Author Topic: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion  (Read 79643 times)

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Online corbe

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2475 on: March 19, 2020, 06:47:34 pm »
100 Pages
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline Idiot

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2476 on: March 19, 2020, 06:49:21 pm »
That's not right or fair.

One cannot serve the aggregate on the basis of the increment.
And this IS a statistical game.
*****rollingeyes*****

Online Hoodat

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2477 on: March 19, 2020, 06:49:44 pm »
I said I got it off bing, you are quibbling on information and making accusations at others.:

No, I am saying that you were dead-ass wrong when you claimed the number to be at 100 seventeen hours ago.


It's still up there, 17 hours ago. Bing says that. Nothing you say is proving so.

Your own link in your own post proves it so.  QED.


Big deal going to the link, they update information, what you say is not being proven so.

When they update information, they say "Updated" and provide the time stamp when it was updated.  In THE LINK YOU PROVIDED, it clearly shows it to be over a day and a half old.  Maybe if you actually checked the veracity of your source material instead of lying about what it says, people would actually begin to take you seriously.  But as long as you continue down this path, you are actually doing a disservice to your own goal, because people have grown tired of hearing you cry 'Wolf!".
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Online Hoodat

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2478 on: March 19, 2020, 06:51:12 pm »
100 Pages

The page is not full yet.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-


"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline skeeter

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2479 on: March 19, 2020, 06:52:29 pm »
That's not right or fair.

One cannot serve the aggregate on the basis of the increment.
And this IS a statistical game.

As cold as it may seem how else shall we determine a collective course of action, especially one with such potential implications for our liberties? We've seen how the anecdotal can be used to set policy - never a good idea.

For example pictures of a drowned Syrian child sparked a ME invasion of western Europe.




« Last Edit: March 19, 2020, 06:56:26 pm by skeeter »

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2480 on: March 19, 2020, 06:54:19 pm »
The page is not full yet.
It won't take long.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline TomSea

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2481 on: March 19, 2020, 07:03:31 pm »
No, I am saying that you were dead-ass wrong when you claimed the number to be at 100 seventeen hours ago.


Your own link in your own post proves it so.  QED.


When they update information, they say "Updated" and provide the time stamp when it was updated.  In THE LINK YOU PROVIDED, it clearly shows it to be over a day and a half old.  Maybe if you actually checked the veracity of your source material instead of lying about what it says, people would actually begin to take you seriously.  But as long as you continue down this path, you are actually doing a disservice to your own goal, because people have grown tired of hearing you cry 'Wolf!".

Am I to say to @Snokin Joe you got your information wrong and accuse him of posting false information? The way you are goinig after someone proves that and you are helping us lose the point, that those killed jaywalking is higher than those who die of the Coronavirus, that's the heart of the matter and my information rebukes that more than your harrassment, libel, personal attacks and vulgar language.

My information was a lot more on point that Smokin Joe's information, why are you not going after others? Because you are singling one out but I will go find those posting about 16 deaths jaywalking to please  you.

Again, 18 hours - Bing.com   That's also what my info told me.

We are in a discussion that doesn't merit picking on my one post, it is also aside from the main point.

Take it to messaging, if you have any further to say.

Quote
Coronavirus: Reported death toll crosses 100 in US as outbreak spreads to all 50 states
Faizan Javed
1 day ago
https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/world/coronavirus-reported-death-toll-crosses-100-in-us-as-outbreak-spreads-to-all-50-states/ar-BB11kWvN

Can anyone read this with link, one day ago, "toll crosses 100", if anyone is quibbling with whether it is pass the 100 mark, then, one is just nit-picking.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2020, 07:15:18 pm by TomSea »

Offline TomSea

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2482 on: March 19, 2020, 07:05:36 pm »
Sixteen people die per day, on average in the US from pedestrian/vehicle accidents. So far, the jaywalkers are ahead.

False, it doesn't help if you are posting inaccurate and false information.

Is this to aid Chinese Communist disinformation?

You are crying wolf and you do your own cause a disservice.

