Author Topic: Ousted Republican reflects on Trump, democracy and America: ‘The place has lost its mind’  (Read 1948 times)

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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Ousted Republican reflects on Trump, democracy and America: ‘The place has lost its mind’
The Guardian, Aug 21, 2022

Rusty Bowers is headed for the exit. After 18 years as an Arizona lawmaker, the past four as speaker of the state’s house of representatives, he has been unceremoniously shown the door by his own Republican party.  Last month he lost his bid to stay in the Arizona legislature in a primary contest in which his opponent was endorsed by Donald Trump.

[...]

In Bowers’s case, his assailants in the Arizona Republican party wanted to punish him because he had steadfastly refused to do their, and Trump’s, bidding. He had declined to use his power as leader of the house to invoke an “arcane Arizonan law” – whose text has never been found – that would allow the legislature to cast out the will of 3.4 million voters who had handed victory to Joe Biden and switch the outcome unilaterally to Trump.

Bowers has a word for that kind of thinking. “The thought that if you don’t do what we like, then we will just get rid of you and march on and do it ourselves – that to me is fascism.”


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/aug/20/rusty-bowers-interview-trump-arizona-republicans?amp;amp

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Bowers has a word for that kind of thinking. “The thought that if you don’t do what we like, then we will just get rid of you and march on and do it ourselves – that to me is fascism.”

Unfu*kingbelievable.




« Last Edit: August 21, 2022, 05:24:36 pm by Right_in_Virginia »

Offline Kamaji

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:facepalm2:

Dear Mr. Bowers, you were defenestrated in an election primary where you have not alleged any sort of vote or election manipulation or fraud.  That is not fascism, that is good-old-fashioned American politics.  In other words, the voters didn't like what you did, and they got rid of you, as is their right.

If you want to see fascism at work, look across the aisle at your DNC fellow travelers.

Online massadvj

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I am and was a reluctant Trump supporter. But I have very little sympathy for these "Never Trumpers" who think they are standing up for something when in fact they have become little more than useful idiots for the advancement of global communism. And I am not being hyperbolic when I say that.

How many of us held our noses and voted for George W. Bush and George Romney when the party decided they were the best candidates to carry our banner?  In those days it was all about "party unity."  Now suddenly, they are singing a different tune.  Well, if you don't like Donald Trump, then you have to beat him in a primary.  That is basically how our system works.

The crybaby who takes his ball and goes home sniveling to his mommy is rarely welcomed back into the game.  That is what you told me when I hesitated to vote for Mitt Romney.  Now Mitt Romney suddenly has a conscience when the shoe is on the other foot.  I have no sympathy.  None.

These people seem to think the party is going to come to its senses and return to its open border, globalist, pro-war agenda.  Not gonna happen.  The GOP has become the "America First" party and there is no going back.
   

Online massadvj

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:facepalm2:

Dear Mr. Bowers, you were defenestrated in an election primary where you have not alleged any sort of vote or election manipulation or fraud.  That is not fascism, that is good-old-fashioned American politics.  In other words, the voters didn't like what you did, and they got rid of you, as is their right.

If you want to see fascism at work, look across the aisle at your DNC fellow travelers.

It is ironic how these people out to "save democracy" are done it by it.

Offline Kamaji

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I am and was a reluctant Trump supporter. But I have very little sympathy for these "Never Trumpers" who think they are standing up for something when in fact they have become little more than useful idiots for the advancement of global communism. And I am not being hyperbolic when I say that.

How many of us held our noses and voted for George W. Bush and George Romney when the party decided they were the best candidates to carry our banner?  In those days it was all about "party unity."  Now suddenly, they are singing a different tune.  Well, if you don't like Donald Trump, then you have to beat him in a primary.  That is basically how our system works.

The crybaby who takes his ball and goes home sniveling to his mommy is rarely welcomed back into the game.  That is what you told me when I hesitated to vote for Mitt Romney.  Now Mitt Romney suddenly has a conscience when the shoe is on the other foot.  I have no sympathy.  None.

These people seem to think the party is going to come to its senses and return to its open border, globalist, pro-war agenda.  Not gonna happen.  The GOP has become the "America First" party and there is no going back.
   


:thumbsup:

Offline Kamaji

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It is ironic how these people out to "save democracy" are done it by it.

Yes, it is, isn't it.

Offline goatprairie

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Bowers was a loyal Republican who supported Trump's policies 100%. He appeared on a platform with Trump when he campaigned in AZ.
What he didn't do was support Trump's lie about a stolen election. He did due diligence when requested and checked the AZ election. Nothing untoward was found. The Ninja Warriors checked. They didn't find anything either.
For that Bowers got threatening calls from Giuliani and Trump. His family was harassed and threatened by Trump thugs. In spite, as is his wont, Trump endorsed Bowers's rival.
Doesn't that bother you people in the slightest?

