Author Topic: Ukraine 3  (Read 163779 times)

0 Members and 7 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 52,963
  • Twitter is for Twits
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1875 on: February 13, 2023, 01:08:50 am »
I agree, but weapons that could reach the Kerch bridge could also reach deep into Russia.

@Maj. Bill Martin

"Could" is NOT the same as "WILL".

This is one of the reasons we have American observers on the ground monitoring what is going on.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Online Bigun

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 54,289
  • Gender: Male
  • Resistance to Tyrants is Obedience to God
    • The FairTax Plan
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1876 on: February 13, 2023, 02:10:33 am »
@Smokin Joe

I know that has been sold as the popular conception,but it just isn't true.

Look up MACV-SOG and you will gain a new understanding. Basically,while the Communists were claiming they had no troops or supply lines in Cambodia or Laos,MACV-SOG Recon Teams and "Hatchet Force Platoons" were raiding NVA supply depots in Laos and Cambodia to plant booby traps to explode and kill any NVA that went into them to draw supplies,thus killing the NVA troops AND exploding all the ordinance in that depot.

We were also doing other little tricks I will NOT speak about to cause injury,death,and loss of morale to the NVA troops moving south to join the fight in VN.

You would be surprised how much chaos a 6 man Recon Team can inflict on a company of NVA in a well-planned and executed ambush.

This was all top secret until a few years ago,but now it is public information,so I am free to expose a little of what we were doing,which included doing things like going in on a mission wearing NVA uniforms and carrying AK's and RPD's to make the rookie soldiers entering the battle in SVN wonder if their own people were trying to kill them.

Even when we wore US uniforms,there was no insignia on them,and we didn't carry dog tags or US ID of any type. If captured,we could legally be shot as criminals.

This is all I ever intend to say about any of this. If you want more information,now that it is no longer classifed as Top Secret,there are plenty of books for sale at places like Amazon selling books written by SOG vets.

One that I can recommend is titled "Reflections of a Warrior" by a good friend of mine named Franklin D..Miller. He spent around 6 years running recon missions in VN,Cambodia,and Laos,and was awarded a Medal of Honor. He is dead now. Finally killed by a blood infection received on his last combat mission when he was shot all to hell.

His children will receive any royalties from the book sales, though.

I worked in another department in SOG known as PRU (Provencial Reconnaissance Unit) I'm sure you've heard of that @sneakypete
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 52,963
  • Twitter is for Twits
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1877 on: February 13, 2023, 03:31:16 am »
I worked in another department in SOG known as PRU (Provencial Reconnaissance Unit) I'm sure you've heard of that @sneakypete

@Bigun

You bet your bippy I have heard of PRU units. Were you in the 1st on Okie? Almost all the guys I knew in PRU units were TDY from Okie on 6 month tours. My knowledge of this is pretty vague,but it seems like that program was running from around 62 or so,right up to the end of the war.

Remember the "Batta Boots"?
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Online Bigun

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 54,289
  • Gender: Male
  • Resistance to Tyrants is Obedience to God
    • The FairTax Plan
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1878 on: February 13, 2023, 03:41:32 am »
@Bigun

You bet your bippy I have heard of PRU units. Were you in the 1st on Okie? Almost all the guys I knew in PRU units were TDY from Okie on 6 month tours. My knowledge of this is pretty vague,but it seems like that program was running from around 62 or so,right up to the end of the war.

Remember the "Batta Boots"?

I was not TDY @sneakypete My post to you earlier was the first time I ever mentioned PRU to anyone outside people who worked within who were primarily CIA or the SVN equivalent IIRC. The only reason I mentioned it in public was I recently saw it talked about in Mark Moyar's new book "Triumph Regained" which is a VERY good read.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2023, 03:47:33 am by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 52,963
  • Twitter is for Twits
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1879 on: February 13, 2023, 06:26:52 am »
I was not TDY @sneakypete My post to you earlier was the first time I ever mentioned PRU to anyone outbigside people who worked within who were primarily CIA or the SVN equivalent IIRC. The only reason I mentioned it in public was I recently saw it talked about in Mark Moyar's new book "Triumph Regained" which is a VERY good read.