Online roamer_1

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2483 on: March 19, 2020, 07:09:25 pm »
As cold as it may seem how else shall we determine a collective course of action, especially one with such potential implications for our liberties? We've seen how the anecdotal can be used to set policy - never a good idea.

For example pictures of a drowned Syrian child sparked a ME invasion of western Europe.

That's right... It seems cold and all. I get it. But hundreds of billions lost in the market and trillions spent by the government, on the basis of infections (deaths) that are so very small...

If this chloroquine play actually works as hoped, and supply can be manufactured to meet demand, which it can, then all those hundreds of billions lost, and all those trillions spent, will be over a death toll that is less than a fair sized train wreck could produce...

Not to mention the loss of liberty which could be permanent.

That is an overreaction of EPIC proportions... Several orders of magnitude bigger than epic.

Online corbe

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2484 on: March 19, 2020, 07:16:04 pm »
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline TomSea

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2485 on: March 19, 2020, 07:21:02 pm »
Quote
Coronavirus deaths in US cross 100, Trump still hesitant about lockdown
The state of Washington currently has the highest death toll at 54 people. The virus made it into a Seattle nursing home and killed 30.
By REUTERS  MARCH 18, 2020 07:27

https://www.jpost.com/International/Over-100-dead-of-coronavirus-in-the-US-confirmed-cases-in-all-50-states-621372

That still says YESTERDAY!



Offline musiclady

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2486 on: March 19, 2020, 07:21:42 pm »
It is perspective. Perspective is always relevant.

We all have perspective here and understand that people die in all sorts of ways. It’s irrelevant to this thread.

I know that five or six of you are trying to dismiss the severity of this very different situation we are all in, but maybe you can all start your own thread with all the scoffing you feel like doing, and let the rest of us get information here about a serious healthcare crisis that is scientifically and medically being dealt with by serious people.

And make sure, in spite of your cynicism, that you do the things necessary to keep yourself and your families healthy.

Btw, people don’t usually die in 9 days from a family reunion.

The callousness it takes to summarily disregard that is breathtaking.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline Bigun

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2487 on: March 19, 2020, 07:24:41 pm »
I am way against most of what's going on, especially for the money being lost in business and printed by the government... I think media and government blew this up way out of proportion.

However, a few things done by this administration have been absolutely brilliant.

For instance: Plowing away red tape and liability issues, at least for masks, and maybe for more... N95 masks are available (35m) that could not be sold for medical purposes - only 10m medical masks were around- But now the industrial rated mask (same exact thing) can be sold into the medical system, instantly more than tripling availability and production

Excellent.

Also, plowing down red tape blocking first responders and medical personnel during emergencies...
Now those assets can work across state lines nationwide where they could not before...

Absolutely excellent.

 :yowsa:   :amen:
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline Fishrrman

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2488 on: March 19, 2020, 07:25:20 pm »
TomSea wrote:
"Also, at the same ABC link above  (not as good as your link) but it is talking of one ER Doctor exposed to the virus, let's hope we don't have much more of this, the link says there's potential many were exposed but we are suppose to have our voices shut down because we are being alarmist."

According to some information in this post I put up earlier today:
http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,388835.msg2172378.html#msg2172378

“Research shows that chloroquine also has strong potential as a prophylactic (preventative) measure against coronavirus in the lab, while we wait for a vaccine to be developed."

To research this, I would suggest that medical personnel (doctors and others) working in close contact with COVID-19 patients undertake a study using small doses of chloroquine as "a prophylactic" to see if that increases their chances of NOT becoming infected.

It could provide useful information...

Offline aligncare

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2489 on: March 19, 2020, 07:26:34 pm »
That's right... It seems cold and all. I get it. But hundreds of billions lost in the market and trillions spent by the government, on the basis of infections (deaths) that are so very small...

If this chloroquine play actually works as hoped, and supply can be manufactured to meet demand, which it can, then all those hundreds of billions lost, and all those trillions spent, will be over a death toll that is less than a fair sized train wreck could produce...

Not to mention the loss of liberty which could be permanent.

That is an overreaction of EPIC proportions... Several orders of magnitude bigger than epic.

