$29,000 to replace batteries in Chevy Volt…

[Elderberry]

https://citizenfreepress.com/breaking/29000-to-replace-batteries-in-chevy-volt-thanks-obama/

[Kamaji]

Appears to be a 2012 Chevy Volt.  So, that would appear to give an effective lifespan to these things of 10 years, after which you're paying for a major overhaul.

[libertybele]

Ridiculous and unaffordable for the average Joe.

[Hoodat]

Appears to be a 2012 Chevy Volt.  So, that would appear to give an effective lifespan to these things of 10 years, after which you're paying for a major overhaul.

The list price of a 2012 Chevy Volt was $40K.  The current list price for a 2012 Chevy Volt is $12K.  Why would anyone invest $30K to keep a $12K car on the road?  If you had a car valued at $1,000 that needed $2,000 in transmission work, would you pay the $2,000?  Or would you simply buy another $1,000 car.

[roamer_1]

The list price of a 2012 Chevy Volt was $40K.  The current list price for a 2012 Chevy Volt is $12K.  Why would anyone invest $30K to keep a $12K car on the road?  If you had a car valued at $1,000 that needed $2,000 in transmission work, would you pay the $2,000?  Or would you simply buy another $1,000 car.

Almost perfectly, planned obsolescence.
Except in that the small batteries that make up the larger complete battery cost a fraction.
It's a thing... I have assisted twice in rebuilding electric car batteries... Which on average, cost about $1600 in parts to assemble, and a hard morning in real time labor (if the battery is considered to be removed from the vehicle and not re-installed). Which also the R&R would be incidental, I would suppose, though it may vary depending upon brand and model.

And yes, I am learning this skill precisely because I can predict a serious demand.

[Hoodat]

And yes, I am learning this skill precisely because I can predict a serious demand.

Don't lose your carburetor skills.

[roamer_1]

Don't lose your carburetor skills.

Couldn't if I tried. I love carburetors, and have a particular knack for linkage. 
None of which will help you rebuild an electric car battery.

[sneakypete]

Appears to be a 2012 Chevy Volt.  So, that would appear to give an effective lifespan to these things of 10 years, after which you're paying for a major overhaul.

@Kamaji

AND......,you LITERALLY can't GIVE the damn thing away because it costs so much to dispose of the batteries.

Which means you have to PAY someone to come get it and haul it away.

[Wingnut]

I wonder if you could do a conversion to drop a gas engine in a volt.  Not that it would be worth it but ...

[sneakypete]

I wonder if you could do a conversion to drop a gas engine in a volt.  Not that it would be worth it but ...

@Wingnut

I am sure you  can.

I am also sure it would be illegal in most states.

[catfish1957]

Don't say these idiots weren't warned.

Interwebs has been awash of these horror stories as behest of the envirwhacko Climate change scam

As far as I am concerned, what happened here is 10X more heinous than the Indian Windows Phone Scams.....

Those scammers typically don't make off with $30K.

[Kamaji]

I wonder if you could do a conversion to drop a gas engine in a volt.  Not that it would be worth it but ...

You’d most likely have to build an entirely new subframe - front or back - to hold the engine as well as strong points to hold the axle if you went rear-wheel drive.  If one were going to do that, it would probably make more sense to go front wheel drive, so you just build one new front subframe that carries the engine, transmission, axles and drive wheels.  Then you’d have to find some way of attaching the new subframe to the rest of the unibody. 

All in all, it might make for an interesting experiment, but almost certainly not cost-effective. 

[GtHawk]

C'mon man! You know your gonna get screwed by the dealer, hell the local dodge dealer wanted to charge my SIL 2K for a starter for his Dodge Ram diesel. There are plenty of options for after market EV batteries and installs like this one that lists a 2012 Volt at $5489 before installation and tax.
https://www.besthybridbatteries.com/categories/hybrid-batteries-by-make/chevrolet/chevy-volt

[GtHawk]

The list price of a 2012 Chevy Volt was $40K.  The current list price for a 2012 Chevy Volt is $12K.  Why would anyone invest $30K to keep a $12K car on the road?  If you had a car valued at $1,000 that needed $2,000 in transmission work, would you pay the $2,000?  Or would you simply buy another $1,000 car.