@Bigun

LOL!

LOTS of people were running around with so many cover stories it was hard to keep up with them.

I first met Charlie Clark when he was medi-evaced from VN in 65. The story was he was a conventional soldier in a conventional unit who was wounded in combat,and sent to the 1st SFG on Okie because it  was the only airborne unit in Asia at the time, and he could keep drawing his jump pay. Hell of a nice guy. Quiet and friendly. Should have mistrusted him because he had blonde hair,bright blue eyes,and was "movie start handsome",but he was just such a friendly guy you had to like him.

Next time I saw him I was waiting to be treated at the Army field hospital in Nha Trang,and when I look up,here comes Charlie Clark walking my way,looking pale and limping a little. He was also wearing odd-looking cammie bush clothes, a black beret with a silver Trojan Horse on it,and Captain's bars. Last time I had seen him,maybe 18 months before,he was wearing E-6 stripes.

I was so happy to see him,I jumped up and screamed,"Charlie,you sweet mofo,come here and gimme a hug! "  Something most E-4's didn't say or do with Captains.

Charlie called out my name,and ran over to give me a hug. Which kinda freaked out pretty much everybody in hearing and vision range because E-4's and 0-3's generally don't call each other by first names and hug each other.

Anyhow,when I asked him where he had been and what he had been doing,he got kinda nervous and said something like "This,that,and the other thing",which caused me to immediately stop asking that kind of question,so I asked him about his family back on Okie. We talked for a while about people we both knew for a while,said our "farewells until next times",and went out about our business. It was the last time I ever saw or talked with him.

I have been told that Charlie got shot up once again a year or so later,and was assigned to a leg unit on Hawaii to heal,and I THINK it was a reserve unit. Anyhow,I was told they were at the rifle range qualifying,and a M-60 got hot,"ran away" and was jammed with a twisted ammo belt,so Charlie took that opportunity to go downrange and replace some shot-up targets.

While he was doing that,some idiot took the M-60 off the sandbag,took out the belt twist,and pointed it downrange for some damnfool reason,and another round cooked off and gut shot him as he was walking back to the firing range.

Yeah,he should have never gone down range with a hot M-60 left laying on sandbags,but then again,he had no reason to expect some idiot to pick it up and point it downrage while he was downrange.

You just get so used to handling these weapons and being around people who understand then and handle them properly, that you sometimes forget that not everybody is experienced enough and mature enough to be trusted to just leave them on the sandbags when anyone is downrange.

Really hurt to find out we had lost Charlie,though. He was one of the genuine nice guys. Always smiling,and always happy. Maybe one of the most upbeat guys I ever knew.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2023, 06:32:15 am by sneakypete »
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Maj. Bill Martin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11,496
  • Gender: Male
  • I'll make Mincemeat out of 'em"
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1880 on: February 13, 2023, 12:58:08 pm »
@Maj. Bill Martin

"Could" is NOT the same as "WILL".

This is one of the reasons we have American observers on the ground monitoring what is going on.

Right -- but their thinking is that you can't get toothpaste back in the tube.  If a Ukrainian attack ends up widening the war, then it is small consolation to say "well, we're not going to give you any more weapons", because it's already too late.  Again, I personally don't agree with that, but I can see the logic/fear.

Offline Smokin Joe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 60,555
  • I was a "conspiracy theorist". Now I'm just right.
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1881 on: February 13, 2023, 01:07:11 pm »
@Smokin Joe

I know that has been sold as the popular conception,but it just isn't true.