All one has to do is compare the reaction to this virus to the response to prior viral outbreaks of even more deadly viruses like the seasonal flu.

Something is different today and it’s not just the particular strain of virus involved. I believe it’s politics, ala never let a good crisis go to waste, and the DNC and media are fully on board with this “crisis.”

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2490 on: March 19, 2020, 07:28:34 pm »
Am I to say to @Snokin Joe you got your information wrong and accuse him of posting false information? The way you are goinig after someone proves that and you are helping us lose the point, that those killed jaywalking is higher than those who die of the Coronavirus, that's the heart of the matter and my information rebukes that more than your harrassment, libel, personal attacks and vulgar language.

My information was a lot more on point that Smokin Joe's information, why are you not going after others? Because you are singling one out but I will go find those posting about 16 deaths jaywalking to please  you.
@TomSea At least spell my handle right.

You're right, it isn't 16, it's 17 per day killed crossing the street (2018 numbers, NHTSA). And yes, when you consider the response to things far more deadly, on a day to day basis, it should give pause to the sight of empty store shelves and general panic.

As has been warned, killing this economy will kill more people than the virus in the long run. (my prediction, because no jobs=no health insurance).
While statistics might seem cold and impersonal, they are. They are numbers. They have no more feelings than a virus.
 
I have done my best to provide perspective by posting that 99% of the dead in Italy had some preexisting condition or combination thereof which complicated their treatment, that they lived in an area with the worst air pollution in the country, and that there ARE specific factors which enhance risk, either present through genetics or lifestyle or both.
 
Which means, that there is a significant part of the population, real people, as I am so often reminded, with children and family and feelings and who used to have the two or three jobs needed to support their children, who will lose those jobs as businesses are shuttered across the country, some never to reopen because they were mom and pop small businesses who will have bills to pay and no revenue. The owners of the businesses will lose whatever they have invested, often everything. Geez. They have feelings, too.

How about just getting some facts out there about who this disease is most likely to target, and let people assess their own risk, including the risk to their loved ones?
The last thing to have this sort of impact on our economy was obamacare, crushing small businesses, which are the lifeblood of our economy.
The Oil Industry pulled the country out of that slump. That won't happen with $20-something per barrel oil.
So, where are people going to look for economic salvation?

 Government.
They already are, only many people won't get any help there, and won't get a dime of the money being pandered about in Congress.

Who is going to bid higher for the votes in 2020 (with taxpayer dollars that haven't been earned yet)?
If the GOP kills that, then what? Feel painted into a corner yet?

If you can't see that very emotional argument coming, you're looking the wrong way.
 
Which is exactly why we need, and I mean desperately need, to maintain perspective during this outbreak.
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Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline TomSea

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2491 on: March 19, 2020, 07:28:56 pm »
Quote
Melania Trump Delivers Urgent Message To American People: ‘We are all in this together, this is not how we’ll live forever’
written by J.C McCallum March 19, 2020



Melania Trump sent out an urgent message to the American people and united the nation with a reminder of what is truly important.

Melania urged the nation to follow the guidelines to “stay safe” and reminded us that “this is not how we will live forever.”

She asked Americans to continue to come together, as most have done, reminding us that “we are all in this together.”

Read more at:   https://newsthud.com/melania-trump-delivers-urgent-message-to-american-people-we-are-all-in-this-together-this-is-not-how-well-live-forever/

11AM, March 19, 2020, this date I think might be the right one.

Offline EdinVA

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2492 on: March 19, 2020, 07:29:33 pm »
All one has to do is compare the reaction to this virus to the response to prior viral outbreaks of even more deadly viruses like the seasonal flu.

Something is different today and it’s not just the particular strain of virus involved. I believe it’s politics, ala never let a good crisis go to waste, and the DNC and media are fully on board with this “crisis.”
And I think our collective lack of confidence in what we are being told, not because of President Trump, we have been lied to for so long for so many reasons, the government is just not viewed as reliable...

Offline Idiot

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2493 on: March 19, 2020, 07:30:48 pm »
We all have perspective here and understand that people die in all sorts of ways. It’s irrelevant to this thread.