Offline Kamaji

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Bowers was a loyal Republican who supported Trump's policies 100%. He appeared on a platform with Trump when he campaigned in AZ.
What he didn't do was support Trump's lie about a stolen election. He did due diligence when requested and checked the AZ election. Nothing untoward was found. The Ninja Warriors checked. They didn't find anything either.
For that Bowers got threatening calls from Giuliani and Trump. His family was harassed and threatened by Trump thugs. In spite, as is his wont, Trump endorsed Bowers's rival.
Doesn't that bother you people in the slightest?

Why should it?  He wasn't raided, he wasn't arrested, he wasn't impeached, he wasn't forced to resign, he lost a primary election for which he has not alleged the slightest irregularity.

That's the way the political cookie crumbles.  That's the way democratic republics work.  If the voters don't like you, out you go.

Online massadvj

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Doesn't that bother you people in the slightest?

It bothers me that now he allows himself to be a useful idiot for the Guardian to promote its communist, globalist agenda.  He says he believes in the constitution.  Well the constitution beat him. Period. Whatever the reason was that he lost, he lost.  His opponents had the right to organize and campaign against him.  Instead of self-reflection, he allows the Guardian to use him for its purposes.

Offline Kamaji

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It bothers me that now he allows himself to be a useful idiot for the Guardian to promote its communist, globalist agenda.  He says he believes in the constitution.  Well the constitution beat him. Period. Whatever the reason was that he lost, he lost.  His opponents had the right to organize and campaign against him.  Instead of self-reflection, he allows the Guardian to use him for its purposes.


:thumbsup:

Offline christian

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Quote:
Bowers has a word for that kind of thinking. “The thought that if you don’t do what we like, then we will just get rid of you and march on and do it ourselves – that to me is fascism.”

restated:
Who do these people think they are and how dare they can presume we have to represent them at any time for any reason?  Once they are disarmed we'll show them whose boss!  The globalist in-the-beltway meetings are gonna show you who rules, and peasants just do as they are told!  Or else, now give up your guns or else!

Bidens rule by utopian fool manipulations are here, and more to come!  The last utopian Pres election was proof thereof.
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Offline mountaineer

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Why didn't he bother to track down that "arcane" law? Did he just not care?
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Offline sneakypete

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"Bowers has a word for that kind of thinking. “The thought that if you don’t do what we like, then we will just get rid of you and march on and do it ourselves – that to me is fascism.”

Unbelievable!

If he wants to see the face of Fascism,he needs to look in a mirror.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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"Bowers has a word for that kind of thinking. “The thought that if you don’t do what we like, then we will just get rid of you and march on and do it ourselves – that to me is fascism.”

Unbelievable!

If he wants to see the face of Fascism,he needs to look in a mirror.

 :thumbsup: @sneakypete

Offline LMAO

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Bowers was a loyal Republican who supported Trump's policies 100%. He appeared on a platform with Trump when he campaigned in AZ.
What he didn't do was support Trump's lie about a stolen election. He did due diligence when requested and checked the AZ election. Nothing untoward was found. The Ninja Warriors checked. They didn't find anything either.
For that Bowers got threatening calls from Giuliani and Trump. His family was harassed and threatened by Trump thugs. In spite, as is his wont, Trump endorsed Bowers's rival.
Doesn't that bother you people in the slightest?

True

But whatever the reasons are for losing to a challenger, using the term fascism to describe his loss was a little over the top




« Last Edit: August 22, 2022, 12:11:19 am by LMAO »
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Offline LMAO

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Why should it?  He wasn't raided, he wasn't arrested, he wasn't impeached, he wasn't forced to resign, he lost a primary election for which he has not alleged the slightest irregularity.

That's the way the political cookie crumbles.  That's the way democratic republics work.  If the voters don't like you, out you go.

Yup.
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

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Offline Kamaji

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True

But whatever the reasons are for losing to a challenger, using the term fascism to describe his loss was a little over the top






:thumbsup:

Online Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Bowers was a loyal Republican who supported Trump's policies 100%. He appeared on a platform with Trump when he campaigned in AZ.
What he didn't do was support Trump's lie about a stolen election. He did due diligence when requested and checked the AZ election. Nothing untoward was found. The Ninja Warriors checked. They didn't find anything either.
For that Bowers got threatening calls from Giuliani and Trump. His family was harassed and threatened by Trump thugs. In spite, as is his wont, Trump endorsed Bowers's rival.
Doesn't that bother you people in the slightest?

