Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion 2

[DB]

I saw Dr. Fauci on one of the morning tv shows.  He was asked about the malaria drug cocktail.  He said there was mixed information that it actually worked.  Everything I've read from experts including Dr. Oz seems to indicate that it does indeed work.  Just wondering why the negative response from Dr. Fauci.

Probably for the same reason as a mask won't help earlier. Trying to prevent hoarding of the items lying in the process.

[Idiot]

Probably for the same reason as a mask won't help earlier. Trying to prevent hoarding of the items lying in the process.

Hey just tell us the truth.  This lying crap has to stop.  I felt like an idiot, but I wore a mask yesterday picking up my Walmart groceries.  Beats getting the virus though....

[TomSea]

This really is just using a bandana, maybe folding it a certain way to get a bit more protection.


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To me, just wearing a winter scarf around the nose would have about as much protection. Still, a simple and easy way to make a mask per video.

As for me, yes, I think a mask probably helps and I wore one Friday in the grocery store.

[libertybele]

I saw Dr. Fauci on one of the morning tv shows.  He was asked about the malaria drug cocktail.  He said there was mixed information that it actually worked.  Everything I've read from experts including Dr. Oz seems to indicate that it does indeed work.  Just wondering why the negative response from Dr. Fauci.

Dr. Fauci is the "leading expert" on infectious diseases and has served under six presidents.  He is used to going through the protocols of research and testing and it seems to me, because of his background and reputation, he doesn't want to just go ahead and randomly suggest that chloroquine or hydroxycholorquine and other drugs will work in treating this virus especially since the drugs are being used off label.  IMHO I think he's letting his reputation and years of experience interfere with telling the medical profession to use it as a last resort to save lives.  There is a possibility that he is also perhaps letting politics play a role in all of this as well.

[libertybele]

Hey just tell us the truth.  This lying crap has to stop.  I felt like an idiot, but I wore a mask yesterday picking up my Walmart groceries.  Beats getting the virus though....

I haven't ventured out yet with a mask, but I have ventured out several times wearing gloves.  I thought I was going to feel silly,but quite the opposite thinking of how many people touched the touch screen I was about to use, handling packages of food, cash back and other items, I felt I was being smart.  I'll have the same mindset when I wear a mask -- I'm potentially protecting myself from the inconsiderate boob that is hacking and sneezing near me!

[PeteS in CA]

Re the info-dump below, the main sources are:

https://www.axios.com/timeline-the-early-days-of-chinas-coronavirus-outbreak-and-cover-up-ee65211a-afb6-4641-97b8-353718a5faab.html

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3074991/coronavirus-chinas-first-confirmed-covid-19-case-traced-back

https://www.nationalreview.com/the-morning-jolt/chinas-devastating-lies/

First some notes. I double-checked the source for each listed event.

* The first event on National Review's list (12/6) is not confirmed by the linked Lancet article. There is nothing resembling what NR quoted, supposedly from Lancet. While some Prog orgs claim NR lied, my guess is that either Lancet edited their article or the incorrect link is in NR's article. Other sources have information consistent with or ante-dating NR's 12/6 date.

* The South China Morning Post is over a century old, and is based in Hong Kong. The Straits Times is ~175 years old and is based in Singapore. Their information is vaguely sourced, to some degree, that's the nature of getting information from inside China.

* Some of NR's source articles are behind paywalls. While I found alternative sources for some, others I simply omitted. I won't support paywalls by paying or linking blocked information.

* Some of NR's source articles are Chinese language. I used Google Translate to verify the content.