I know that five or six of you are trying to dismiss the severity of this very different situation we are all in, but maybe you can all start your own thread with all the scoffing you feel like doing, and let the rest of us get information here about a serious healthcare crisis that is scientifically and medically being dealt with by serious people.

And make sure, in spite of your cynicism, that you do the things necessary to keep yourself and your families healthy.

Btw, people don’t usually die in 9 days from a family reunion.

The callousness it takes to summarily disregard that is breathtaking.

If I knew where you lived I'd send you a case of toilet paper for that comment.   happy77
Very...very...very....well said.

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2494 on: March 19, 2020, 07:36:19 pm »
For the day, sure.
Using the average, since February 1 there have been 768 people die in the streets from automobile impacts. The updated number (average per day) is 17 https://www.nhtsa.gov/road-safety/pedestrian-safety
Not to mention the average of 138 to 345 which die each day from the common flu.  And remember this is in spite of many people taking flu shots, whereas no one has yet taken a flu shot for CV 19.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/preliminary-in-season-estimates.htm
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Offline Bigun

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2495 on: March 19, 2020, 07:37:41 pm »
All one has to do is compare the reaction to this virus to the response to prior viral outbreaks of even more deadly viruses like the seasonal flu.

Something is different today and it’s not just the particular strain of virus involved. I believe it’s politics, ala never let a good crisis go to waste, and the DNC and media are fully on board with this “crisis.”

I agree with you 100% @aligncare and not one word of that downplays the seriousness of the China Virus!

The left has invested over 100 years and many $$$ to get them to where they are at present in this country and they WILL NOT see all that lost without one hell of a fight!

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"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Online roamer_1

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2496 on: March 19, 2020, 07:38:20 pm »
All one has to do is compare the reaction to this virus to the response to prior viral outbreaks of even more deadly viruses like the seasonal flu.

Something is different today and it’s not just the particular strain of virus involved. I believe it’s politics, ala never let a good crisis go to waste, and the DNC and media are fully on board with this “crisis.”


There is a game afoot... Never let a good crisis, etc... Can't see what it is, because the players are on all sides. That could be various sides vying for advantage, or it could be all sides moving as one... It is too worried up to tell.

Online mystery-ak

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2497 on: March 19, 2020, 07:38:29 pm »
Throwing this out there

I want to know why Italy seems worse off than other countries...
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2498 on: March 19, 2020, 07:38:35 pm »
We all have perspective here and understand that people die in all sorts of ways. It’s irrelevant to this thread.

I know that five or six of you are trying to dismiss the severity of this very different situation we are all in, but maybe you can all start your own thread with all the scoffing you feel like doing, and let the rest of us get information here about a serious healthcare crisis that is scientifically and medically being dealt with by serious people.

And make sure, in spite of your cynicism, that you do the things necessary to keep yourself and your families healthy.

Btw, people don’t usually die in 9 days from a family reunion.

The callousness it takes to summarily disregard that is breathtaking.
I am a scientist. Call me callous as you please, I really don't care.
That won't change the cold, hard, facts.

Those people didn't "die in 9 days from a family reunion", this wasn't some inner-city gathering in a drive-by shooting.

They died of a virus, and I'll bet if you had all the facts, you would find that these genetically related people had one or more of the conditions which enhance their probability of succumbing to the disease.  Not to mention that in any family reunion, the family elders are usually present.  All the high risk factors may be present.
But we are dealing with panic induced by cherry picked and omitted data and that is poor, thin, gruel to base decisions upon.

If rationality seems cold and unfeeling, then you are correct, but it is rational, not emotional, as so much of what I am seeing here is. If you think policy is best served by feelings, then you are barking up the wrong tree. Emotionally based decisions are Democrat fare. 
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline aligncare

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Re: Coronavirus, comprehensive and updates discussion
« Reply #2499 on: March 19, 2020, 07:42:48 pm »
The Italian healthcare system has an inadequate numbers of ICUs compared with the U.S.. Because of this and the large population of elderly, a socialized medical system, and the larger number of Chinese in Milan working in the garment industry, I doubt the U.S. will ever see the same numbers of per capita deaths experienced in Italy.