Ukraine 3

[Hoodat]

Anything taken from active inventory can be said to 'draw down' our reserves. Every bullet. Every shell. We were supposed to be set up for a two theater war, and there's a lot of aging materiel out there. That becomes a use or lose it proposition, and at least this way its disposal is serving a purpose besides training EOD personnel in vlosing things up. Replacement stocks of ammo and arms should be the latest and best, for out guys to use if the need arises.

And with the 'draw down' the Pentagon ends up with the money that Biden claims went to Ukraine.

[Smokin Joe]

And with the 'draw down' the Pentagon ends up with the money that Biden claims went to Ukraine.

Yep! and guaranteed the replacements will cost more than the original materiel, if for no other reason than being more advanced (not to mention Bidenflation)

[Hoodat]

Joe is an evil, corrupt politician that isn't all there (as we all know).  I see that the war in the Ukraine has greatly weakened our country

No.  Joe Biden has greatly weakened our country.  To the point that Russia thought they could take Ukraine and get away with it.  The Afghanistan debacle was their cue.

I'm not so sure that the escalation wasn't by design. Certainly Joe & Company have profited.

If you mean the escalation in spending, absolutely.  I don't think Biden directly encouraged Russia from invading Ukraine.  But I definitely believe his incompetence and the asinine statements he delivered were seen by Putin as a giant 'welcome' sign.

We both agree that the atrocities against Ukraine need to end. Also the Russian people aren't free from harm. From my viewpoint with Joe in office the conflict will continue. I don't see Russia retreating and to annihilate them would mean WWIII.  Just my opinion.

Of course the conflict will continue with Biden's current policy.  I keep saying that Biden wants to drag this out.

I see three courses of action here:

• Stab Zelenskiy in the back.  Cut off all aid and support and leave Ukraine to the mercy of those committing atrocities against their people.  Let Putin have the gas and oil fields of eastern Ukraine.  Allow Russia to park troops on the Polish and Romanian borders.  And live with Russia's energy extortion.
  
  
• Give Ukraine just enough equipment to continue the war indefinitely, tying down the Russian army, and making this a political albatross for Putin.  The misery and atrocities against the Ukrainian people will continue for months on end.  The US Treasury is further depleted with empty promises of helping Ukraine while money is syphoned off to our NATO allies.
  
  
• Give Ukraine everything they need now to destroy the Russian army, retake their country (all of it), and set Russia back for decades.  This will bring stability to the entire region.  Ukraine will then be free to join the EU and begin the road to economic prosperity while Russia's grip on European energy markets would be severed.  Everyone wins.

I choose Option 3.

[Hoodat]

Yep! and guaranteed the replacements will cost more than the original materiel, if for no other reason than being more advanced (not to mention Bidenflation)

Those M-113s had been sitting in a surplus lot somewhere collecting dust for the last decade or so.  But the Pentagon just found a buyer for all that old surplus equipment that went out of production in 2007.  Ukraine just purchased every bit of it at retail as if it just came of the assembly line.  It's not as if they are in a position to bargain.  Biden already set the cost.

Biden:  "Here's $1 billion in equipment that you didn't ask for, but we're going to give the Pentagon $5 billion to release it to you.  And then we're going to tell everyone else that we just gave Ukraine $5 billion in aid, even though all they got was $1 billion in used equipment."

That is how a draw down works.

[Hoodat]

Ukrainian fighters eliminated the deputy chief of staff of PMC “Wagner”

29 October, 2022

During a combat mission, soldiers of the Ukrainian special forces “Hort” liquidated the deputy chief of staff of the PMC “Wagner” mercenaries.

The Hort special unit reported this on Facebook.

“During the performance of a combat mission, the soldiers of our special forces in close combat encountered a group of militants of the infamous Prigozhin PMC Wagner. The combat contact sent the entire enemy group to hell. Among the two hundredth Wagnerites, the deputy chief of staff was identified,” the report says.

The servicemen also “captured” the weapon of the liquidated invader – AK-12. Hort noted that the enemy army adopted this assault rifle in 2018.


AK-12 assault rifle of the dead occupier captured by defenders of Ukraine / Photo credi: Khort special unit

https://odessa-journal.com/ukrainian-fighters-eliminated-the-deputy-chief-of-staff-of-pmc-wagner/

[christian]

How odd it is that Putin openly told the world his intentions to attack the Ukraine and not long after threatened the Ukraines neighbors.  Some might recall i then told people that Putin intended to be this centuries Hitler gobbling up neighbors with the excuse of people having loyalties to both Countries.
The democrats weakened America as much as they could, even going to ridiculous lengths, then after a great deal of empowering them, Communists or radical muslim nations, they are ready to provoke war with them.
The Afghanistan debacle should have warned even dullards something was and is drastically wrong, and war approaches, like democrats letting loose the co-vid virus.

[Kamaji]

Obviously you either have no rebuttal or you missed my point.