So, put down your coffee and hold on to your seat:

Possible first contraction of coronavirus (9 cases reported in November): November 17, 2019, https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3074991/coronavirus-chinas-first-confirmed-covid-19-case-traced-back

Nine cases reported: November, 2019, https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3074991/coronavirus-chinas-first-confirmed-covid-19-case-traced-back

Pneumonia patients in study published by NEJM, earliest illness onset: December 8, 2020, https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMoa2001316

Early Wuhan patient Wei Guixian starts feeling ill: December 10, 2020, https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-it-all-started-chinas-early-coronavirus-missteps-11583508932

Pneumonia patients in study published by NEJM, at least one early admission: December, 12, 2020, https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMoa2001316

Pneumonia patients studied by Lancet, at least one early admission: December, 16, 2020, https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30183-5/fulltext

Pneumonia patients studied by NEJM, earliest patient with infected person contact, not the meat market: December, 19, 2020, https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30183-5/fulltext

Cluster of pneumonia cases in Wuhan recognized: December 21, 2019, http://weekly.chinacdc.cn/en/article/id/a3907201-f64f-4154-a19e-4253b453d10c

Recognition of infection of hospital staff reported: December 25, 2020, https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/IzzCnz4Yr2jEIYZePiu_ow  (Chinese language)

Guangzhou genomics company (one of several) partly sequence virus DNA, recognized as similar to SARS (a corona virus): December 27, 2020, https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/how-early-signs-of-the-coronavirus-were-spotted-spread-and-throttled-in-china

Zhang Jixian, a doctor at a Hubei Provincial hospital informed health authorities it was a new coronavirus: December 27, 2020, https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3074991/coronavirus-chinas-first-confirmed-covid-19-case-traced-back

Ai Fen, director of Wuhan Central Hospital, posted a WeChat message about the new SARS-like virus and reprimanded: December 30, 2019, https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/11/coronavirus-wuhan-doctor-ai-fen-speaks-out-against-authorities

Li Wenliang sent WeChat message to fellow doctors, warning to protect themselves from infection: December 30, 2019, https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30382-2/fulltext

Wuhan Municipal Health Commission claimed no evidence of human-human transmission or infected medical staff: December 31, 2019, http://wjw.wuhan.gov.cn/front/web/showDetail/2019123108989  (Chinese language, second paragraph)

Genomics company employee ordered by Hubei Provincial Health Commission official to stop testing and destroy samples: January 1, 2020, https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/how-early-signs-of-the-coronavirus-were-spotted-spread-and-throttled-in-china

14 of 41 studied patients had no direct connection to the Huanan seafood market: January 2, 2020, https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30183-5/fulltext

China's National Health Commission ordered institutions not to publish any information and ordered labs to transfer samples to testing institutions (without designating an institution) or to destroy them: January 3, 2020, https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/how-early-signs-of-the-coronavirus-were-spotted-spread-and-throttled-in-china

Wuhan Municipal Health Commission claimed no evidence of human-human transmission or infected medical staff: January 3, 2020, http://wjw.wuhan.gov.cn/front/web/showDetail/2020010309017  (Chinese language)

Li Wenliang detained by Wuhan police for "spreading false rumors": January 3, 2020, https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/feb/07/coronavirus-chinese-rage-death-whistleblower-doctor-li-wenliang  Died of Covid-19, February 7, 2020

Wuhan Municipal Health Commission claimed no evidence of human-human transmission or infected medical staff: January 5, 2020, http://wjw.wuhan.gov.cn/front/web/showDetail/2020010509020  (Chinese language)

After unknowingly treating a patient with coronavirus, Li Wenliang had symptoms: January 10, 2020, https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-51403795 (human-human transmission!)

Wuhan Municipal Health Commission claimed no evidence of human-human transmission or infected medical staff: January 11, 2020, http://wjw.wuhan.gov.cn/front/web/showDetail/2020011109035  (Chinese language)

Wuhan Municipal Health Commission claimed no cases among related contacts: January 14, 2020, http://wjw.wuhan.gov.cn/front/web/showDetail/2020011409039  (Chinese language)

Wuhan Municipal Health Commission claimed "there is no clear evidence of person-to-person transmission" but "the possibility of limited person-to-person transmission cannot be ruled out": January 15, 2020, http://wjw.wuhan.gov.cn/front/web/showDetail/2020011509040  (Chinese language, Google Translate translation)

First confirmed US case left Wuhan to come to the US: January 15, 2020, confirmed January 21, 2020, https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2020/p0121-novel-coronavirus-travel-case.html

Wuhan Municipal Health Commission claimed no cases among related contacts: January 17, 2020, http://wjw.wuhan.gov.cn/front/web/showDetail/2020011809064  (Chinese language)