Look up MACV-SOG and you will gain a new understanding. Basically,while the Communists were claiming they had no troops or supply lines in Cambodia or Laos,MACV-SOG Recon Teams and "Hatchet Force Platoons" were raiding NVA supply depots in Laos and Cambodia to plant booby traps to explode and kill any NVA that went into them to draw supplies,thus killing the NVA troops AND exploding all the ordinance in that depot.

We were also doing other little tricks I will NOT speak about to cause injury,death,and loss of morale to the NVA troops moving south to join the fight in VN.

You would be surprised how much chaos a 6 man Recon Team can inflict on a company of NVA in a well-planned and executed ambush.

This was all top secret until a few years ago,but now it is public information,so I am free to expose a little of what we were doing,which included doing things like going in on a mission wearing NVA uniforms and carrying AK's and RPD's to make the rookie soldiers entering the battle in SVN wonder if their own people were trying to kill them.

Even when we wore US uniforms,there was no insignia on them,and we didn't carry dog tags or US ID of any type. If captured,we could legally be shot as criminals.

This is all I ever intend to say about any of this. If you want more information,now that it is no longer classifed as Top Secret,there are plenty of books for sale at places like Amazon selling books written by SOG vets.

One that I can recommend is titled "Reflections of a Warrior" by a good friend of mine named Franklin D..Miller. He spent around 6 years running recon missions in VN,Cambodia,and Laos,and was awarded a Medal of Honor. He is dead now. Finally killed by a blood infection received on his last combat mission when he was shot all to hell.

His children will receive any royalties from the book sales,though.
@sneakypete I have read a few of those accounts, including that one, but there were proscriptions which still got in the way, I am sure, unless you know of Arc-light missions flown over the Trail across those borders (maybe there were that have yet to be disclosed).

I have no doubt you guys gave them as much considerable Hell as you could dish out, including leaving them 'presents' along the way to get the next batch coming in, and though none of that was supposedly happening, there were still things that could not be done because it would be too obvious.

Official deniability was part and parcel of your operations, which limited what large scale overt action could be taken.  But for those who were not aware and for the folks back home listening to the likes of Walter Cronkite, even just the perception of "they won't let us fight to win" puts morale in the half-barrel to be burned with the rest.
And that erodes popular support among noncombatants and even patriotic folks on the home front as well.

Every armchair general was listening to the official version of the War at home, and getting discouraged because the official pronouncements sure made it sound like the politicians were not letting the troops get the job done. Sadly, while the hippies were protesting the war because they didn't want to go and they had been infiltrated by some serious communists, there were others who got the attitude that "If they won't let our guys fight to win, why are we there? Bring our boys home."

The other problem with a difference in announced vs actual ROE, is that if someone thinks what is being said is what is actually being done (and it is effective), you will see that set of rules again, even though it was the actions that went outside the ROE that made things work.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Online Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 59,063
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1882 on: February 13, 2023, 01:15:57 pm »
Russian tank is blown up by a landmine… before another suffers the exact same fate moments later while driving past in latest display of incompetence by Putin's military

By CHRIS JEWERS FOR MAILONLINE
13 February 2023

A Russian tank was blown up by a landmine on a battlefield in Ukraine, moments before another suffered the exact same fate, in the latest display of incompetence by Vladimir Putin's military captured on camera.

The clip emerged as Russian forces inched closer to Bakhmut over the weekend, with the Wagner private military company claiming to have captured a village on the outskirts of the Ukrainian city.

The PMC said its 'assault units' seized Krasna Gora on Sunday, posting footage of its soldiers at what appeared to be the entrance to the settlement found four miles to the north of the city which has been at the centre of a fierce months-long battle.

But Russia's slow progress has been made at a huge cost. Britain's Ministry of Defence said on Sunday the Russian Armed Forces have likely suffered their highest casualties in the last seven days since the first week of the invasion.

