Author Topic: Former GOP Sen. Jeff Flake says he will not vote for Trump (Read 1251 times)

Formerly Once-Ler · « **on:** April 28, 2020, 06:18:00 pm »

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/495014-former-sen-jeff-flake-says-he-will-not-vote-for-donald-trump

Quote

He added that a Trump defeat November would be a "long-term" benefit for the Republican Party and "conservatism as well."

"This won't be the first time I've voted for a Democrat â€” though not for president. Last time I voted for a third-party candidate," he said. "But I will not vote for Donald Trump."

He also predicted that the GOP would change once Trump is out of the Oval Office.

I don't think Flake has many fans here that are willing to speak out, but he doesn't need many to hurt President Trump. Flake's home state of AZ voted Trump in 2016 but is trending Biden now. In 2016 many Republican NeverTrumpers sat out the election, fortunately for President Trump he brought in enough new voters to make up the difference with promises that will be hard to argue were fulfilled. In 2016 some GOP voters held their nose closed as they voted GOP, will they be satisfied? There are other factors at play as well. How much did Hillary motivate GOP voters to GOTV? Are there any Hillary voters who will decided in 2020 President Trump did OK?

Now parts of NeverTrump are pushing a vote for Biden. The argument is a return to normalcy. Some of the voters and nonvoters I mention above are less important. A NeverTrumper in 2016 that votes for Biden in 2020 is a net +1 vote. A 2016 voter who sits out 2020 is a net -1 vote. But a GOP voter, who pinched his nose to vote for Trump in 2016, but is aggravated to vote Biden is net +2 vote for Biden (1 for Biden and -1 for Trump) I don't know how many of theses voters exist, and it's possible that some Hillary voters could be disgusted with the unfair partisan behavior of the rats, or press, enough to vote for President Trump because he wasn't as bad as they thought he would be.

Flake is not the first NeverTrumper to vow a vote for Biden this season. Many of the media guys have said the same thing. https://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/article242196206.html
It was unheard of in 2016. Hillary was just too despised by Republicans to support.

PeteS in CA · « **Reply #1 on:** April 28, 2020, 06:51:12 pm »

In other news, it is predicted the Sun will rise in the east tomorrow.

Cyber Liberty · « **Reply #2 on:** April 28, 2020, 08:04:10 pm »

Jeff who?

Cyber Liberty · « **Reply #3 on:** April 28, 2020, 08:06:14 pm »

Quote from: Once-Ler on April 28, 2020, 06:18:00 pm

Flake's home state of AZ voted Trump in 2016 but is trending Biden now.

You got a fantasy poll to link to back that BS up, bubba?

catfish1957 · « **Reply #4 on:** April 28, 2020, 08:23:15 pm »

Quote from: Cyber Liberty on April 28, 2020, 08:06:14 pm

You got a fantasy poll to link to back that BS up, bubba?

Yep.... From RCP, and sorry about the spacing.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/az/arizona_trump_vs_biden-6807.html

Polling Data
Poll   Date   Sample   MoE
Biden (D)
Trump (R)
Spread
RCP Average   10/25 - 4/8   --   --   48.6   44.2   Biden +4.4
OH Predictive Insights   4/7 - 4/8   600 LV   4.0   52   43   Biden +9
NBC News/Marist   3/10 - 3/15   2523 RV   2.7   47   46   Biden +1
Monmouth   3/11 - 3/14   847 RV   3.4   46   43   Biden +3
Univision/ASU   3/6 - 3/11   1036 RV   3.0   50   42   Biden +8
PPP (D)   3/2 - 3/3   666 RV   3.8   48   47   Biden +1
Emerson   10/25 - 10/28   901 RV   3.2   50   50   Tie

berdie · « **Reply #5 on:** April 28, 2020, 08:24:15 pm »

An aptly named individual.