Yeah it bothers me. Trump (and others) behavior from November 2020 to January 2021 bothered me frankly. But the Democrats bothered me more. And still do. Remember them burning down the country? Making white people kneel? Etc. etc.? So I know about the "lesser of two evil is still evil arguments". And I'm kinda exasperated at this point.

Maybe the two party system has truly run it's course at this point?

Online DCPatriot

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Yeah it bothers me. Trump (and others) behavior from November 2020 to January 2021 bothered me frankly. But the Democrats bothered me more. And still do. Remember them burning down the country? Making white people kneel? Etc. etc.? So I know about the "lesser of two evil is still evil arguments". And I'm kinda exasperated at this point.

Maybe the two party system has truly run it's course at this point?

@Weird Tolkienish Figure

You've hit on a path Donald Trump should take.  It's a GUTSY move, however.

Pres. Trump has to speak to the American People...including the non-MAGAs out here.

Declare THIRD PARTY!

He must point out with examples/video productions of the clear choices for America.  THE LEFT! or FREEDOM!

I'm betting he can break off tens of millions of Democrat voters...either by them sitting on the asses at home, or actually voting for Pres. Trump.
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Online massadvj

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@Weird Tolkienish Figure

You've hit on a path Donald Trump should take.  It's a GUTSY move, however.

Pres. Trump has to speak to the American People...including the non-MAGAs out here.

Declare THIRD PARTY!

He must point out with examples/video productions of the clear choices for America.  THE LEFT! or FREEDOM!

I'm betting he can break off tens of millions of Democrat voters...either by them sitting on the asses at home, or actually voting for Pres. Trump.

Trump does not need a third party. He already has control of the GOP.  If some in the GOP don't like it, then it is up to them to beat him, or to start a third party.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2022, 09:48:04 pm by massadvj »

Offline DefiantMassRINO

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The place hasn't lost its mind.

The paradigms are shifting from Globalists First to America First.  Trump was the first, of hopefully many, that will put American Government back to work for American citizens and American interests.

Democracy is a messy, free-form process which is why the impatient, the intolerant, and those ignorant of history gravitate towards authoritarianism and revolutionary doctrines.

It was a mistake of the Congress to abuse the Reconciliation Process to foist Obamacare unto Americans without debate and amendment for the sake of expediency.

It is a mistake of the Senate to require 60 vote supermajority for anything the does not Constitutionally require a supermajority.

It was a mistake of the US Senate to abandon the talking filibuster.  For all its controversial history and its imperfection, it did force debate, compromise, and amendment to legislation, which is sorely lacking now.

American Constitututional Federal Republicanism is imperfect.  It is an experiment of distributed powers to prevent absolute monarchism, or its 21st Century equivalents.

It is not democracy that is failing.  It is the over-concetration of power in Washington, DC, among Speakers of the House, Majority Leaders of the Senate, the US Supreme Court Justices, Presidents, and party National Committees that is failing the American people.

Chuck Schumer, Mitch McConnell, Nancy Pelosi, and Kevin McCarthy are preventing the Congress from fulfilling the Founders' purpose of authoring publicly deliberated legislation.  Both sides craft "frameworks" behind closed doors and ask our Representatives and Senators to vote upon legislation that hasn't even been written.  Presidential Executive Orders and Supreme Court Rulings fill the legislative voids created by our broken Congress.

Much as God used the Great Flood to wash evil from this World to start anew, American voters need to call upon an Electoral Flood to wash our failing representatives from power.  It's also imperative that grass-roots, rank-and-file party members take back their parties from failing National Committees.
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Offline goatprairie

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Why should it?  He wasn't raided, he wasn't arrested, he wasn't impeached, he wasn't forced to resign, he lost a primary election for which he has not alleged the slightest irregularity.

That's the way the political cookie crumbles.  That's the way democratic republics work.  If the voters don't like you, out you go.
That's not the point. He wouldn't do an extralegal thing because Trump demanded it, and was punished for not trying to break to law to satisfy Trump's whims.
Trump is never wrong, right?

Offline goatprairie

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It bothers me that now he allows himself to be a useful idiot for the Guardian to promote its communist, globalist agenda.  He says he believes in the constitution.  Well the constitution beat him. Period. Whatever the reason was that he lost, he lost.  His opponents had the right to organize and campaign against him.  Instead of self-reflection, he allows the Guardian to use him for its purposes.
Trump is never wrong, right?

Offline goatprairie

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True

But whatever the reasons are for losing to a challenger, using the term fascism to describe his loss was a little over the top
You're right, it wasn't fascism. However, this is another case of a previously loyal Trump backer who was punished by Trump for not doing his bidding. In this case trying to enact some arcane law that had no chance of succeeding anyway.
Another example of petty Trump.