Tens of thousands gather for Wuhan's Lunar New Year banquet: January 18, 2020, https://www.thestar.com.my/news/regional/2020/02/06/wuhan-neighbourhood-sees-infections-after-40000-families-gather-for-potluck

China and WHO claim that how the virus is transmitted is unknown: January 19, 2020, https://www.bbc.com/news/health-51168333

Wuhan Municipal Health Commission claimed no cases among related contacts: January 19/20, 2020, http://wjw.wuhan.gov.cn/front/web/showDetail/2020012009077  (Chinese language)

First acknowledgement of human-human transmission of coronavirus: January 20, 2020, https://abcnews.go.com/Health/human-human-transmission-coronavirus-reported-china/story?id=68403105

WHO delegation reported human-human transmission had happened (January 20-21), announced by WHO: January 22, 2020, https://www.who.int/china/news/detail/22-01-2020-field-visit-wuhan-china-jan-2020

Wuhan and other cities in Hubei Province shut down travel: January 23, 2020, https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-01-27/5-million-people-left-Wuhan-before-the-lockdown-where-did-they-go--NACCu9wItW/index.html

[Victoria33]

This is not a normal time. I had to post all those actions, so those who think, WRITE,  nothing is being done by POTUS.  The way I understand it,  each STATE, IS TO KEEP THEMSELVES PREPARED for all issues. Then if they can't, to seek help from federal agencies. We found out that NY Cumono, sp?  was HIDING his ventilators & supplies, then claiming POTUS did not give him any. Democrats do have a mental issue. Corrupt and evil thinking.

@LegalAmerican

I watch Cuomo's update every day.  Cuomo hid nothing.  His medical people told him how many more ventilators/other they would need as the numbers climbed and he was getting supplies wherever he could to build a pile to have enough.  He still needs more.  If you watched his updated progress every day you would know this.

I do not consider this problem in terms of political parties and no one should.  Democrats are sick/dying, Republicans are sick/dying.  Instead of parties, see in your mind a stack of 9,267 dead bodies as of right now, Sunday, 3:30 pm. 

[PeteS in CA]

@LegalAmerican, here is the source of the timelines you posted, https://www.donaldjtrump.com/media/timeline-the-trump-administrations-decisive-actions-to-combat-the-coronavirus/ .

[PeteS in CA]

@LegalAmerican

I watch Cuomo's update every day.  Cuomo hid nothing.  His medical people told him how many more ventilators/other they would need as the numbers climbed and he was getting supplies wherever he could to build a pile to have enough.  He still needs more.  If you watched his updated progress every day you would know this.

I do not consider this problem in terms of political parties and no one should.  Democrats are sick/dying, Republicans are sick/dying.  Instead of parties, see in your mind a stack of 9,267 dead bodies as of right now, Sunday, 3:30 pm.

@Victoria33, "HIDING" is clearly wrong. However, @LegalAmerican was alluding to this, https://nypost.com/2020/03/27/coronavirus-in-ny-cuomo-defends-need-for-30k-ventilators-after-trump-called-it-overblown/

Cuomo also shot down criticism by Dr. Deborah Birx, the White House coronavirus response coordinator, about New York not using the ventilators they already have.

“Somebody said one of the cable news shows, the ventilators that New York needed aren’t even being deployed — they’re in a stockpile,” Cuomo said, paraphrasing Birx’s comments without naming her.

“Yes they’re in a stockpile because that’s where they’re supposed to be because we don’t need them yet. We need them for the apex. The apex isn’t here so we’re gathering them in the stockpile so when we need them they will be there,” Cuomo said.

So Gov. Cuomo demanded 30,000 ventilators. The Feds sent NY several thousand, and ... Cuomo stuck them in stockpiles, because despite the urgency he claimed, they were not yet needed. Now, that 30,000 number. It contradicts NY's own 2015 pandemic task force study, https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/national-international/new-york-modeled-a-pandemic-and-found-a-15000-ventilator-shortfall-2/2331057/

https://www.health.ny.gov/regulations/task_force/reports_publications/docs/ventilator_guidelines.pdf?fbclid=IwAR1B70DidltlJL70fKc-qzOgSI6V0rfvq4yOo0KnhHMXCYjhTdf7cnxMKZg

As for, "I do not consider this problem in terms of political parties and no one should," take it up with the Dems, who have been trying to Katrina-ize this pandemic since at least the beginning of February. Reagan, GHWB, and GWB proved the futility of not responding to Dems' attack. Trump has chosen to respond in-kind.