Cyber Liberty · « **Reply #6 on:** April 28, 2020, 08:40:17 pm »

Quote from: catfish1957 on April 28, 2020, 08:23:15 pm

Yep.... From RCP, and sorry about the spacing.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/az/arizona_trump_vs_biden-6807.html

Polling Data
Poll   Date   Sample   MoE
Biden (D)
Trump (R)
Spread
RCP Average   10/25 - 4/8   --   --   48.6   44.2   Biden +4.4
OH Predictive Insights   4/7 - 4/8   600 LV   4.0   52   43   Biden +9
NBC News/Marist   3/10 - 3/15   2523 RV   2.7   47   46   Biden +1
Monmouth   3/11 - 3/14   847 RV   3.4   46   43   Biden +3
Univision/ASU   3/6 - 3/11   1036 RV   3.0   50   42   Biden +8
PPP (D)   3/2 - 3/3   666 RV   3.8   48   47   Biden +1
Emerson   10/25 - 10/28   901 RV   3.2   50   50   Tie

Cool. So Trump is doomed. Glad that's settled.

catfish1957 · « **Reply #7 on:** April 28, 2020, 08:53:17 pm »

Quote from: Cyber Liberty on April 28, 2020, 08:40:17 pm

Cool. So Trump is doomed. Glad that's settled.

Not the intent, he isn't doomed as there is plenty of time to put Slow Joe away.

I think Oncler's point is that Trump is seeing some ebbing of support due to COVID-19.

Cyber Liberty · « **Reply #8 on:** April 28, 2020, 08:59:08 pm »

Quote from: catfish1957 on April 28, 2020, 08:53:17 pm

Not the intent, he isn't doomed as there is plenty of time to put Slow Joe away.

I think Oncler's point is that Trump is seeing some ebbing of support due to COVID-19.

It's just wishful thinking.

Media polls suck. Never trust them. What was Hillary's "Chance of Winning" in the last "polls" in 2016? 95%?

catfish1957 · « **Reply #9 on:** April 28, 2020, 09:08:26 pm »

Quote from: Cyber Liberty on April 28, 2020, 08:59:08 pm

It's just wishful thinking.

Media polls suck. Never trust them. What was Hillary's "Chance of Winning" in the last "polls" in 2016? 95%?

Bitch did win the popular vote tally by 2.8M votes, so it wasn't really as much a matter of faulty polling, as much as some slick and lucky EV footwork and math on election day. Thank goodness of that though.

I do agree, that there is an inherent left lean to polling, but once you understand that, extrapolation of trends are still possible. I beleive that Trump is suffering short term from COVID and economic bad news fatigue. Still time to right the ship, but writing off polls (and trends) as just tools of the left, is a losing strategy.

truth_seeker · « **Reply #10 on:** April 28, 2020, 09:18:06 pm »

Quote from: PeteS in CA on April 28, 2020, 06:51:12 pm

In other news, it is predicted the Sun will rise in the east tomorrow.

The only way Flake gets attention.

Cyber Liberty · « **Reply #11 on:** April 28, 2020, 09:20:35 pm »

Quote from: catfish1957 on April 28, 2020, 09:08:26 pm

Bitch did win the popular vote tally by 2.8M votes, so it wasn't really as much a matter of faulty polling, as much as some slick and lucky EV footwork and math on election day. Thank goodness of that though.

I do agree, that there is an inherent left lean to polling, but once you understand that, extrapolation of trends are still possible. I beleive that Trump is suffering short term from COVID and economic bad news fatigue. Still time to right the ship, but writing off polls (and trends) as just tools of the left, is a losing strategy.

Not writing them off, because there are still lots of idiots who believe in them. Yes, Trump's taken a dip in the polls. Millions of people suddenly unemployed will do that. If they're still unemployed by November it will be a tough election night. Right or wrong, the idiots will blame the King no matter what he does.

corbe · « **Reply #12 on:** April 28, 2020, 09:33:18 pm »

I thought it to be a well thought post @Once-Ler even though you didn't touch upon the Bernie Bros. I still think it's Trumps to lose even though we are unsure who is gonna be the final dem nominee, Shirley not Joe.

Formerly Once-Ler · « **Reply #13 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:23:48 pm »

Quote from: Cyber Liberty on April 28, 2020, 08:06:14 pm

You got a fantasy poll to link to back that BS up, bubba?

The last 5
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/az/arizona_trump_vs_biden-6807.html

Formerly Once-Ler · « **Reply #14 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:25:51 pm »

Quote from: Cyber Liberty on April 28, 2020, 08:59:08 pm

It's just wishful thinking.

I actually think "wishful thinking" is believing something despite the evidence.

Formerly Once-Ler · « **Reply #15 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:30:17 pm »

Quote from: corbe on April 28, 2020, 09:33:18 pm

I thought it to be a well thought post @Once-Ler even though you didn't touch upon the Bernie Bros. I still think it's Trumps to lose even though we are unsure who is gonna be the final dem nominee, Shirley not Joe.

