GOP dilemma — how to keep Trumpers yet regain anti-Trumpers

[sneakypete]

The main thing the 2024 Trump is missing at this point is humility.

@Hoodat

I couldn't possible disagree more strongly. That IS the one thing that drives the professional pols BatBush crazy! Oh,it's ok for him to accept a little personal humility as long as he keeps it secret,but why throw away one of his most powerful tools to make them come unglued?

He needs to recognize his mistakes,

I think he has,but he will never admit it in public. Well,maybe after he retires from business and writes his "tell all book".

develop a grass roots movement at the State level nationwide, and overturn the GOP structure.

I could easily be wrong because I don't follow him or anyone else on a daily basis,but I kinda got the feeling that is exactly what he is working on right now. Not that he is going to tell ANYBODY what his plans are. He likes to keep his enemies off-balance.

[roamer_1]

Gee, the Rodents just blew 10% of that in less than a month, and less than 10% of that actually went to help people's problems with the Political Flu that swept the nation last year.

What ARE you crying about?

Ah, the Republican motto.... 'Vote for us because we are slightly better than Democrats'.

FECKLESS. Utterly without feck.

And likely untrue - Right now it is a Republican administration that holds the record for spending the most money in the history of man. Gonna be hard to top that one, after all, spending TWICE what the Democrat before him spent. Buydem will have to reach far to top that.

(spit)

[roamer_1]

The GOP is the Heaven's Gate of US politics.  It castrates itself for fear of getting power and doing good for the nation and the world.

Nah. It colludes. A palace eunuch.

[roamer_1]

Aren't going to get a balanced budget until the Republicans gain control of House and Senate...real Americans, not RINOs.

Never going to happen, because y'all just keep voting em in.

Don't blame Trump for that, the US hasn't had an American Congress in our lifetimes.

Bullsh*t. He signed it. He owns it. His people helped to craft it. He owns it.

How much did you do to help re-elect President Trump and defeat the Rodents and RINOs?

I would not elect Tumpy to dogcatcher. And I have no obligation toward your fetid party, and consider it the other side of the very same coin as the Democrats. I see no difference at all.

I acknowledge that you may not have been able to do much...I live in Hatefilled Haridan Maxine's district and my vote hasn't put a Republican in office since 1996 (?).   But I support the American Majority of the GOP and recognize that Trump did the very best ANYONE could have done in similar circumstances.

My only fealty is to Principled Conservatism. And if he is the best you can do, there is no hope at all

Given that no one could have done more for America than Trump did, what exactly is your emotional problem with him?   He tweeted mean things?  That bugging you?   

That isn't 'given'

He signed budgets, which were necessary to advance his agenda items, even though they were loaded with pork that the President is powerless to excise?   

Then at least don't sign them. But he did. That is him signing on. He OWNS it. Were it to my satisfaction, VETO would be the only answer.

What's your stance on the Line Item Veto?

Generally against it... I like things the way the founders meant them to be, and a line item is too powerful a tool for the administration. Be careful what you wish for, you might just get it.

Trump was only one man...the ONLY time in US history when the President was ONLY ONE MAN.  Every other president had a team helping him advance his goals.

There's your problem right there. It was messianic bullcrap to think he COULD change it in the first place... Defeating the TEA Party for the Moderates at the same time. And you think it's great.

Trump was a citizen, not a politician.

Yeah bullcrap. He's been bumping elbows with the elite, political and otherwise, his whole life.

Should we have elected Jeb! because he was a politician, even though he didn't need our votes?

Oh hell no.

Why are you crying so much?  The people that supported him aren't crying as much as you are.  We are trying instead to find roads to success.

I ain't crying. I am pissed.

What is your road to success, besides surrendering and letting the Rodents win forever and ever and ever?

Right.

Surrendering isn't an option for the real Americans.

The only road there is is Conservatism. Every other plan or hyphenation is sure doom.
That is what happens when you throw principle things under the bus. And it happens every time.