[truth_seeker]

If you have stayed reasonably well informed, you should b full of facts that justify "real conservatives' concern about big costly government.

It sounds to me, like a pea and walnut shell game.

Who is responsible for masks, for ventilators, forr beds, for gowns, etc.

He is, no he is, no he is.

Fed.Gov, State.Gov, County.Gov, individual medical companies and hospitals?

Oh yes, they all are, and nobody is.

[bigheadfred]

@LegalAmerican

I watch Cuomo's update every day.  Cuomo hid nothing.  His medical people told him how many more ventilators/other they would need as the numbers climbed and he was getting supplies wherever he could to build a pile to have enough.  He still needs more.  If you watched his updated progress every day you would know this.

I do not consider this problem in terms of political parties and no one should.  Democrats are sick/dying, Republicans are sick/dying.  Instead of parties, see in your mind a stack of 9,267 dead bodies as of right now, Sunday, 3:30 pm.

They updated the infometer. 9,540 dead bodies at 3:43 MST

[PeteS in CA]

https://in.news.yahoo.com/coronavirus-stopped-48-hours-using-103100205.html

Coronavirus Can be Stopped in 48 Hours Using a Simple Anti-Parasitic Drug: Monash University
News18  5 April 2020

Amid a barrage of research on finding treatment for new coronavirus, Australian scientists have found that a common anti-parasitic drug killed SARS-CoV-2 virus, growing in cell culture, within 48 hours in lab settings. Ivermectin is an FDA-approved anti-parasitic drug that has also been shown to be effective in vitro against a broad range of viruses including HIV, dengue, influenza and Zika virus.

Published in the journal Antiviral Research, the study from Monash University showed that a single dose of Ivermectin could stop the coronavirus growing in cell culture -- effectively eradicating all genetic material of the virus within two days. "We found that even a single dose could essentially remove all viral RNA by 48 hours and that even at 24 hours there was a really significant reduction in it," said study lead author Dr Kylie Wagstaff.

Dr Wagstaff, however, cautioned that the tests conducted in the study were in vitro and that trials needed to be carried out in people. ...

My emphasis.

[TomSea]

Dr. Drew apologizes for getting it wrong on coronavirus, then threatens people on Twitter
Apr. 5, 2020 9:33 am by SooperMexican

...

That was the final straw. Dr. Drew took to video to apologize and explain why he got it so wrong.


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Now I really wanted to praise him for coming clean, manning up, and admitting he was wrong. But then I saw what he was doing on Twitter. He’s making vague threats to people who post the video of his prior comments:

Article:  https://therightscoop.com/dr-drew-apologizes-for-getting-it-wrong-on-coronavirus-then-threatens-people-on-twitter/

Just hearing about this....

[bigheadfred]

They updated the infometer. 9,602 dead bodies at 5:05 MST

62 more dead bodies in just over an hour.

[TomSea]

I didn't know the Surgeon General was on with Chris Wallace on Fox today....

Fox News Host Chris Wallace, Surgeon General Jerome Adams Spar Over Pandemic Shutdown
Bruce Haring   ,Deadline•April 5, 2020

Surgeon General Jerome Adams and Fox News host Chris Wallace sparred today over Adams’s choice of words during a Sunday interview on the pandemic shutdown. The conversation provoked an unusual amount of mudslinging online between the two sides of the political aisle.

During the conversation, Adams defended the fact that nine states have not issued shut down orders, and likened the coronavirus to cigarette smoking. Wallace leaped on that comment, saying one is done by choice, the other acquired.

Adams fell into word salad by talking about a report on tobacco cessation released earlier this year. “And we know that states have different laws there. And more people will die, even in the worst projections, from cigarette smoking in this country than are going to die from — from coronavirus this year.  And so we always are struggling with trying to get information out to guide people that we know will help them be healthy with states’ rights.”