Thank you @corbe . You make a good point with the Bernie Bros. The question is will they vote for Trump to spite Biden? I'm thinking they might need 4 years of Biden as President to hate him that much.

LegalAmerican · « **Reply #16 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:31:09 pm »

Quote from: berdie on April 28, 2020, 08:24:15 pm

An aptly named individual.

And it always was a RINO. One of the GANG OF EIGHT. ALL DEMON-RATS & RINOS. All for supporting ILLEGALS. FLAKE, McCain "NO NAME", LINDSEY GRAHAM, (wife to no name), Marco Rubio. These are all RINO'S.

Same as RINO Romney, taking the place of McCain & supporting NWO & ILLEGALS. Halve of Romneys family is in mexico.
Sure it is USA to blame, not those who live in Mexico.

Error 404 (Not Found)!!1

LegalAmerican · « **Reply #17 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:35:25 pm »

Quote from: Cyber Liberty on April 28, 2020, 08:06:14 pm

You got a fantasy poll to link to back that BS up, bubba?

lol Zing.

LegalAmerican · « **Reply #18 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:48:37 pm »

Hilary did not win popular 'vote. That is the same lie posted over & over again. VOTER FRAUD DOES NOT COUNT...nor illegals voting. BALLOT STUFFING. BRENDA SNIPES. Corrupt DONNA BRAZZILE giving Hillary the answers to debates.

307 for TRUMP 232 for Hillary. Even with her super delegates. Very wealthy people giving her the electoral vote.

LegalAmerican · « **Reply #19 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:50:26 pm »

Half.

catfish1957 · « **Reply #20 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:51:23 pm »

Quote from: LegalAmerican on April 28, 2020, 10:48:37 pm

Hilary did not win popular 'vote. That is the same lie posted over & over again. VOTER FRAUD DOES NOT COUNT...nor illegals voting. BALLOT STUFFING. BRENDA SNIPES. Corrupt DONNA BRAZZILE giving Hillary the answers to debates.

307 for TRUMP 232 for Hillary. Even with her super delegates. Very wealthy people giving her the electoral vote.

EV superdelegates? EV's from wealthy people?

HRC fradulently added 2.8 M votes? 2.8M?

You can't be for f'n real.....

Cyber Liberty · « **Reply #21 on:** April 28, 2020, 10:57:02 pm »

Quote from: Once-Ler on April 28, 2020, 10:25:51 pm

I actually think "wishful thinking" is believing something despite the evidence.

Show me evidence that's worth a snot, sure. Media political polls are worse than useless, they are deliberately misleading. That said, I have no doubt his approval polls are taking honest hits. It's been non-stop "Trump fiddles while Rome burns!!" headlines from the rats and their media arm. Millions of people just got thrown out of work, and they can't reason beyond, "blame the King!!"

LegalAmerican · « **Reply #22 on:** April 28, 2020, 11:02:29 pm »

Quote from: truth_seeker on April 28, 2020, 09:18:06 pm

The only way Flake gets attention.

You know, if I were he, I would change my name. He has to get ribbed about that name all the time. No doubt, it was already changed from something else...way back when. Flakeman? Flaker? Flakenstein. Flakewitz? Some shortening of his name. Many people did that. Ellis Island.

LegalAmerican · « **Reply #23 on:** April 28, 2020, 11:10:24 pm »

Quote from: Cyber Liberty on April 28, 2020, 10:57:02 pm

Show me evidence that's worth a snot, sure. Media political polls are worse than useless, they are deliberately misleading. That said, I have no doubt his approval polls are taking honest hits. It's been non-stop "Trump fiddles while Rome burns!!" headlines from the rats and their media arm. Millions of people just got thrown out of work, and they can't reason beyond, "blame the King!!"

People think others would do better? Biden? Any of them?

Cyber Liberty · « **Reply #24 on:** April 28, 2020, 11:19:18 pm »

Quote from: LegalAmerican on April 28, 2020, 11:10:24 pm

People think others would do better? Biden? Any of them?

There is sufficient question as to whether Sloe Joe actually gets nominated that the Rats are still in "anybody but the hated Trump" mode. Polls are, therefore, "generic." The Rat box is empty. When there's really somebody in that bracket, then we'll start getting some (but not all) reliable polling. Polls right now are not any different than polls a year ago.