[roamer_1]

But you're not fighting for conservatism.   

Sure I am.

Nobody here can quite figure out what it is you want, but whatever that might be, you're not going to get a stronger and healthier America on the path you're traveling.

That much is obvious.  Right now you're helping the enemy.

In fact, there are many here who know exactly where I am coming from... And agree.
And in fact, no, it is not me that is helping the enemy. You are.

I am for limited government and federalism. I am not in it because I think I can run the federal beast better than the Democrats. I am here to kill the beast. Bleed it dry.

I don't make excuses and justifications for otherwise. Nor will I ever.

I am a Conservative, first and only.

[roamer_1]

@txradioguy

 
It also effects EVERY aspect of our private lives because it is OUR money the government takes away from us to fund it all.

No.. If only they just took all your money. They are well past that, running the printers with the balls to the wall.

[roamer_1]

The RNC has gotten the rules changes it needed in 2016 and 2020 to ensure that they alone get to choose who runs at the state and local levels.


McDaniel was unanimously re-elected just two days after the electoral vote certifying Trump's defeat was accepted by Congress and control of the Senate reverted to the hardline communists.  Her tenure has seen control of both houses of Congress and the White House ceded over to the Democrats.  If there was ever a time for an RNC Chair to step down, this was it.  But all the RNC cares about is their own control over the GOP.


McConnell was on his way out in 2014, only to be saved at the 11th hour by Donald Trump.  The favor was repeated again in 2020.  The fault here lies with Trump himself.  He still hasn't learned that the RNC could care less about who controls Washington.  All they care about is who controls the RNC.  Cruz was half way there to getting them all booted in 2016.  Trump rescued them.


That is tough to do at this point considering that it's the RNC and their patsies at the state level that are giving us our candidates.  I haven't seen a Conservative Republican win the nomination in my Congressional district in over a decade.  And because of that, it has been held by a Democrat for the last two cycles.  And will be held for at least the next six because the State GOP will select the candidate that is loyal to them with zero regard for the people of this district.  I had to endure over a decade of that Paul Ryan proxy Tom Price, followed by two years of that lazy POS Karen Handel.  Now I am represented by a Dem who lives in Tennessee.  And both the RNC and the state GOP are perfectly OK with that.

Trump was naive.  He sided with the wrong folks.  And he got burned.  Bigtime.  Just like we the people have been getting burned for decades.

To hell with the GOP.

BRAVO! Every bloody word of it!

[roamer_1]

If the President vetoes the budget and the House and Senate fail to override that veto, the federal government would no longer be able to spend money it didn't have.  Personally, I strongly favor this approach.  But our government is filled with cowards at every level.

I do too... They shut down Main Street for over a year... Time to give them some of their own medicine.

[Smokin Joe]

Throw ALL the bastards out. All of em. Across several elections. That'll fix it.

To do that we need to eliminate election fraud as much as possible. Why would the GOP be so slow to fight Fraud in elections?    You tell me...

[roamer_1]

To do that we need to eliminate election fraud as much as possible. Why would the GOP be so slow to fight Fraud in elections?    You tell me...

Yup. Whichever, whatever. It has to be done, Lest all we have left is to pick up arms.

[Smokin Joe]

He accomplished almost literally nothing. And cost 20 trillion dollars. More money than anyone, anywhere, in the entire history of mankind.

I thought I heard Queen Nancy and her White House vassal singing "Hold My beer..."

[Smokin Joe]

There is only one solution. Throw ALL the bastards out. Plow the ground. NONE survive the next three elections.

None survive without balanced budgets.
None survive without massive spending reductions.
None survive that appease or entertain liberalism in the slightest way.
None survive that seek to consolidate power in the fed, that refuse to turn power back to the States.
None survive that try to amend morality to acommodate liberal views or social justice bullcrap.