More: https://news.yahoo.com/fox-news-host-chris-wallace-223005407.html

Fox News’ Chris Wallace Challenges Surgeon General for Downplaying Coronavirus Compared to Smoking, Opioid Deaths
Jeremy Fuster  ,The Wrap•April 5, 2020

“Fox News Sunday” anchor Chris Wallace denounced U.S. Surgeon General Vice Admiral Jerome Adams Sunday when the Trump appointee compared the coronavirus crisis to smoking and opioid usage.

While governors of 42 U.S. states have issued stay-at-home orders for their residents to prevent the spread of the virus, Utah, Arkansas, North and South Dakota, Wyoming, Iowa, Nebraska and South Carolina — all with Republican governors — have held out, even as some have ordered non-essential businesses to close.

Dr. Anthony Fauci, one of the heads of the Trump Administration’s coronavirus task force, has spoken in favor of a national stay-at-home order, yet Trump has refused to issue one.

More: https://news.yahoo.com/fox-news-chris-wallace-challenges-220255339.html

[Smokin Joe]

I saw Dr. Fauci on one of the morning tv shows.  He was asked about the malaria drug cocktail.  He said there was mixed information that it actually worked.  Everything I've read from experts including Dr. Oz seems to indicate that it does indeed work.  Just wondering why the negative response from Dr. Fauci.

This is his moment in  the spotlight. Effective treatment, and the 'experts' are not so relevant any more.

Ding! Sorry sir, your 15 minutes of fame are expired.

[bigheadfred]

It was known the malarial drug cocktail helped against SARS in 2003.

[bigheadfred]

Get this. About the first SARS outbreak in 2002

They developed a vaccine.

Whether a vaccine will ever need to be deployed is an open question. Sars was brought under control with public health measures, and possibly because it mutated into a less virulent strain. The vaccine was shelved and never licensed.

[TomSea]

https://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status/1246984368331075586

Worth watching.

[Hoodat]

04-06-2020 | 0:00 GMT

REGION	Recov:Death	Cases:Recov
Global (excluding China & US)	2.962 ↑	5.108 ↓
United States	1.869 ↑	18.728 ↓
China	23.119 ↑	1.061 ↓

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

[catfish1957]

https://in.news.yahoo.com/coronavirus-stopped-48-hours-using-103100205.html

Coronavirus Can be Stopped in 48 Hours Using a Simple Anti-Parasitic Drug: Monash University
News18  5 April 2020
My emphasis.

I have been using Ivermectin for Heart Worm protection for our pups for over 25 years now.  1:10 Dilution, then 1 ml per 40 pounds of dog weight. Your Vet may prescribe differently, and I do understand some dogs to show allergic reactions to the stuff.  So be careful, and take Vet's advise.  As far as usm It has worked well, as these montly treatments have prevented reoccurence, and no new problems with Heartworms (8 dogs)

I guess if I were in dire straits and other medical options were exhausted I'd use what I have on ourselves.  I'd hope I'd never come to that decision. 

[mountaineer]

81,766 COVID-19 deaths in USA projected by August 4, 2020
https://covid19.healthdata.org/projections

This site gives state-by-state projections, but I have no idea whether they should be relied upon.

[jmyrlefuller]

81,766 COVID-19 deaths in USA projected by August 4, 2020
https://covid19.healthdata.org/projections

This site gives state-by-state projections, but I have no idea whether they should be relied upon.

Cuomo is relying on those projections. So far the IHME model has generally overstated most of the stats.

[Hoodat]

81,766 COVID-19 deaths in USA projected by August 4, 2020
https://covid19.healthdata.org/projections

This site gives state-by-state projections, but I have no idea whether they should be relied upon.

They pushed it back a month.  Last time, it was 80,000 deaths by the start of July.

[Hoodat]

Cuomo is relying on those projections. So far the IHME model has generally overstated most of the stats.

Maybe someone can explain why Germany, a country with 70% LESS cases than the United States, has reported 60% MORE recoveries than the US.