes lurking over the horizon.

I do not put Putin using nukes as being a long shot.  I can see him easily using them.  His whole behavior with this Hitler style attack upon Ukraine has been irrational.  Anything can happen, and most likely will.

[sneakypete]

Just don't send our guys into Ukraine!

@bilo

Not any combat arms troops,anyhow.

I am all for sending in tech troops to teach Ukrainians how to properly use the materials we are sending,though.

[sneakypete]

It was announced in the news that with the delivery of Patriot missile systems in Ukraine, it would take USA military to man those weapon batteries.  That is boots on the ground.

@jafo2010

I don't see it that way. Those troops are not really combat arms troops,and they are there to teach,not "do".

You WILL see me having a hissy-fit if they start send in regular army infantry units,though.

Now imagine Russia striking them and killing 15, 50, 100 Americans.  Then what?

Depends. If the neo-Soviets just get lucky and take out a field piece that just happens to have USA redlegs there teaching how to use it,I see it as more of an indistrial accident than an act of war against the US.

Yeah,they are just as dead as any infantry troops on any combat assault in history,but you can't join the army,accept a combat arms position like field artillery,and be shocked when you end up shooting cannons and  having cannons shooting back.


In the civilian world,this is know as "The Cost of doing business",and you can bet your bippy that every cannon cocker that goes there is a career artillery soldier,and not 18 year old privates.

Ya take the money and ya gotta take the occasional risks associated with taking that money.

 

This escalates into Vietnam over night, only with nukes lurking over the horizon.

It is a VERY real possibility given the desperation and insecurities of the Neo-Soviets in Moscow,but I honestly think,and hope,that saner minds will prevail,and the Russian Army Regulars will arrest and jail them pending trials.

The career military that are insulated from reality might be in favor of that sort of thing,but I can guarantee you that the typical Russian soldier who lives in Moscow with his family is NOT. This includes the officers of troop commands,who tend to be much younger and informed about reality than the geezers that back Putin.

If the neo-Soviet leaders start talking this up,I THINK there is a genuine chance we will see a "Second Russian Revolution" as rioting breaks out in Moscow.

Also,consider this. When and IF this happens,it will be riots by some of the most trusted Russian citizens because ONLY citizens that the leadership considers to be "politically trustworthy" are even allowed to live in Moscow.

Don't forget,the Russian government owns EVERY building in Russia,and they get to say who gets to live inside and who has to sleep in the park

If they start rioting in Moscow,what will they be doing in other Russian cities that are populated by people not considered to be politically trustworthy enough to live in Moscow" 

Of course,I may be wrong. I haven't spent any time in Russia talking with actual Russian citizens since Yeltsin was in office,and it is remotely possible the Neo-Soviet leadership decided to allow the riff-raff to live in the same cities as their more junior officers and their families. I think the chances of that being true are pretty slim though,given that this program was started by Stalin at the end of WW-2,and dedicated Soviets are NOT noted for being open to new ideas.

I do not put Putin using nukes as being a long shot.

 

I do. I see it as a VERY long shot because the people directly under him live in Moscow with their families,and they KNOW the result would be a nuclear attack on Moscow.

I am NOT saying that lunatic Putin would not give the orders,but I am saying I strongly suspect he would be immediately arrested and locked away in the Lubyanka (spelling) prison in Mosow while awaiting trial and execution.

Having someone put your entire family put on the major impact zone of western nuclear missiles is not something that can be easily dismissed. They might not care about the familes of OTHER people glowing in the dark,but when it comes to their own families,they can be as human as anyone else.

 

His whole behavior with this Hitler style attack upon Ukraine has been irrational.

I think the only thing that has kept him from already being backed against a brick wall in Lubyanka basement is that nobody in the Politburo really thinks it will go that far. You can bet your bippy that if it begins to SERIOUSLY look like Putin is going to start a nuclear war that he will be removed from office by the Politburo.

I honestly think the only reason they haven't already attacked the US and other western nations is because they simply didn't/don't have enough missiles to guarantee a win,and they don't want to die anymore than anyone else does.

Anything can happen, and most likely will.

This is true initially,but when push comes to shove,seeing the POSSIBILITY of your whole family dying in a war YOU started can cause damn near anyone to take a pause.

Don't forget,if they were to make such an attack,they would not be JUST facing the nuclear might of the US,which would be no small thing,but also the nuclear might of every nation that is a part of Nato.

It would take a HELL of a lot of nuclear missiles to do that,and even then it would take operators at every one willing to fire them and "end the world as we know it".

That is no small thing,and only an absolute lunatic would even consider it. Or maybe someone as desperate as Putin,who really does qualify as an absolute lunatic.

IMNSHO,one of the most dangerous aspects of this is that even though Putin was a senior Red Army officer,he was never a Combat Command officer. He dealt with spying,not infantry attacks,so it is slightly POSSIBLE that he may not fully understand what the end consequences of launching a nuclear attack on Ukraine might be.

Once again,in MY NSHO,if things start to look THAT ugly,he will be removed from office by the Politburo before he ever has a chance to give the orders.

Or possibly "Murdered by a clerk that had clearly gone insane,and he will be greatly missed."

 Yeah,NO ONE with two IQ points to rub together is going to believe an armed clerk was allowed to get close enough to Putin to even identify him,never mind shoot him to death,but something like that will be the story handed out,and everybody all over the world in a position of political authority will pretend to believe it.

BTW,to put this into a clearer perspective for those of you who don't know,Russia is NOTHING like the US. It is a VERY big nation with a very small population,given the size. Thanks to the Soviets, who limited the number of children Soviet subjects were ALLOWED to have,this is still virtually as true today as it was in 1930. They kept everybody but essential rural workers confined to cities,so most of the nation is unpopulated.

Vacant rural land and cities filled to the top with tall apartment blocks to house the populations make for a VERY easy targetting plan. This is especially true for a nation that tended to put all "like industry" in the same cities in order to save time and money.

In other words,the targets of any likely western nuclear counter-attack will gathered together in just a few cities,while the cities that focused on producing products like dump trucks and refrigerators won't need to be attacked.

Not that this will save a large part of the population because it won't. The huge wind storms will spread the radiation,and a lot of people will die "down the road"after a lot of terrible suffering,while the people in Moscow that survived the first wave of attacks will just glow in the dark for short while before dying.

Once again,the Soviet political leadership is NOT composed of idiots. They might be selfish and self-centered like any political creature,but they are not going to be willing to die and see their families die to soothe Putin's ego.