Ukrainian and Western officials have repeatedly warned that Russia could launch a new, broad offensive in the country's east to try to turn the tide of the conflict as the war approaches the one-year mark. Ukrainian officials say it has already begun, but that Moscow is having trouble mounting such an assault.

*  *  *

Source:  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11744255/Russian-tank-blown-landmine-suffers-exact-fate.html

Online Bigun

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 54,289
  • Gender: Male
  • Resistance to Tyrants is Obedience to God
    • The FairTax Plan
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1883 on: February 13, 2023, 02:39:24 pm »
@Bigun

LOL!

LOTS of people were running around with so many cover stories it was hard to keep up with them.

This is true. The few Americans I knew in PRU had names, but I have no idea if they were real or not. Most likely they were not.  Many of the SVN guys I saw only once or twice then never again.  I'm told that if they are buried at all, only God knows where.

Quote
I first met Charlie Clark when he was medi-evaced from VN in 65. The story was he was a conventional soldier in a conventional unit who was wounded in combat,and sent to the 1st SFG on Okie because it  was the only airborne unit in Asia at the time, and he could keep drawing his jump pay. Hell of a nice guy. Quiet and friendly. Should have mistrusted him because he had blonde hair,bright blue eyes,and was "movie start handsome",but he was just such a friendly guy you had to like him.

Next time I saw him I was waiting to be treated at the Army field hospital in Nha Trang,and when I look up,here comes Charlie Clark walking my way,looking pale and limping a little. He was also wearing odd-looking cammie bush clothes, a black beret with a silver Trojan Horse on it,and Captain's bars. Last time I had seen him,maybe 18 months before,he was wearing E-6 stripes.

I was so happy to see him,I jumped up and screamed,"Charlie,you sweet mofo,come here and gimme a hug! "  Something most E-4's didn't say or do with Captains.

Charlie called out my name,and ran over to give me a hug. Which kinda freaked out pretty much everybody in hearing and vision range because E-4's and 0-3's generally don't call each other by first names and hug each other.

Anyhow,when I asked him where he had been and what he had been doing,he got kinda nervous and said something like "This,that,and the other thing",which caused me to immediately stop asking that kind of question,so I asked him about his family back on Okie. We talked for a while about people we both knew for a while,said our "farewells until next times",and went out about our business. It was the last time I ever saw or talked with him.

I have been told that Charlie got shot up once again a year or so later,and was assigned to a leg unit on Hawaii to heal,and I THINK it was a reserve unit. Anyhow,I was told they were at the rifle range qualifying,and a M-60 got hot,"ran away" and was jammed with a twisted ammo belt,so Charlie took that opportunity to go downrange and replace some shot-up targets.

While he was doing that,some idiot took the M-60 off the sandbag,took out the belt twist,and pointed it downrange for some damnfool reason,and another round cooked off and gut shot him as he was walking back to the firing range.

Yeah,he should have never gone down range with a hot M-60 left laying on sandbags,but then again,he had no reason to expect some idiot to pick it up and point it downrage while he was downrange.

You just get so used to handling these weapons and being around people who understand then and handle them properly, that you sometimes forget that not everybody is experienced enough and mature enough to be trusted to just leave them on the sandbags when anyone is downrange.

Really hurt to find out we had lost Charlie,though. He was one of the genuine nice guys. Always smiling,and always happy. Maybe one of the most upbeat guys I ever knew.

Sorry to hear about Clark @sneakypete .  It sucks that he had to go out that way. Now I'm going to let this thread get back on its subject.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Online Timber Rattler

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3,537
  • Conservative Purist and Patriot
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1884 on: February 13, 2023, 03:19:33 pm »
Travel Advisory: Russia – Do Not Travel

https://ru.usembassy.gov/travel-advisory-russia-do-not-travel-february-12-2023/

Quote
Do not travel to Russia due to the unpredictable consequences of the unprovoked full-scale invasion of Ukraine by Russian military forces, the potential for harassment and the singling out of U.S. citizens for detention by Russian government security officials, the arbitrary enforcement of local law, limited flights into and out of Russia, the Embassy’s limited ability to assist U.S. citizens in Russia, and the possibility of terrorism. U.S. citizens residing or travelling in Russia should depart immediately. Exercise increased caution due to the risk of wrongful detentions.

