US waves the white flag of surrender to the Taliban and al Qaeda

[mystery-ak]

US waves the white flag of surrender to the Taliban and al Qaeda
by Kevin Carroll
 | February 29, 2020 05:48 PM

Eighteen years, five months, two weeks, and four days after the Sept. 11 attacks, the United States waved the white flag of surrender to the Taliban and al Qaeda.

Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad and Gen. Austin Miller, great Americans, no doubt secured the best deal they could after Secretaries Mike Pompeo and Mark Esper pulled the plug on what was unironically christened Operation Enduring Freedom. President Trump’s partisans will polish this turd of an agreement best they can, to help his reelection. But this war now likely ends like Vietnam did: enemy tanks crashing through our embassy gate and a CIA officer slugging a liaison partner trying to board the last helicopter out.

Withdrawal conditions will be interpreted with a view toward getting out fast. The Taliban did not even follow through on its promised weeklong ceasefire, quickly rebranded as a “reduction in violence.” The Taliban will break its agreements, al Qaeda will return, literally with a vengeance, and terror attacks will be launched to kill people in the U.S.

more
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/taliban-peace-deal-is-us-surrender

[EdinVA]

But this war now likely ends like Vietnam did:

It already has we were just unwilling to admit it.

[skeeter]

Kevin doesn’t think 18 years is long enough. Another year and we’d have this thing licked.

I had no idea the media were such hawks, BTW. I guess they were just joshing all those times they  bitched about our ‘bloated’ defense budget.

[Smokin Joe]

Well, when they come in out of their holes, send in the drones and blame it on premature jihadulation...

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Russia got out of that hellhole a lot quicker than we did.

[Smokin Joe]

Russia got out of that hellhole a lot quicker than we did.

When your interest is conquest rather than 'nation building', the balance sheet and terms of success are simpler.

[skeeter]

Russia got out of that hellhole a lot quicker than we did.

Britain fought three wars in that shithole totaling less than 30% of the time we've been there.

They didn't get anywhere either.

[EdinVA]

The Afghans won't fight so they don't consider that they have anything worth fighting for... we are the ones forcing our value system on a valueless society.

[TomSea]

I don't want another Iraq, huge Obama mistake bit Iraq was mostly pacified unlike Afghanistan which debatably, gets worse.

So, I am still thinking it over but it's certainly a meat grinder.

FWIW, this past week was somehow pretty quiet.

[skeeter]

I don't want another Iraq, huge Obama mistake bit Iraq was mostly pacified unlike Afghanistan which debatably, gets worse.

So, I am still thinking it over but it's certainly a meat grinder.

FWIW, this past week was somehow pretty quiet.

There is no 'center' to Afghanistan. Our way of 'pacifying' can never work there. The tribes are just milking us - as soon as we stop paying them they creep out and shoot at us. Screw that.

[TomSea]

My understanding is too, they were fighting for 20 years before we went in.

Those insider attacks are just totally deflating to me

[Free Vulcan]

Afghanistan is just a staging ground. The real source of the problem is Pakistan.

We could be there another 100 years and not change a thing.

[skeeter]

My understanding is too, they were fighting for 20 years before we went in.

Those insider attacks are just totally deflating to me

I believe they were fighting for a might longer than that. They love fighting. It's their way of life.

[EdinVA]

I believe they were fighting for a might longer than that. They love fighting. It's their way of life.

And when they are not fighting external forces, they fight each other.

[txradioguy]

We haven't been allowed to fight a war to win it since WW II.

If we'd been able to do that in this instance in addition to being able to chasing them back into Pakistan we'd have finished this around 2005.

[Smokin Joe]

The Afghans won't fight so they don't consider that they have anything worth fighting for... we are the ones forcing our value system on a valueless society.

You can't give someone a form of government they don't really care to have.

Government, after all, derives its just powers from the consent of the governed. If we stick to that principle, imposing freedom on a people (especially one which routinely embraces a totalitarian religious order that governs as well) likely just will not work.  Absent goals of colonialism and/or economic exploitation of their resources, there is no further compelling motive to remain. We can't force them to be free. They have had a look, they will ultimately choose for themselves, as is their Right.

[Absalom]

A wise Greek knew how to win decisively some 2300 years ago in a matter of weeks!
Sadly his kind no longer exist!

[Smokin Joe]

And when they are not fighting external forces, they fight each other.

There are parallels in other tribally based warrior cultures. Native Americans (North and South), Africans,etc.
A quick look around the region, and it appears many of the peoples there (not monolithic, by any means, even within national boundaries) are much the same. It is why Middle Eastern countries are often ruled by men who can impose peace among the tribal factions.

[Smokin Joe]

A wise Greek knew how to win decisively some 2300 years ago in a matter of weeks!
Sadly his kind no longer exist!

That wise Greek (Macedonian, actually), overran whole countries militarily, but essentially imposed a veneer of government on his conquests, leaving much there to run as it always had.

[Sighlass]

Kill every man woman and child... Old Testament ways are starting to look wiser by the day.

[txradioguy]

Kill every man woman and child... Old Testament ways are starting to look wiser by the day.

I see nothing wrong with fighting the enemy using their established set of rules.

[skeeter]

That wise Greek (Macedonian, actually), overran whole countries militarily, but essentially imposed a veneer of government on his conquests, leaving much there to run as it always had.

The secret to Britain’s several centuries run of success too.

[sneakypete]

It already has we were just unwilling to admit it.

@EdinVA

Too broken to fix,so pulling out the troops seems like half of what we need to do at this point.

The OTHER half of "what we need to do" is to get serious about taking out the leadership every time we find one,anywhere we find one. Play "Whack a Mole" every time a new leader pops up,pop caps on his ass.

AND......,if you REALLY want to stop it from returning,start popping caps on the money boys that finance them,where you find them,when you find them,regardless of who they are. Track them down and just "disappear them" if in a country we can't get away with publicly killing them in. If asked,say something like "Gee,I was kinda wondering what happened to him myself! Let me know if you find  him,ok?"

NO SAFE REFUGE ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD for terrorist financiers and/or enablers.

An old saying from my-era Army comes to mind,"If you are going to be a bull,be a Brahma."

[sneakypete]

There is no 'center' to Afghanistan. Our way of 'pacifying' can never work there. The tribes are just milking us - as soon as we stop paying them they creep out and shoot at us. Screw that.

@skeeter

Nope! As soon as we pull out and quit paying them,they will go back to shooting at each other,like they have always done.

[sneakypete]

We haven't been allowed to fight a war to win it since WW II.

If we'd been able to do that in this instance in addition to being able to chasing them back into Pakistan we'd have finished this around 2005.

@txradioguy

There it is!