What will fix it -The ONLY thing that will fix it - Is pure, unadulterated, un-hyphenated
CONSERVATISM. And that from an entire machine - A whole party... Nothing else will do.

But still Republicans will compromise and accuse me of purism. And go chasing after shiny things and candy thrown from the front of the parade.

I know. I have seen it over and over and over again. For decades.
But it is down to the wire now. It may not be fixable.

But the only way we have is for all y'all to grow a pair and defend Conservatism.

You're right, of course. It is folly to continue to pursue the GOP because at the top, and in most of the places that matter it is thoroughly corrupt. If the past 4 years didn't hammer that point home, I don't know what will, maybe another 40 or 50 years of hitting that same button and getting the same results (as if there will even be a USA by then).

[roamer_1]

I thought I heard Queen Nancy and her White House vassal singing "Hold My beer..."

Oh, I don't know... They can spend, say, $15T ... and still claim to be the frugal ones... There's no downside in that,as Republicans already know.

[Smokin Joe]

TWENTY FRIGGIN TRILLION DOLLARS. And y'all will vote for more. There ain't a damn thing 'good for America' in that at all. That is our very DOOM.

How much of that twenty trillion was siphoned off into the coffers of this country's enemies, foreign and domestic? Very little went to The People, and that was what the whole scam was sold on. A lot of the responsibility for that belongs with the GOP in Congress, who likely lined their pockets, too.

[roamer_1]

You're right, of course. It is folly to continue to pursue the GOP because at the top, and in most of the places that matter it is thoroughly corrupt. If the past 4 years didn't hammer that point home, I don't know what will, maybe another 40 or 50 years of hitting that same button and getting the same results (as if there will even be a USA by then).

I don't see ANY way the Republicans can be brought to heel... Because the Republican rank and file has been well-trained to be more afraid of Democrats than they are interested in what their own may do. Thus their own get a free  ride, with little consequence. Free to do whatever they want.

And funny how it goes... The Democrats have done the exact same thing. Point their fingers each at the other and their voters vote in fear, each of the other... And not a grown-up in sight to take control and actually do what's right instead of what popularity dictates.

[Smokin Joe]

The last time the GOP was a "conservative" party was under Lincoln, and then it's agenda was seriously radical, that of abolition, which Lincoln did not embrace.

The GOP wasn't conservative under Reagan, he had that damned RINO Bush as his VP and that clown acted immediately to shut down Reagan's conservative gains once Bush took the White House.

Conservative my ass. Lincoln routinely violated the Constitution, suspended Habeas Corpus, suborned the invasion of my state of birth by armies from other states (that's what a Militia was defined as, at the time, an army), and continued with other unconstitutional acts as well.

[Smokin Joe]

The GOP is the Heaven's Gate of US politics.  It castrates itself for fear of getting power and doing good for the nation and the world.

Yeah, and it's waiting to ride the UFO in the tail of the comet, too.

[roamer_1]

How much of that twenty trillion was siphoned off into the coffers of this country's enemies, foreign and domestic? Very little went to The People, and that was what the whole scam was sold on. A lot of the responsibility for that belongs with the GOP in Congress, who likely lined their pockets, too.

And they will continue... Until they bleed us dry and all that's left is Venezuela. Many here don't know it, but that is where we are certainly going, and that only because there is no opposition.

And they will vote for candy from the front of the parade, and the other side will vote for government largess, and in the end, the end will come crashing in on all Americans - A generation of servitude and other people eating the work of their hands, and taking their women and children.

It is surely coming to a land that has no god and has no morals, and has no ability to stop its addictions... offering *no* resistance.

[Smokin Joe]

If he refuses to sign, then it becomes law after ten days.  But that has no bearing on what I am suggesting.