The U.S. government’s ability to provide routine or emergency services to U.S. citizens in Russia is severely limited, particularly in areas far from the U.S. Embassy in Moscow, due to Russian government limitations on travel for embassy personnel and staffing, and the ongoing suspension of operations, including consular services, at U.S. consulates.

In September, the Russian government mobilized citizens to the armed forces in support of its invasion of Ukraine.   Russia may refuse to acknowledge dual nationals’ U.S. citizenship, deny their access to U.S. consular assistance, subject them to mobilization, prevent their departure from Russia, and/or conscript them.

U.S. citizens should note that U.S. credit and debit cards no longer work in Russia, and options to electronically transfer funds from the United States are extremely limited due to sanctions imposed on Russian banks. There are reports of cash shortages within Russia.

Commercial flight options are extremely limited and are often unavailable on short notice. If you wish to depart Russia, you should make independent arrangements as soon as possible. The U.S. Embassy has severe limitations on its ability to assist U.S. citizens to depart the country and transportation options may suddenly become even more limited. Click here for Information for U.S. Citizens Seeking to Depart Russia.

U.S. Embassy personnel are generally not permitted to travel on Russian air carriers due to safety concerns.  The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) downgraded the air safety rating for Russia from Category 1 to Category 2 on April 21, 2022, due to Russia’s Federal Agency for Air Transport noncompliance with International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) safety standards.  The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) has issued a Notice to Air Missions (NOTAM) prohibiting U.S. aviation operations into, out of, within, or over those areas of the Moscow Flight Information Region (FIR), the Samara FIR (UWWW) and the Rostov-na-Donu (URRV) FIR within 160NM of the boundaries of the Dnipro (UKDV) Flight Information Regions. For more information, U.S. citizens should consult the Federal Aviation Administration’s Prohibitions, Restrictions, and Notices.

The right of peaceful assembly and freedom of expression are not consistently protected in Russia.  U.S. citizens should avoid all political or social protests and not photograph security personnel at these events.  Russian authorities have arrested U.S. citizens who have participated in demonstrations.

Country Summary:

U.S. citizens, including former and current U.S. government and military personnel and private citizens engaged in business who are visiting or residing in Russia, have been interrogated without cause and threatened by Russian officials, and may become victims of harassment, mistreatment, and extortion.

Russian security services may fail to notify the U.S. Embassy of the detention of a U.S. citizen and unreasonably delay U.S. consular assistance.  Russian security services are increasing the arbitrary enforcement of local laws to target foreign and international organizations they consider “undesirable.”

Russian security services have arrested U.S. citizens on spurious charges, singled out U.S. citizens in Russia for detention and harassment, denied them fair and transparent treatment, and convicted them in secret trials or without presenting credible evidence. Furthermore, Russian authorities arbitrarily enforce local laws against U.S. citizen religious workers and have opened questionable criminal investigations against U.S. citizens engaged in religious activity.  U.S. citizens should avoid travel to Russia to perform work for or volunteer with non-governmental organizations or religious organizations.

There have been multiple security incidents in southwestern Russia related to Russia’s unprovoked and unjustified invasion of Ukraine.  The Russian government declared martial law in Russia’s regions bordering Ukraine (Bryansk, Kursk, Belgorod, Voronezh, Rostov, Krasnodar) on October 20, 2022.  The martial law regime allows the rapid introduction of restrictive measures such as curfew, seizure of private property, restriction of entry/exit and freedom of movement, internment of foreigners, forced relocation of local residents, and restrictions on public gatherings.  U.S. citizens should avoid all travel to these areas.