Guarantee their security?  Ok ... so, should we enter into war?  Keep giving them billions?  What exactly do you propose??

BTW bawk and laugh at yourself .... meanwhile there are those of us that do see the dangers of  WWIII and the severity of the hardship that this has created for our country.

I'll stick with making America First.  Without her, where is the rest of the world going to be?  Think about it instead of quickly using snide antics.

You see nothing, and are proud of it.  The country weeps for people like that.

[Kamaji]

Russia 'suffers deadliest day of invasion yet with nearly a THOUSAND troops killed' as video shows panic-stricken soldiers fleeing on armored vehicle which flips as it speeds away from Ukrainian attack

By MAILONLINE REPORTER
31 October 2022

Nearly 1,000 Russian soldiers have been killed in a single day in Ukraine, Kyiv has claimed, marking the deadliest day of Vladimir Putin's war since his troops invaded the country eight months ago. Ukrainian forces have been making gains across Russian-occupied areas, with fighting intensifying in the country's east and in the southern city of Kherson. In a blow to Putin's invasion, 950 Russian soldiers were killed on Sunday, pushing his force's death toll up to at least 71,200, Kyiv has claimed.

And in yet another example of the incompetence of his forces, video shows panic-stricken Russian soldiers fleeing a Ukrainian attack on an armored vehicle - only for it to flip over and fling the troops into the air. Footage, apparently from Kherson, shows Russian soldiers running towards an armored vehicle as Ukrainian missiles rain down on them. The soldiers scramble on top of the armored vehicle and are seen smiling as they speed off down a road away from the Ukrainian attack.

But the vehicle suddenly veers to the right and into a ditch, causing the Russian soldiers - no longer smiling - to scream in fear. The driver quickly steers to the left, but the speeding vehicle flips over - flinging the troops on to the road below them. The video then cuts out. It is the latest example of just how incompetent Putin's forces are as Russia tries to round up as many men as possible and push them to the front lines, regardless of skill, training and equipment. The UK's Ministry of Defence (MoD) said in its latest intelligence briefing that Russia has deployed several thousand newly mobilized reservists to the front line in Ukraine - but in many cases they are 'poorly equipped'. 'In September, Russian officers were concerned that some recently mobilized reservists were arriving in Ukraine without weapons,' the MoD said in its Monday morning briefing. For those Russian soldiers who are turning up with weapons, they are often being issued AKM rifles, which fires 7.62 mm ammunition. This is different to the ammunition required in the rifles issued to Russia's regular combat units.

*  *  *

Source:  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/galleries/article-11374173/Video-shows-panicked-Russians-speeding-away-Ukrainian-attack.html

[Hoodat]

That video shows that there is very little command structure in place.  The scene was chaos.  No one was issuing orders.  And no one was taking orders either.  Whoever wanted to jump on jumped on.

[Kamaji]

Russian lawmaker who called for end to Putin's war is comatose in hospital after claims 'he was attacked at parliament building' and suffered 'unfortunate fall'

By WILL STEWART FOR MAILONLINE
1 November 2022

A Russian lawmaker who called for an end to Putin's war in Ukraine is comatose in hospital after suffering serious head injuries.

Anatoly Karpov, 71, who was a chess grandmaster in the 1970s before turning to politics, is thought to have been injured in Moscow some time overnight on Saturday - amid claims he 'suffered a fall'.

He is now on a neurology ward at the renowned Sklifosovsky Institute and has been placed in a medically induced coma, with allies describing his condition as 'serious'.

*  *  *

Source:  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11376515/Russian-lawmaker-called-end-Ukraine-war-coma-falling.html

[240B]

Unlike Joe Biden/Austin/Milley and the idiot fool Blinken - at least the Russians had enough 'common sense' to remove all of their equipment before surrendering a working airfield to an active enemy. Leaving $85 Billion dollars in ammo and top shelf equipment to the Taliban, who are dedicated to destroying ALL Western nations, is the STUPIDEST military move in all of history.

[Kamaji]

Ukraine shoots down two Russian choppers in three minutes - weeks after blasting four helicopters in 18 minutes - as Putin's forces increase air attacks in bid to reverse defeats in Kherson

By JACK NEWMAN FOR MAILONLINE
1 November 2022

Ukraine has shot down two Russian attack helicopters in just three minutes in the latest blow to Putin's botched invasion.

Anti-aircraft gunners hit the Ka-52 Alligators in Kherson region yesterday evening, Ukraine's Air Force said.

The £12 million single-seat attack helicopter is nicknamed the 'Black Shark' and has been described as Russia's 'deadliest helicopter'.

Its battlefield management system allows it to share data with other aircraft to coordinate attack operations.

The attack came just weeks after Ukrainian troops shot down four Russian helicopters in 18 minutes.

Ukraine also blew up a Mi-8 helicopter gunship in Donetsk after a surface-to-air missile picked it out of the sky yesterday.