What I am suggesting is practical.  It requires nothing from Congress.  It is perfectly Constitutional and completely within the confines of Executive Power.  If Congress appropriates $31.7 billion for the Department of Energy in a fiscal year, it does not mean that the President has to spend all $31.7 billion.  It is entirely within his discretion to spend the money thus appropriated.  If he only spends $21.7 billion, then $10 billion remains in the Treasury unspent when the fiscal year is over.  And there isn't a damn thing Congress can do about it.

That's practical, in theory. Like most theories, they work fine in theory.

The reality is that the swamp is wide and deep and no bureaucrat is willing to reduce their budget or the scope of their department (which is a loss of status in the bureaucracy), so the swamp, teeming with life, will go on, because each and every one of those fiefdoms will fight tenaciously for every dime it can get its hands on.

The only time I have seen something like that be successful was when Governor Ed Shaffer of ND requested that all departments curb spending and return 10% of their budget to the general fund in ND when the oil boom of the late 70s-early80s had died. For the most part, they did, and the budget was balanced during his terms.

But on a national level, good luck. I just don't see that happening. 

[Smokin Joe]

Oh, I don't know... They can spend, say, $15T ... and still claim to be the frugal ones... There's no downside in that,as Republicans already know.

The only thing holding them back is Biden's writer's cramp.

[Sled Dog]

The main thing the 2024 Trump is missing at this point is humility.

He's Superman, not Clark Kent.

[Sled Dog]

It is actually quite easy to enact.  The President does not have to spend money that Congress appropriates.  That is a key tenet of the Executive Branch.

Ummm...if I recall, and I was a pre-teen at the time, that's what Nixon would do, withhold funds to force compliance, and after his abdication laws were passed that required the president to spend the money as the law required.

But I'm sure someone is more up on this topic than I am.  Sorry.

[libertybele]

And they will continue... Until they bleed us dry and all that's left is Venezuela. Many here don't know it, but that is where we are certainly going, and that only because there is no opposition.

And they will vote for candy from the front of the parade, and the other side will vote for government largess, and in the end, the end will come crashing in on all Americans - A generation of servitude and other people eating the work of their hands, and taking their women and children.

It is surely coming to a land that has no god and has no morals, and has no ability to stop its addictions... offering *no* resistance.

Truth.           AMERICA  What will we do without her??     The rest of the world will suffer as well.

[Sled Dog]

Your analysis is interesting and credible. In hindsight it is amazing Trump, or any non-insider, managed to pull it off in 2016. All things considered - all the mistakes he made - I'm still very glad he did.

It will be interesting to see which way he goes now, being the most influential figure in the party. Play ball with the insiders, take a shot at actually reforming the party or just fade away. Does it even matter.

It's surprising, but in a way, it's not.

After Reagan, who Americans loved, the Americans found the national primaries were always giving them RINO squishes. 

Bush and his Read Me Lying Lips pledge,
Bush handing us that draft dodging rapist,
Dole the Mediocre Viagra Salesman,
Bush the Compassionate Not-A Conservative
Romney, the ONLY candidate that couldn't campaign against Messiah-Care.
And then we were threatened with Jeb! or Kaysick.

The people revolted against the revolting line-up and just LOVED Trump, because Trump was the first, and only, candidate in 28 years who FOUGHT BACK.  And that's why the Americans still love their president and gave him his second term in 2020.

If he runs in 2024, he'll get a third term, too.

He's not going to coddle the RINO insiders who have spent their careers betraying everyone who voted for them.

[Sled Dog]

He's met with McCarthy and made comments about getting people elected in '22.  McCarthy is an insider which doesn't set well with me.  I think we'll see Trump fade away within the next couple of months.  He has to realize that trying to win when nothing has changed is futile.  If he stays in..it boils down to keeping the GOP money machine going.  I personally am not interested.

But Trump has decided to starve the GOP RINO Financing Operation by setting up his own PAC and bypassing the RINO Funding goons...both taking their money away from them and then letting the money out to (hopefully) non-RINO candidates.

The GOP is not happy about this.