Recent legislation has expanded the ability of Russian authorities to detain, question, and arrest individuals suspected of acting against Russia’s interests, including engaging with foreign and international entities, discrediting the Russian state or military, as well as advocating for the rights of LGBTQI+ persons.

Terrorist groups, both transnational and local terrorist organizations, and individuals inspired by extremist ideology continue plotting possible attacks in Russia. Terrorists may attack with little or no warning, targeting tourist locations, transportation hubs and systems, markets/shopping malls, local government facilities, hotels, clubs, restaurants, places of worship, parks, major sporting and cultural events, educational institutions, airports, and other public areas.  Travel to the North Caucasus (including Chechnya and Mt. Elbrus) is prohibited for U.S. government employees and strongly discouraged for U.S. citizens.

The international community, including the United States and Ukraine, does not recognize Russia’s purported annexation of Crimea as well as four other Ukrainian oblasts – Donetsk, Luhansk, Kherson, and Zaporizhzhya – that Russia has purported to annex more recently. There is extensive Russian Federation military presence in these areas. Russia staged its further invasion of Ukraine, in part, from occupied Crimea, and Russia is likely to take further military actions in Crimea, and the four other Ukrainian oblasts are the subject of intensive fighting. There are continuing abuses against foreigners and the local population by the occupation authorities in these regions, particularly against those who are seen as challenging Russia’s authority.

The U.S. Embassy in Kyiv continues to provide consular services to U.S. citizens in Crimea as well as four other Ukrainian oblasts partially occupied by Russia – Donetsk, Luhansk, Kherson, and Zaporizhzhya, although the ongoing conflict severely restricts the Embassy’s ability to provide services in these areas.

Read the country information page for additional information on travel to Russia.

If you decide to travel to Russia:

*  Read the Department of State’s COVID-19 page before planning any international travel, and read the Embassy COVID-19 page for country-specific COVID-19 information.
*  Familiarize yourself with the information on what the U.S. government can and cannot do to assist you in a crisis overseas.
*  Have a contingency plan in place that does not rely on U.S. government assistance. Review the Traveler’s Checklist.
*  Monitor local and international media for breaking events and adjust your contingency plans based on the new information.
*  Ensure travel documents are valid and easily accessible.
*  Visit our website for Travel to High-Risk Areas.
*  Enroll in the Smart Traveler Enrollment Program (STEP) to receive Alerts and make it easier to locate you in an emergency.
*  Follow the Department of State on Facebook and Twitter.
*  Review the Country Security Report for Russia.
*  Visit the CDC page for the latest Travel Health Information related to your travel.
*  Get a COVID vaccine to facilitate your travel.
*  Understand the COVID testing and vaccine requirements for all countries that you will transit through to your destination.

This was just issued...something's changed behind the scenes.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2023, 03:20:24 pm by Timber Rattler »
aka "nasty degenerate SOB," "worst of the worst at Free Republic," "Garbage Troll," "Neocon Warmonger," "Filthy Piece of Trash," "damn $#%$#@!," "Silly f'er," "POS," "war pig," "neocon scumbag," "insignificant little ankle nipper," "@ss-clown," "neocuck," "termite," "Uniparty Deep stater," "Never Trump sack of dog feces," "avid Bidenista," "filthy Ukrainian," "war whore," "fricking chump," "psychopathic POS," "depraved SOB," and "Never Trump Moron."

"In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act."  ---George Orwell

Online Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 59,063
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1885 on: February 13, 2023, 03:25:22 pm »
Travel Advisory: Russia – Do Not Travel

https://ru.usembassy.gov/travel-advisory-russia-do-not-travel-february-12-2023/

This was just issued...something's changed behind the scenes.

Probably a combination of an uptick in U.S. citizens/nationals complaining to the Embassy about abuse at the hands of the Russians, and the glacial bureaucratic pace of the State Department, particularly staff in the embassies and consulates (a phenomenon that is not just limited to Russia).