*  *  *

Source:  https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11376801/Ukraine-shoots-two-Russian-choppers-three-minutes.html

[Right_in_Virginia]

Haven't we given them weapons and supplies and in doing so haven't we drawn down on our own reserves?

Yes, @libertybele 

DoD Fights to Replace Munitions Sent to Ukraine
https://news.clearancejobs.com/2022/10/27/dod-fights-to-replace-munitions-sent-to-ukraine/

Ukraine War Shows the US Military Isn’t Ready for War With China
Providing Kyiv with weapons has depleted the Pentagon’s munitions alarmingly, and defending Taiwan would be far more costly.
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2022-09-18/ukraine-war-shows-the-us-military-isn-t-ready-for-war-with-china?leadSource=uverify%20wall

Ukraine War Is Depleting U.S. Ammunition Stockpiles, Sparking Pentagon Concern
https://www.wsj.com/articles/ukraine-war-depleting-u-s-ammunition-stockpiles-sparking-pentagon-concern-11661792188

US Has Given So Many Weapons To Ukraine That Its Weapon Stockpile Is Depleting: Report
https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/us-has-given-so-many-weapons-to-ukraine-that-its-weapon-stockpile-is-depleting-report-3309504

[Right_in_Virginia]

Obviously you either have no rebuttal or you missed my point.

Guarantee their security?  Ok ... so, should we enter into war?  Keep giving them billions?  What exactly do you propose??

BTW bawk and laugh at yourself .... meanwhile there are those of us that do see the dangers of  WWIII and the severity of the hardship that this has created for our country.

I'll stick with making America First.  Without her, where is the rest of the world going to be?  Think about it instead of quickly using snide antics.

   @libertybele

[Right_in_Virginia]

You see nothing, and are proud of it.  The country weeps for people like that.

[ @libertybele  ]

[art.prout]

Thank you for this @art.prout

Thank you for your persistence!

 

[240B]

[bilo]

Yep! and guaranteed the replacements will cost more than the original materiel, if for no other reason than being more advanced (not to mention Bidenflation)

The amount needed for a safe stockpile will be less with the collapse of Russia as a conventional threat.

[sneakypete]

The amount needed for a safe stockpile will be less with the collapse of Russia as a conventional threat.

@bilo

WHY is it that so many people fail to see and understand a concept as basic as that?


It makes no sense at all,but the only explanation that I can come up with is they don't WANT to see it because it upsets their understanding of how the world works.

[DB]

The amount needed for a safe stockpile will be less with the collapse of Russia as a conventional threat.

What does NATO cost every year for the last 70+ years... The purpose of NATO is to contain the ambitions of Russia consuming its neighbors which it has a long history of doing.

Russia is committing suicide right before our eyes and people want to go all weak-kneed in fear of "WWIII" which Russia cannot wage economically. It already losing the war it started with Ukraine, it is in no position to expand that front to the rest of Europe. And if Russia wants this to end all they have to do is leave Ukraine - which they are going to do one way or another.

[Kamaji]

What does NATO cost every year for the last 70+ years... The purpose of NATO is to contain the ambitions of Russia consuming its neighbors which it has a long history of doing.

Russia is committing suicide right before our eyes and people want to go all weak-kneed in fear of "WWIII" which Russia cannot wage economically. It already losing the war it started with Ukraine, it is in no position to expand that front to the rest of Europe. And if Russia wants this to end all they have to do is leave Ukraine - which they are going to do one way or another.

[berdie]

This is interesting. So did Latvia, Estonia or the Ukraine shoot down the copters? Or, looking at the jpg address is it a joke?

[Kamaji]

This is interesting. So did Latvia, Estonia or the Ukraine shoot down the copters? Or, looking at the jpg address is it a joke?

Most likely a gag, since the Pskov Oblast in Russia is hundreds of km from Ukraine, and to-date, as far as we know, Ukraine is not making military forays that deep into Russia.

On the other hand, the reporting from the Daily Mail, which doesn't typically engage in such larks, indicates that Ukraine is claiming it shot the helicopters down over Kherson, which is definitely within Ukraine's own territory.

[berdie]

Most likely a gag, since the Pskov Oblast in Russia is hundreds of km from Ukraine, and to-date, as far as we know, Ukraine is not making military forays that deep into Russia.

On the other hand, the reporting from the Daily Mail, which doesn't typically engage in such larks, indicates that Ukraine is claiming it shot the helicopters down over Kherson, which is definitely within Ukraine's own territory.

Thanks

[Hoodat]

This is interesting. So did Latvia, Estonia or the Ukraine shoot down the copters? Or, looking at the jpg address is it a joke?

Unable to see the link in @240B 's post (because of VPN).  But from my understanding, the sabotage attack on the base near Estonia was on the ground, not in the air.  There's a link up thread on it:  https://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,478214.msg2731142.html#msg2731142