That depends, if the car was in really good condition and a 2k transmission kept it on the road for say another 3-5 years or more, yeah instead of picking up a big car payment I probably would just pay the 2K.

[GtHawk]

@Kamaji

AND......,you LITERALLY can't GIVE the damn thing away because it costs so much to dispose of the batteries.

Which means you have to PAY someone to come get it and haul it away.

Ah heck, haul it to the boonies and with luck a few good shots will ignite it and it will dispose of itself

[Kamaji]

That depends, if the car was in really good condition and a 2k transmission kept it on the road for say another 3-5 years or more, yeah instead of picking up a big car payment I probably would just pay the 2K.

[roamer_1]

You’d most likely have to build an entirely new subframe - front or back - to hold the engine as well as strong points to hold the axle if you went rear-wheel drive.  If one were going to do that, it would probably make more sense to go front wheel drive, so you just build one new front subframe that carries the engine, transmission, axles and drive wheels.  Then you’d have to find some way of attaching the new subframe to the rest of the unibody. 

All in all, it might make for an interesting experiment, but almost certainly not cost-effective.

Yeah... easier to float the body onto a frame that is close enough to use that is already designed around an engine.

[Kamaji]

Yeah... easier to float the body onto a frame that is close enough to use that is already designed around an engine.

All in all, it might make for an interesting experiment, but almost certainly not cost-effective.

Good point.  I wasn’t thinking in that direction.  But yeah, it’d be much better to just mount the body onto a pre-existing chassis/frame.   

[roamer_1]

Good point.  I wasn’t thinking in that direction.  But yeah, it’d be much better to just mount the body onto a pre-existing chassis/frame.

Might I suggest cutting down a square body chevy 4x4 pickup frame to fit... Then jack it up with an eight inch kit and 37s or better... and cut the back end out of the body to shove in an 80's el camino bed... A big ground-pounder tree-fitty....

Alright, alright... I know... too redneck for all y'all. 

Just slide a jeep under it and keep it in the suburbs... it'll be fine.

[rustynail]

Good thing they had Car Shield?

[Cyber Liberty]

The price has gone up considerably in the last year and a half.  The HV Battery for my Ford Escape cost about $13K installed at a dealer. 

My consideration that encouraged the investment was replacement cost.  The car was $35K in 2009, and to replace it with a new car would have been easily $50K, and the rest of the car was fine, so I dropped the $13K.  Probably would have been cheaper in Vegas, but that's an hour or so of towing.  There were no mechanics I trusted in Bullhead.

The car runs great now, until next time when the battery will be made of "Unobtainium."

[GtHawk]

The price has gone up considerably in the last year and a half.  The HV Battery for my Ford Escape cost about $13K installed at a dealer. 

My consideration that encouraged the investment was replacement cost.  The car was $35K in 2009, and to replace it with a new car would have been easily $50K, and the rest of the car was fine, so I dropped the $13K.  Probably would have been cheaper in Vegas, but that's an hour or so of towing.  There were no mechanics I trusted in Bullhead.

The car runs great now, until next time when the battery will be made of "Unobtainium."

Don't worry, Mr. Fusion is just over the horizon.

[mountaineer]

Gary Howell, a legislator in my state (a business owner in a small town) posted this to Fakebook:

I want to start by saying that I am not opposed to the use of electric vehicles.  In some areas, they make sense, short trips, city driving, known routes likes buses or deliveries. 

They simply don’t have the range for rural America without fast charging,  zero to 100% in 5 minutes.  My diesel Ram can go 700 miles on a tank, I refill an empty tank in less than 5 minutes.  Also, if I forget to fill up my truck, then in the morning I can go to the local Sheetz. I can’t do that if I forget to plug in my electric car.
 