Offline Smokin Joe

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 60,555
  • I was a "conspiracy theorist". Now I'm just right.
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1886 on: February 13, 2023, 03:41:40 pm »
@Timber Rattler

Interesting choice of words by the Russians:

Quote
Russia staged its further invasion of Ukraine, in part, from occupied Crimea, and Russia is likely to take further military actions in Crimea, and the four other Ukrainian oblasts are the subject of intensive fighting.

Which negates all the BS about "Liberation".

The Nordstream Pipeline story breaking in the press and Biden supposedly saying 'we did it' just might have changed the climate in Moscow a bit.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Online DB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14,106
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1887 on: February 13, 2023, 05:06:42 pm »
@Timber Rattler

Interesting choice of words by the Russians:

Which negates all the BS about "Liberation".

The Nordstream Pipeline story breaking in the press and Biden supposedly saying 'we did it' just might have changed the climate in Moscow a bit.

Did Biden say "we did it" recently?

Online Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 59,063
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1888 on: February 13, 2023, 05:07:47 pm »
Did Biden say "we did it" recently?

Then there should be ample proof of that fact, just as there is ample proof of the fact that Russia invaded Ukraine.

Online Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 59,063
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1889 on: February 13, 2023, 06:22:43 pm »
Videos show Russians losing dozens of armored vehicles in Ukrainian ambush

By Snejana Farberov
February 13, 2023

Graphic drone footage appears to show dozens of Russian armored vehicles getting ambushed and destroyed during a single botched attack near the coal-mining town of Vuhledar in eastern Ukraine, which Moscow’s forces have been trying to capture for months.

Vuhledar, a Ukrainian stronghold at the strategic intersection between the eastern and southern front lines, has seen some of the bloodiest fighting of the war as the Kremlin is gearing up for a decisive offensive on the eastern front. 

Based on the newly released video evidence, a column of dozens of tanks and armored vehicles was lost or damaged last week, with a large number of troops apparently killed.

Russian soldiers are seen in aerial footage fleeing for their lives under sustained aerial bombardment by the Ukrainians.

In the chaos, Russian tanks are seen mowing down their own men.

*  *  *

Source:  https://nypost.com/2023/02/13/russian-lose-31-armored-vehicles-in-ukrainian-ambush/

Online Timber Rattler

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3,537
  • Conservative Purist and Patriot
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1890 on: February 13, 2023, 07:07:32 pm »
The videos and photos are brutal, with the groups of Russian soldiers, obviously poorly trained, huddling and trying to hide behind their tanks.  Putin's new offensive is not going to work out that well for him, if this is the quality of his troops and replacement armor.
aka "nasty degenerate SOB," "worst of the worst at Free Republic," "Garbage Troll," "Neocon Warmonger," "Filthy Piece of Trash," "damn $#%$#@!," "Silly f'er," "POS," "war pig," "neocon scumbag," "insignificant little ankle nipper," "@ss-clown," "neocuck," "termite," "Uniparty Deep stater," "Never Trump sack of dog feces," "avid Bidenista," "filthy Ukrainian," "war whore," "fricking chump," "psychopathic POS," "depraved SOB," and "Never Trump Moron."

"In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act."  ---George Orwell

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 40,802
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1891 on: February 13, 2023, 07:17:12 pm »
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 40,802
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1892 on: February 13, 2023, 07:21:27 pm »
The videos and photos are brutal, with the groups of Russian soldiers, obviously poorly trained, huddling and trying to hide behind their tanks.  Putin's new offensive is not going to work out that well for him, if this is the quality of his troops and replacement armor.

Did you see the clips of the two Russian tanks running over and dragging their own infantry soldiers?
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Online DB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14,106
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1893 on: February 13, 2023, 08:04:09 pm »

Online Kamaji

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 59,063
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1894 on: February 13, 2023, 08:04:28 pm »
I still don't see that as a direct admission that "we did it".

:thumbsup:

Online Timber Rattler

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3,537
  • Conservative Purist and Patriot
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1895 on: February 13, 2023, 10:11:25 pm »
Did you see the clips of the two Russian tanks running over and dragging their own infantry soldiers?

No, do you have the links?
aka "nasty degenerate SOB," "worst of the worst at Free Republic," "Garbage Troll," "Neocon Warmonger," "Filthy Piece of Trash," "damn $#%$#@!," "Silly f'er," "POS," "war pig," "neocon scumbag," "insignificant little ankle nipper," "@ss-clown," "neocuck," "termite," "Uniparty Deep stater," "Never Trump sack of dog feces," "avid Bidenista," "filthy Ukrainian," "war whore," "fricking chump," "psychopathic POS," "depraved SOB," and "Never Trump Moron."

"In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act."  ---George Orwell

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 40,802
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1896 on: February 14, 2023, 01:49:21 am »
I still don't see that as a direct admission that "we did it".

No, but that is where the claim originated from.  Not saying I agree.  But that's where it started.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 40,802
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1897 on: February 14, 2023, 02:08:26 am »
No, do you have the links?

Searching for it now.  Will ping you when I find it again.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 40,802
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.     -Dwight Eisenhower-

"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."     -Ayn Rand-

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 52,963
  • Twitter is for Twits
Re: Ukraine 3
« Reply #1899 on: February 14, 2023, 02:50:35 am »
This is true. The few Americans I knew in PRU had names, but I have no idea if they were real or not. Most likely they were not.  Many of the SVN guys I saw only once or twice then never again.  I'm told that if they are buried at all, only God knows where.

Sorry to hear about Clark @sneakypete .  It sucks that he had to go out that way. Now I'm going to let this thread get back on its subject.


@Bigun

They all had names. I am guessing 90+ percent of them were SF. Depending on the ops they were running,they were still on active duty with the US army,but "detached for special duty". Like Charlie,for instance. He was wearing the assimilated rank of Captain,but was actually a USASF SSG. The army pretty much had to do this so that if he was KIA or MIA,his dependents would receive the benefits they were due.

There was also the FACT that he was training and leading non-US troops into combat,so he needed the rank of Captain to get their respect so they would listen to him and learn as he tried to train them and lead them against the enemy.

Not that it mattered. If you were SF,you would know most of them if you bumped in to them somewhere,regardless of what ID they were carrying or what ops they were assigned to. If they pretended they didn't know you,you just apologized to them for your mistake,and moved on. No big deal.

The IMPORTANT thing to know about this is that NOBODY was in those units that didn't volunteer to serve in them when asked to volunteer. If,for whatever reason you said "No",it was "No harm-No foul." No "blackmarks went into your record,and you didn't have to make excuses to anyone.

Just like those of us running SOG recon and HF missions. All you had to say to get out was "I don't want to do this anymore". ZERO negative results. They would even ask you where you would like to serve and what you would like to be doing next in SF in VN. The only exception was once your team or platoon got a mission alert,you WERE going to go on THAT mission.

The mirror image of this is a lot of the guys that got wounded and were supposed to be medivaced back to Okie or the US would decide they weren't ready to give it up yet,and would call the FOB and say "come get me",so we would send a couple of guys in the cab and a medic or two under the canvas in the rear,and "steal" them from whatever army hospital they were in,and bring them back to the camp for our medics to treat them so they could become operational again. Frankly,I was surprised at how often that happened when I first got there,but it was just a routine thing. Guys didn't want to leave their teammates in danger by forcing them to go into the bush with someone they didn't know,or even worse,someone who had never ran a mission and was untested under fire.
.Some people discover they were born to do that type of thing,and others discovered they were not. If you weren't,you weren't. There was nothing to be ashamed of.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2023, 02:53:35 am by sneakypete »
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!