Another problem is the grid is not ready.  Consider that “Counting the overall energy demand for use in homes, versus cars in 2008, the EIA estimates U.S. consumers use 21,637 trillion BTUs of energy in their homes, versus 16,765 BTUs in their cars.” (1)

Here is the information on the US electric grid.   “U.S. retail electricity sales to end-use customers totaled about 3,795 billion kWh—or about 3.8 trillion kWh—in 2021,” (2) Of that 39% or 1,477 billion kWh was used for residential, while on 0.2% or 6 billion kWh used for transportation. (2)  In order to go totally electric on vehicles, you would need to increase power into the grid by 1,144 billion kWh.  That is a 30% increase in power needed from the gride or a total new usage of 4,939 billion kWh.  Total US electric generation capacity is about 4,000 billion kWh(3)

We are about 1000 billion KWh short of going total electric on transportation and demand for electric is increasing while capacity has dropped off.  The power is not uniformly distributed across the nation’s 3 power grides, some have more excess capacity than others.  The current average annual growth rate for electric consumption is around 1%
(4). 

 California is in the western grid and the entire grid couldn’t handle what they are trying to do by themselves without massive new generating capacity.

The grid is not ready for then end of gasoline and diesel-powered vehicles and will not be ready for decades to come.
Middle class and low-income families will have a tough time.  They are ones the buy their transportation on the secondary market, aka used cars.  The average price of used vehicle in the US stands at $34,291 and in West Virginia slightly below the national average at $34,125. (5)

 The Average Age of a Used Car at Purchase Is 6.47 years old, and in West Virginia 6.91 years old.  The average price of a 7 year old Chevy Volt is $16,658. (7)  The replacement battery pack for that same car, GM part number 24043694 cost $15,908.40 (😎 if you can find one. Most places do not stock them, and some sites say discontinued.  If the cost to repair a car exceeds half it’s value, then the car is typically considered a right off.  This will effectively eliminate most late model used cars from the market.  Older cars will be kept in service long beyond the norm, because you will be able to get spare parts for those.  You will effectively be widening the gap between the halves and have nots.

The shift to electric vehicles must come naturally through market forces.  Government trying to force the issue will only lead to hardship of the America people.  Again, buses on planed routes make sense.  Even for the city dwellers that do not have to travel far they can make sense, but the rural areas of the nation, for middle class and low-income people they don’t currently make sense.  Government will seek the best experts to predict the future of electric cars.  In 1974 Ken Olsen president of Digital Equipment Corporation (DEC) said that he couldn’t see any need or any use for a computer in someone’s home. (10)

 At the time DEC was one of the largest computer companies in the world and Olsen was they type of person the Government would hire to tell them what direction to take.  Just 3 years later, Byte magazine referred to the Apple II, Commodore PET 2001, and TRS-80 as the "1977 Trinity" of Home Computers. (9) Government is bad about predicting the future, let the free market figure it out like it has everything else.

(1) Consumer Reports News: August 27, 2009
(2) US Energy Information Administration, July 15, 2022
(3) US EPA, February 2021
(4) US Energy Information Administration, March 3, 2022
(5) iSeeCars August 6, 2022
(6) Value Penguin August 22, 2022
(7) Kelley Blue Book August 31, 2022
(😎 US Spares.com August 31, 2022
(9) Byte Magazine March 1977
(10) Cnet Feb. 7, 2011

[sneakypete]

What Congresscritter Howell doesn't seem to understand is that the gooberment KNOWS this,and this is WHY they are pushing electric cars and trucks.

Their GOAL is to have the vast majority of the "huddled masses" huddling in cement apartment blocks similar to the Khrushchev Apartment blocks of old Moscow. What better way to control what they are saying to one another,doing,and even thinking,than to have them all living in the same buildings as people who don't like them and are happy to report any subversive thoughts or activity to the  local police?

Especially when doing so guarantees they get a raise at their jobs,and maybe even a better place to stay.

The only people who will be allowed to NOT live in city apartment blocks will be the necessary rural workers to feed the animals that provide the milk and the food that the cities will need to keep going.

Think "USSR,Part 2",and you have it nailed.

But THIS time they are going to do it RIGHT,Comrades!

Meanwhile,this leaves most of the nation open to the enjoyment of the elites because the city dwellers who work in the factories will not be able to get permits to leave the city and go visit a rural area.

[EdinVA]

I wonder how much of that battery cost was a disposal fee for the old batteries?